Dairy Chitchat 4, an udder new thread.

GrasstoMilk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117779431#Comment_117779431

Tbh for me it would just mean keep the best of thr cows and accept the high N and lower stocking rate and no need to take on extra land

The only land that's going to be of use to dairy farmers now is right next to the parlour

Chasing land away to milk sane number or more isn't going to add into the whole thing because you'll be making an ass load of silage you probably won't need

Gillespy

Why does it have to be so convoluted? A cow is a cow. Let the individual farmer decide what works for them and their setup.

It's a lot to do with stubbornness over the flawed EBI system and adding complexity just to keep themselves in work. Good thing the Irish farm lobby is so powerful isn't it?

Morris Moss

Does everyone powerhose their cubicles before the winter? I'm after doing it the last 5 or so years and I'm not seeing any real benefit to it as regards less mastitis, any opinions?

straight

I'm just over the 6500 in milk recording report, just under it in co op performance report. That's on 1ton of meal approx. I'd have to drop about 12 cows if I get caught for the 106. They are basically encouraging me milk suckler cows or cut numbers and import more soya to get them up to 9000 litre cows. Is this rubbish coming from teagasc or what. Surely an expert group somewhere.

ted_182

I'd say we will shelf plans for new parlour and extra cubicles. Giving serious consideration to going oad to get into 80kg bracket and keep same cow numbers, very close to zero debt on the farm, would be madness to take on debt now. My reason for investment is the time it takes to run the show. Oad would make the job far more flexible. Milk as usual in morning, day is your own there after.

mahoney_j

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117779731#Comment_117779731

the all the eggs in one basket (low cost ????kiwi based x bred cows so heavily endorsed by Tegasc )over last few years has fed into this proposal …..then u throw in some suit in an office with no understanding of Irish farms putting together these bands snd some of the other proposals around dirty water collection in particular

they will cripple and make smaller fragmented family farms unviable and feed the narrative amongst lots of farmers that the ifa are just interested in the big farmer with all the land

on the organic n bands linked to cows production I fail to see how anyone can justify them as proposed …you have narrow bands at bottom and then a 6500 ltr herd is hammered to the same level as a herd doing 10/12 k ltrs

jaymla627

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117779835#Comment_117779835

Could be some 3d chess by teagasc to help with peak milk by forcing lads to milk goats, you have two choices now high ouput 700kgs ms plus cows our extreme low cost kiwi type system, but whats going to screw most of the big operator's is down the line having to cover their outdoor lagoons ...

On another sidenote has the eu even granted a new nitrates derogation for next year, the timeline was the department should of had the new proposals submitted months ago and the eu advisory was to rule on it by this Autumn

yosemitesam1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117779731#Comment_117779731

The only way to do it fairly would be to work out an estimated organic n based on bought in feed and fertiliser.

Dont see why that couldnt be done

trixi2011

I think people are missing the picture re n loading of higher yielding cows . On one side you have small cow doing 5500l and 100% of her live weight in Ms with moderate levels of meal feed . On the other side you have a large cow 650+ kg doing 6700l of milk less than 100% Ms and needing higher levels of meal to achieve this . It's about the effincey of the cow .

Timmaay

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117782211#Comment_117782211

Agreed, however more bands definitely needed if your going to bother with this. Ideally it would be based on the cows liveweight, that is a better nitrogen match than her milk output (an efficient 6kL mud fat br fr could well be 200kg heavier than likes of small HO doing 7kl), however weighting all the cows isn't practical at all. I think the best bet would be to introduce alot more bands, a cow doing 5500 to 6kl is 90kgs, 6 to 6.5k is 93, 6.5 to 7k is 96 etc etc

mahoney_j

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117782430#Comment_117782430

Came up last night and is so relevant and shows just how out of touch the dept are …..we’ve moved from ltrs per cow to kgms per cow …that’s what we’re paid on

can’t say I agree with Trixi …u can just as easily have a super efficient 600/650 kg cow doing her weight in solids on grass and moderate feed ….less cows would solve a lot of problems ….less slurry storage etc etc

straight

Why not just use EBI as measure of efficiency of that's what it is supposed to do? I could milk 125 Angus or hereford Vs my high EBI Friesians. They are milking over 6500 litres but only 540 kgms on 1 ton of meal. It makes no sense to me to have more cows milking less. I see the kiwis are milking on average 330 kgms per cow or something and that's what we are being forced into.

mahoney_j

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117783475#Comment_117783475

Kiwis are farming at much bigger scale and don’t have to adhere to the level of restrictions we have to …..lads still making silage pits in grass fields …makes some mockery of what we’re been forced do ….not for a minute saying making a silage pit in a field is right

trixi2011

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117782960#Comment_117782960

I'd say our views of a moderate level of meal feeding could be very different MJ

mahoney_j

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117783922#Comment_117783922

To me less than a tonne …weighed cows in June average weight 598 kg …sold 595 kgms last year off 1570 kg meal stocked at 3.9 on milk block 20% heifers

jaymla627

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117783475#Comment_117783475

The other option of going the more intensive route of a 8500 litre plus cow knocking out 700kgs plus of milk solids is surely the only show in town for anyone that has excess to 100's of acres of land, these lads themselves are in alot of cases wanked in 2027 if they have to cover their acres of outdoor lagoons

alps

Just in case it's news to you folks....

ALL kiwi bred herds in Ireland are delivering over 4,500 litres.

Bad management, bad breeding, bad fertility or fattening a **** load of cows, is the only way to deliver under 4,500l

straight

That's only 1000 gallons like. It's irrelevant anyway until these bands got dreamt up as we're paid in kgms. Each to their own type of cow and all that but it's just such a stupid idea that they think more stomachs (methane), more calvings, more vaccines, more cubicles, more labour is more "efficient". I spent nearly 700 euro on salmonella vaccines yesterday alone for my small herd. Glanbia and Greenfield ran a mile from crossbreeds and now you have teagasc & co still trying to force them down our throat. Don't get me wrong, I've nothing against the cows in particular but they are just not for me personally. The kiwis are feeding a ton on average and delivering 333 kgms per year. That kind of performance doesn't pay for Irish regulations.

timple23

Just wondering would a coal bin/bunker do to hold cubical lime outdoors over the winter? Trying to reduce workload around the place. (They're a good bit cheaper than jfc bins)

whelan2

Anyone scanned yet? Seems to be a tough year breeding wise. Had a lot of repeats from 1 ai man here.

alps

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117788018#Comment_117788018

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117788018#Comment_117788018

Using a Tipsy feed bin here and its really handy

cute geoge

which of jfc ,titan ortipsy feed bin is the strongest thinking of putting one in field to be hear troughs and cattle might break it

Injuryprone

I don't know if this has been asked before, but is it proposed that the N loading per cow is based on individual cows or will they be taking the average across the whole herd?

What I'm getting at is let's say your herd average works out at 6600, probably half your herd is less than 6500, so they should be getting the lower figure. And the top yielding ones would still be just in the higher band. That would half the effect of these measures.

alps

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117790455#Comment_117790455

Can only be milk sold from the farm divided by the total number of cows on your herd profile for the year. Milk recording would be required otherwise, and that's not a very exact science.

Mooooo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117790213#Comment_117790213

Scanning Wednesday, expecting 13/ 14% empty in cows, would be twice last years empty rate but bull pulled a week earlier. Hoping it won't be worse. There was one heifer bulling 2.5 weeks ago at the herd test but a fr bull is still with them. They will be scanned as well but hoping the rest will be in calf within the Feb to April timeframe. All heifers scanned in calf at scanning the last 2 years but generally one or two may have embryo losses and don't calve

Poor May and that week of right hot weather effecting conception I reckon. Also think 22% of cows seen bulling since end of breeding had embry loss.

Mooooo

On these Nitrates proposals, they seem to be throwing anything out there, possibly in an attempt to keep dero. Big fear for me is the extra cost of meeting some of them and then in 5 years dero gets pulled, no cows to pay the cost of all this.

kevthegaff

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117790833#Comment_117790833

Think your right throwing lots out atm, we are in uncertain times atm

straight

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117790531#Comment_117790531

Then it would be calculated at the end of the year. Sounds a bit unworkable

Mooooo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117790942#Comment_117790942

I assume it would be based on the previous year. You'd wonder if the senator has much influence in these proposals. Above 6500 litres seems too low for the jump to 109, prob not enough herds doing the output at the correct level to have an effect if it was brought in

green daries

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117790531#Comment_117790531

Interesting all these cows that get on the cull list a bit (4months minimum) won't be long being reserected