Relaxation of Restrictions, Part IV - **Read OP for Mod Warnings**

ShyMets

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

All those regulations from the IT article will do is cause already struggling businesses to fold completely as customers decide "ta fook am I gonna pay a premium for this nonsense!" and just stay home instead and have a house party. :rolleyes:

Most people are now getting out and about, the Gardai have lost the power to send them home for being naughty and exceeding arbitrary distance limits, and social distancing (excluding queues outside shops) seems to be minimal. Despite this, the numbers continue to fall as this virus seems to be burning out.

I won't be wearing masks, I don't use public transport anyway and I hate queuing as it is (and long before CV-19) so I will not be going to restaurants, pubs, hotels or other businesses where I'm asked to take ridiculous steps for no valid reason. I don't blame the company but I predict there'll be a lot of lobbying when the public continue to stay away.

Most of these guidelines are largely unworkable in the long run. I firmly believe we'll see them and the 2 meter rule relaxed sooner rather then later.

the kelt

is_that_so wrote: »

I don't think it was, we just couldn't process it properly in March and April. What little we knew then suggested it was about the only path open to us. I see that Phillip Nolan told the COVID-19 committee that responses to a "second wave" would be different and probably more targeted first.

Which makes sense. To be fair what we don in March and April was totally the right thing to do under the circumstances at the time.

The problem is it seems a lot of people cant look past March/April and that response to see any other option.

hmmm

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Yup he also warned against using the term 2nd wave, said he prefers resurgence as the term but its was possible but not a guarantee of a another resurgence.

With our testing capabilities now, and public awareness, we hopefully shouldn't see a wave. We had a wave initially as we had multiple cases popping up everywhere, and no systematic way to trace them.

I haven't seen much from businesses about sick pay for employees. It's going to be very important for all our sake that employees with a fever/cough etc are told (warned) to stay away from work.

hmmm

the kelt wrote: »

Which makes sense. To be fair what we don in March and April was totally the right thing to do under the circumstances at the time.

The problem is it seems a lot of people cant look past March/April and that response to see any other option.

Who is in the latter group?

I've seen a lot of people say we need to reduce risk through general social distancing, and will need to jump on cases when they happen. This is the strategy for every country effectively (except Trumpian America).

Elsewhere all in this thread you see complete denial ("it's only a cold") and fantasy ("it disappeared on its own, get rid of all restrictions").

MickeyLeari

ZX7R wrote: »

Makes sense

Indeed - but what is that side of caution puts into jeopardy the livelihoods of 200000 families?

robbiezero

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

It's so completely bizarre and bears no relation to the general conversations I'm seeing elsewhere on the Internet and in real life.

Guess it depends on your circle.

Myself and most friends I know are meeting family now regularly, full contact with grand kids etc, any distance restrictions are being ignored.
Plenty back garden parties and BBQs etc (not really doing that myself yet). Life almost back to normal for most of them.
Had a reunion of our immediate family in Tipperary a few weeks ago, was great to see what a boost it gave my parents to see and hold their grand kids and chat to their family in person.


Then I know of other people who haven't seen close family outside the 20km limit in 3/4 months,
wouldn't visit if they were 25km away,
would cross the road if someone was coming against them on a footpath, visiting the shop is like walking a tightrope across a tiger cage for them.

Flickerfusion

As necessary as they may be deemed to be, it’s very sad to see individual pieces of fruit all wrapped in cling film at my local Spar the other day.

Seems from an environmental point of view we have gone back about 40 years in a few months.

setanta1984

setanta1984 wrote: »

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/new-rules-for-holidays-in-ireland-under-covid-19-no-buffets-mini-bars-or-close-dancing-1.4274393
All this is so insane and over the top. We're utterly collectively losing our minds.

Some of these 'guidelines' are mental:
"Hotels: Guests will be asked to enter the property through doors that are automated or manually operated by an employee where possible"
"If guests use bell service, “ask them to place their luggage on the ground. The bell service can then commence, after which the bell cart can be cleaned and disinfected.”"
"Restaurateurs are being asked to verbally tell customers what is on the menu"
"For golfers, the space between tee times will be increased to 15-minute intervals"

This one is the best, and like something out of a monty python sketch:
"Embellishments on drinks such as decorative cocktail umbrellas will have to be “minimised.”"

Are we living in cloud cuckoo land or what?
You have all these nuts ideas, but anyone can walk into a supermarket and pick up every box of cornflakes, every single product in the shop, lick it and put it back. You can touch any door to any shop yourself. But apparently umbrellas in drinks are lethal and need to be outlawed??

The rubbish about steaming clothes after someone tries on something reported over the last few days was another one. That's apparantly necessary, but you can walk around the clothes section in Tesco for the last 3 months pawing anything you like? And yet it hasn't resulted in the apocalypse?

It's all insane. Companies are going to be made invest in a load of stupid 'regulations' only to realise it's all nonsense after about 3 weeks when compliance falls to nothing and the sky doesn't fall in. Like it didn't with the supermarkets and petrol stations etc. which operated fine all along.

How do you not realise at this point that its all about probabilities? Reduce the contact and we'll reduce any spread. It's that simple. Some people were wiping down their shopping when they got home. There was announcements about being careful using petrol pumps.

_Kaiser_

Deleted User wrote: »

How do you not realise at this point that its all about probabilities? Reduce the contact and we'll reduce any spread. It's that simple. Some people were wiping down their shopping when they got home. There was announcements about being careful using petrol pumps.

Spread has been reduced. The risk and danger of tens of thousands dead has been managed and averted. Mission accomplished.

Time now to get back to living and working and supporting the economy with a minimum of interference from these OTT guidelines and requirements that will only put more businesses under pressure than they already are.

setanta1984

Deleted User wrote: »

Some people were wiping down their shopping when they got home. There was announcements about being careful using petrol pumps.

And that was insane too.

Ginger n Lemon

Deleted User wrote: »

How do you not realise at this point that its all about probabilities? Reduce the contact and we'll reduce any spread. It's that simple. Some people were wiping down their shopping when they got home. There was announcements about being careful using petrol pumps.

At this point its all about protecting our elderly and vulnerable group.

Since when did we change the tune to completely eradicating the virus? We flattened the curve 4 weeks ago. Job done.

Getting really worrying there are still some people out there thinking we can "eradicate" a virus when we have an open border with the country that has most covid deaths and cases in Europe.....

Arghus

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

It's so completely bizarre and bears no relation to the general conversations I'm seeing elsewhere on the Internet and in real life.

Deciding to cut back on the attention and effort I was giving this thread was one of the best decisions I've ever made.

ZX7R

MickeyLeari wrote: »

Indeed - but what is that side of caution puts into jeopardy the livelihoods of 200000 families?

At the end of the day they are the recommendations of the health expert's
There is recommendations and proposal's from other government groups been put forward.
It will be up to the government to hopefully make a balanced decision based on all the available information

hmmm

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

Mission accomplished.

You only have to look at places like South Korea where one person with Covid who went on a pub crawl led to 100 infected people, and over 2,000 bars and nightclubs were told to close to know we are not "mission accomplished".
http://www.koreaherald.com/view.php?ud=20200512000586

We know this thing can spread with great speed - there's a casualness creeping into some people as if the actions of one person don't matter for much, but they can.

Jackman25

Arghus wrote: »

Deciding to cut back on the attention and effort I was giving this thread was one of the best decisions I've ever made.

No doubt you will be back again if cases start to rise.

If that was one of the best decisions you have ever made, you must lead a fairly sheltered life or you take anonymous forums far too seriously.

stephenjmcd

[Deleted User] wrote: »

How do you not realise at this point that its all about probabilities? Reduce the contact and we'll reduce any spread. It's that simple. Some people were wiping down their shopping when they got home. There was announcements about being careful using petrol pumps.

If your going to talk about probabilities acknowledge the probability of you catching covid in day to day life now is extremely slim seeing as spread is already reduced.

The wiping down shopping was always advised against.

There were never announcements about being careful at petrol pumps, there was a made up WhatsApp message about it.

All that was said was the general hand hygiene advice applied to everything, wash your hands after touching stuff and or sanitize them.

facehugger99

These latest guidelines remind me of the saying that a camel is a horse designed by committee.

They have obviously been drafted by lifelong bureaucrats who've never spent a day working in the private sector in their lives. Their primary concern is to cover their own arses even if that means condemning viable businesses to the scrapheap.

If i was a small cafe or restaurant owner, I would be incredibly angry at the nonsense that has been indulged in this country. Meanwhile off-licences have been allowed to trade away during the whole 'pandemic' - where were all the fcuking clusters as a result of this???

Total joke of a county we're living in and the bill is coming for it all

skelly22

is_that_so wrote: »

It is aimed at a general control of population movement and that most people will strategy. In that respect it works very well. The relaxation on Monday and next Monday give the psychological boost a lot of people need. Additionally we are so well programmed in terms of what we can do at this stage you will still get a good degree of compliance plus full travel freedom is under three weeks away.

Sums it up quite well actually.

stephenjmcd

facehugger99 wrote: »

These latest guidelines remind me of the saying that a camel is a horse designed by committee.

They have obviously been drafted by lifelong bureaucrats who've never spent a day working in the private sector in their lives. Their primary concern is to cover their own arses even if that means condemning viable businesses to the scrapheap.

If i was a small cafe or restaurant owner, I would be incredibly angry at the nonsense that has been indulged in this country. Meanwhile off-licences have been allowed to trade away during the whole 'pandemic' - where were all the fcuking clusters as a result of this???

Total joke of a county we're living in and the bill is coming for it all

https://twitter.com/adriancummins/status/1270315549176655873?s=19

_Kaiser_

hmmm wrote: »

You only have to look at places like South Korea where one person with Covid who went on a pub crawl led to 100 infected people, and over 2,000 bars and nightclubs were told to close to know we are not "mission accomplished".
http://www.koreaherald.com/view.php?ud=20200512000586

We know this thing can spread with great speed - there's a casualness creeping into some people as if the actions of one person don't matter for much, but they can.

This is not South Korea, and our health system and public awareness has been ramped up to respond if there should be a significant outbreak.

It is not practical nor realistic to expect the current levels of restrictions and requirements to be maintained until we get to a 0/0 point. We just need to manage the needs of those at greatest risk and restart work, and socialising for the rest as quickly as possible with as little obstacles to that goal as possible.

hmmm

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

This is not South Korea, and our health system and public awareness has been ramped up to respond if there should be a significant outbreak.

South Korea have probably the most efficient and effective testing regime of any country anywhere in the world. We can only aspire to get to their level, and hopefully we will get close. The only reason they managed to get control of this cluster was because they caught it fast.

It is not practical nor realistic to expect the current levels of restrictions and requirements to be maintained until we get to a 0/0 point

It's not about getting to zero. It's about getting it to a low level and keeping it there, and trying to reduce the risk of big clusters popping up because a large group get infected at one event.

leahyl

stephenjmcd wrote: »

https://twitter.com/adriancummins/status/1270315549176655873?s=19

So....I won't be able to meet my friends for something to eat, because we are not in the same household even though, by that stage, I will probably have already met them for a walk or something previously. It's not possible for people at the same table to be 2m apart ffs. :mad: Common sense is going out the window a bit now; I'm all for exercising caution but in all fairness

TaurenDruid

facehugger99 wrote: »

Meanwhile off-licences have been allowed to trade away during the whole 'pandemic' - where were all the fcuking clusters as a result of this???

Total joke of a county we're living in and the bill is coming for it all

When was the last time you spent more than 15 minutes in close proximity to a stranger, at an off licence? When did you last spend more than 10 minutes in one, full stop? In and out in less than ten minutes, including browsing.

That's vastly different from sitting in a cafe for an hour, with strangers at the next table, and the one waitress handling both sets of delph and plates.

The bill is already being paid by the almost 1,700 families who lost loved ones.

ixoy

leahyl wrote: »

So....I won't be able to meet my friends for something to eat, because we are not in the same household even though, by that stage, I will probably have already met them for a walk or something previously. It's not possible for people at the same table to be 2m apart ffs. :mad: Common sense is going out the window a bit now; I'm all for exercising caution but in all fairness

Yep, that too will kill the restaurant business. Nobody's going to meet with friends so they can shout to a table 2m over from them. They'll get take away and go to their friend's houses instead.

I also saw someone saying that staff will have be to 2m away from customers. How would that work? Because if they back 2m away, then they're right beside the next table. 4m now between tables?

Ginger n Lemon

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

At this point its all about protecting our elderly and vulnerable group.

Since when did we change the tune to completely eradicating the virus? We flattened the curve 4 weeks ago. Job done.

Getting really worrying there are still some people out there thinking we can "eradicate" a virus when we have an open border with the country that has most covid deaths and cases in Europe.....

Never as far as I know

skelly22

Cork Boy 53 wrote: »

Which high risk activities in particular are you referring to?

Licking Cornflake boxes in Aldi.

Micky 32

Ginger n Lemon wrote: »

Ouch.

Even to a guy like me thats cold.

I guess that’s the reality on here if your opinion differs to some posters on here they resort to that tactic. Last week it was your age.

Ginger n Lemon

Micky 32 wrote: »

I guess that’s the reality on here if your opinion differs to some posters on here they resort to that tactic. Last week it was your age.

I am cool either way. As long as restrictions are lifted and life goes back to normal which, by looking at all those enjoying the sun on Grafton St yesterday, seems to be back to normal.

Very happy to read report earlier posted by stephenjmc that no matter what we wont go into 2nd lockdown but rather do targeted approach. Best piece of news

stephenjmcd

ixoy wrote: »

Yep, that too will kill the restaurant business. Nobody's going to meet with friends so they can shout to a table 2m over from them. They'll get take away and go to their friend's houses instead.

I also saw someone saying that staff will have be to 2m away from customers. How would that work? Because if they back 2m away, then they're right beside the next table. 4m now between tables?

It'll never work and nowhere is going to be asking if your from the same family or house

tobefrank321

At this stage it would be relatively easy to become virus free.

But it would mean almost indefinite controls on tourists and travellers here from abroad.

The UK, US, Sweden and Brazil remain very high risk countries and also anyone who travelled through those countries. We'd have to restrict travel from there until a vaccine is widely rolled out, which could take years.

I think we need to look at testing people before they leave the airport. Not perfect, but it would allow some kind of return to normality and we do have huge testing capacity now, something like 10,000 tests per day.