US Presidential Election 2020 Thread II - Judgement Day(s)

Francie Barrett

This fella donated $2.5m to Trump's campaign to investigate the vote, now he wants his money back - https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8993305/Pro-Trump-donor-gave-2-5m-help-prove-election-fraud-sues-recover-money.html

It's mad how Trump can lie over and over again, and people just keep lapping it up.

prawnsambo

Quin_Dub wrote: »

She's accused Kemp and Raffensperger of accepting bribes.

Given how vocal Raffensperger has been is pushing back on all the crap he's been getting I'd fully expect him to go after her at least.

And it starts. Dominion have reported her to law enforcement for incitement to target their staff.

Inquitus

PA courts deny motion to prevent certification of results. If you use incognito mode you can bypass the paywall.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/federal-appeals-court-rejects-trump-request-for-emergency-injunction-to-overturn-certification-of-pennsylvanias-election-results/2020/11/27/556540ba-30d7-11eb-bae0-50bb17126614_story.html

A federal appeals court on Friday rejected President Trump’s request for an emergency injunction to overturn the certification of Pennsylvania’s election results.

The Third Circuit Court of Appeals said that the Trump campaign’s challenge of a U.S. district court’s decision had “no merit.”

The court’s sharply worded opinion was written by Judge Stephanos Bibas, who was appointed to the court by Trump.

“Charges of unfairness are serious. But calling an election unfair does not make it so. Charges require specific allegations and then proof. We have neither here,” Bibas wrote.

Quin_Dub

Inquitus wrote: »

PA courts deny motion to prevent certification of results. If you use incognito mode you can bypass the paywall.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/federal-appeals-court-rejects-trump-request-for-emergency-injunction-to-overturn-certification-of-pennsylvanias-election-results/2020/11/27/556540ba-30d7-11eb-bae0-50bb17126614_story.html

Not surprising of course and just as importantly it was an all Republican bench of Judges that handed down the decision including one appointed by Trump..

Of course they'll all be RINOs now, but at least they have been robbed of the "Democrat Judges" angle

TomOnBoard

Quin_Dub wrote: »

Not surprising of course and just as importantly it was an all Republican bench of Judges that handed down the decision including one appointed by Trump..

Of course they'll all be RINOs now, but at least they have been robbed of the "Democrat Judges" angle

The judgement, written by Bibas (a Trump appointed Judge) was a fitting follow on to Judge Brann's District Court judgement and both are really worth reading. Such pearls of justice as “Free, fair elections are the lifeblood of our democracy. Charges of unfairness are serious. But calling an election unfair does not make it so. Charges require specific allegations and then proof. We have neither here,” and “Voters, not lawyers, choose the president. Ballots, not briefs, decide elections,” are for the ages!

Inquitus

TomOnBoard wrote: »

The judgement, written by Bibas (a Trump appointed Judge) was a fitting follow on to Judge Brann's District Court judgement and both are really worth reading. Such pearls of justice as “Free, fair elections are the lifeblood of our democracy. Charges of unfairness are serious. But calling an election unfair does not make it so. Charges require specific allegations and then proof. We have neither here,” and “Voters, not lawyers, choose the president. Ballots, not briefs, decide elections,” are for the ages!

Aye no judge, no matter who appointed them, is going to rule in Trump's favour on these issues, given the complete lack of evidence. As mentioned above the SCOTUS Judges are not going to tarnish and ruin their standing just because Trump appointed them, its one thing to rule in a conservative fashion on a keenly contested point of law, quite another to undermine the US Democracy by considering these frivolous motions which lack any sort of evidence. The SCOTUS judges can be impeached in the same manner as the president, impeachment in the House followed by a trial in the Senate, and if they tried to undermine US Democracy as a quid pro quo for Trump, there can be little doubt that Impeachment would happen rather quickly, whether or not a conviction in the Senate ensues or not.

This is exactly why we have seen all these cases dismissed in the lower courts, even by Republican or Trump nominees, they rule on the Law not on a Quid pro Quo with Trump, and we can expect to see this continue unless proper evidence of a corrupt election were available, and lets be straight, its not.

spacecoyote

So much winning continues. The Wisconsin recount demanded by Trump has resulted in Biden gaining votes

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/nov/28/joe-biden-gains-votes-in-wisconsin-county-after-trump-ordered-recount

prawnsambo

spacecoyote wrote: »

So much winning continues. The Wisconsin recount demanded by Trump has resulted in Biden gaining votes

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/nov/28/joe-biden-gains-votes-in-wisconsin-county-after-trump-ordered-recount

Cost him $3 million to lose 132 votes. That must rankle.

Itssoeasy

It’s a bad sign when one of the judges appointed under your term(and in trumps mind that means on his side) basically laughed his case out of the courtroom. You’d think if there was actual fraud on any scale they’d argue that in court documents, but they don’t, they yell it from upon high outside the court but then inside don’t allege it at all. It might have been here but Sidney Powell redacted the name of the person she alleges was a witness to fraud. I mean surely that’d be the one thing you wouldn’t redact. It’s a joke at this stage except I can’t imagine Americans find it that funny.

Water John

prawnsambo wrote: »

Cost him $3 million to lose 132 votes. That must rankle.

Cost some other eejits, cost Trump nothing I'd be sure.

TomOnBoard

It looks like the Trumpists in the GOP are still forging ahead with the attempted election of POTUS Donald via the Plan B, previously outlined. Despite having been knocked back every single time in Courts all across the so-called battleground States, Pennsylvania legislators are proceeding with a resolution to have the Presidential Election nullified and allow the State legislature to decide its slate of electors for the Electoral College vote next month.

Following the alleged 'hearing' in Gettysburg this week, which was really only a bat**** crazy presser, PA GOP legislators were invited to the White House to meet Trump. The content of that meeting has not been disclosed, but 2 days later, State Senator Mastriano proposed the resolution. A mirror is being prepared for the PA House.

The resolution itself is based on all the bolloxology previously thrown out of courts, and it seeks to have the Governor and Sec of State withdraw any certifications and allow the legislature to decide who goes to the EC. Of course, the Gov/SoS won't do that; but, thats not what Plan B wants. Once the resolution is passed, and rejected by the Gov/SoS, it will give Mastriano and his ilk the platform to argue that the elections are in dispute, and Article II of the Constitution can be invoked. Now, you may well say, its off the wall and hasn't a prayer. But Plan B is a Hail Mary that depends on all the losses in Court and the kerrrrazy Sidney Powell cases that can't succed either, being used to give Rep legislatures the cover to ignore certification.

In my mind, Trumpists have been aiming for such a denial of certification, ever since Nov 5. I had hoped Plan B would have been made impossible by now; sadly, it still remains on the table and is still being actively worked on, with the passive and silent 'wait and see' stance of most GOP Congress- men/women. While its chances of succeeding are low, its continued existence is creating a deep wound that will be very hard to heal.

listermint

Sounds like Parler waffle tbh.

Brian?

TomOnBoard wrote: »

It looks like the Trumpists in the GOP are still forging ahead with the attempted election of POTUS Donald via the Plan B, previously outlined. Despite having been knocked back every single time in Courts all across the so-called battleground States, Pennsylvania legislators are proceeding with a resolution to have the Presidential Election nullified and allow the State legislature to decide its slate of electors for the Electoral College vote next month.

Following the alleged 'hearing' in Gettysburg this week, which was really only a bat**** crazy presser, PA GOP legislators were invited to the White House to meet Trump. The content of that meeting has not been disclosed, but 2 days later, State Senator Mastriano proposed the resolution. A mirror is being prepared for the PA House.

The resolution itself is based on all the bolloxology previously thrown out of courts, and it seeks to have the Governor and Sec of State withdraw any certifications and allow the legislature to decide who goes to the EC. Of course, the Gov/SoS won't do that; but, thats not what Plan B wants. Once the resolution is passed, and rejected by the Gov/SoS, it will give Mastriano and his ilk the platform to argue that the elections are in dispute, and Article II of the Constitution can be invoked. Now, you may well say, its off the wall and hasn't a prayer. But Plan B is a Hail Mary that depends on all the losses in Court and the kerrrrazy Sidney Powell cases that can't succed either, being used to give Rep legislatures the cover to ignore certification.

In my mind, Trumpists have been aiming for such a denial of certification, ever since Nov 5. I had hoped Plan B would have been made impossible by now; sadly, it still remains on the table and is still being actively worked on, with the passive and silent 'wait and see' stance of most GOP Congress- men/women. While its chances of succeeding are low, its continued existence is creating a deep wound that will be very hard to heal.

If that happens then Biden still has 286 and wins.


I can’t see it happening.

TomOnBoard

Brian? wrote: »

If that happens then Biden still has 286 and wins.


I can’t see it happening.

That's not the point at all. Anyone with a titter of wit at this stage (obviously this excludes the likes of Rudey and Jenna Ellis) can see that Plan B is doomed to failure. The point I am making is not that it will succeed, but that it is still being played out and is being supported by the GOPpers in Congress (with very few exceptions), either by public support for it by some, or by silence from the rest of them. The Congressional GOP complicity is made exponentially worse when one sees the extent to which many Trump voters actually believe the BS that underpins Plan B, and will believe that the election was stolen from Trump (it wasn't) and that the Democrats perpetrated a major fraud (they didn't), for years to come. That, coupled with the ongoing grift that is robbing them blind through demands for donations to fund the legal 'actions', is setting the USA up for internal political chaos, and hatreds that will not just disappear when Trump leaves the White House. The already difficult landscape that is about to be inherited by the Biden/Harris Presidency is being poisoned more and more every day by treacherous undermining of its electoral system, its Government and its judiciary.

Tell me how

TomOnBoard wrote: »

That's not the point at all. Anyone with a titter of wit at this stage (obviously this excludes the likes of Rudey and Jenna Ellis) can see that Plan B is doomed to failure. The point I am making is not that it will succeed, but that it is still being played out and is being supported by the GOPpers in Congress (with very few exceptions), either by public support for it by some, or by silence from the rest of them. The Congressional GOP complicity is made exponentially worse when one sees the extent to which many Trump voters actually believe the BS that underpins Plan B, and will believe that the election was stolen from Trump (it wasn't) and that the Democrats perpetrated a major fraud (they didn't), for years to come. That, coupled with the ongoing grift that is robbing them blind through demands for donations to fund the legal 'actions', is setting the USA up for internal political chaos, and hatreds that will not just disappear when Trump leaves the White House. The already difficult landscape that is about to be inherited by the Biden/Harris Presidency is being poisoned more and more every day by treacherous undermining of its electoral system, its Government and its judiciary.

I wonder are GOP people operating under some broad strategy, or are they all working in clusters or of their own devices in determining whether or not to support Trump/Giuliani/Powell or a combination of them and others?

Politics in the US, in spite of the dominance of the Democrat and Republican Party is hard to decipher in terms of an overarching Party policy as opposed to the personal interests of dominant players within both parties. Understandable to a degree given the size and variation of the country but they are much less cohesive units than what we see in Ireland or in the UK for example.

You can only imagine what is going on in group chats and text messages of some of the key players. Whatever about Hunter Biden's laptop, the security and encryption on Mitch McConnell's or Lyndsey Graham's or Nancy Pelosi's cell phones mush be pretty robust. I imagine the market within some circles for the content of such devices would be pretty valuable.

Windmill100000

Trump set it up from the off: staying the only way he can lose is if there is fraud. I mean, really? That was his safety net.

His supporters will hold onto this FOREVER and no amount of evidence to the contrary is going to change that.

Best thing anyone can do is ignore it. Dont give his supporters any credit by challenging them.

They will look even more stupid when no one listens to their cries and their argument. In time, will become weaker and weaker as a result.

ancapailldorcha

Mod: Linkdump deleted.

TomOnBoard

Tell me how wrote: »

I wonder are GOP people operating under some broad strategy, or are they all working in clusters or of their own devices in determining whether or not to support Trump/Giuliani/Powell or a combination of them and others?

Politics in the US, in spite of the dominance of the Democrat and Republican Party is hard to decipher in terms of an overarching Party policy as opposed to the personal interests of dominant players within both parties. Understandable to a degree given the size and variation of the country but they are much less cohesive units than what we see in Ireland or in the UK for example.

You can only imagine what is going on in group chats and text messages of some of the key players. Whatever about Hunter Biden's laptop, the security and encryption on Mitch McConnell's or Lyndsey Graham's or Nancy Pelosi's cell phones mush be pretty robust. I imagine the market within some circles for the content of such devices would be pretty valuable.

There is a great piece of reporting in the WaPo which deals with these points as it lays out the totally bat**** crazy shenannigans from various parts of Trump's 'well-oiled machine' over the 20+ days since the election.

It's worth a read on the WaPo website if you have a sub (or try incognito mode). Anyway, I've found a summary here:

https://www.rawstory.com/2020/11/trump-endangered-americas-democracy-presidents-delusion-broken-down-in-brutal-wapo-analysis/

Edit: For anyone interested in getting in-depth reporting on the likely tumult over the next month or so in the US, the WaPo has a BlackFriday 1 month trial sub for $1. New York Times has a similar deal if you'd prefer not to give Bezos any more $$- its 2 bucks a month for a year, cancellable anytime.

Harry Palmr

Just a note to say I've be able to open that story twice without hindrance, maybe they will leave it open for a few days.

Carfacemandog

Wapo give a certain number of free articles a month. After that, you have to pay...

...or open links in incognito browser which stops it from noticing you have hit your free article limit.

Arizona and Wisconsin certify for Biden.

dogbert27

DubInMeath wrote: »

Arizona and Wisconsin certify for Biden.

At what stage do the rats jump the sinking ship and try to save themselves?

If the EC certify Biden will Trump give up on the law suits or will can he try to get the Supreme Court to overturn the EC?

He said yesterday the world was laughing at the US for Biden winning a fraud election.

He's completely out of touch with reality if he believes that's the reason the world is laughing at the US right now. :rolleyes:

Quin_Dub

dogbert27 wrote: »

At what stage do the rats jump the sinking ship and try to save themselves?

If the EC certify Biden will Trump give up on the law suits or will can he try to get the Supreme Court to overturn the EC?

He said yesterday the world was laughing at the US for Biden winning a fraud election.

He's completely out of touch with reality if he believes that's the reason the world is laughing at the US right now. :rolleyes:

Well, they are laughing at the US right now , but the laughter is directed at him and the GOP for enabling his utter delusion.

dogbert27

Trumps campaign lawyer saying Chris Krebs should be executed for stating the election was secure.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9003843/Trumps-campaign-lawyer-says-fired-cybersecurity-chief-Chris-Krebs-executed.html#comments

It's almost Simpsonsesque that Trump and his team can say virtually anything they want or tweet anything they want without legal repercussions.

This is weeks after a planned abduction on a governor and Fauci having to hire security for him and his family after attacks in the media from Trump and his people.

Quin_Dub

dogbert27 wrote: »

Trumps campaign lawyer saying Chris Krebs should be executed for stating the election was secure.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9003843/Trumps-campaign-lawyer-says-fired-cybersecurity-chief-Chris-Krebs-executed.html#comments

It's almost Simpsonsesque that Trump and his team can say virtually anything they want or tweet anything they want without legal repercussions.

This is weeks after a planned abduction on a governor and Fauci having to hire security for him and his family after attacks in the media from Trump and his people.

Sidney Powell retweeted this..

A call for the use of the Insurrection Act followed by Military tribunals.



Variously his "team have been calling for people to be shot, beheaded or summarily jailed and now they are calling for a Military take over and a suspension of Democratic process.

And yet with a few exceptions we have absolute silence from the elected GOP officials.

dogbert27

Quin_Dub wrote: »

Sidney Powell retweeted this..

A call for the use of the Insurrection Act followed by Military tribunals.



Variously his "team have been calling for people to be shot, beheaded or summarily jailed and now they are calling for a Military take over and a suspension of Democratic process.

And yet with a few exceptions we have absolute silence from the elected GOP officials.

It says it all about Sidney Powell really when even the Trump team distanced themselves from her! :pac:

Brussels Sprout

A progressive organisation is targeting Trump voters in Georgia:

https://twitter.com/CursedLavaLamp/status/1333597793739534338

duploelabs

Brussels Sprout wrote: »

A progressive organisation is targeting Trump voters in Georgia:

https://twitter.com/CursedLavaLamp/status/1333597793739534338

Like the snake eating itself

Quin_Dub

Brussels Sprout wrote: »

A progressive organisation is targeting Trump voters in Georgia:

https://twitter.com/CursedLavaLamp/status/1333597793739534338

The Run-off elections were always going to be fairly close , but the absolute shambles that Trump is causing really puts the Senate at risk for the GOP.

It just proves what has long been clear to many , Trump does not care about the GOP , he cares about himself and only himself.

If blowing up Georgia makes him feel better , then that is what he will do regardless of the impact to anyone else.

serfboard

Brussels Sprout wrote: »

A progressive organisation is targeting Trump voters in Georgia

That's a very clever ad - splitting the GOP between Trumpists and everyone else. Given the "stab-in-the-back" mythology that Trumpists will be going on with now the message is - your messiah has been betrayed by your tribal elders, so now is your chance to punish those elders for their treachery.