Benefits of Public Sector over Private Sector

kippy

addaword wrote: »

It's a hell of a lot more opulent personhood than the average private sector employee enjoys. And do not forget the huge tax free "gratuity" lump sum public servants get on retirement, 18 months salary.

You would be mad to leave your public sector job, we can all agree on that.

People do leave the public sector or don't take the roles they've been offered. Particularily in the past 5 years or so. Usually when they realise that:
1. Salary and starting salary is generally not negotiable.
2. There are no bonus', healthcare, gym membership, share options etc.
3. The net salary is typically A LOT lower than a comparable gross salaried job in the private sector (yes - there is a pension contribution on top of what everyone else would pay as well.
4. Their final pension gross figure is also made up of the COAP (13-14K) and not on top of the COAP.

The average "private sector" worker isn't a fair comparison to the average public sector worker in a lot of ways but you continue to roll it out.

Sinzo

addaword wrote: »

It's a hell of a lot more opulent personhood than the average private sector employee enjoys. And do not forget the huge tax free "gratuity" lump sum public servants get on retirement, 18 months salary.

You would be mad to leave your public sector job, we can all agree on that.

Well that depends on the relative jobs you had in either sector and the current cycle the economy is experiencing. If the economy is booming I might keep my nice over paid job in the private sector rather than the relatively lower paid public sector equivalent.
All pension lump sums have tax free elements to them, public or private - first 200k is tax free.
Most lump sums are not huge especially after 40 years service. How much does a typical Glanbia worker get in their pension?
18 months salary?? What does that mean??

addaword

Sinzo wrote: »

Most lump sums are not huge especially after 40 years service. How much does a typical Glanbia worker get in their pension?
18 months salary?? What does that mean??

You do not think 75 ,000 or 90k is huge?

Most of the 2 million private sector workers are not Glanbia or have DB pensions.

ParkRunner

addaword wrote: »

It's a hell of a lot more opulent personhood than the average private sector employee enjoys. And do not forget the huge tax free "gratuity" lump sum public servants get on retirement, 18 months salary.

You would be mad to leave your public sector job, we can all agree on that.

That 18 months salary (lump sum payment) is calculated just on basic pay with a pro rate adjustment for allowances, right? Strange how salary can mean different things

KaneToad

SouthWesterly wrote: »

How can the average pay be 63k when top of the scale for most gardai is 54k?

Allowances supplement the basic guarda salary. You're quoting the basic salary.

According to the Minister for Justice, who stated:

"It is important to recall that the Garda pay scale does not represent the full earnings of a Garda as it does not include any allowances.

Gardaí assigned to frontline duties work the Garda Roster which attracts unsocial hours payments. Such payments amount to between 25% and 30% of their earnings.

Even at the entry level of €23,750 and the lower end of unsocial hours scale, this will add almost €6,000 to the salary. Other allowances may also be payable, as may overtime."

KaneToad

SouthWesterly wrote: »

How can the average pay be 63k when top of the scale for most gardai is 54k?

Allowances supplement the basic guarda salary. You're quoting the basic salary.

According to the Minister for Justice, who stated:

"It is important to recall that the Garda pay scale does not represent the full earnings of a Garda as it does not include any allowances.

Gardaí assigned to frontline duties work the Garda Roster which attracts unsocial hours payments. Such payments amount to between 25% and 30% of their earnings.

Even at the entry level of €23,750 and the lower end of unsocial hours scale, this will add almost €6,000 to the salary. Other allowances may also be payable, as may overtime."

KaneToad

KaneToad wrote: »

Allowances supplement the basic guarda salary. You're quoting the basic salary.

According to the Minister for Justice, who stated:

"It is important to recall that the Garda pay scale does not represent the full earnings of a Garda as it does not include any allowances.

Gardaí assigned to frontline duties work the Garda Roster which attracts unsocial hours payments. Such payments amount to between 25% and 30% of their earnings.

Even at the entry level of €23,750 and the lower end of unsocial hours scale, this will add almost €6,000 to the salary. Other allowances may also be payable, as may overtime."

It wouldn't add that much to a new recruit. 6000 is about right for someone in the top of the scale but it varies naturally.

The allowances payable to a Garda on the regular:
Uniform 5 euro a week. (Part taxed)
Boot 3 euro a week. (Part taxed)
Twilight hours between 6 and 8pm*
Night allowance between 8pm and 8am*
Saturday allowance*
Sunday allowance**
Bank holiday allowance***

*Taxed in full and payable monthly. Usually equates to about 200 per month on average

**Taxed in full and equates to double time. Varies per month of course but worth about 150 extra per shift worked. Rostered to work every second Sunday so about 300 gross per month.

***Taxed in full and equates to double time. Varies per month of course but worth about 150 extra per shift worked. Roughly works out at about 6 per year on average across the entire Garda rank. Naturally depending on how your shifts land, some get more than others.

addaword

addaword wrote: »

You do not think 75 ,000 or 90k is huge?

Most of the 2 million private sector workers are not Glanbia or have DB pensions.

Most public servants aren't Gardai bit you still go on about them as if it's the set standard. Why can only you cherry pick?

It should be noted of course that the usual sticky questions were ignored again.

I cannot understand your hate of the Gardai. Just because you didn't get in? Inferiority complex? Superiority complex? Convictions? Did your missus run off with one? It's so strong, it's unhealthy how fixated you are.

Treppen

I'm a bit disappointed , these threads usually end up in teacher bashing mode, never seen a Garda bashing fixation so strong.

So basically one guy wants to hold court for months in order to compare a Guard's job to every private sector worker. What's the equivalent private sector job anyway?

addaword

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

Most public servants aren't Gardai bit you still go on about them as if it's the set standard. Why can only you cherry pick?

It should be noted of course that the usual sticky questions were ignored again.

I cannot understand your hate of the Gardai. Just because you didn't get in? Inferiority complex? Superiority complex? Convictions? Did your missus run off with one? It's so strong, it's unhealthy how fixated you are.

The statistics about the Gardai are well known. I do not hate the Gardai, I think they are a great bunch of people. One of them who is also a friend also admits how well paid and pensioned a job it is, and how he was so lucky to get a job as a Garda when he left school with a pass leaving cert. He joked it was pull all those years ago, his uncle was a Guard. Not what you know but who you know.

Let's talk about teachers and lecturers so, and the benefits of those careers over careers in the private sector. Or architects. Or librarians. Or receptionists. Or cleaners.

I think we can all agree the security and better pay and pension and other perks of the public service means anyone would be mad to consider leaving it, unless they were very talented.

SouthWesterly

KaneToad wrote: »

Allowances supplement the basic guarda salary. You're quoting the basic salary.

According to the Minister for Justice, who stated:

"It is important to recall that the Garda pay scale does not represent the full earnings of a Garda as it does not include any allowances.

Gardaí assigned to frontline duties work the Garda Roster which attracts unsocial hours payments. Such payments amount to between 25% and 30% of their earnings.

Even at the entry level of €23,750 and the lower end of unsocial hours scale, this will add almost €6,000 to the salary. Other allowances may also be payable, as may overtime."

Ive also worked in private sector jobs that were shift work and unsocial hours and got paid an allowance for it.

I know I'm quoting basic pay. I also know what they get in allowances in a basic week. It's not a lot.

Treppen

addaword wrote: »

The statistics about the Gardai are well known. I do not hate the Gardai, I think they are a great bunch of people. One of them who is also a friend also admits how well paid and pensioned a job it is, and how he was so lucky to get a job as a Garda when he left school with a pass leaving cert. He joked it was pull all those years ago, his uncle was a Guard. Not what you know but who you know.

Let's talk about teachers and lecturers so, and the benefits of those careers over careers in the private sector. Or architects. Or librarians. Or receptionists. Or cleaners.

I think we can all agree the security and better pay and pension and other perks of the public service means anyone would be mad to consider leaving it, unless they were very talented.

I think we can all agree we definitely don't have any grudges going on there.

Tork

It's almost as if he's the reincarnation of a banned previous poster who was unhealthily obsessed with the gardai.

Treppen

Treppen wrote: »

I'm a bit disappointed , these threads usually end up in teacher bashing mode, never seen a Garda bashing fixation so strong.

So basically one guy wants to hold court for months in order to compare a Guard's job to every private sector worker. What's the equivalent private sector job anyway?

^^^^This!!

Having worked both in private and public sector I was interested in this thread. I have popped in to it a few times over the last few months and the only posts are about Gardai!! I thought I was popping in on the wrong day so I left but each and every time I have a look its all about Gardai - what's the hell? :mad::mad:
Some people here sound obsessed !

Treppen

[Deleted User] wrote: »

^^^^This!!

Having worked both in private and public sector I was interested in this thread. I have popped in to it a few times over the last few months and the only posts are about Gardai!! I thought I was popping in on the wrong day so I left but each and every time I have a look its all about Gardai - what's the hell? :mad::mad:
There are more people in the public sector than Gardai!

Now he's trying to deflect by asking us to compare teachers and lectures to the public sector.
Maybe he might get some traction out of the teacher bashing cohort.

But anyway, let's look at private sector teachers and lecturers will we?

barneystinson

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

It wouldn't add that much to a new recruit. 6000 is about right for someone in the top of the scale but it varies naturally.

The allowances payable to a Garda on the regular:
Uniform 5 euro a week. (Part taxed)
Boot 3 euro a week. (Part taxed)
Twilight hours between 6 and 8pm*
Night allowance between 8pm and 8am*
Saturday allowance*
Sunday allowance**
Bank holiday allowance***

*Taxed in full and payable monthly. Usually equates to about 200 per month on average

**Taxed in full and equates to double time. Varies per month of course but worth about 150 extra per shift worked. Rostered to work every second Sunday so about 300 gross per month.

***Taxed in full and equates to double time. Varies per month of course but worth about 150 extra per shift worked. Roughly works out at about 6 per year on average across the entire Garda rank. Naturally depending on how your shifts land, some get more than others.

Worth pointing out that pretty much any employment where there's weekend work, 24/7 or night shift patterns, pay premiums for the unsocial hours, some of which entitlements are derived from the Organisation of Working Time Act, so the allowances above that make up the majority of the uplift in pay, are no different than an equivalent private sector employment would be likely to be.

addaword

addaword wrote: »

The statistics about the Gardai are well known. I do not hate the Gardai, I think they are a great bunch of people. One of them who is also a friend also admits how well paid and pensioned a job it is, and how he was so lucky to get a job as a Garda when he left school with a pass leaving cert. He joked it was pull all those years ago, his uncle was a Guard. Not what you know but who you know.

Let's talk about teachers and lecturers so, and the benefits of those careers over careers in the private sector. Or architects. Or librarians. Or receptionists. Or cleaners.

I think we can all agree the security and better pay and pension and other perks of the public service means anyone would be mad to consider leaving it, unless they were very talented.

Nah, let's not. Your fixation is obvious. Your bias and hate more so. All public sector are unskilled and underworked fools, privste sector underpaid geniuses with obsoletely no high paid staff ever unless we include educated staff, management, owners, self employed but we won't, because that doesn't suit your hate.

You have danced around this for a month now and it's all just waffle that doesn't hold up.

I don't really care to engage with someone that is so dishonest in their interactions that they continue to ignore questions and facts that are inconvenient to their rants

For your sake, get help. Meditate or whatever but get that bridge built. Don't bother answering, your on ignore.

BMHOPE

snoopboggybog wrote: »

I have interview in three weeks for a role, obviously salary is better and more holidays but anything i should be aware of like been easier to let go etc.

Has there been ever a huge layoff of public sector staff?

Thanks

How did the interview go? The post has gone very off topic since. I took an enormous pay cut to join, but I think it was worth it. I had a very senior role in the private sector that I enjoyed for many years, but there are a lot of opportunities in the public sector too. Timing is everything, getting to interview stage is a major hurdle. There may or may not be moratorium on hiring after this, but in general there are no lay offs. There was redeployements when some offices closed however.

Treppen

BMHOPE wrote: »

How did the interview go? The post has gone very off topic since. I took an enormous pay cut to join, but I think it was worth it. I had a very senior role in the private sector that I enjoyed for many years, but there are a lot of opportunities in the public sector too. Timing is everything, getting to interview stage is a major hurdle. There may or may not be moratorium on hiring after this, but in general there are no lay offs. There was redeployements when some offices closed however.

OP is long gone (banned!) So probably just trolling. Check his other posts.

r93kaey5p2izun

addaword wrote: »

You would be mad to leave your public sector job, we can all agree on that.

I await the men in white coats.

speedboatchase

Can we at least agree that with another massive recession looming and absolutely no job losses or even pay cuts expected in the PS (especially with SF waiting to exploit any such move) - working in the PS is a pretty good gig? The fact this page is basically devoted to Clerical Officer roles is a fair indicator :pac:

whampiri

speedboatchase wrote: »

Can we at least agree that with another massive recession looming and absolutely no job losses or even pay cuts expected in the PS (especially with SF waiting to exploit any such move) - working in the PS is a pretty good gig? The fact this page is basically devoted to Clerical Officer roles is a fair indicator :pac:

I'm expecting that there will be job losses in the form of unfilled vacancies. I'm also expecting pay cuts across the board.

In relation to redundancy, I doubt it will happen but I'm wondering where one believes that redundancies could come from. Social welfare? They're busier than ever. The Garda Siochanna? They get busier during a recession. Health? I can't see cut backs there given the current scenario.

Hotblack Desiato

AGS is undermanned anyway.

Sinzo

speedboatchase wrote: »

Can we at least agree that with another massive recession looming and absolutely no job losses or even pay cuts expected in the PS (especially with SF waiting to exploit any such move) - working in the PS is a pretty good gig? The fact this page is basically devoted to Clerical Officer roles is a fair indicator :pac:

In fairness there is a lot more security in the public service due to the nature of the work - it is vital and in the public interest. The PS will be lucky to get away without cuts down the line especially if there is another COVID lockdown and the world economy and stability seems a bit shaky.

Genuinely though, the public service is not as guaranteed as it used to be. No job is, due to the ever changing face of the new world order and the proliferation of IT and electronic communications to do everything. I have noticed that in the civil service at least, there have been many retirements that have never been replaced. De facto everyone is expected to do more and to be more flexible. We have performance management in the same way as any systems in private industry. Public servants who entered after April 1995 have only half the occupational pension that their predecessors had.

I'm obviously not complaining but there has been a definite change of culture and the future of employment for most people, public or private, is in a period of massive change and there's more to come...

Top chief

Would 30 days hoilday a year be the most you would get in a job ? Does anyone eles take unpaid leave if they want to take a little holiday?
Not talking about at the present moment but just in general si you get extra hoilday.

Cyrus

Top chief wrote: »

Would 30 days hoilday a year be the most you would get in a job ? Does anyone eles take unpaid leave if they want to take a little holiday?
Not talking about at the present moment but just in general si you get extra hoilday.

Generally Yes unless you work somewhere with Unlimited holidays (which is a cod)

6 weeks is plenty of holiday why would you want to take extra unpaid leave on top of that ?

Divisadero

Cyrus wrote: »

Generally Yes unless you work somewhere with Unlimited holidays (which is a cod)

6 weeks is plenty of holiday why would you want to take extra unpaid leave on top of that ?

Why not take extra? Different strokes etc.

UpBack1234

Top chief wrote: »

Would 30 days hoilday a year be the most you would get in a job ? Does anyone eles take unpaid leave if they want to take a little holiday?
Not talking about at the present moment but just in general si you get extra hoilday.

1. You won't be getting 30 days annual leave within your first decade working in the public service unless you carry over untaken leave from the previous period and 2. Unpaid leave is not something you can just take because you want a 'little holiday'. In general there has to be a valid reason given to a manager.

ThumbTaxed

Downside with some public sector roles is that you have no chance of getting a promotion unless you are a female. There is literally a published mandate to fill positions with women.

That may suit some of course.

gmisk

ThumbTaxed wrote: »

Downside with some public sector roles is that you have no chance of getting a promotion unless you are a female. There is literally a published mandate to fill positions with women.

That may suit some of course.

Complete garbage.
I started as a CO and I am now an AP.

I think about 25 percent of ASECs and 35 percent at PO are woman!

There are of course efforts to promote equal opportunities as there should be.