How will schools be able to go back in September?

r93kaey5p2izun

CinemaGuy45 wrote: »

I am not posting from a personal motivation I see reality is going to collide with some people.

If a person feels they are not healthy enough to continue a job they should be replaced.


This is real life and life is not always nice the country can not afford to have a big percentage of it's population hiding in their homes longterm on full wages.

We NOW have high unemployment we are in a deep recession and the national debt is scary.

Those who decide to get militant may find that it all ends in tears for them.

By September with every other European nation back at school people may be well advised to be careful how they behave.

Replaced with who out of interest?

CinemaGuy45

Yosef Stocky Backspace wrote: »

Replaced with who out of interest?

Somebody willing and able to do the job.:)

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Scruff101 wrote: »

I apologise, if posting a worklist on a Sunday night constitutes maximum effort then I completely take that statement back.

Cull the hostility - I never said I disagreed with you. Nor did I ask what constituted minimum/maximum effort.

I asked HOW you knew what they were or were not doing.

r93kaey5p2izun

CinemaGuy45 wrote: »

Somebody willing and able to do the job.:)

I'm not even disagreeing, but I think you are not fully aware of the serious recruitment difficulties in schools.

brendanwalsh

The solution is not simple as “sack all teachers who refuse to work”.

We already have a teacher shortage.

Equally it’s not about refusing to work, it’s that classrooms of 30 children sitting next to each other without masks are big vectors of spread.

Btw children are at high risk too, lot of Kawasaki disease appearing in the USA in children who had Covid.

CinemaGuy45

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

Cull the hostility - I never said I disagreed with you. Nor did I ask what constituted minimum/maximum effort.

I asked HOW you knew what they were or were not doing.

I know you are not responding to me but I will let you know there is no hostility from me.

Getting back to work is something that has to happen and something that will happen.

Distribution shops supermarkets rubbish collection post food delivery have all been deemed essential and there have been NO large clusters in any of these sectors.

This is only May if people think they are going to be sitting at home on full pay come September they are not living in reality.

I find this attitude from office workers also I find it a bit annoying and over the top.

Again I am not getting hostile because whatever we say here does not matter financial reality will sort this out none of us will have a say.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

CinemaGuy45 wrote: »

I know you are not responding to me but I will let you know there is no hostility from me.

Getting back to work is something that has to happen and something that will happen.

Distribution shops supermarkets rubbish collection post food delivery have all been deemed essential and there have been NO large clusters in any of these sectors.

This is only May if people think they are going to be sitting at home on full pay come September they are not living in reality.

I find this attitude from office workers also I find it a bit annoying and over the top.

Again I am not getting hostile because whatever we say here does not matter financial reality will sort this out none of us will have a say.

None of this is relevant to the question asked of the other poster: how did they know what the teachers were or were not doing "for a fact"?

CinemaGuy45

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

None of this is relevant to the question asked of the other poster: how did they know what the teachers were or were not doing "for a fact"?

As far as that goes I don't know or care school days are long behind me and I don't have any children.

I just think we ALL need to get the country moving again the Government has set out a five step plan we need to go along with it.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

CinemaGuy45 wrote: »

As far as that goes I don't know or care school days are long behind me and I don't have any children.

I just think we ALL need to get the country moving again the Government has set out a five set plan we need to go along with it.

Which is fine - but again - you didn't need to quote me! You really didn;t need to quote anyone!

TheValeyard

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

Which is fine - but again - you didn't need to quote me! You really didn;t need to quote anyone!

- quote Princess Consuela Bananahammock

daydorunrun

I have high regard for teachers, it’s not a job I could do, but some think that if they are busy working at home then that’s fine, it isn’t.
Online teaching for many kids won’t be effective.
Some will not have any support at home either. Education is a way for kids from poor backgrounds to find a way out, their disadvantage will grow more as time goes on. I genuinely believe there are many who have developed an appetite for working from home and get defensive every time there’s talk of going back sooner.

khalessi

daydorunrun wrote: »

I have high regard for teachers, it’s not a job I could do, but some think that if they are busy working at home then that’s fine, it isn’t.
Online teaching for many kids won’t be effective.
Some will not have any support at home either. Education is a way for kids from poor backgrounds to find a way out, their disadvantage will grow more as time goes on. I genuinely believe there are many who have developed an appetite for working from home and get defensive every time there’s talk of going back sooner.

Agreed but that is not the teachers fault as we cannot control what goes on in the home and are dealing with as best we can. No one here objects to going back to school. What is annoying is people just coming on thread just to teacher bash. Reasonable on topic discourse is welcomed.

There have been numerous suggestions on this thread and others by teachers on how to reopen a school and what would be needed.

But when people constantly come on and say we are sitting on our asses at home that is frustrating and off topic. Then there are the others who think teachers control schools being closed, not true or that we dont care about the kids because schools are closed on government orders. Then the suggestion that people who are well enough to do their job prior to a pandemic should be sacked because they may have an underlying condition, that could cause an issue during a pandemic, ridiculous.

This thread is about how will schools be able to go back in September and conversation on that would be nice.

Jim Root

My 6 year old gets an email Monday morning from his teacher and she does a class zoom call once a week. It’s quite nice.

JP100

France acted in haste and now have an outbreak of 70 new cases linked to the early reopening of schools.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/coronavirus-france-school-cases-reopen-lockdown-a9520386.html

kandr10

Hearty80 wrote: »

Oh in sure that's exactly what will happen, whilst everyone else has to return to work as normal. It's an absolute joke having schools closed. You obviously couldn't give one ****e about the disadvantaged children with that comment about Christmas. Coronavirus will be the least of their problems at that stage. But you do you and look after yourself.

Anyone I know of in an office setting who is currently working from home has been told that they won’t be back to full capacity before Christmas and most people will continue to work from home. That is as long as they are still required to observe social distancing which is current government advice. There’s a lot of people saying everyone will return to work. It simply isn’t true!

ldy4mxonucwsq6

Jim Root wrote: »

My 6 year old gets an email Monday morning from his teacher and she does a class zoom call once a week. It’s quite nice.

That's a whole what 2-3 hours of work a week there. More than what the teacher we have does I suppose.

If thats what passes for a full week of work on full pay then that's probably why parents are annoyed.

I saw a thread in the Teaching forum practically relishing in the fact that parents were struggling, another from a teacher who wanted to be compensated because they weren't getting their yearly top up of 3k-4k for correcting exams this year.

I think the reality of the situation will come as a major shock to teachers and their unions if the schools can't open properly in September because the budget can't stretch to keep paying dept of education staff if they aren't working.

High unemployment, parents unable to return to work = no money in the kitty

khalessi

Zahir Bitter Cellist wrote: »

That's a whole what 2-3 hours of work a week there. More than what the teacher we have does I suppose.

If thats what passes for a full week of work on full pay then that's probably why parents are annoyed.

I saw a thread in the Teaching forum practically relishing in the fact that parents were struggling, another from a teacher who wanted to be compensated because they weren't getting their yearly top up of 3k-4k for correcting exams this year.

I think the reality of the situation will come as a major shock to teachers and their unions if the schools can't open properly in September because the budget can't stretch to keep paying dept of education staff if they aren't working.

High unemployment, parents unable to return to work = no money in the kitty

What about teachers who are working and the point ws made that teacher may only be getting a few hours a week work so 3000 - 4000 could be very important to them. That point was made in the thread but you choose to ignore that. Not every teacher is working full hours and correcting exams helps with pay. I know teachers in secondary schools who are on 5 hours a week and stick at it in hopes of more hours eventually.
Also if it is the thread i am thinking teachers arent relishing on parents struggling as many of us are parents and struggling but I hate to interfer with your constant bashing of subtle bashing despite the fact you have no investment in the Irish education as you yourself have said you live abroad. Have you considered passing your wisdom onto the courtry you are living in?

History Queen

Zahir Bitter Cellist wrote: »

That's a whole what 2-3 hours of work a week there. More than what the teacher we have does I suppose.

If thats what passes for a full week of work on full pay then that's probably why parents are annoyed.

I saw a thread in the Teaching forum practically relishing in the fact that parents were struggling, another from a teacher who wanted to be compensated because they weren't getting their yearly top up of 3k-4k for correcting exams this year.

I think the reality of the situation will come as a major shock to teachers and their unions if the schools can't open properly in September because the budget can't stretch to keep paying dept of education staff if they aren't working.

High unemployment, parents unable to return to work = no money in the kitty

Would you and others on this forum have a problem with teachers who are working from home being paid if those that are not working were not paid? Genuine question.

ldy4mxonucwsq6

khalessi wrote: »

What about teachers who are working and the point ws made that teacher may only be getting a few hours a week work so 3000 - 4000 could be very important to them. That point was made in the thread but you choose to ignore that. Not every teacher is working full hours and correcting exams helps with pay. I know teachers in secondary schools who are on 5 hours a week and stick at it in hopes of more hours eventually.
Also if it is the thread i am thinking teachers arent relishing on parents struggling as many of us are parents and struggling but I hate to interfer with your constant bashing of subtle bashing despite the fact you have no investment in the Irish education as you yourself have said you live abroad. Have you considered passing your wisdom onto the courtry you are living in?

I live in Ireland and have 3 children in different educational institutions, primary, secondary and third level. So I have investment and experience here (don't know where you got the idea that I'm abroad from).

Some parts of the education system here are very slow to adapt and innovate (and the pandemic is only highlighting that).

If it was a private company it'd be out of business and I feel for the young graduate teachers who come into it full of zest and good ideas only to find there are no proper jobs for some them.

ldy4mxonucwsq6

History Queen wrote: »

Would you and others on this forum have a problem with teachers who are working from home being paid if those that are not working were not paid? Genuine question.

Well if I put in the amount of work that I've seen from some teachers I'd likely be sacked.

I think it's unfair that some teachers are working so hard and others couldn't give a hoot to be honest.

If they were my colleagues I'd be mighty pissed off.

brookers

We are getting the same, as if they in school, non stop emails, i was so shattered from it all last week, I just wasnt able to do another day. On top of this they have activiities and have to list them, projects, essay writing etc our teachers are way beyond the call of duty.

Lillyfae

Zahir Bitter Cellist wrote: »

I live in Ireland and have 3 children in different educational institutions, primary, secondary and third level. So I have investment and experience here (don't know where you got the idea that I'm abroad from).

Some parts of the education system here are very slow to adapt and innovate (and the pandemic is only highlighting that).

Is it was a private company it'd be out of business and I feel for the young graduate teachers who come into it full of zest and good ideas only to find there are no proper jobs for some them.

I think Khalessi is probably getting you mixed up with me.

See the thing about offices is, we can actually work purely online because for the most part, that’s what we’re doing in our offices anyway. Working with colleagues on the other side of the world, in different timezones, constantly learning and reskilling in different types of software and systems that are required for us to do our jobs. We’re not IT specialists or experts and we don’t get paid extra for this, it’s just a requirement.

Teaching children to a sufficient level is not possible if it is only done remotely. The longer this goes on the more detrimental it will be for this generation of children. All teachers here seem to be doing is shutting down any discussion on opening schools. And teachers are not best qualified to make decisions about schools reopening or not. Having an opinion is fine but previously having been a nurse does not mean that one knows what’s the best public health policy either, especially in a situation as dynamic as this.

khalessi

Lillyfae wrote: »

I think Khalessi is probably getting you mixed up with me.


Teaching children to a sufficient level is not possible if it is only done remotely. The longer this goes on the more detrimental it will be for this generation of children. All teachers here seem to be doing is shutting down any discussion on opening schools. And teachers are not best qualified to make decisions about schools reopening or not. Having an opinion is fine but previously having been a nurse does not mean that one knows what’s the best public health policy either, especially in a situation as dynamic as this.

I probably did and apologies. No being a nurse though does give a better insight then some of the half assed comments on this thread blaming teachers for school closures when it had nothing to do with us. Then blaming us for them not reopening also not to do with teachers.

I think that being in a different country with no input to Irish education does not mean that you now know whats best about education policy either.

There have been in a couple of threads comparisons to nursing and private and being one of the few people who have worked public and private along with being a nurse does give me better insight than the people making the comments.

History Queen

Zahir Bitter Cellist wrote: »

Well if I put in the amount of work that I've seen from some teachers I'd likely be sacked.

I think it's unfair that some teachers are working so hard and others couldn't give a hoot to be honest.

If they were my colleagues I'd be mighty pissed off.

That's why I asked if you are happy for those working from home to continue being paid if those not working were not. You haven't answered me.

ldy4mxonucwsq6

History Queen wrote: »

That's why I asked if you are happy for those working from home to continue being paid if those not working were not. You haven't answered me.

Absolutely in an ideal world those who are putting in the effort should be paid. I have seen some teachers putting in fantastic effort so of course they deserve to be fully paid.

There are others who are doing minimal work (if any at all).

First though how would you measure who's working and who isn't and secondly the reality is that there will not be enough money to continue to pay teachers to stay at home indefinitely regardless of how much they do.

People need to get back to work so the country can start ticking over again, there's a huge debt waiting to be paid already.

There will not be a household in the country that does not feel the financial impact of this and that goes for us all teachers or not.

khalessi

Zahir Bitter Cellist wrote: »

Absolutely in an ideal world those who are putting in the effort should be paid. I have seen some teachers putting in fantastic effort so of course they deserve to be fully paid.

There are others who are doing minimal work (if any at all).

First though how would you measure who's working and who isn't and secondly the reality is that there will not be enough money to continue to pay teachers to stay at home indefinitely regardless of how much they do.

People need to get back to work so the country can start ticking over again, there's a huge debt waiting to be paid already.

There will not be a household in the country that does not feel the financial impact of this and that goes for us all teachers or not.

So your solution if the schools remain closed, due to public health policy is to sack everyone?

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

TheValeyard wrote: »

- quote Princess Consuela Bananahammock

I actually had Graham Chapaman / Brian in my head when I wrote it - but with "follow" instead of quote...

Lillyfae

History Queen wrote: »

That's why I asked if you are happy for those working from home to continue being paid if those not working were not. You haven't answered me.

What are you even asking?

If people are not working when they are supposed to be, or claim to be, they shouldn’t be paid. We’re all stressed and struggling, and organizations should allow for flexibility. Such as flexible working to allow for childcare. I’m currently getting up around 5:30 to get a couple of hours in before my toddler gets up, working in the afternoon during nap time and then after bed time at night. The last 5 months have been our busiest time since I started so I’ve been online most weekends too. I check in with my manager once a week and my team once a week so everyone is still communicating and if help is needed or available we put our hands up.

But I’ve also had to use quite a few vacation days just to get my head straight because I’m knackered, all the time. I simply can’t afford to lose my job, mentally or financially, and if I wasn’t working and I wasn’t engaging with my colleagues, that would most certainly happen.

History Queen

Lillyfae wrote: »

What are you even asking?

If people are not working when they are supposed to be, or claim to be, they shouldn’t be paid. We’re all stressed and struggling, and organizations should allow for flexibility. Such as flexible working to allow for childcare. I’m currently getting up around 5:30 to get a couple of hours in before my toddler gets up, working in the afternoon during nap time and then after bed time at night. The last 5 months have been our busiest time since I started so I’ve been online most weekends too. I check in with my manager once a week and my team once a week so everyone is still communicating and if help is needed or available we put our hands up.

But I’ve also had to use quite a few vacation days just to get my head straight because I’m knackered, all the time. I simply can’t afford to lose my job, mentally or financially, and if I wasn’t working and I wasn’t engaging with my colleagues, that would most certainly happen.

What I'm asking is very clear.

Lillyfae

History Queen wrote: »

What I'm asking is very clear.

If you’re going to be obtuse, then a clear question would have been: Do you think people who aren’t working should be paid for working?