Formula 1 2021 - General Discussion Thread (Read 1st post rules)

Frank Bullitt

flazio wrote: »

Wasn't Flavio Briatore Alonso's manager throughout his McLaren, Ferrari and Renault days?

He had some part of Webbers career too.

Frank Bullitt

Pen Rua wrote: »

In Sky’s F1 Show (available on YouTube) they ask Ocon if the Mercedes dream is over. He says he is still “managed by Mercedes” (direct quote). He says he will be a “full Alpine driver” for the next 3 years with “no interaction” with Mercedes.

Full quote here:

“I am completely [an] Alpine driver for the next three years, that is where I stand at the moment,” he said. “For sure, there are connections with Mercedes but the job I’m doing is to be with Alpine and fully with Alpine so there will be nothing, no interaction, with Mercedes Grand Prix team,” he maintained.

Pen Rua

Frank Bullitt wrote: »

Full quote here:

FWIW, That’s from a different interview than the Sky F1 Show one on YouTube with PDR and Brooks. But content the same.

pjohnson

Ocon must be wrong aswell. We all know what Matt Carter thinks after all.


Cant possibly be that Carter was at worst spewing shíte and at best incorrect, No siree.

Ocon, Alpine and Mercedes are the ones who are wrong.

pjohnson

quokula wrote: »

You seem to be making stuff up - there is zero evidence that either team didn’t comply with the recommended tyre pressures - in fact all evidence is to the contrary, that they did comply, and you’re just advancing a conspiracy theory that two completely different teams with completely different car designs somehow both magically got around the limits in a way nobody can prove or measure.

I have sympathy for Pirelli, it’s near impossible for them to make good tyres with the extreme testing limits and the seriously overweight unfit for purpose hybrid cars, but they have produced absolutely nothing to suggest the tyre failure was anyone else’s fault.

That happens a lot

Joeface

https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/pirelli-red-bull-and-aston-martin-were-running-with-lower-pressures/6579094/

El_Duderino 09

Frank Bullitt wrote: »

I can't really understand your point though. Ocon has just signed a 3 year deal with Alpine, yet you think/say he is still a Merc driver. He is managed by Toto yes, but it is clear that Russell is fav to step into that, Ocon clearly sees this and has stuck to Alpine (great move for both with the marketing etc and rule change).

There is no conflicting info.

I can see your misunderstanding. I haven't said I think he's a Mercedes driver (pretty sure I've said in every post that I don't know). What I have said is that matt Carter (and Joe Saward) say he's also under contract with Mercedes. And that's 100% true - I heard them say it. I don't know the

But apart from that, people can work under more than one contract at an time. Why is this such a big issue to you?

El_Duderino 09

Frank Bullitt wrote: »

Full quote here:

Lol. So there we have it. He still had a contract with Mercedes while also having a contract with Alpine.

El_Duderino 09

quokula wrote: »

You seem to be making stuff up - there is zero evidence that either team didn’t comply with the recommended tyre pressures - in fact all evidence is to the contrary, that they did comply, and you’re just advancing a conspiracy theory that two completely different teams with completely different car designs somehow both magically got around the limits in a way nobody can prove or measure.

I have sympathy for Pirelli, it’s near impossible for them to make good tyres with the extreme testing limits and the seriously overweight unfit for purpose hybrid cars, but they have produced absolutely nothing to suggest the tyre failure was anyone else’s fault.

The evidence for my "conspiracy theory" is growing, I've even got Hamilton here talking about it:
"As you know every weekend, whenever there is a failure, they always put the pressures up - so that tells you something," he said.

"More often than not, [it's] that the tyres are not being run at the pressures that are being asked. We didn't have a problem with our tyres".
Motorsport.com: Hamilton: Pirelli not to blame for Baku tyre blowouts.
http://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/hamilton-pirelli-not-to-blame-for-baku-tyre-blowouts/6577971/amp/
Plus the fact that Pirelli's solution to the problem is to increase the recommended tyre pressure and another rooster said they're going to test the tyres when cold to control for temperature changes to tyre pressure.

"However, a swift response from the FIA to ramp up tyre pressure and temperature checks for this weekend's French Grand Prix, has offered answers about teams potentially trying to get around limits being a factor."

And here's Pirelli saying RB and AM wer running the tyres at low pressures during the race - but didn't break the rules because they complied with the checks at the start - isn't that exactly what I said?

"And while Pirelli confirmed that both Red Bull and Aston Martin had followed the regulations with the minimum starting pressures and maximum blanket temperatures, it says that things deviated from what it expected once the cars were running."

Motorsport.com: Pirelli: Red Bull and Aston Martin were running with lower pressures.
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/red-bull-and-aston-martin-were-running-with-lower-pressures-says-pirelli/6579071/amp/

Frank Bullitt

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Lol. So there we have it. He still had a contract with Mercedes while also having a contract with Alpine.

Connections and contract aren't the same thing

Joeseph Balls

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

The evidence for my "conspiracy theory" is growing, I've even got Hamilton here talking about it:
"As you know every weekend, whenever there is a failure, they always put the pressures up - so that tells you something," he said.

"More often than not, [it's] that the tyres are not being run at the pressures that are being asked. We didn't have a problem with our tyres".
Motorsport.com: Hamilton: Pirelli not to blame for Baku tyre blowouts.
http://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/hamilton-pirelli-not-to-blame-for-baku-tyre-blowouts/6577971/amp/
Plus the fact that Pirelli's solution to the problem is to increase the recommended tyre pressure and another rooster said they're going to test the tyres when cold to control for temperature changes to tyre pressure.

"However, a swift response from the FIA to ramp up tyre pressure and temperature checks for this weekend's French Grand Prix, has offered answers about teams potentially trying to get around limits being a factor."

And here's Pirelli saying RB and AM wer running the tyres at low pressures during the race - but didn't break the rules because they complied with the checks at the start - isn't that exactly what I said?

"And while Pirelli confirmed that both Red Bull and Aston Martin had followed the regulations with the minimum starting pressures and maximum blanket temperatures, it says that things deviated from what it expected once the cars were running."

Motorsport.com: Pirelli: Red Bull and Aston Martin were running with lower pressures.
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/red-bull-and-aston-martin-were-running-with-lower-pressures-says-pirelli/6579071/amp/

Wait, wasn't there a report somewhere in the days after that Hamilton's rear left had scarring too? I'll have to find it.

MadYaker

Verstappen claimed in an interview that his team shared all their data with Pirelli.

El_Duderino 09

Joeseph Balls wrote: »

Wait, wasn't there a report somewhere in the days after that Hamilton's rear left had scarring too? I'll have to find it.

Yeah Pirelli said that in the post race interviews. It hasn't been mentioned in the reporting of Pirelli's investigation.

The teams are always trying to run the tyres at lower pressures during the race. It's a cat and mouse game of testing compliant before the race and bringing the pressures down after the teat so the tyres are at lower pressure during the actual race. It's an old battle weteeen the FIA-Pirelli and the teams.

They're bringing in tabdardised sensors on the tyres to feed back pressure and temperature, during the race, for next year so that should put a stop to it.

El_Duderino 09

MadYaker wrote: »

Verstappen claimed in an interview that his team shared all their data with Pirelli.

I suppose they did, particularly if they were told to do so - I don't know ow how these investigations work. The might have been compelled to hard over the information. And they tested compliant before the race so they have nothing to fear. Pirelli said everyone tested compliant before the race.

The trick is to get the tyres to test compliant before the race, but drop pressure through one clever mechanism or another, without breaking the rules, so they run at lower pressure during the race (but obviously without the tyre failing, which it did in this race and in Silverstone last year).

El_Duderino 09

Frank Bullitt wrote: »

Connections and contract aren't the same thing

He doesn't have a contract with his own management team? You're stretching a bit now. But that's OK. No idea why this seemed to matter so much to you anyway. It was a pretty trivial point. Well just have to wait and see how it pans out.

Frank Bullitt

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

He doesn't have a contract with his own management team? You're stretching a bit now. But that's OK. No idea why this seemed to matter so much to you anyway. It was a pretty trivial point. Well just have to wait and see how it pans out.

His manager is Toto, not Merc. Yes there are "connections", but that is not a contract to the Merc team. His contract for racing is with Alpine, how is that stretching?

flazio

Alex Albon is racing for Alpha Tauri this weekend....with Ferrari power...... in DTM.

https://twitter.com/AlphaTauriF1/status/1406152173185011714?s=09

weisses

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

I suppose they did, particularly if they were told to do so - I don't know ow how these investigations work. The might have been compelled to hard over the information. And they tested compliant before the race so they have nothing to fear. Pirelli said everyone tested compliant before the race.

The trick is to get the tyres to test compliant before the race, but drop pressure through one clever mechanism or another, without breaking the rules, so they run at lower pressure during the race (but obviously without the tyre failing, which it did in this race and in Silverstone last year).

You cannot compare the situation in Silverstone with the incident in Baku ...

pjohnson

flazio wrote: »

Alex Albon is racing for Alpha Tauri this weekend....with Ferrari power...... in DTM.

https://twitter.com/AlphaTauriF1/status/1406152173185011714?s=09

Some will say Albon has a Ferrari contract

El_Duderino 09

pjohnson wrote: »

Some will say Albon has a Ferrari contract

Has he a ferrari contract? Hadn't heard that.

El_Duderino 09

weisses wrote: »

You cannot compare the situation in Silverstone with the incident in Baku ...

Why not?

El_Duderino 09

quokula wrote: »

You seem to be making stuff up - there is zero evidence that either team didn’t comply with the recommended tyre pressures - in fact all evidence is to the contrary, that they did comply, and you’re just advancing a conspiracy theory that two completely different teams with completely different car designs somehow both magically got around the limits in a way nobody can prove or measure.

I have sympathy for Pirelli, it’s near impossible for them to make good tyres with the extreme testing limits and the seriously overweight unfit for purpose hybrid cars, but they have produced absolutely nothing to suggest the tyre failure was anyone else’s fault.

As a matter of interest, are you still calling the tyre pressure explanation of the tyre failure a "conspiracy theory"?

flazio

Theory, if you told Christian and Toto that your team could only win the drivers or the constructors championship, Toto would let Max win the drivers championship if it meant Mercedes-Benz won the constructors and Christian would rather Max win the drivers race then Red Bull winning the constructors.

Harika

I would say the constructor's championship is something either takes en passent. Nice to have, driver championship is what has priority and in majority of cases both is won together. Without Google I won't be able to tell you when it happened.

TheQ_Man

Harika wrote: »

I would say the constructor's championship is something either takes en passent. Nice to have, driver championship is what has priority and in majority of cases both is won together. Without Google I won't be able to tell you when it happened.

2008 was the last time both weren’t won by the same team.

Drivers: McLaren
Constructors: Ferrari

Since then it’s been:

2009 Brawn
2010-13 Red Bull
2014- present Mercedes

Joeseph Balls

Harika wrote: »

I would say the constructor's championship is something either takes en passent. Nice to have, driver championship is what has priority and in majority of cases both is won together. Without Google I won't be able to tell you when it happened.

I always thought constructors is what the team wants as it's where the money is. I know 'usually' the drivers goes hand in hand with it, but if the question was posed to them, I would have thought constructors was the big one

Joeseph Balls

Joeseph Balls wrote: »

I always thought constructors is what the team wants as it's where the money is. I know 'usually' the drivers goes hand in hand with it, but if the question was posed to them, I would have thought constructors was the big one

They say that but now the prize money's been narrowed a good bit it's less so. Plus most of the publicity has always been about the drivers' championship.

BrentMused

Yesterday's French GP was only the 10th in F1 history without a single DNF! :eek:

And 7 of them were in the last 10 years. The other 3 were Indianapolis 2005 (lol), Italy 2005 and Holland 1961