How will schools be able to go back in September? (Continued)

khalessi

smellyoldboot wrote: »

No, but you would have to agree the optics of multiple strikes in the not too distant past for better pay/conditions versus compliance with a plan a lot of teachers apparently don't support don't now paint a great picture.

THis is my post 9276 on coronavirus page 619

These and many more concerns have been raised on FB, here, the radio, newspapers, Twitter and in my own head.

The Dept have not been so forthcoming. We looked at MM in a school the other day that has a total of 196 students and perspex sheeting lowered from ceiling. Lovely optics all for pr. How about going into the biggest secondary school or looking at a variety of schools. Maybe class photos should be put up on internet for comparison.

Should teachers stay stum and not complain about the lack of health and safety for students? Even the Depts own plans have students 40cm apart on the plans. Perspex is lovely but the teacher cannnot stand behind it all day, that isnt teaching. A lot of schools are not providing perspex.

How consistent is it that a 12 year old secondary student on a bus has to wear a mask but a 12 year primary student doesnt?

Students with special educational needs are being further disadvantaged as their Speacial education teacher will be covering all over school for absences. These children are on the backfoot already.

My school is one of 16 schools put together in a group for 4 substitute teachers covering absences.

There is no thought really post the day 1 reopening of schools. What about children who get sick and cannot be collected, I hav often seen children waiting an hour or so as parents are in a difficult position getting off work.

What about parents of children who are at risk who are worried about being chased by TUSLA? Where is the planning for that? Why wasn't the Dept working on a plan for them or any parent who wishes to keep their child home?

I think the Dept has let down parents, children, and teachers. Parents are told that they are the primary educators in our constitution but there has been no back up plan if they decide to keep children home and worry about TUSLA.

Back in March HCW were not being provided with proper PPE and had to bring this to public attention eventually getting a committment from gov to supply PPE brought in by plane from China.

Would it have been better if HCWs kept quiet?

Now numbers have fallen in our hopsitals and ICU but the schools have been closed and all experts admit sending them back is a high risk. Teachers have been working hard to get schools reopen but they are voicing the dangers.

Do you think they should stay quiet and say nothing or voice concerns get them sorted and make sure the environment is as safe as possible for children?

Personally I am concerned but I have worked in highly infectious environments before and not caught anything not brought anything home. However in that cases proper efforts were made to protect the workers.

There will be pockets of crises when the schools reopen but hopefully they will be dealt with properly. There is a vacuum of leadership from the top of the Dept down and that should be fixed.

These have been voiced and dismissed on different media platforms as teachers whining.

i_surge

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

You do know that your ire being directed at the school is directed at that wrong people. Schools are only implementing what they have been given. We have been saying for the past month that the guidelines are pure muck.

Better than silence? wtf Of course concerns should be raised

You come here complaining that it is all wrong but do nothing. In many ways it is worse.

i_surge

Quantum Erasure wrote: »

Well, that's going to be the case anyway, no matter what opens, and we have to get back to some sort of normality, rather open the schools than pubs and nightclubs

WHY???????

wirelessdude01

i_surge wrote: »

Better than silence? wtf Of course concerns should be raised

You come here complaining that it is all wrong but do nothing. In many ways it is worse.

So tell us teachers what you think we should be doing instead???????

i_surge

khalessi wrote: »

I know it is hard but how about making a coherent argument without using cliches such as money, holidays or teachers are cowards/lazy.

I don't like any of that public servant bashing ignorance here but teachers are showing themselves to be cowardly. I can't see it another way. Should be resisting the collective guilt trip that we "have to get schools reopened".

I wouldn't accept working in an environment that is simply inadequate. FULL STOP.

You have had also had 6 months to save up to provide some security for hard decisions if needs be.

i_surge

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

So tell us teachers what you think we should be doing instead???????

Striking and not turning up for work until they get it right. Backbone man, backbone

khalessi

i_surge wrote: »

I don't like any of that public servant bashing ignorance here but teachers are showing themselves to be cowardly. I can't see it another way. Should be resisting the collective guilt trip that we "have to get schools reopened".

I wouldn't accepting working in an environment that is simply inadequate. FULL STOP.

You have had also had 6 months to save up to provide some security for hard decisions if needs be.

Super answer there how many cliches? Good for you and what you wouldn't do. I on the otherhand cannot afford covid payment as I am a single parent. So you shout from the roof tops there are many steps to be taken before strike.

youandme13

downthemiddle wrote: »

Shocking response. What an embarrassment.

How is that a shocking response?


Anyways, I dont think the schools will be open long especially after seeing 41 schools in Berlin close again less than two weeks after opening, and then cases rising again all across Europe.

Children of every age have been affected in Berlin so there goes that theory people had that children dont get infected!!

wirelessdude01

i_surge wrote: »

Striking and not turning up for work until they get it right. Backbone man, backbone

You and striking. Have you anything else to suggest? You've got such a hard on for us to go striking and probably be the first on boards to ridicule us if we did. Damned if we do, damned if we don't.

As an aside I've seen a school near to us timetable an 8 day soft opening at secondary level so that they can see how things are and adapt as they go/see fit. They are getting torn apart on social media as they 'aren't just getting on with it' , 'are soft'. Those are comments I've seen.

khalessi

youandme13 wrote: »

How is that a shocking response?


Anyways, I dont think the schools will be open long especially after seeing 41 schools in Berlin close again less than two weeks after opening, and then cases rising again all across Europe.

Children of every age have been affected in Berlin so there goes that theory people had that children dont get infected!!

57 percent rise in Scotland which they are putting down to a meat factory, interesting it happened 2 weeks after schools reopened.

i_surge

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

You and striking. Have you anything else to suggest? You've got such a hard on for us to go striking and probably be the first on boards to ridicule us if we did. Damned if we do, damned if we don't.

As an aside I've seen a school near to us timetable an 8 day soft opening at secondary level so that they can see how things are and adapt as they go/see fit. They are getting torn apart on social media as they 'aren't just getting on with it' , 'are soft'. Those are comments I've seen.

No I would support you.

You could at least achieve some fair compromises if you weren't failing to act up.

i_surge

I also remember from my school days even in primary the wave of good intentions from my self and others at the start of September all completely abandoned by mid October.

Complacency and error will kick in if ye manage to stay open that long.

freak scence

jesus all the teachers will be too hungover to do anything next week by the looks of things

wirelessdude01

i_surge wrote: »

You could at least achieve some fair compromises if you weren't failing to act up.

If you say so, think is teachers know how things actually work.

Sunday Sunday

i_surge wrote: »

Striking and not turning up for work until they get it right. Backbone man, backbone

Striking won't solve much, we're all in a bad situation. Everyone knows it, which is also why unions are so quiet about the whole thing.

I don't think teachers lack backbone for not striking, quite the opposite in fact.

It's easy to shout for strike action when it won't impact you at all.

i_surge

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

If you say so, think is teachers know how things actually work.

Anyway, I know you have been put in a very hard position, not of your own choice and have been failed by the groups supposed to protect you.

Elliejo

I_surge, correct me if I am wrong, but did you not say you weren't a teacher and that you are not a parent of school-going children? Can you explain your agenda on this thread please.

i_surge

Sunday Sunday wrote: »

Striking won't solve much, we're all in a bad situation. Everyone knows it, which is also why unions are so quiet about the whole thing.

I don't think teachers lack backbone for not striking, quite the opposite in fact.

It's easy to shout for strike action when it won't impact you at all.

What is this secret sauce teachers have that you both complain about and accept bad situations in the same sentence?

i_surge

Elliejo wrote: »

I_surge, correct me if I am wrong, but did you not say you weren't a teacher and that you are not a parent of school-going children? Can you explain your agenda on this thread please.

Public health and an aversion to repeating avoidable mistakes, a hatred for ineptitude.

Scoondal

What were schools doing in May and June ?
Perhaps some people have had a positive experience.
Could they not have maintained a physical contact for just 2 hours per week for 2 or 3 pupils at a time.
I saw a huge dis-engagement from my son doing home schooling when I told him in May that there was no more school. He mentally gave up. For an 8 year old, another 4 months after 2 months home schooling is like never.
And he keeps asking "Daddy, when will coronavirus be gone ?"
I used to answer "soon". Now I just say "things are getting better".

wirelessdude01

Sunday Sunday wrote: »

It's easy to shout for strike action when it won't impact you at all.

This 100%. That poster by their own admission has zero skin in the game. They've been calling for strikes for at least 2/3 weeks.

i_surge

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

This 100%. That poster by their own admission has zero skin in the game. They've been calling for strikes for at least 2/3 weeks.

I do have skin in the game, indirectly. We all do.

Our collective behaviour matters.

Elliejo

i_surge wrote: »

Public health and an aversion to repeating avoidable mistakes, a hatred for ineptitude.

So how did your workplace deal with the situation?

scrubs33

Interesting that the Dáil is to be recalled but only after schools go back according to RTE.

i_surge

Elliejo wrote: »

So how did your workplace deal with the situation?

I work for myself, thankfully.

I have quit other jobs on ethical grounds. So I have put my money where my mouth is where I did have direct skin in the game.

Sunday Sunday

i_surge wrote: »

What is this secret sauce teachers have that you both complain about and accept bad situations in the same sentence?

Where did I complain about teachers? I think it will take guts for them to go back into an unknown environment, we are in a bad situation, everyone accepts that.

wirelessdude01

scrubs33 wrote: »

Interesting that the Dáil is to be recalled but only after schools go back according to RTE.

Avoiding any potential calls for changes to the plan.

khalessi

Scoondal wrote: »

What were schools doing in May and June ?
Perhaps some people have had a positive experience.
Could they not have maintained a physical contact for just 2 hours per week for 2 or 3 pupils at a time.
I saw a huge dis-engagement from my son doing home schooling when I told him in May that there was no more school. He mentally gave up. For an 8 year old, another 4 months after 2 months home schooling is like never.
And he keeps asking "Daddy, when will coronavirus be gone ?"
I used to answer "soon". Now I just say "things are getting better".

May June Teaching
Daily contact by phone with most of the kids who wanted it. THey could ring me or ask online for me to ring them
Also contact with the parents who wanted/needed it, they had my phone number to vent, ask questions, chat.
I worked up until the last day.
July August CPD courses and plans for September

i_surge

Sunday Sunday wrote: »

everyone accepts that.

And that is the failure behind it all, which no one here is resisting.

Let's go back on topic, one person was suggesting that another should not raise their valid concerns at a work meeting. That is too much.

i_surge

Sunday Sunday wrote: »

Where did I complain about teachers? I think it will take guts for them to go back into an unknown environment, we are in a bad situation, everyone accepts that.

You misread what I said. Teachers and others, aka you have drank some secret sauce that you can both condemn and entertain the same set of circumstances in the same breath.

If it is wrong it is wrong.