2020 the battle of the septuagenarians - Trump vs Biden, Part 2

ohnonotgmail

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

all of the attacks from trump supporters are around Bidens decline. they post them on an endless loop. Only fair that Trumps obvious decline also gets an airing.

There is a big difference in fairness. Trump is still working as President and actively campaigning and giving long speeches just like he has for the previous 4 years. Biden on the other hand, God love him, he seems to be hanging by a thread every time he opens his mouth. It's really sad to see and I feel his family should not let him embarrass himself like this. If they have a head to head debate it will be a bloodbath Trump will murder him.

Igotadose

Deleted User wrote: »

There is a big difference in fairness. Trump is still working as President and actively campaigning and giving long speeches just like he has for the previous 4 years. Biden on the other hand, God love him, he seems to be hanging by a thread every time he opens his mouth. It's really sad to see and I feel his family should not let him embarrass himself like this. If they have a head to head debate it will be a bloodbath Trump will murder him.

Nah. You're telling porkies. Biden sounds fine every time he speaks. Town hall went fine. Various speeches have been enjoyable.

Versus rambling incoherence for hours at Nuremberg rallies. Debates are next week. Bring 'em on.

Timberrrrrrrr

[Deleted User] wrote: »

There is a big difference in fairness. Trump is still working as President and actively campaigning and giving long speeches just like he has for the previous 4 years. Biden on the other hand, God love him, he seems to be hanging by a thread every time he opens his mouth. It's really sad to see and I feel his family should not let him embarrass himself like this. If they have a head to head debate it will be a bloodbath Trump will murder him.

You should probably watch both of their town hall discussions, only one came across as a bumbling fool and it wasn't Biden.

Trump won't have his rent-a-mob behind him for the debates so no crowd to play up to. He won't answer a single question and will instead go on long rants about anything and everything (the way he has for the last four years).

All Biden has to do is stay calm and call him out everytime he lies (which will be plenty) and make Trump look like a fool.

DangerScouse

Oh Joe

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J9GPD-0aMVQ

I'm beginning to think it may be funnier if he wins than if the Donald does again :pac: Either way America is going to be a basket case for years to come.

Debates will be epic

DangerScouse

Deleted User wrote: »

There is a big difference in fairness. Trump is still working as President and actively campaigning and giving long speeches just like he has for the previous 4 years. Biden on the other hand, God love him, he seems to be hanging by a thread every time he opens his mouth. It's really sad to see and I feel his family should not let him embarrass himself like this. If they have a head to head debate it will be a bloodbath Trump will murder him.

It's more than likely too late for the Democrats to pull him out now.

ohnonotgmail

Deleted User wrote: »

There is a big difference in fairness. Trump is still working as President and actively campaigning and giving long speeches just like he has for the previous 4 years. Biden on the other hand, God love him, he seems to be hanging by a thread every time he opens his mouth. It's really sad to see and I feel his family should not let him embarrass himself like this. If they have a head to head debate it will be a bloodbath Trump will murder him.

have you actually watched any of the clips of trump speaking? rambling and incoherent are the words that spring to mind. did you watch the two town halls? biden was able to answer coherently. from trumps replies you couldn't work out what the question was.

ohnonotgmail

DangerScouse wrote: »

Oh Joe

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J9GPD-0aMVQ

I'm beginning to think it may be funnier if he wins than if the Donald does again :pac: Either way America is going to be a basket case for years to come.

Debates will be epic

did you spend your day looking for clips of biden to post? SAD!!

Quin_Dub

DangerScouse wrote: »

Oh Joe

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J9GPD-0aMVQ

I'm beginning to think it may be funnier if he wins than if the Donald does again :pac: Either way America is going to be a basket case for years to come.

Debates will be epic

Ah yes , nothing like an 8 second clip to provide full context and background.

Nothing from the Trump campaign about Policy or anything like that no?

biko

Igotadose wrote: »

Sigh. Slow day on boards, let's trot out some anti-HRC stuff. So 2016.

You mean IMFLOTUS?

Timberrrrrrrr

biko wrote: »

You mean IMFLOTUS?

Was Hillary ever impeached?

I'm waiting to see the excuses about the debates, I'm guessing they'll follow the line that Trump is using atm by claiming Biden is on performance enhancing drugs.

Professor Moriarty

biko wrote: »

You mean IMFLOTUS?

What does that mean?

salmocab

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I'm waiting to see the excuses sheet the debates, I'm guessing they'll follow the line that Trump is using atm by claiming Biden is on performance enhancing drugs.

It doesn’t matter how the debates go they’ll be hear claiming victory because Joe trips over a word and will ignore all of Trumps gaffs. It’s playing chess with a pigeon.

Quin_Dub

Deleted User wrote: »

I'm waiting to see the excuses sheet the debates, I'm guessing they'll follow the line that Trump is using atm by claiming Biden is on performance enhancing drugs.

They are already out being road tested.

If Biden fluffs it - Confirmation that he's senile and about to die

If Biden performs well enough (as he has done at every public speaking event so far) - He's on drugs , can't be trusted.

The drugs thing is a fairly weak exit plan from the corner they've painted themselves into here.

They've spent months playing the "Sleepy Joe" & "Senile Joe" angle which is now backfiring on them badly.

Bidens speech at the convention was nothing spectacular , it was a decent solid effort , but because of the incredibly low bar the Trump campaign had set for him even Fox News talked about him "knocking it out of the park" etc.

Similarly at the recent townhall - Biden was fairly well prepared and had solid answers to the questions posed , Trump however had done no prep whatsoever and fluffed the majority of his responses by attempting to bluster past them with his standard issue "rally cries" - He did so badly that Fox had to resort to calling the townhall an "ambush" even though every question he was asked was exactly the questions he should have expected to be asked.

Given all the talk of "Biden won't turn up to the debates" etc. I wonder what odds you could get on Trump refusing to attend the 2nd & 3rd debates if the first one goes the way I expect it**?

** I expect that Biden will be pretty well prepared , will have solid answers to the questions that come up and for him yo come across as generally likeable and competent . I also expect that Trump will have zero preparation done and resort to shouting, snuffling and snorting but will struggle badly in the absence of an audience.

I also expect one or both of Wallace and Biden to catch Trump out on a major falsehood and for him to throw a hissy fit.

mcmoustache

Quin_Dub wrote: »

** I expect that Biden will be pretty well prepared , will have solid answers to the questions that come up and for him yo come across as generally likeable and competent . I also expect that Trump will have zero preparation done and resort to shouting, snuffling and snorting but will struggle badly in the absence of an audience.

I also expect one or both of Wallace and Biden to catch Trump out on a major falsehood and for him to throw a hissy fit.

Biden is well-capable of performing the basic tasks required of a politician and that includes preparing for debates. He's been at it for years.

I expect a competent performance from him but nothing earth-shattering.

From Trump, I expect the usual and I could see him getting angrier as it goes on.

What's the story with placement, does anyone know? Will candidates be free to move about or will they be seated or at podiums? It was odd that Trump opted to do his town-hall sitting down while Biden stayed on his feet.

weisses

Deleted User wrote: »

There is a big difference in fairness. Trump is still working golfing as President and actively campaigning and giving long speeches just like he has for the previous 4 years

I just fixed that for you

weisses

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

What does that mean?

Its a brainfart

Quin_Dub

mcmoustache wrote: »

Biden is well-capable of performing the basic tasks required of a politician and that includes preparing for debates. He's been at it for years.

I expect a competent performance from him but nothing earth-shattering.

From Trump, I expect the usual and I could see him getting angrier as it goes on.

What's the story with placement, does anyone know? Will candidates be free to move about or will they be seated or at podiums? It was odd that Trump opted to do his town-hall sitting down while Biden stayed on his feet.

Agree with you completely on Biden - He will be well prepared and competent - Nothing outstanding , just solid. But Trump has lowered the bar so far with his attacks that him being simply "Competent" will be viewed as a spectacular performance.

Not sure on the stage set-up for the debates - I certainly can't see them being allowed to wander around like Trump did in 2016.

Trump sitting down was probably because frankly he looks weird standing up when he's not behind a lectern or whatever , and Biden probably stood because if he'd sat then Trump without a sliver of self-awareness would have attacked him for "not having the stamina" or something.

namloc1980

Quin_Dub wrote: »

** I expect that Biden will be pretty well prepared , will have solid answers to the questions that come up and for him yo come across as generally likeable and competent . I also expect that Trump will have zero preparation done and resort to shouting, snuffling and snorting but will struggle badly in the absence of an audience.

I also expect one or both of Wallace and Biden to catch Trump out on a major falsehood and for him to throw a hissy fit.

Biden is going to be very well prepared for the debates and will have answers and ways to deal with virtually anything Trump can throw at him. Trump certainly will be under prepared.

briany

mcmoustache wrote: »

From Trump, I expect the usual and I could see him getting angrier as it goes on.

Biden will need a response to Trump's main attack point which will be of Biden's stance toward Antifa. And by good response, I mean one that slaps Trump down swiftly but also does not give dignity to the accusation in the first place.

Leroy42

namloc1980 wrote: »

Biden is going to be very well prepared for the debates and will have answers and ways to deal with virtually anything Trump can throw at him. Trump certainly will be under prepared.

They said exactly the same about HC back in 2016.

Of course circumstances are very different this time, most notably that Trump now has a record to defend when in 2016 he had nothing, but Trump continues to defy the critics and normal expectations.

Trump doesn't just fire across an accusation and let it lie. He constantly invokes it, bu snide remarks, his tone, a gesture, the rolling of the eyes. He drags the other person, even the debate, down to the level of a schoolyard argument. Because he knows he cannot win a normal debate, or debate policy or facts.

But he understands that however long the debate, Twitter., Youtude, Facebook etc will be full of the 10 sec gaff, not the 90 minutes of boring stuff. And that is what he targets. THe rest is just filler

namloc1980

Leroy42 wrote: »

They said exactly the same about HC back in 2016.

Of course circumstances are very different this time, most notably that Trump now has a record to defend when in 2016 he had nothing, but Trump continues to defy the critics and normal expectations.

Trump doesn't just fire across an accusation and let it lie. He constantly invokes it, bu snide remarks, his tone, a gesture, the rolling of the eyes. He drags the other person, even the debate, down to the level of a schoolyard argument. Because he knows he cannot win a normal debate, or debate policy or facts.

But he understands that however long the debate, Twitter., Youtude, Facebook etc will be full of the 10 sec gaff, not the 90 minutes of boring stuff. And that is what he targets. The rest is just filler

There's a weird revisionism going on here about the 2016 debates. None of the major post debate polls had Trump winning any of the debates against Hillary. Many had her winning by a country mile in all 3 debates. If you actually watched the 2016 debates Trump was poor in them - underprepared and had very little of substance to say. Yet another Trump myth that the Trumpists fully believe in.

francois

200k now dead from C19 under Trump's presidency

Tell me how

francois wrote: »

200k now dead from C19 under Trump's presidency

How can this guy be in with a shout of getting 4 more years?

https://twitter.com/Acosta/status/1308385029417062401

Leroy42

namloc1980 wrote: »

There's a weird revisionism going on here about the 2016 debates. None of the major post debate polls had Trump winning any of the debates against Hillary. Many had her winning by a country mile in all 3 debates. If you actually watched the 2016 debates Trump was poor in them - very underprepared and had very little of substance to say. Yet another Trump myth that the Trumpists fully believe in.

Yes, but he did enough to keep himself well in the race. He wasn't destroyed, at least not electorally in the debates.

Clearly HC won the debates, no question about it, in terms of the normal rules of debates. But who won the PR war? Everyone knows that clip of Trump stalking HC, who remembers what she was actually saying?

My point being that these are different rules we are working under here. There is no rationale person that listens to a Trump speech and says that that sums up what America is all about and Trump is the leader it needs. Yet thousands f people continue to attend, even with a pandemic going on. It is not about facts it is entertainment.

baaba maal

timsey tiger wrote: »

This line of attack is not stupid, it is very apt. AOC is correctly pointing out that we have to move away from an industrial model that pollutes.

While, this is necessary and for the good of society as a whole, it will mean devistation and poverty for people working in these industries. Many of these industries are longstanding and unionised.

These unions and workers will have to directly pay for the green new deal. AOCs policy goals will cost them their jobs. Granted they will lose their jobs anyway as industry moves away from fossil fuels, but that discomfort is down the line.

A couple of points- I was (only slightly) shocked to learn that union membership is down to 10% of the workforce in the US now, down from 20% in 1983. From my extensive trawl of Wiki I couldn't see it broken down by sector, but it did say that 33% of the total are working in the public sector, and that the majority overall is in services, not manufacturing. In short, I don't believe the unions have any muscle in the industry at this stage.

Secondly the whole point of the GND (and I am uncertain about the efficacy of some aspects of it overall, but it is a damn sight nearer to where we need to be going globally), is that there is "just transition"- not a pie-in-the-sky feelgood slogan- it means that workers in the sunset industries get real opportunities to retrain (or early retirement if more appropriate). So you speak of it as a straight loss of jobs. Think of the potential for real jobs, not just directly in renewables, but in all the retooling of the energy infrastructure, building refits etc. that will be required. In Ireland, this already happening with BnM.

If only there was a self-proclaimed genius business man leading the country and spotting an enormous opportunity in developing new, fit for purpose industries, instead of ironically telling workers in the carcinogenic fossil fuel sector that he was going to revitalise their industry whilst claiming that windmills give you cancer.

The stockmarket globally has realised there is huge potential in this
area for pulling funds from oil,coal and gas and the shift has already started.

hotmail.com

francois wrote: »

200k now dead from C19 under Trump's presidency

America has over 300 million people in it.

Secondly, it is clear by now that Americans are unphased by any death toll.

baaba maal

hotmail.com wrote: »

America has over 300 million people in it.

Secondly, it isn't clear by now that Americans are unphased by any death toll?

Can you have another go at the second sentence please?

Kidchameleon

Anyone good at maths here? What is 200k as a fraction of 330 million?

Tell me how

Kidchameleon wrote: »

Anyone good at maths here? What is 200k as a fraction of 330 million?

200,000/330,000,000

A more relevant way to consider it is that it is the 4th biggest single cause of US deaths in history behind the Civil War, the 1918 Pandemic and WWII.