Cycle infrastructure planned for south Dublin

Larbre34

Let the City Council present a comprehensive strategic plan for cycling infrastructure so. And then implement it with the correct planning processes.

Mannix is a member of the Area Committee that covers Sandymount and in fact all City Councillors are entitled weigh in on the conduct of the Council.

I don't agree with him on much, but the black and white terms with which you are attempting to characterise the legitimacy of his involvement, are somewhere between disingenuous and bogus.

Weepsie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117701002#Comment_117701002

You're talking absolute nonsense though. It's such a silly and moot point to bring up several times that This is nothing to do wih impartiality.

Thousands of cycleing journeys, walks and jogs happen along the coast every winter. Like anything, people dress for occasion.

And here's the thing. It's on average warmer in coastal areas than inland in the winter, and vice versa in the summer. There are millions cycling in freezing or sub zero temps around the world in winter. Winter also predominantly southerly, westerly and southeasterly winds.

Easterly winds and northeasterly tend to hit us in spring.

Look it can get cold very cold. But it's colder in ballymun than it is in sandymount, I'd wager it's windier too sometimes due its unique redesign that has made it a wind tunnel on a moderate day.

First Up

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117701279#Comment_117701279

He doesn't have a say. It was ruled on by a judge on matter of law.

Mr. Cats

If anything it’s the rain rather than the cold that is more likely to put somebody off cycling.

I haven’t checked with Met Eireann, and I don’t have anything to back this statement up, but I’m going to dive right in and say that it doesn’t rain more on average on Strand Road than other parts of the city 😂

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117701382#Comment_117701382

There is nobody cycling on the Coastal Mobility Route on wet days. I am looking out my window on a cycle lane and its empty most of the day even when the weather is nice.

Many people including me dont like being boxed into these lanes, no way to get out of the speeding cyclists way,no way to turn right except to get off the bike when previously you could move to the centre of the road and cycle to the right.

I have cycled with traffic all my life and will continue to do so.

Other people wont take up cycling because of cycle lanes that go nowhere because unless you CPO gardens cyclists will continue to exit these two way cycle lanes onto narrow roads.

And no, I dont need to be told about Holland, Holland is completely flat and cycling provision was made before roads were built, it is a tiny, heavily populated country, no point in comparing it to Ireland.

tomasrojo

Dublin is just like the Netherlands just described. It's compact, quite densely populated within the M50 and relatively flat. It's very well suited for more cycling.

tomasrojo

"The cycle lanes are empty all the time" is a trope from all the places that have built infrastructure recently. A road can look busy with 20 people on it in cars and vans. They take up an very large amount of space, even when they're not in use. The same road looks "unused" if 20 people go by in a bus.

tomasrojo

Article about perception of how used infrastructure is there.

https://usa.streetsblog.org/2016/04/01/why-bike-lanes-with-lots-of-bike-traffic-can-still-appear-empty/

I think there are hard data about how used the coastal mobility route is. If there aren't, there will be.

buffalo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117701498#Comment_117701498

"I am looking out my window on a cycle lane and its empty most of the day even when the weather is nice."

There's a road outside my window and it's empty most of the day. Do you think we should get rid of that too? I walk along the canal too, and the train tracks are empty most of the day, must be a sign they're not worth having. 😂

The point is someone is claiming bad weather wont affect the thousands who will be cycling if they get their cycle lane in Sandymount.

Count the number of cyclists on the CMR when its wet, its practically empty for the day.

Its extremely unpleasant cycling in wet and windy conditions on any seafront, not pleasant driving either but at least one is dry.

Weepsie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117701498#Comment_117701498

That's good empirical data you have there. Surprising given cycling is on the rise, particularly for commuting and were due another census (postponed til next year) that might show another shift

BabysCoffee

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117701722#Comment_117701722

Rain or hail, I cycle. It's the only way I can go to work as I have no car and it is quicker than the bus.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117701382#Comment_117701382

Usual response from you. I make a well observed point from experience. You respond with something more insulting than "poppycock" and continue to push your line in the face of reality. 15 to 20 minutes delays, inclement weather, disability and infirmity, creation of rat runs and diversion of traffic to other roads don't exist in your book. Everyone should be on their bikes according to your world view.

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117701498#Comment_117701498

No-one at all using it on wet days, then?

https://twitter.com/MikeMcKillen/status/1327658938649743360

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117701060#Comment_117701060

If you're not away of his history on this topic, you might like to withdraw your suggestion that 'he doesn't have an issue'. He has a long history, even before segregated routes were ever considered.

Weepsie

No, everyone should not be on their bikes. I don't think so. Cars have their place, but dublin is beyond capacity for the amount of cars on their road. Public Transport, Cycling and Walking should all be prioritised though well ahead of cars.

That may well be your observational experience, but if you're going to disagree with an actual meteorological and geographical truth, then there's absolutely no reasoning with you whatsoever.

The only inclement weather that has been bad enough to keep people off bikes in the last 10 years say, are Storm Ophelia and the beast from the east. But they were also weather that we were advised not to drive in too. If you want to go look at some historical weather data, you'll find that Sandymount has a warmer recorded temp than parts of dublin further inland.

More people on bikes, means less cars on roads, leading to better journey times for those who may have to no other option. Space for all and a plan that takes more than a small enclave of opinions.

magicbastarder

i've cycled along the strand road in a 40km/h+ headwind. i (genuinely) think my average speed up howth from the village was faster. but it was great fun; type 2 fun, but fun.

First Up

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117701923#Comment_117701923

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117701923#Comment_117701923

I can't withdraw something I didn't say. Of course Flynn has "issues" with cyclists. Just like most posters here have issues with motorists.

That isn't the point. The objections to the Strand Rd plan are based on the likely consequences and the Courts agree something so drastic needs to be more thoroughly examined.

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117701498#Comment_117701498

You're wrong about Holland they embraced the car post war like every where else. The cycling infrastructure there is not due to anything historical.

Weepsie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117702123#Comment_117702123

Not an issue with motorists, an issue with putting the car first by officialdom for far too long though as a be all and end all of travel. That has to change. Our confestion and travel times in a city this size are absurd. I shouldn't be able to get from the City Centre to Clonee on a bike quicker than someone can do it on a bus, but the reality is I can, and that's not some sort of humblebrag, it just a reality of the congestion of our city at peak hours. I'm also with regularity able to get from City Centre to Finglas quicker than a car, and that's in post covid commuter traffic. All those cars, spending time idling in traffic. Something has to give.

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117702123#Comment_117702123

You said "He doesn't have an issue with cyclists."

Podge_irl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117701498#Comment_117701498

The point regarding cycling provision being made before roads were built is simply a flagrant falsehood. It is incredibly, incredibly wrong.

All new roads require cycle infrastructure yes, but they massively retrofitted their towns and cities after the 70s.

Larbre34

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117702141#Comment_117702141

Actually, that depends on how recent you consider history to be.

The bicycle was popular in the Netherlands from the very infancy of bicycles, because it is as flat as a pancake.

Yes, the private car boomed in post-war recovery, but somehow, by the late 60s, 500 kids per year were being killed on Dutch roads. (I have no clue how other safety measures weren't employed to stem that before it got that bad, it seems bonkers).

Anyway, massive protests in the early 70s against the huge death rate forced the Government to curtail car use (removed parking, increased taxes etc) and it was that that organically lead to an increase in cycling as the only alternative, rather than a promotion of cycling in particular. There is simply no parallel to that in Ireland today.

And for the record, the modal split for personal travel at the present day in Dutch cities is; Private Car 50%, Bikes 40%, Public Transport 10%

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117702659#Comment_117702659

You'd swear Ireland was the Alps the way people go on. Its mostly flat. We don't even have any mountains.

Cycling was popular everywhere until cars became accessible . Including Ireland.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wYMqb0F5aqo&ab_channel=PhilMartin

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4uX1Ji8ToXw&ab_channel=PhilMartin

Flinty997

This is Driving Through 1960s Amsterdam, Netherlands, HD - note the volume of cars and the lack of any cycling infrastructure.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iDDkdSUHokw&ab_channel=thekinolibrary

Podge_irl

Or indeed more recently...

https://twitter.com/Jamesdestafford/status/1278735426312945664

tomasrojo

Check out 70s Amsterdam in Rock Your Baby! The rhythm guitar is mighty fine, the cycling and pedestrian infrastructure, not so much.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P08cLiLOmto

First Up

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117702380#Comment_117702380

Yes, I did - my mistake. I was referring to his objections to the plan to close Strand Rd to traffic but I didn't make that clear.

First Up

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117702215#Comment_117702215

Try making the trip while pulling a truck and see how long it takes.

Compare the world of 1910 with what we have today. I am all in favour of bicycles and cycle lanes but I don't want access to places, goods and services to be limited to what non-motorised transport allows.

The Dutch economy isn't based around people cycling along the canals of Amsterdam. They accomodate both and so should we.

Fighting Tao

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117702916#Comment_117702916

It appears that your focus is on your convenience only. So what type of truck are you driving on Strand Road? Is it permitted on Strand Road, or do you head that route due to lack of enforcement?