How will schools be able to go back in September? (Continued)

Spanish Eyes · 22-08-2020 09:57PM

I thought schools were back next week? So title of thread is a bit confusing.

I've no schoolgoing kids now, so I speak without any knowledge of the startback dates apart from what I heard and read. lol.

I wish you all well, parents and teachers must be bricking it. Just hope the kids don't pick up on the vibe.

smellyoldboot · 22-08-2020 09:57PM

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

You do know that your ire being directed at the school is directed at that wrong people. Schools are only implementing what they have been given. We have been saying for the past month that the guidelines are pure muck.

And where has been the stand from teachers/principals in this regard? But the same principals will report to Tusla absences based on not walking your kids into face the fire in this ****show. "Just doing my job" yet again.

Loafing Oaf · 22-08-2020 09:59PM

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

I thought schools were back next week? So title of thread is a bit confusing.

I guess it's kind of the traditional 'back to school' month. Whenever this thread was launched late August/early September probably seemed interchangeable...

downthemiddle · 22-08-2020 09:59PM

smellyoldboot wrote: »

When not one link in the chain sticks their neck out and says "Hey this isn't right" then all are equally culpable for both design and implementation of a terrible plan. Just doing my job, just isn't good enough.

Do you honestly think principals are happy with what is expected of them? Who in their right mind would want the responsibility that rests on their shoulders? Can you picture the media scrum outside the first school with an outbreak? Do you really believe they haven't voiced their concerns?

byhookorbycrook · 22-08-2020 10:00PM

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

I thought schools were back next week? So title of thread is a bit confusing.

I've no schoolgoing kids now, so I speak without any knowledge of the startback dates apart from what I heard and read. lol.

I wish you all well, parents and teachers must be bricking it. Just hope the kids don't pick up on the vibe.

Our staff are in from Monday( though various groups have been in and out all through the summer ) Children are back in on Thursday .

Spanish Eyes · 22-08-2020 10:03PM

Loafing Oaf wrote: »

I guess it's kind of the traditional 'back to school' month. Whenever this thread was launched late August/early September probably seemed interchangeable...

Gotcha. I suppose by first week in Sep all will have returned.

It's a trying time for everyone with kids going to school for sure. My brother has a SEN kid in a special school, and the bus situation is causing a lot of stress in that household, god love them all. The parents want her to go back for socialisation and so on, but it is a worry, because she is vulnerable to infection.

downthemiddle · 22-08-2020 10:03PM

smellyoldboot wrote: »

And where has been the stand from teachers/principals in this regard? But the same principals will report to Tusla absences based on not walking your kids into face the fire in this ****show. "Just doing my job" yet again.

They will report because they are legally obliged to report.
It has been said all along that the power to make a difference in this fiasco lies firmly with parents. Anything else will be portrayed as "moany teachers who don't want to work". We've seen plenty of it on this thread when genuine concerns were raised by teachers. Now the reality is finally dawning on people that this is a recipe for disaster, but yet again in some people's eyes teachers are to blame.

wirelessdude01 · 22-08-2020 10:03PM

smellyoldboot wrote: »

And where has been the stand from teachers/principals in this regard? But the same principals will report to Tusla absences based on not walking your kids into face the fire in this ****show. "Just doing my job" yet again.

Direct your ire to your local TDs, the government, the department, the papers, the media. Schools can only do so much. As it stands, by law we have report absences of 20+ to Risks, so yes we are just doing out job as outlined by law.

Loads of us have raised concerns. Sure you see the attitude on here of 'just get on with it', 'lazy teachers'. This mirrors what alot of the general public think.

Parents need to raise holy war about this.

smellyoldboot · 22-08-2020 10:04PM

downthemiddle wrote: »

Do you honestly think principals are happy with what is expected of them? Who in their right mind would want the responsibility that rests on their shoulders? Can you picture the media scrum outside the first school with an outbreak? Do you really believe they haven't voiced their concerns?

Should we absolve anybody of responsibility as long as they "voiced their concerns" and didn't really want to go through with, but stuck the head down and did it anyway. Would that stand up in a court/tribunal? Is that the only standard we aim for?

byhookorbycrook · 22-08-2020 10:05PM

smellyoldboot wrote: »

And where has been the stand from teachers/principals in this regard? But the same principals will report to Tusla absences based on not walking your kids into face the fire in this ****show. "Just doing my job" yet again.

Twitter / Facebook / newsmakers and radio and even some boards fora have been filled with school staff discussing the plans for returning to work . Unfortunately, this got painted as “ whining teachers “ ( have a look back over this thread for loads of examples .) Media/ the DES won’t listen to school staff , parents need to make their voices known .

nyarlothothep · 22-08-2020 10:07PM

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

Go on, tell us how?

The first rule of Project Mayhem...

smellyoldboot · 22-08-2020 10:09PM

byhookorbycrook wrote: »

Twitter / Facebook / newsmakers and radio and even some boards fora have been filled with school staff discussing the plans for returning to work . Unfortunately, this got painted as “ whining teachers “ ( have a look back over this thread for loads of examples .) Media/ the DES won’t listen to school staff , parents need to make their voices known .

Well my (and plenty of other like me) stand, will result in the machinations of the state being sought out by those same "concerned" education professionals. But they won't do the same.

Now if there was money on the table.....

khalessi · 22-08-2020 10:10PM

smellyoldboot wrote: »

Should we absolve anybody of responsibility as long as they "voiced their concerns" and didn't really want to go through with, but stuck the head down and did it anyway. Would that stand up in a court/tribunal? Is that the only standard we aim for?

Give it a week. The best thing at the moment is for teacher to implement the government plans as best they can. It needs to be given a chance and we will keep the chldren as safe as possible and when if starts to fail they will notice.

If you are on twitter look at the tweets of Dr. Mairead De Burca she has been among the many teachers voicing concern on this topic and writing about itl

wirelessdude01 · 22-08-2020 10:11PM

smellyoldboot wrote: »

Well my (and plenty of other like me) stand, will result in the machinations of the state being sought out by those same "concerned" education professionals. But they won't do the same.

Now if there was money on the table.....

Just direct your ire in the proper direction and make sure to go public with it. Schools aren't the enemy.

wirelessdude01 · 22-08-2020 10:14PM

khalessi wrote: »

If you are on twitter look at the tweets of Dr. Mairead De Burca she has been among the many teachers voicing concern on this topic and writing about itl

Plenty more including a lot of principals publicly disparaging the plan. MSM finally beginning to pick holes in it but we await the likes of the NPC to voice their concerns. They've been broadly supportive of it.

Hopefully once the reality becomes apparent the parent body will rise up.

Quantum Erasure · 22-08-2020 10:26PM

brendanwalsh wrote: »

...
anyone who dies will be written off as an unfrotuante consequence of having to reopen society and the virus we have no cure for, and of course ever death will have an addendum - 'had underlying health conditions' as if that makes it ok that they died.

FUKCING disgraceful government

martin and leo, SHAME ON YOU.

Well, that's going to be the case anyway, no matter what opens, and we have to get back to some sort of normality, rather open the schools than pubs and nightclubs

Blondini · 22-08-2020 10:26PM

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

Plenty more including a lot of principals publicly disparaging the plan. MSM finally beginning to pick holes in it but we await the likes of the NPC to voice their concerns. They've been broadly supportive of it.

Hopefully once the reality becomes apparent the parent body will rise up.

I assume at this stage the unions are happy to let their members return ...

They've been silent really.

khalessi · 22-08-2020 10:28PM

Blondini wrote: »

I assume at this stage the unions are happy to let their members return ...

They've been silent really.

ASTI questioning a few things but I think they are on the downlow and letting guidelines speak for themselves, see what happens with them next week.

wirelessdude01 · 22-08-2020 10:33PM

Blondini wrote: »

I assume at this stage the unions are happy to let their members return ...

They've been silent really.

Personally think the unions are better keeping their powder dry. They have to be seen to be broadly supportive of getting schools open. If they went the other way the media would be full of 'powerful teacher unions close down the country' type headlines.

downthemiddle · 22-08-2020 10:33PM

smellyoldboot wrote: »

Well my (and plenty of other like me) stand, will result in the machinations of the state being sought out by those same "concerned" education professionals. But they won't do the same.

Now if there was money on the table.....

Yeah every teacher values money over their health. SMH.

Warbeastrior · 22-08-2020 10:37PM

Quantum Erasure wrote:

Well, that's going to be the case anyway, no matter what opens, and we have to get back to some sort of normality, rather open the schools than pubs and nightclubs

Rather open the schools in a manner that will keep to the safety guidelines that the rest of the working public get to avail off than pubs and nightclubs

Fixed it for ya.

khalessi · 22-08-2020 10:37PM

smellyoldboot wrote: »

Well my (and plenty of other like me) stand, will result in the machinations of the state being sought out by those same "concerned" education professionals. But they won't do the same.

Now if there was money on the table.....

I know it is hard but how about making a coherent argument without using cliches such as money, holidays or teachers are cowards/lazy.

BonsaiKitten · 22-08-2020 10:38PM

Blondini wrote: »

I assume at this stage the unions are happy to let their members return ...

They've been silent really.

I saw John Boyle (INTO head for those who don't know) sent a very harsh, unfeeling email to a high risk teacher. She posted it on Twitter. https://mobile.twitter.com/Lainey_75/status/1296501098178662400?s=20

Based on that and his past behaviour on national TV (remember him showing Virgin Media how an infant room should run?) I think he knows it's dangerous alright, just doesn't really care.

wirelessdude01 · 22-08-2020 10:46PM

BonsaiKitten wrote: »

I saw John Boyle (INTO head for those who don't know) sent a very harsh, unfeeling email to a high risk teacher. She posted it on Twitter. https://mobile.twitter.com/Lainey_75/status/1296501098178662400?s=20

Based on that and his past behaviour on national TV (remember him showing Virgin Media how an infant room should run?) I think he knows it's dangerous alright, just doesn't really care.

I actually can't stand the man. Had dealings with him when he was still a CEC rep. Arrogant boar.

He couldn't even get the fact that there is no SD needed in an infant class correct.

downthemiddle · 22-08-2020 10:57PM

BonsaiKitten wrote: »

I saw John Boyle (INTO head for those who don't know) sent a very harsh, unfeeling email to a high risk teacher. She posted it on Twitter. https://mobile.twitter.com/Lainey_75/status/1296501098178662400?s=20

Based on that and his past behaviour on national TV (remember him showing Virgin Media how an infant room should run?) I think he knows it's dangerous alright, just doesn't really care.

Shocking response. What an embarrassment.

smellyoldboot · 22-08-2020 11:10PM

khalessi wrote: »

I know it is hard but how about making a coherent argument without using cliches such as money, holidays or teachers are cowards/lazy.

No, but you would have to agree the optics of multiple strikes in the not too distant past for better pay/conditions versus compliance with a plan a lot of teachers apparently don't support don't now paint a great picture.

Scoondal · 22-08-2020 11:10PM

Add John Boyle with some schools that have done almost nothing for 5 months = Thursday Mayhem.

downthemiddle · 22-08-2020 11:12PM

smellyoldboot wrote: »

No, but you would have to agree the optics of multiple strikes in the not too distant past for better pay/conditions versus compliance with a plan a lot of teachers apparently don't support don't now paint a great picture.

I’m sure you can list these multiple strikes.

khalessi · 22-08-2020 11:18PM

smellyoldboot wrote: »

No, but you would have to agree the optics of multiple strikes in the not too distant past for better pay/conditions versus compliance with a plan a lot of teachers apparently don't support don't now paint a great picture.

Well done you could not get through a post without using a cliche. I'm actually quoting myself here from an earlier post.

I suppose like yourself we should ignore the teacher Kay from Dublin voicing concerns directly to MM after he toured the 196 pupil school.

We should ignore the letters sent to newpapers by teachers and other educators.

We should ignore the fact that the radio stations are constantly mentioning teachers are worried.

We should ignore the fact for the last few weeks teachers have been ridiculed for going on the radio and voicing their concerns

As it seems you have. Ryan has mentioned it, Sarah McInerney, Joe Duffy show woth Kate, it is all over Newstalk.

Normally we see infrastructure issues on the news because the teachers bring it up. For example the teachers and parents of my school marched on the Dail a number of years ago regarding the fact 60% of our school buildings were prefabs and had mould, the stench was amazing.

And I am old enough to remember numerous times since the 70s as kid and adult when teachers have raised issues over school buildings and called on the government about education matters right the way through today.

What happens is the publicity is enough to get the problem sorted before striking. So we ended up with vast improvements to our building. But it should not take marching on the Dail or striking teachers to get the obvious done.

It is always the go to point which shows shallow thinking in my view, one of three, teacher pay, teacher holidays, when did ye last strike?

If you look at newspapers you will see letters from teachers, newspaper reports and tv new reports about teachers complaining about infrastructure. Striking always is a lst resource there are many other means first, some public some not.

Blondini · 22-08-2020 11:18PM

downthemiddle wrote: »

I’m sure you can list these multiple strikes.

Yeah, I'm looking forward to this list of multiple strikes that I must have missed.

How will schools be able to go back in September? (Continued)

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