Ireland u20 6 nations and world championship 2021

Lost Ormond

Hands Like Flippers wrote: »

When is squad likely do be announced?

Considering its not starting next weekend and As we dont know when the tournament will be played then who knows.

Lost Ormond

Confirmed no world championship this year.

Was always likely to be this way.
Shame. Wonder if games can be played at some stage so players born in 01 at least get a chance of playing some rep rugby this season

bayern

The U20s Six Nations will take place across June and July in the same format as originally planned, but through a condensed 3-week period. The tournament is expected to start on 19 June.

Further fixture dates, venues and kick off times for both tournaments will be announced in due course.

bayern

alanb92 wrote: »

Do we expect it to be 1 year too soon for Tector to start at 10? He was very impressive in the Schools cup last year. ROG name checked him on Newstalk earlier in relation to long term 10 prospects.

could be a bolter.. lots of talent at 10 this year though.

OneLungDavy

bayern wrote: »

The U20s Six Nations will take place across June and July in the same format as originally planned, but through a condensed 3-week period. The tournament is expected to start on 19 June.

Further fixture dates, venues and kick off times for both tournaments will be announced in due course.

How can they play 5 games in 3 weeks?

bayern

OneLungDavy wrote: »

How can they play 5 games in 3 weeks?

same as the JWC, quick turn arounds and bigger squads with more rotation.

Lost Ormond

OneLungDavy wrote: »

How can they play 5 games in 3 weeks?

Same format as in junior world cup. playing every 4 days or so.
Every world championship see's sides playing 5 games in 18 or 19 days

bayern

https://www.the42.ie/will-hickey-ospreys-back-row-5345162-Feb2021/

confirmation of a well known rumour.

realhorrorshow

bayern wrote: »

https://www.the42.ie/will-hickey-ospreys-back-row-5345162-Feb2021/

confirmation of a well known rumour.

Makes sense, I think more young Irish players should look at moving to other Pro14 clubs.

arsebiscuits1

Hickie presumably 19 still meaning he'd be eligible for Wales at 24 which is still a pretty reasonable age. I'm sure he'd hope to be an established back row in the next few years.

Definite room to get first team rugby at Ospreys in the next few seasons too.

Hope it works out for him

stellenbosch

bayern wrote: »

https://www.the42.ie/will-hickey-ospreys-back-row-5345162-Feb2021/

confirmation of a well known rumour.

Hes already there apparently

nerd69

arsebiscuits1 wrote: »

Hickie presumably 19 still meaning he'd be eligible for Wales at 24 which is still a pretty reasonable age. I'm sure he'd hope to be an established back row in the next few years.

Definite room to get first team rugby at Ospreys in the next few seasons too.

Hope it works out for him

Best case he gets a heap of game time and eventually comes back ala beirne

bayern

https://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/rugby/arid-40221629.html

good article on rugby now, also confirms Marcus Kiely was cut.

Number 137

Had a look at a few stats in terms of which clubs and schools have supplied the most players to u20s squads since 2008 until 2020. Based on the opening matchday 22/23 named for the Six Nations, here is what I found. I've named the top in each criteria

Total

- Blackrock 30
- St. Michael's 27
- Clongowes 14

Forwards

- St. Michael's 13
- Blackrock 11
- CC Roscrea & Clongowes 10

Backs

- Blackrock 19
- St. Michael's 14
- Methodist & Crescent 6

Front Row

- CC Roscrea 6

Second Row

- Blackrock 5

Back Row

- St. Michael's 6

Half Backs

- St. Michael's 10

Midfield

- Blackrock 9

Outside Backs

- Blackrock 6

Lost Ormond

Number 137 wrote: »

Had a look at a few stats in terms of which clubs and schools have supplied the most players to u20s squads since 2008 until 2020. Based on the opening matchday 22/23 named for the Six Nations, here is what I found. I've named the top in each criteria

Total

- Blackrock 30
- St. Michael's 27
- Clongowes 14

Forwards

- St. Michael's 13
- Blackrock 11
- CC Roscrea & Clongowes 10

Backs

- Blackrock 19
- St. Michael's 14
- Methodist & Crescent 6

Front Row

- CC Roscrea 6

Second Row

- Blackrock 5

Back Row

- St. Michael's 6

Half Backs

- St. Michael's 10

Midfield

- Blackrock 9

Outside Backs

- Blackrock 6

Is that just listing the final school where some will have attended. So Carbery is Blackrock despite only playing there for a year

No surprise these schools have most considering the resources they have both in facilities, coaches and number of players.

bayern

u20's named in A sides:

Connacht
13. Shane Jennings
12. Cathal Forde
16. Eoin de Buitlear

Backrows
Hubert Costello, Oisin McCormack, Donnacha Byrne, Diarmuid McCormack

Scrumhalf
Matthew Devine

Munster
6. Alex Kendellen
21. Ethan Coughlan

bayern

Alex Kendellan listed at 6'1, 104kg... pretty small for a modern 8.

Squidgy Black

bayern wrote: »

Alex Kendellan listed at 6'1, 104kg... pretty small for a modern 8.

Pretty small is a bit harsh considering the average height is around 6'3 outside of the likes of Stander at 6'1 or Sam Simmons at 6'.

Doris and Deegan are listed as 106/108 respectively so wouldn't be concerned about his weight either depending on his frame

bayern

Squidgy Black wrote: »

Pretty small is a bit harsh considering the average height is around 6'3 outside of the likes of Stander at 6'1 or Sam Simmons at 6'.

Doris and Deegan are listed as 106/108 respectively so wouldn't be concerned about his weight either depending on his frame

just don't see many internationals playing 8 at 6'1, I would have concerns he can carry enough weight and retain athleticism.

Deegan and Doris are both 6'4 and rangy athletes.

Niallof9

Speaking of Munster youth prospects, what are the chances of Okeke making it. He seems like a big boy.

I agree 6,1 does seem rather small for an 8. He's an excellent prospect though.

Personally i fear we try to box too smart in this country. We'll jettison larger lads as too obvious. I remain convinced a Victor Costelloe or even a Vunipola type wouldn't be looked at anymore.

You can see this happening to Sean French as well. We seem more ready to back the smaller guy with dog in him and consistency then anything.

Eventually our lack of size will kill us, if it hasn't already. We just aren't good enough or have the numbers to back a NZ type policy of smaller bodies.

Or is it truly a lack of real monsters coming through? Are there no more Des Dillons (as crap as he turned out), Bob Caseys, Damien Brownes, Costelloes anymore?

bayern

Niallof9 wrote: »

Speaking of Munster youth prospects, what are the chances of Okeke making it. He seems like a big boy.

I agree 6,1 does seem rather small for an 8. He's an excellent prospect though.

Personally i fear we try to box too smart in this country. We'll jettison larger lads as too obvious. I remain convinced a Victor Costelloe or even a Vunipola type wouldn't be looked at anymore.

define "make it"

Why?

bayern

Niallof9 wrote: »

Speaking of Munster youth prospects, what are the chances of Okeke making it. He seems like a big boy.

I agree 6,1 does seem rather small for an 8. He's an excellent prospect though.

Personally i fear we try to box too smart in this country. We'll jettison larger lads as too obvious. I remain convinced a Victor Costelloe or even a Vunipola type wouldn't be looked at anymore.

You can see this happening to Sean French as well. We seem more ready to back the smaller guy with dog in him and consistency then anything.

Eventually our lack of size will kill us, if it isn't already. We just aren't good enough or have the numbers to back a NZ type policy of smaller bodies.

French is an awful defender, until he sorts that out then he is a liability.

Niallof9

bayern wrote: »

French is an awful defender, until he sorts that out then he is a liability.

As are plenty of others in the system already. Hence what i'm talking about. Cause perhaps he's a little bigger or whatnot he doesn't get the same pass.

I can't prove it or anything, but personally i think its happening.

I mean our body size in Japan was for the heat, yes, but Aki has already talked about the negatives of it. While Henshaw probably got too big.

In terms of Kendallan, unless he's at Underhill levels he's possibly too small.

Its just a hunch.

Having played rugby all my life i know its not for the lack of size i've played against enough monsters in my time. I think its an active policy of slimming guys down or only recruiting based on other parameters. Size isn't everything, of course not. And most of our big lads never really made any impact. Costelloe, Casey, Browne, Quinlan, Downey and so on. Was it part of a similar mindset. The opposite of "good face". I don;t know if other countrys would have misused a Victor Costelloe. And we often moaned, and still do, of how small we are etc.

bayern

Niallof9 wrote: »

As are plenty of others in the system already. Hence what i'm talking about. Cause perhaps he's a little bigger or whatnot he doesn't get the same pass.

I can't prove it or anything, but personally i think its happening.

I mean our body size in Japan was for the heat, yes, but Aki has already talked about the negatives of it. While Henshaw probably got too big.

Its just a hunch.

Having played rugby all my life i know its not for the lack of size i've played against enough monsters in my time.

thats bollix, French was notably awful for the irish 20's defensively, much worse than any of his peers but was still picked regularly.

nerd69

bayern wrote: »

just don't see many internationals playing 8 at 6'1, I would have concerns he can carry enough weight and retain athleticism.

Deegan and Doris are both 6'4 and rangy athletes.

at 6 foot tHodnett played 8 at 20s level and was looking very good at 7 at senior level.before getting hurt so that's a possible option

Niallof9

bayern wrote: »

thats bollix, French was notably awful for the irish 20's defensively, much worse than any of his peers but was still picked regularly.

its hardly bollix. I'm talking about at every level. Stockdales been woeful, albeit at a much higher level. Lowe is getting critcism. French played most of his career at 12.

Hodnett looks class. If Kendallan is at the same level, thats great news for Munster.

I think the discarding of certain players because of certain traits and picking another type will hurt Irish rugby long term. I think its already happening.

Not only would Costelloe not make it now, neither would a Keith Wood. His throwing, as he admits himself wasn't good enough. Give me a Keith Wood over a Herring any day of the week. Cronin is a live example of it. A criminal waste of one of our best open field forwards.

And its not only me who thinks this. Jackman was talking about this recently if i can find the link.

I will say though, the skill levels of our youth players are insane. Which is a great change.

My criticism is part of a broder pov as well. Like the idea of turning Ahern into a second row despite having played winger all his life, same as Cormac Izuchukwu.

Its the same mindset that sees Conroy not a pro rugby player and i'd wager the same fate awaits aaron Sexton.

bayern

Niallof9 wrote: »

I'm talking about at every level. Stockdales been woeful, albeit at a much higher level. French played most of his career at 12.

Hodnett looks class. If Kendallan is at the same level, thats great news for Munster.

I think the discarding of certain players because of certain traits and picking another type will hurt Irish rugby long term. I think its already happening.

Not only would Costelloe not make it now, neither would a Keith Wood. His throwing, as he admits himself wasn;t good enough.

And its not only me who thinks this. Jackman was talking about this recently if i can find the link.

I will say though, the skill levels of our youth players are insane. Which is a great change.

have you watched irish rugby? when has poor throwing stopped any hooker from getting a contract?

bayern

nerd69 wrote: »

at 6 foot tHodnett played 8 at 20s level and was looking very good at 7 at senior level.before getting hurt so that's a possible option

Kendellan could be an option at 7, just don't see it as an 8 at that size.

bayern

Niallof9 wrote: »

its hardly bollix. I'm talking about at every level. Stockdales been woeful, albeit at a much higher level. Lowe is getting critcism. French played most of his career at 12.

Hodnett looks class. If Kendallan is at the same level, thats great news for Munster.

I think the discarding of certain players because of certain traits and picking another type will hurt Irish rugby long term. I think its already happening.

Not only would Costelloe not make it now, neither would a Keith Wood. His throwing, as he admits himself wasn't good enough. Give me a Keith Wood over a Herring any day of the week. Cronin is a live example of it. A criminal waste of one of our best open field forwards.

And its not only me who thinks this. Jackman was talking about this recently if i can find the link.

I will say though, the skill levels of our youth players are insane. Which is a great change.

Insane? I wouldn't agree, it's improved from a very low level but still loads of room for improvement.

OneLungDavy

Niallof9 wrote: »

As are plenty of others in the system already. Hence what i'm talking about. Cause perhaps he's a little bigger or whatnot he doesn't get the same pass.

I can't prove it or anything, but personally i think its happening.

I mean our body size in Japan was for the heat, yes, but Aki has already talked about the negatives of it. While Henshaw probably got too big.

In terms of Kendallan, unless he's at Underhill levels he's possibly too small.

Its just a hunch.

Having played rugby all my life i know its not for the lack of size i've played against enough monsters in my time. I think its an active policy of slimming guys down or only recruiting based on other parameters. Size isn't everything, of course not. And most of our big lads never really made any impact. Costelloe, Casey, Browne, Quinlan, Downey and so on. Was it part of a similar mindset. The opposite of "good face". I don;t know if other countrys would have misused a Victor Costelloe. And we often moaned, and still do, of how small we are etc.

Quinlan was never a monster.

John Madigan is another example. Although it was Rassie who got rid of him so we can't really blame the Irish system for that.


I agree we seem to have a, sometimes, strange selection policy regarding big lads. If your naturally big, your in the tight-five. Two years was wasted on Gavin Coombes trying to play him at lock. If Billy Vunipola was Irish he'd be a tighthead prop.