Dairy Chitchat 4, an udder new thread.

GrasstoMilk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117830178#Comment_117830178

You wouldn't get an acre of land around me for less than 300 an acre

It's tillage and hobby farmers driving it

Mooooo

What are lads planning on doing in the face of these possible regs? Stay the same as they are? Reduce stocking rates? Try take on more ground? Get out? Or just wait and see?

Hard to know at times, mind changes every so often but given age, debt etc in my circumstance i think I may as well try and drive on. Have to invest anyway to modernise

kevthegaff

Ya I'm not far off 40, prob investment/expansion of the farm is nearly over as I'm land locked. Probably roof the tower eventually and a few small scale jobs until more clarity

Mooooo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117831396#Comment_117831396

Ah mid 30's lasts till 45 Kev!

straight

In my mid 30's here too. Although I'm being encouraged to get rid of my high EBI cows and replace them with more low yielding cows I'll probably plough on with the smaller number of better cows. Try to get them up around the 600kg solids. My parents and then myself have built fine facilities here and were grant aided for most of it. Now they are saying that soiled water must be separate but my parlour is in a corner joined onto the dairy unit so I can't build a separate tank. Few years ago it had to be a certain size, now bigger. What would it need to be in the future. Might look into a slurry tower to increase overall capacity but I don't see myself digging more tanks. I'm going to start extracting as much money out of the farm as possible over the next few years and may stand near the exit in case of derogation going, etc.

K.G.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117830803#Comment_117830803

Planning to coast along the next 10 years until the young lads hit 25/26.alot depends on land availability but no expansion planned as we are in our fifties.would like to getthe purchased farm paid for in another 10 years but things would have to go well.will try and work around the regs instead of building more

straight

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117830289#Comment_117830289

I'm not a renter myself at least not at the moment anyway. I was talking about land purchase prices. 300 an acre is high considering the return but it's a pretty miserable return for an investor paying 8 - 10k per acre. 3 percent like.

Mooooo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117837203#Comment_117837203

Rental prices are less a reflection on the the value of the land but more on what it can return from whatever farming enterprise it is being used for. Land value compared to farming returns is over priced, but it always has been. Land i bought won't pay for its itself with its own output, only with its combined output with the existing block. But the asset would still be there at the end of the period, and going of historical trends will be appreciating but whether that continues remains to be seen.

Unless Land is over the ditch and cows can walk to it I'd be slow to buy from a farming point of view anyway

cute geoge

So instead of buying at 15k/acre lads prefer to pay 350/acre rent .A few years ago a bigish local farm sold for 10k/acre some of it heavyish non would be outstanding but decent average quality every established farmer condemned the farm but they have no hesitation giving 300 plus an acre to rent .I think their heads should be examined .I am renting bits myself with years but now only established enough to buy but naught suitable on market and I aint too fussy hitting 50 years shortly time will have run out on me in a few years to buy

mahoney_j

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117838387#Comment_117838387

Buying land at 15 k per acre ….u need a cash deposit and repayment capacity …renting land at 300 /acre might make more sense to some ….if most dairy farmers were offered land beside there milk block to rent at 300 mad and all as it is they’d jump at it as it is in a lot of circumstances a once in a lifetime chance ….buying land is a great aspiration for lots but u need serious financial clout for it …..very hard to build stock ,facilities etc and also buy land

GrasstoMilk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117838387#Comment_117838387

My father was 54 when thd right place came up for him to buy

Sold his 40 acres let leases go on 100 acres he had and moved 30 miles to 120 ac him and my mam bought

Was tough going for a good while tbf and he's fairly well bet now too but still won't shy away from work

Schooled us all and paid for from my parents hard work, never inherited a penny

I dunno will I ever do anything like it tbh

straight

You get tax relief on the rental which makes a big difference. My parents bought land in the late 80's. It was crazy money at the time. 1100 pounds an acre. Dry stock were flying, milk was flying and inputs were cheap. Only mistake they made was that they didn't buy more at the time. Cheap credit drove it mad in the meantime but now I'd say alot of lads might have enough on their plate already without more debt. I got outbid twice this year at 10k per acre. It might be no harm.

Grueller

At €10k an acre around here you won't even get your hand raised. €17-20k is the going.

kevthegaff

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117839634#Comment_117839634

I'd rather buy a tractor then spend that money on land

cute geoge

well if you can;t pay for the tractor all they will do is reposses it ,while if you can't pay for the land they will carry the shirt off you back

JustJoe7240

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117837203#Comment_117837203

Where else would you get 3% bar buy to let property?

green daries

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117839896#Comment_117839896

Shares

straight

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117839896#Comment_117839896

Pension, stock market, bitcoin, precious metals. 7% is considered a minimum return to make long term investments worth it.

cute geoge

yet most stock markets in general did not increase from year 2000 to 2020 so basically if you invested 1k in 2000 in stocks your average value would have being the same 2020

Grueller

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117840469#Comment_117840469

And you are entrusting your hard earned to a polished salesman that specialises in meeting sales targets.

I have some shares here that I bought myself, not a lot but some. I also have a pension with Irish life. Both are performing at about 6% per annum. I also have rental property that yields 3% of current value but 10% of purchase value. However the rental property was bought in 2011 and has tripled on value.

I am very reluctant to trust my future financial stability to a 3rd party.

JustJoe7240

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117840459#Comment_117840459

Sorry I meant with comparable risk levels, Those listed above are high risk with the exception of a pension.

roosterman71

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117840469#Comment_117840469

Now that is not true. Few examples:

ISEQ since 1998:

FTSE since 1990 (probably flat enough since 2000 alright - Brexit most likely the reason):

S&P 500 since 1981:

straight

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117840756#Comment_117840756

If you spread your money across them all it lessens the risk. Having said that I agree with grueller above. Having got burnt in the past I'd be slow to trust others with my money. There is risk with land too though. Guy around me paid over 20k per acre for average ground in the boom. He's loosing money there since and will never get his money back. Hard to beat the state savings at the moment I'd say. 1%, no Dirt, 7 days notice. It's better than getting nothing in the bank anyway. Land is a huge and very long term investment for the average guy like me anyway.

cute geoge

Imo buying land is for future generation .An uncle of my father was a great farmer and bought 80 acres back over 50 years ago he died childless shortly after leaving a widow .The place was let out from that time until his wife died and land was sold for big money and proceeds divided between all realations probably I would never have heard of this grand uncle other wise even if he had millons in the bank.In my book the bull was right about the land!!!

straight

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117841325#Comment_117841325

Poor owl bull. The land went to his head. Tried beating the sea back with a big shtick. I often feel like him going through all the jars for an extra few Bob.

JustJoe7240

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117841209#Comment_117841209

Land is generally a fairly sound investment except in cases where the buyer loses the run of themselves like the case mentioned above

green daries

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117843464#Comment_117843464

Land is generally a very poor return on investment for farmers.

Land is generally if not nearly always a great vehicle of wealth holding and transfer of wealth to the next generation

straight

It's often just a great way of buying yourself extra work. It's great for the next generation if they have any interest in it

degetme

Would people here spread non protected urea in this weather with little rain in sight??

green daries

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117844048#Comment_117844048

It's even better for them if they have no interest$$$$