FF/FG/Green Next Government

efanton

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/sinn-féin-td-says-good-riddance-to-member-who-resigned-over-sending-abusive-messages-1.4327497


The content of this is very topical and very in tune with this thread.

Worth a read, in my opinion.

What is your point? Such people exist there is no doubt of that. But this is a phenomenon that all political parties and organised groups suffer from.

That person was a 'former' member of SF, so would it not be equally fair to suggest that he was either kicked out, was made unwelcome, or that he decided that SF no longer represents his view point before making those comments?

I am absolutely certain that you will find similar people making these kinds of remarks from those that claimed to support FG, FF, Lab, Greens indeed all the political parties. In fact you need not have to look long where some members here accuse those who might have voted SF of supporting terrorism and murder. Are these not equally vile and detestable insults and slurs?

How many people have been banned or cautioned on this thread?
If you were to do a quick tally I'm pretty certain you would find the majority that were censored were FG supporters.
That certainly does not mean that they reflect the opinions of the FG party or other FG supporters. Likewise there has been some inappropriate comments on this forum for those that claim to not support the government parties. Does that mean that everyone who does not support a government party is equally bad?

All your post show is that far too many people will resort to slurs, false accusations and falsehoods when they are losing an argument or incapable of making a rational argument, or that some people think they can deliberately hurt or abuse people from anonymity while on a forum or social media.

If you are going to make an accusation back it up with fact.
If you don't have positive prove then even if it is possible that your accusation might be true you still cant make it, unless of course you put yourself on a par with the detestable person featured in that article.

Shefwedfan

Bowie wrote: »

That's it folks.
The trouble with co-living regulations allowing for living spaces of 12 square metres and the like is rent arrears in council tenancies.
What a load of defective cobblers.
It sets a precedent. In a few years even clever boys who support anything that sticks it to the poor will be moving into these. Enjoy.

You figure out yet what a vulture fund is :-)

Shefwedfan

efanton wrote: »

What is your point? Such people exist there is no doubt of that. But this is a phenomenon that all political parties and organised groups suffer from.

That person was a 'former' member of SF, so would it not be equally fair to suggest that he was either kicked out, was made unwelcome, or that he decided that SF no longer represents his view point before making those comments?

I am absolutely certain that you will find similar people making these kinds of remarks from those that claimed to support FG, FF, Lab, Greens indeed all the political parties. In fact you need not have to look long where some members here accuse those who might have voted SF of supporting terrorism and murder. Are these not equally vile and detestable insults and slurs?

How many people have been banned or cautioned on this thread?
If you were to do a quick tally I'm pretty certain you would find the majority that were censored were FG supporters.
That certainly does not mean that they reflect the opinions of the FG party or other FG supporters. Likewise there has been some inappropriate comments on this forum for those that claim to not support the government parties. Does that mean that everyone who does not support a government party is equally bad?

All your post show is that far too many people will resort to slurs, false accusations and falsehoods when they are losing an argument or incapable of making a rational argument, or that some people think they can deliberately hurt or abuse people from anonymity while on a forum or social media.

If you are going to make an accusation back it up with fact.
If you don't have positive prove then even if it is possible that your accusation might be true you still cant make it, unless of course you put yourself on a par with the detestable person featured in that article.

Former member now, not when he was up to the messing.....

Have you seen the SF online supporters on Facebook etc? If you haven’t your probably the only person in Ireland. Do you think that carry on is acceptable?

You had some of them abusing people on FF Facebook page just because they said something positive. Check it out yourself if you want, just go to FF Facebook and pick any video. Same people, same disgusting comments. Not a lot of IQ between the lot of them .....

Shefwedfan

Bowie wrote: »

That's it folks.
The trouble with co-living regulations allowing for living spaces of 12 square metres and the like is rent arrears in council tenancies.
What a load of defective cobblers.
It sets a precedent. In a few years even clever boys who support anything that sticks it to the poor will be moving into these. Enjoy.

Somehow I doubt I will be moving into one :-) so don’t worry about me

Shefwedfan

Shefwedfan wrote: »

Same people, same disgusting comments. Not a lot of IQ between the lot of them .....

:pac:


You cannot be this lacking in self awareness

Shefwedfan

BonnieSituation wrote: »

We've gone through this "rent in council house non payment" at length on this thread.

You and/or others were caught unawares as to what a differential rent was, and how it operates. I also discussed evictions, their difficulty in progressing within LA properties and other ancillary problems that may occur. But yes, unpaid rent in LA properties are the cause of all of our woes. Just like people on the dole are bleeding the State dry.

Tell me about co-living arrangements in "Europe"?

Is Los Angles(LA) in Europe? I’m lost now? Why are you in LA?

Shefwedfan

[Deleted User] wrote: »

:pac:


You cannot be this lacking in self awareness

Find any white gold with your millionaire farmer buddies who drive home drunk?

James Brown

Barry Cowen a farmer?

efanton

Shefwedfan wrote: »

Former member now, not when he was up to the messing.....

Have you seen the SF online supporters on Facebook etc? If you haven’t your probably the only person in Ireland. Do you think that carry on is acceptable?

You had some of them abusing people on FF Facebook page just because they said something positive. Check it out yourself if you want, just go to FF Facebook and pick any video. Same people, same disgusting comments. Not a lot of IQ between the lot of them .....

I dont use Ar$sbook, havent used it for over a decade. The only reason I still have the account is to be able to follow links posted that I might be interested in.
Why would anyone want to visit a FF facebook page in the first place?

I'm sure what you say could be true, I dare say it is also true that if you went to any other facebook page you would see similar rubbish from those who claim to represent supporters of other parties.
But the question remains are they officially representing the party they claim to support or are they just the lowlife visible on any public social media site or forum, including this one.

Shefwedfan

efanton wrote: »

I dont use Ar$sbook, havent used it for over a decade. The only reason I still have the account is to be able to follow links posted that I might be interested in.
Why would anyone want to visit a FF facebook page in the first place?

I'm sure what you say could be true, I dare say it is also true that if you went to any other facebook page you would see similar rubbish from those who claim to represent supporters of other parties.
But the question remains are they officially representing the party they claim to support or are they just the lowlife visible on any public social media site or forum, including this one.

Google Sinn Fein Online Supporters.....

Why would you visit a Facebook page? Information. It is king you know

If you can go find on any media forum similar posts from any of Greens/FF/FG I will be more than happy to withdraw. I won’t hold my breathe

Shefwedfan

Bowie wrote: »

Barry Cowen a farmer?

No idea, ask Francie, he is obsessed with politicians personal lives, Francie what can you tell us?

Shefwedfan

[Deleted User] wrote: »

This is brilliant.....lolcow status secured

lolcow?

Shefwedfan

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Nothing personal in that

If yous dislike,poor posting habits (which your free to do so),been lol at.....perhaps you should consider posting habits.....

foaming at mouth about god knows what,deosnt help your case.....needz thundadrome

So which post exactly would you say I was foaming at the mouth out of interest?

Shefwedfan

[Deleted User] wrote: »

...(like you honestly taught a discussion on social housing here,was about los angeles :pac: )

I honestly didn’t and really a small bit embarrassing for you if you didn’t get that

Snow Garden

Shefwedfan wrote: »

So which post exactly would you say I was foaming at the mouth out of interest?

Do you ever fight with yourself or try to beat yourself up?

Shefwedfan wrote: »

Find any white gold with your millionaire farmer buddies who drive home drunk?

How are your IFA buddies?

Shefwedfan

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Clearly did.......but now your just backtracking imo



Got so outraged at someone you disagree with posting,dived straight in raving about los angeles and now trying to coverup an obvious blunder.......like yous started the thread,maybe try keep abreast of developments within it?

I would have thought the “dog eat dog” comment might have given it away. But nope.

Spelling out Los Angles(LA) but nope

That flew right over your head.

Don’t worry, sure some of the lads on here spent days waffling about vulture funds and didn’t even know what they are.....

efanton

is_that_so wrote: »

Why are SF so keen to ban things out of hand? He imagines everyone is a defined unit, we are not. It has its place and would appeal to certain kinds of people. It is a part of an overall solution which has many moving parts, most of which are not working properly.

Co living will result in pure chaos. In fact give it a few years where these properties are not renovated or maintained properly and they will be worse than the bedsits the FG and FF banned.
Personally given the choice of a bedsit or one of these co-living apartment I would take the bedsit.


What is going to happen when one tennent stops paying their rent, an something needs fixing like a sink or a cooker. Are we going to see landlords refusing to fix anything for the other tenants tht have paid while there is arrears owing from one tenant.
Some of us all remember our student days where the kitchen was a biohazard zone. Why would any tenant willingly share a kitchen or bathroom while paying significant amounts of rent.

Who gets the single parking space? Will developer be obliged to proved a parking space for each tenant?

I could see an argument for this type of accommodation if the rent was capped by legislation at no more than €150 a week.

The problem with these solving schemes is they are not targeted to solve any particular problem. If they are let go ahead they will be come the new standards for anyone who rents an apartment.

I think the SF proposal is actually sensible. Co-living does not solve the housing problem, nor does it benefit any tenant, all it will do is benefit those who build co-living apartment, or the financial institution who buy to let.

There is absolutely no reason why we cant allow self-contained apartment buildings to be built higher. If the fire service need newer or better equipment to deal with that then the government should make provision for that.
Also too many planning complaints are tolerated and eventually used to prevent sensible projects form proceed.
If the likes of Pat Kenny want unrestricted views from their property then they should have bought the surrounding properties to prevent development.

I see nothing in the proposed SF bill that actually is bad, they are simply removing the clause that Eoghan Murphy changed two years ago.

When FG banned bedsits they should have thought of the repercussions of such a move. Obviously they must have thought it through and determined that bedsits and shared facilities were outdated and not acceptable when they made that decision. What has changed except that some developers now want to make an awful lot of money building substandard accommodation?

If we need to have more small single occupancy accommodation then lets do as they do in Europe, studio flats consisting of a bed/living area/kitchenette and a separate bathroom.
If the housing minister wants to change planning laws then you would think that allowing self contained apartment buildings of ten storeys or greater would be a far better solution.

Its going to be very strange to see FF voting against this bill when their own housing spokesman, who now happens to be the Housing minister, was so vociferously against co-living accommodation.

Beasty

Shefwedfan wrote: »

No idea, ask Francie, he is obsessed with politicians personal lives, Francie what can you tell us?

I would be very careful about what I post and how I post it if I was you

Attack the post, not the poster

efanton

Shefwedfan wrote: »

Google Sinn Fein Online Supporters.....

Why would you visit a Facebook page? Information. It is king you know

If you can go find on any media forum similar posts from any of Greens/FF/FG I will be more than happy to withdraw. I won’t hold my breathe

If I want information I think I will choose to get it else where.

Why would I trust anything written in a FF facebook page.
Facebook is a cesspit, plain and simple. I would not trust anything posted by anyone on Facebook unless it was backed up by other sources that are considerably more trustworthy and authoritative, and if I was going to verify everything written on facebook why go there at all.


In fact why would I believe anything posted by a FF TD.
Before the election they were all posting we will not go into government with FG, now it appears they are.
We now have a FF housing minister that was absolutely against any form of co-living accommodation, saying as much to any TV or radio reporter that would listen to him, and no doubt posting such comment on facebook. Maybe you could dig one up for me?
Am I to believe what he wrote 6 months ago or the nonsense he will no doubt spout when this bill is put before the Dail?

James Brown

We know FG spent far more on social media in the election run up and it fell flat. For FF too. It's a tool and a means of social communication.
How some people troll changes nothing about good or poor government policy.
A lot of folk get personal and cite numbers of posts by posters and call people liars and so on.
And arseholery begets arseholery but some having the neck to cite online bullying like it's all shinners is a laugh.

markodaly

efanton wrote: »

I am absolutely certain that you will find similar people making these kinds of remarks from those that claimed to support FG, FF, Lab, Greens indeed all the political parties.

The excuse of 'sure everyone does it' is not an excuse.
First of all you provided no proof of this and secondly two wrongs don't make a right.

SF especially seems to have an aggressive bullying element within them, and are very vocal online especially on social media.

In fact you need not have to look long where some members here accuse those who might have voted SF of supporting terrorism and murder. Are these not equally vile and detestable insults and slurs?

Absolutely not, when you have guys like Dessie Ellis in the party and running for a TD, then the accusations are 100% fair game.
Dont know who he is?

https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/top-sinn-fein-man-dessie-ellis-linked-to-50-deaths-29009506.html

If you are going to make an accusation back it up with fact.

Yes, you should so please back up your first point with some facts please.

Find us say, a Green member who was caught abusing other TD's and local business people via Twitter. You can start there and work your way out.

James Brown

markodaly wrote: »

The excuse of 'sure everyone does it' is not an excuse.
First of all you provided no proof of this and secondly two wrongs don't make a right.

SF especially seems to have an aggressive bullying element within them, and are very vocal online especially on social media.




Absolutely not, when you have guys like Dessie Ellis in the party and running for a TD, then the accusations are 100% fair game.
Dont know who he is?

https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/top-sinn-fein-man-dessie-ellis-linked-to-50-deaths-29009506.html





Yes, you should so please back up your first point with some facts please.

Find us say, a Green member who was caught abusing other TD's and local business people via Twitter. You can start there and work your way out.

If I may...

A Green Party senator texted colleagues after the leadership election, saying: "**** her" about deputy leader Catherine Martin.
https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-40028681.html

On 11 December 2009, during his contribution[19] to a debate in the Dáil on the Social Welfare bill of the 2010 budget, Gogarty said to Labour Party TD Emmet Stagg: "With all due respect, in the most unparliamentary language, **** you Deputy Stagg! **** you!"

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Gogarty

Green Party's Eamon Ryan apologies after saying the n-word in the Dail

https://www.dublinlive.ie/news/dublin-news/green-partys-eamon-ryan-apologies-18405866

And that's party members and public representatives.

This from one of the smaller parties...

Taoiseach says senior Fine Gael official behind insulting tweets to women should resign

Barry Walsh:

"Some stupid Sinn Fein bitch on Claire Byrne refusing to condemn comments by another Provo wag re McCabe murder. Leopards, spots etc."

""Some daft old bitch on @BreakfastNT goes on rant about not getting pension rise from Enda Kenny....then says she always votes for FF!"

https://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/taoiseach-says-senior-fine-gael-11536168

Fine Gael TD advisor admits ‘Mary Lube McDonald’ tweet was ‘not right’
https://extra.ie/2020/02/06/news/politics/mary-lube-mcdonald

LEO VARADKAR has been described as "autistic" by a Fine Gael senator running in the election.
https://www.irishpost.com/news/leo-varadkar-branded-autistic-fine-gael-senator-178168

markodaly

Bowie wrote: »

If I may...

Oh please...

Apples and Lego again.
Always with the false equivalence, ALWAYS!


The post was specifically about online abuse via social media, not the rough and tumble of internal party politics.

Again, find me Green/Labour/FF/FG members who set up an anonymous Twitter accounts and started abusing business members and other TD's?

James Brown

markodaly wrote: »

Oh please...

Apples and Lego again.
Always with the false equivalence, ALWAYS!


The post was specifically about online abuse via social media, not the rough and tumble of internal party politics.

Again, find me Green/Labour/FF/FG members who set up an anonymous Twitter accounts and started abusing business members and other TD's?

Le sigh...
The first green one was a tweet. All the FG ones except the autistic comment were tweets....

I see you added 'anonymous'. We'd only know if they got caught. But sure add 'standing on one leg'.

markodaly

Bowie wrote: »

Le sigh...
The first green one was a tweet. All the FG ones except the autistic comment were tweets....

No, the Green instance was a text message sent privately to another Green TD, when talking about the leadership campaign.

Why did you bring in stuff that was not said on Social Media?
Muddy the waters?
Strawmanning?
Some other innate reason that you have to bring non-related events to try and shield SF from any criticism?

Bringing the Paul Goggerty and Emmet Stagg instance into it? Clutching at straws to me.
Next up, some FF meeting in 1978 had a bad word said at it, oh let's mention that!

But do carry on, clutching those straws.

James Brown

markodaly wrote: »

No, the Green instance was a text message sent privately to another Green TD, when talking about the leadership campaign.

Why did you bring in stuff that was not said on Social Media?
Muddy the waters?
Strawmanning?
Some other innate reason that you have to bring non-related events to try and shield SF from any criticism?

Bringing the Paul Goggerty and Emmet Stagg instance into it? Clutching at straws to me.
Next up, some FF meeting in 1978 had a bad word said at it, oh let's mention that!

But do carry on, clutching those straws.

You added 'anonymous'. You've some neck

Nope she tweeted it to colleagues by the report, tweet. Also you didn't stipulate the amount of people one tweet went to. Don't they normally go to one person's account? And what's the topic got to do with it?

Green senator Garvey apologises after insulting party deputy leader in group texts

[https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-40028681.html/quote

Were it was tweets is says so.

Look you are threading water. The tweets for Barry Walsh, Kate O'Connell are there. Did you miss them?

You asked for it you got it.

markodaly

Bowie wrote: »

Nope she tweeted it to colleagues by the report, tweet.
.

I think you need to get your reading glasses checked. Here, let me help you.

A Green Party senator texted colleagues after the leadership election, saying: "**** her" about deputy leader Catherine Martin and accused the returning officer of being a "Sinn Féin front".

This caps off a fine run of missteps.

James Brown

Fair enough. Text. Strike that one.

Taoiseach says senior Fine Gael official behind insulting tweets to women should resign

Barry Walsh:

"Some stupid Sinn Fein bitch on Claire Byrne refusing to condemn comments by another Provo wag re McCabe murder. Leopards, spots etc."

""Some daft old bitch on @BreakfastNT goes on rant about not getting pension rise from Enda Kenny....then says she always votes for FF!"

https://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/taoiseach-says-senior-fine-gael-11536168

Fine Gael TD advisor admits ‘Mary Lube McDonald’ tweet was ‘not right’
https://extra.ie/2020/02/06/news/politics/mary-lube-mcdonald

FG councillor defends his 'love' for Blueshirts' Nazi-style salute


A Fine Gael councillor has defended a late night tweet where he expressed his "love" for a picture of Blueshirts performing a Nazi-style salute.

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/fg-councillor-defends-his-love-for-blueshirts-nazi-style-salute-39274128.html

Varadkar 'suggested creating anonymous accounts online to make positive comments on news'
https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/varadkar-suggested-creating-anonymous-accounts-online-to-make-positive-comments-on-news-37275799.html

Discuss....

markodaly

Bowie wrote: »

Pathetic. You got what you asked for.
She group tweeted. But sure 'look over there!'.

No, again, I cannot believe that you cannot even read the article and understand the difference between two words. Text vs Tweet

She group 'TEXTED' in a WhatsApp group.

TEXT not Tweet, TEXT!!

Do you know the difference between WhatsApp and Twitter?

Keep digging that hole, you are halfway to NZ at the moment.
This is like your DCC vs SDCC moment all over again.

James Brown

markodaly wrote: »

Keep digging that hole, you are halfway to NZ at the moment.
This is like your DCC vs SDCC moment all over again.

It's exactly like that

Not as bad as you sliding in 'anonymous'. Mine were errs also I owned up.