The Vaccine

Lex Luthor

You dont have a pandemic if the positive test results are in single or low teens

its not just Dr Yeadon that is saying it, Fauci himself. The CDC

but you have the daily msm churning out the numbers

Even the HSE are saying today there are a total of 1467 empty beds and a sharp decrease in trolleys compared to last year

We are apparently never as healthy as a country but in the middle of a 3rd wave lockdown

Meanwhile an ex neighbour & friends of mine have lost loved ones
One the father deteriorated significantly since going into lockdown in March, the isolation from family just had a huge impact on him

The other who had alzheimers was left to rot in a home when his family were only allowed one person attend on certain days and were masked up to the point he didnt even recognise his own wife of 50+ years
Another friend of mine has her mother in ICU after suffering multiple seizures and they wont allow the family in to see her

You wont hear about these cases, anyone who agrees with these lockdowns due to a falsified scam from test results hasnt a clue

drunkmonkey

King Mob wrote: »

Yes. What's the issue you have with this?

Again, you've kind of demonstrated that you don't understand the basics behind vaccines and viruses. So don't you think it's possible that you don't understand a scientific paper based on these things?

I think it's you don't understand, your really not getting that the vaccine might not be 100% effective on it's own yet your saying it is.

Lex Luthor

runawaybishop wrote: »

You mean discredited former Pfizer employee Mike yeadon? He's full of ****.

Ya Pfizer have everything to gain and nothing to lose from discrediting him

King Mob

drunkmonkey wrote: »

I think it's you don't understand, your really not getting that the vaccine might not be 100% effective on it's own yet your saying it is.

No, I understand the basics of how viruses and vaccines pretty good.

Could you please explain your point in full.
The vaccines trails showed the vaccines are effective. You believe these vaccine trials are fraudulent and their conclusions are wrong.
Why specifically?

There's no need to ask leading and rhetorical questions. Just state why you believe these studies are wrong and supply your source and evidence for this accusation.

I think however that you can't actually point out where or why these studies are wrong and you've no evidence for your accusations.

Lex Luthor

King Mob wrote: »

The vaccines trails showed the vaccines are effective.

Cool, you wont need to bother reading this article then

https://childrenshealthdefense.org/defender/pfizer-covid-vaccine-trial-pathogenic-priming/



“People are sheep. TV is the shepherd.”
― Jess C. Scott, Literary Heroin (Gluttony): A Twilight Parody

runawaybishop

Lex Luthor wrote: »

Ya Pfizer have everything to gain and nothing to lose from discrediting him

Ah so they let him go nine years ago in advance of this pandemic? And then he was discredited at the behest of Pfizer? How about no. He's just wrong.

drunkmonkey

King Mob wrote: »

No, I understand the basics of how viruses and vaccines pretty good.

Could you please explain your point in full.
The vaccines trails showed the vaccines are effective. You believe these vaccine trials are fraudulent and their conclusions are wrong.
Why specifically?

There's no need to ask leading and rhetorical questions. Just state why you believe these studies are wrong and supply your source and evidence for this accusation.

I think however that you can't actually point out where or why these studies are wrong and you've no evidence for your accusations.

To put it simply they don't take everything into account. For example when outside today I didn't feel the cold as I had a tissue in my pocket.
No we both now it wasn't just the tissue in my pocket, hat, socks, pants, jacket all had a role to play. The vaccine is the tissue in that scenario taking all the credit for keeping me warm.

runawaybishop

drunkmonkey wrote: »

To put it simply they don't take everything into account. For example when outside today I didn't feel the cold as I had a tissue in my pocket.
No we both now it wasn't just the tissue in my pocket, hat, socks, pants, jacket all had a role to play. The vaccine is the tissue in that scenario taking all the credit for keeping me warm.

What is this nonsense? Trials are conducted with control groups. Get away would you.

drunkmonkey

runawaybishop wrote: »

What is this nonsense? Trials are conducted with control groups. Get away would you.

Right so what percentage of the people who had the vaccine as opposed to the placebo had previously had the BCG vaccine and what was were there vitamin d levels like in winter and summer, was it even looked at?

runawaybishop

drunkmonkey wrote: »

Right so what percentage of the people who had the vaccine as opposed to the placebo had previously had the BCG vaccine and what was were there vitamin d levels like in winter and summer, was it even looked at?

Who gives a monkies. Your theories are nonsense and don't deserve any credence.

nino1

Lex Luthor wrote: »

People ask about a conspiracy..........

You have a vaccine being rushed through to apparently quash a virus, that has a pandemic declared based on the confirmation of the virus on a flawed testing procedure

Why? MONEY and MONEY MEANS POWER

So who is in on this conspiracy? Politicians? All of them or just those in power? Politicians in every country? Medical professionals also? anyone else?

Lex Luthor wrote: »

Lockdowns are being driven by PCR test results, not ICU or hospital admissions.

They may be using PCR tests as a measuring stick but in October for example we nearly reached ICU capacity and needed the lockdown to prevented us reaching capacity. ICU admissions does increase with increasing cases so its disingenuous to suggest there is no link.

Lex Luthor wrote: »

When you run PCR tests at 35-40 cycles then you will have a lot of false positives (maybe up to 97%)

The increased cycles just mean that they are picking up smaller viral levels and admittedly in some cases such small viral levels that the person may have a very small viral load and not be infectious or require self isolation but its the best test available.
I'd love to see your evidence of the PCR test at 40 cycles providing false positives of 97%!!

Lex Luthor

the evidence is availble, you can find it if you look

Quiner

It's horrible what they're doing to us. Every aspect of our lives controlled by that diabolical government.

runawaybishop

Lex Luthor wrote: »

the evidence is availble, you can find it if you look

The mating call of the conspiracy theorist. The 'evidence' is there if you disregard credible sources and go searching for nutjobs.

nino1

nino1 wrote: »

So who is in on this conspiracy? Politicians? All of them or just those in power? Politicians in every country? Medical professionals also? anyone else?






They may be using PCR tests as a measuring stick but in October for example we nearly reached ICU capacity and needed the lockdown to prevented us reaching capacity. ICU admissions does increase with increasing cases so its disingenuous to suggest there is no link.




The increased cycles just mean that they are picking up smaller viral levels and admittedly in some cases such small viral levels that the person may have a very small viral load and not be infectious or require self isolation but its the best test available.
I'd love to see your evidence of the PCR test at 40 cycles providing false positives of 97%!!

Anyone else able to clarify the above questions?

Timberrrrrrrr

Quiner wrote: »

It's horrible what they're doing to us. Every aspect of our lives controlled by that diabolical government.

Looked into moving to Tanzania yet? :rolleyes:

nino1

drunkmonkey wrote: »

Right so what percentage of the people who had the vaccine as opposed to the placebo had previously had the BCG vaccine and what was were there vitamin d levels like in winter and summer, was it even looked at?

Why would it be looked at? We have already established that vitamin d levels don't predict hospitalisations or death. As for the BCG is has long been shown to have a protective effect against virus' and bacteria and may well have a beneficial effect with covid but large randomised clinical trials are needed to show this not one small non-randomised study. Either way it makes not difference as to the effectiveness of the vaccine.

antgal23

Read a post about the testing procedures and validity

My sister and three sons were at mine two Saturdays ago. They travelled down with my parents, 1.5 hour journey.

They spend all day at mine, my house is quite small.

I get a call three days later to say

1/ they all have flu like symptoms
2/ they all got tested
3/ two are positive and two are negative
4/ we all should get tested

Parents ( no symptoms) got tested twice and are negative, all 6 of us were negative ( no symptoms)

I've told people this story and the reply I get is " Ah , must be different immune systems"

The mantra from March has been 'two metres for more than 15 minutes'

My daughter sat beside my cousin ( positive) for an hour and she was negative, my Mum sat beside the same kid and she was negative too

I don't doubt the existence of the virus nor it's potential to kill but the infection numbers ( dodgy tests) and the direct deaths from Covid ( news says people are dying WITH Covid) are lower than stated

aido79

antgal23 wrote: »

Read a post about the testing procedures and validity

My sister and three sons were at mine two Saturdays ago. They travelled down with my parents, 1.5 hour journey.

They spend all day at mine, my house is quite small.

I get a call three days later to say

1/ they all have flu like symptoms
2/ they all got tested
3/ two are positive and two are negative
4/ we all should get tested

Parents ( no symptoms) got tested twice and are negative, all 6 of us were negative ( no symptoms)

I've told people this story and the reply I get is " Ah , must be different immune systems"

The mantra from March has been 'two metres for more than 15 minutes'

My daughter sat beside my cousin ( positive) for an hour and she was negative, my Mum sat beside the same kid and she was negative too

I don't doubt the existence of the virus nor it's potential to kill but the infection numbers ( dodgy tests) and the direct deaths from Covid ( news says people are dying WITH Covid) are lower than stated

And how is this related to the conspiracy theory surrounding the covid vaccine?

Quiner

nino1 wrote: »

Anyone else able to clarify the above questions?

I never understand why people think there couldn't possibly be collusion. Just look at the guy running WHO. Look at his past. He was a member of an organisation that the US categorised as a terrorist organisation:

"Tedros became a member of the Tigray People's Liberation Front (TPLF), which began a protracted rebellion against the military government and was crucial in the 1991 overthrow of Mengistu Haile Mariam, Ethiopia's Marxist dictator. The victory resulted in swapping out a Amhara-dominated government with one led by Tigray leaders, which led to more than a decade of conflict.

Journalist Abebe Gellaw claims Tedros was one of the top three members of the TPLF and that the party is "ultimately responsible for all the corruption, killings, torture, mass detention, land grab or displacement," he wrote in the Ethiopian Registrar.

The United States State Department has categorized TPLF as a terrorist organization due to its "violent activities before it became part of the ruling coalition and the government of Ethiopia in May 1991.""

https://www.google.ie/amp/s/www.foxnews.com/world/who-chief-tedros-questionable-past-coronavirus.amp

He was also accused of covering up three cholera outbreaks. And yet people trust him and WHO.

And people don't seem to be able to comprehend the idea of there being a virus, but it being taken advantage of to push an agenda. Instead, they spend every day accusing people of denying the existence of the virus. Granted, there are people who deny that the virus exists. But a lot of people simply believe the virus is being taken advantage of.

nino1

Quiner wrote: »

I never understand why people think there couldn't possibly be collusion. Just look at the guy running WHO. Look at his past. He was a member of an organisation that the US categorised as a terrorist organisation:

"Tedros became a member of the Tigray People's Liberation Front (TPLF), which began a protracted rebellion against the military government and was crucial in the 1991 overthrow of Mengistu Haile Mariam, Ethiopia's Marxist dictator. The victory resulted in swapping out a Amhara-dominated government with one led by Tigray leaders, which led to more than a decade of conflict.

Journalist Abebe Gellaw claims Tedros was one of the top three members of the TPLF and that the party is "ultimately responsible for all the corruption, killings, torture, mass detention, land grab or displacement," he wrote in the Ethiopian Registrar.

The United States State Department has categorized TPLF as a terrorist organization due to its "violent activities before it became part of the ruling coalition and the government of Ethiopia in May 1991.""

https://www.google.ie/amp/s/www.foxnews.com/world/who-chief-tedros-questionable-past-coronavirus.amp

He was also accused of covering up three cholera outbreaks. And yet people trust him and WHO.

And people don't seem to be able to comprehend the idea of there being a virus, but it being taken advantage of to push an agenda. Instead, they spend every day accusing people of denying the existence of the virus. Granted, there are people who deny that the virus exists. But a lot of people simply believe the virus is being taken advantage of.

I not one of those that has a completely closed mind to all conspiracy throries. Earlier i have been advocating keeping an open mind and investigating both sides of every argument.

I just want to know exactly what people think the conspiracy is?
Who is in on it, who is not etc etc?

Quiner

nino1 wrote: »

I not one of those that has a completely closed mind to all conspiracy throries. Earlier i have been advocating keeping an open mind and investigating both sides of every argument.

I just want to know exactly what people think the conspiracy is?
Who is in on it, who is not etc etc?

Sorry, I wasn't suggesting that you were closed minded. I was just putting into words my bewilderment as to why people are so willing to trust people like the head of WHO who was an influential member of an organisation the US categorised as a terrorist organisation, and was accused of covering up three cholera outbreaks. And yet the idea that he could possibly be pursuing nefarious goals this time round is impossible in the eyes of the vast majority of people.

I've been wondering the same thing myself. Who is in on it? If there is something goin on then I would say the head of WHO. Klaus Schwab. The Head of the UN, Bill Gates, Fauci, the heads of banks and big corporations, the heads of governments. They're all following the same script. 'new normal', 'build back better', 'universal basic income' etc. Now, I of course accept that I could be wrong. I want to be wrong. I'm just speculating. But as soon as you mention Bill Gates you hear "lizard people", "5G", "microchips" and so on. But the man is probably the most powerful man in the world when it comes to health and vaccines. It's not crazy to believe that he'd be in on it IF there is something going on.

So the above is me speculating. I have no proof, but it's an attempt to answer your question.

Lex Luthor

runawaybishop wrote: »

The mating call of the conspiracy theorist. The 'evidence' is there if you disregard credible sources and go searching for nutjobs.

if you think I'm here to supply links for you to just pick holes in just because they dont agree with your agenda, think again
Then they have them deleted in case they see the wider audience

I presume you are all grown adults and can find them for yourselves

aido79

Quiner wrote: »

Sorry, I wasn't suggesting that you were closed minded. I was just putting into words my bewilderment as to why people are so willing to trust people like the head of WHO who was an influential member of an organisation the US categorised as a terrorist organisation, and was accused of covering up three cholera outbreaks. And yet the idea that he could possibly be pursuing nefarious goals this time round is impossible in the eyes of the vast majority of people.

I've been wondering the same thing myself. Who is in on it? If there is something goin on then I would say the head of WHO. Klaus Schwab. The Head of the UN, Bill Gates, Fauci, the heads of banks and big corporations, the heads of governments. They're all following the same script. 'new normal', 'build back better', 'universal basic income' etc. Now, I of course accept that I could be wrong. I want to be wrong. I'm just speculating. But as soon as you mention Bill Gates you hear "lizard people", "5G", "microchips" and so on. But the man is probably the most powerful man in the world when it comes to health and vaccines. It's not crazy to believe that he'd be in on it IF there is something going on.

So the above is me speculating. I have no proof, but it's an attempt to answer your question.

You've already said that you don't believe there is a conspiracy about the vaccine so why are you still posting in this thread?

What power has Bill Gates got when it comes to health and vaccines? I imagine it's close to zero.

Yet again though you are unable to say what the conspiracy is apart from it might have something to do with rich people and governments like most other conspiracy theories.

nino1

Lex Luthor wrote: »

if you think I'm here to supply links for you to just pick holes in just because they dont agree with your agenda, think again
Then they have them deleted in case they see the wider audience

I presume you are all grown adults and can find them for yourselves

There is little point in you participating in a discussion on a public forum if you are unwilling to back up any claims with evidence especially when it comes to a medical topic.
It you are afraid that your "evidence" will have holes picked in them maybe base your opinions around better evidence rather the one you posted earlier from childrens health defense quoting a study by renowned quack James Lyons-Weiler who makes a fortune from anti-vax events attended also by Andrew Wakefield and who along with wakefield links autism to vaccines

Quiner

aido79 wrote: »

You've already said that you don't believe there is a conspiracy about the vaccine so why are you still posting in this thread?

What power has Bill Gates got when it comes to health and vaccines? I imagine it's close to zero.

Yet again though you are unable to say what the conspiracy is apart from it might have something to do with rich people and governments like most other conspiracy theories.

Sorry, I was just trying to answer the poster's question.

aido79

Quiner wrote: »

Sorry, I was just trying to answer the poster's question.

It read like paranoid nonsense to me but I'll let them decide if their questions were answered.

nino1

aido79 wrote: »

It read like paranoid nonsense to me but I'll let them decide if their questions were answered.

no, still totally in the dark on what the conspiracy actually is and who is involved!

Lex Luthor

nino1 wrote: »

There is little point in you participating in a discussion on a public forum if you are unwilling to back up any claims with evidence especially when it comes to a medical topic.
It you are afraid that your "evidence" will have holes picked in them maybe base your opinions around better evidence rather the one you posted earlier from childrens health defense quoting a study by renowned quack James Lyons-Weiler who makes a fortune from anti-vax events attended also by Andrew Wakefield and who along with wakefield links autism to vaccines

Not a big fan of him but Fauci himself has said there is no point doing a PCR test more than 25 cycles

Does that get much more important for you?

nino1

Lex Luthor wrote: »

Not a big fan of him but Fauci himself has said there is no point doing a PCR test more than 25 cycles

Does that get much more important for you?

I actually agree with you that the number of cycles used could be something that needs to be looked at to reduce the number of positive results that are potentially non-infectious.
Its doesn't make it a conspiracy though as even if the cycles are reduced to 25 cycles cases will still increase (maybe to a lesser extent) and restrictions will need to be introduced to prevent hospitals from being over run which is the point of restrictions