COVID-19: Vaccine/antidote and testing procedures Megathread [Mod Warning - Post #1]

Gael23

Gael23 wrote: »

Anyone seen this? https://www.irishexaminer.com/world/arid-40037516.html

He is suggesting late 2021 before the Oxford vsccine is available for the general population

Unless I'm blatantly missing something, nowhere in that article refers to late 2021?

Stark

This bit I think:

His comments came after England’s chief medical officer, Professor Chris Whitty, said a vaccine for coronavirus may not be ready until next winter.

timsey tiger

Le Bruise wrote: »

With front line/vulnerable being vaccinated in early 2021 (hopefully), would that mean the rest of the population could go back to some form of normality or do we have to wait for the full roll out for that?

I'd imagine we'd need a significant portion of the population vaccinated, as even the less vulnerable cohorts would have the potential to overwhelm the hospital system and most vaccines are not 100% effective, esp. for the higher risk groups.

I'd guess it would another factor to model into the phased reopening.

Hector Savage

Stark wrote: »

This bit I think:

Next winter is Winter 20/21 ...

JDD

Hector Savage wrote: »

Next winter is Winter 20/21 ...

Ah the age old discussion - does "next weekend" mean the weekend coming or the one after it? I think it's generally accepted that the weekend coming is called "this weekend" and the one after it is "next weekend". Therefore "this winter" is Winter 20/21 and "next winter" is Winter 21/22. But some clarity from the scientist himself would help...

hmmm

I don't like the way Moderna has these conference calls, but if proven true this looks like great news.
https://www.cnbc.com/2020/08/26/moderna-says-its-coronavirus-vaccine-shows-promising-results-in-small-trial-of-elderly-patients.html

"The company tested its vaccine on 10 adults between ages 56 and 70 and 10 elderly adults aged 71 and older, Moderna said. Each participant received two 100 microgram doses of the vaccine 28 days apart.

The volunteers produced neutralizing antibodies, which researchers believe are necessary to build immunity to the virus, and killer T-cells, Moderna said in its results, which have not yet been published in a peer-reviewed journal. Additionally, the antibodies that were produced were higher than those seen in people who have recovered from Covid-19. "

is_that_so

Call me Al wrote: »

When can we expect to see results from phase 3 trials?
How long do they normally take to complete?

They are still recruiting so could be closer to election time in US.

is_that_so

Gael23 wrote: »

People won’t give up another summer next year

Agreed. In theory, we should have a much wider range of tools and measures to ensure that doesn't happen.

Hmmzis

A VLP type candidate, well, two actually:

https://www.vbivaccines.com/wire/preclinical-coronavirus-data-candidate-selection/

The first one is very interesting as it's intended to be a trivalent type against the two SARS's and MERS.
The press release is stating some impressive nAB titers in comparison with convalescent sera. I'd like to see at least a pre-print with their pre-clinical data and I hope they did at least one challenge study with the wild type virus.

Given how well the HPV vaccine works (it's a VLP type as well), this could have the potential to be a 'protected for life' deal, especially with the boost option.

Gael23

is_that_so wrote: »

Agreed. In theory, we should have a much wider range of tools and measures to ensure that doesn't happen.

Such as what?

irishgeo

Gael23 wrote: »

People won’t give up another summer next year

We don't need a vaccine for that. It could be a combination of a vaccine and a drug to reduce the symptoms.

Imagine a vaccine for the vulnerable people and the elderly and then drugs that could reduce down people's symptoms. If you have both on to go it would be mean things might be back to normality.

We could have also have more than one vaccine available also.

To the anti vaccine people. What do you do if you want to travel to Africa etc that you need to show proof of your vacations before traveling.

is_that_so

Gael23 wrote: »

Such as what?

Well it's a year out! We already know the benefit of managing via a variety of restrictions, better testing systems, quite probably aided by rapid tests. Care homes will have proper infection control and one would hope we'll have a good range of treatments that will help manage the severity of the disease.

gmisk

https://news.sky.com/story/some-insect-repellents-could-kill-coronavirus-military-study-shows-12057007

Very interesting read I thought could help

Thierry12

gmisk wrote: »

https://news.sky.com/story/some-insect-repellents-could-kill-coronavirus-military-study-shows-12057007

Very interesting read I thought could help

Spray it up your nose?

How does it work?

nannerbenahs

Query
If a sick person is suffering from Covid 19, their lungs should be filled with sars cov 2, as in the case of all viruses, the viral load would have increased dramatically as the illness caused by this virus made the person sicker, so why would they need to do a pcr test on this patient to see if they have this virus, a test that involves the multplying of tiny amounts of DNA/RNA often from asymptomatic patients. This DNA must also first be isolated from other impurities and bacteria also taken in the pcr throat swab.
Surely if we had a clearly purified image of the Sars Cov 2 virus, that could be visualised under a microscope and it could also be identified very quickly in a situation where it has increased its load so dramatically.
Seems strange. Maybe someone can explain...

3xh

irishgeo wrote: »

To the anti vaccine people. What do you do if you want to travel to Africa etc that you need to show proof of your vacations before traveling.

I can’t speak for people who are truly anti-vaccine, as in, take no vaccine at all and how they go to places like Africa etc. But I’m sure you mean the anti-Covid vaccine people of which I am one.

The key difference for me is one is a tried and tested process and one is a mad dash, lucrative race to market. It’s obvious which is which and how one is clearly riskier to one’s health than the other.

There aren’t many never before seen adverse reactions occurring in people taking shots for a trip to Uganda or Borneo anymore. The testing process in this Covid vaccine race is, by the players’ own admission, faster than they’ve ever done it before.

They’ve asked for immunity too.

I just think it’s nuts to be unquestioning of Pharma’s reassurances that their Covid vaccine is safe (read; ‘within limits acceptable to us’)

Throw in hints from Governments around the world that a reopening of society is predicated on vaccine penetration rates and mandatory vaccination under a so-called No Jab, No Pay policy and if you’ve any sort of critical thinking process, you’ll say ‘Hang on a sec’

hmmm

3xh wrote: »

I just think it’s nuts to be unquestioning of Pharma’s reassurances that their Covid vaccine is safe (read; ‘within limits acceptable to us’)

The pharma companies won't get to decide whether the vaccine will be released to the public, the regulators will.

Now maybe Trump can find some way to corrupt all the scientists in the FDA, and who is going to trust Russia & China, but I trust the EU and Irish regulators, the Japanese, the Australians, the Koreans and so on will do their jobs properly.

We've already by the way seen the US regulator hold up one of the main vaccine candidates (Moderna), and tell them to go back and redo part of their testing. They wouldn't be doing that if they were told to release things as quickly as possible.

Azatadine

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/moderna-and-pfizers-covid-19-vaccine-candidates-require-ultra-low-temperatures-raising-questions-about-storage-distribution-2020-08-27?mod=home-page

Thierry12

Azatadine wrote: »

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/moderna-and-pfizers-covid-19-vaccine-candidates-require-ultra-low-temperatures-raising-questions-about-storage-distribution-2020-08-27?mod=home-page

They have to be stored at -70c

Need liquid nitrogen type storage for that?

How long to defrost lol

CruelSummer

Question: Who handles the contracts for purchasing vaccines in the Republic of Ireland? Does NPHET choose or the HSE? What do we know about any conflicts of interest that may arise from this process?

Thierry12

CruelSummer wrote: »

Question: Who handles the contracts for purchasing vaccines in the Republic of Ireland? Does NPHET choose or the HSE? What do we know about any conflicts of interest that may arise from this process?

Good question, but why worry yourself?

We will buy whatever the pharma giants based in Ireland are selling

Pfizer, Regeneron

You can be sure plenty of conflicts

3xh

hmmm wrote: »

The pharma companies won't get to decide whether the vaccine will be released to the public, the regulators will.

Now maybe Trump can find some way to corrupt all the scientists in the FDA, and who is going to trust Russia & China, but I trust the EU and Irish regulators, the Japanese, the Australians, the Koreans and so on will do their jobs properly.

We've already by the way seen the US regulator hold up one of the main vaccine candidates (Moderna), and tell them to go back and redo part of their testing. They wouldn't be doing that if they were told to release things as quickly as possible.

hmmm, those regulators are the same regulators that got other approvals wrong. Where people were left with life long ailments and maiming owing to unforeseen (or otherwise) reactions.

What follows is a lifetime of stress and financial hardship trying to extract compensation from the relevant redress schemes. I wouldn’t wish that grind on anyone. You’re a forgotten number.

All that hassle to reduce the risk of covid. For me, it’s not worth it. It is for you by the sounds of it, so take it yourself but don’t be calling for vaccinations for all.

hmmm

3xh wrote: »

All that hassle to reduce the risk of covid. For me, it’s not worth it. It is for you by the sounds of it, so take it yourself but don’t be calling for vaccinations for all.

If people don't want to take vaccinations they should be kept away from vulnerable people. I'd also not like to be sitting in a workplace, restaurant or on a flight with someone who is potentially carrying a dangerous disease because getting vaccinated is a "hassle", myself and my family have rights too.

Gael23

Leaves the Oxford one as the most encouraging still.
Will any Irish Pharma company be involved in that?

3xh

hmmm wrote: »

If people don't want to take vaccinations they should be kept away from vulnerable people. I'd also not like to be sitting in a workplace, restaurant or on a flight with someone who is potentially carrying a dangerous disease because getting vaccinated is a "hassle", myself and my family have rights too.

Just to be clear hmmm, my use of the word hassle is in reference to suffering a long term adverse reaction to an expedited vaccine and having to fight for years for redress. Be it me or a child of mine. Not that having to go for a jab ruins my evening plans.

So don’t misuse my use of the word to make it sound like I’m trampling on your rights. You won’t be in any way helping me or my family seek assistance if a jab was to go wrong for us as you live your healthy lives all vaccinated.

hmmm

3xh wrote: »

So don’t misuse my use of the word to make it sound like I’m trampling on your rights. You won’t be in any way helping me or my family seek assistance if a jab was to go wrong for us as you live your healthy lives all vaccinated.

Good to hear, but we don't all live our lives in fear. If you choose not to do your bit to protect society, hopefully society can be protected from the consequences of your choices.

LessOutragePlz

3xh wrote: »

Just to be clear hmmm, my use of the word hassle is in reference to suffering a long term adverse reaction to an expedited vaccine and having to fight for years for redress. Be it me or a child of mine. Not that having to go for a jab ruins my evening plans.

So don’t misuse my use of the word to make it sound like I’m trampling on your rights. You won’t be in any way helping me or my family seek assistance if a jab was to go wrong for us as you live your healthy lives all vaccinated.

https://twitter.com/GraalTruth/status/1298385687729799170?s=19

Source: https://t.co/LG2kxE28XW?amp=1

I'd rather take my 99.99% of surviving if I got infected than the potential risks associated with taking a rushed vaccine.

Absolutely ridiculous too that people are already trying to shame or guilt people into taking a vaccine for an illness that the vast majority of people will have a 99.99% of surviving if they get infected.

And before anyone starts spouting some nonsense about the potential long terms effects after recovering from the virus. There is no way with any kind of certainty that anyone can say what the long term effects on a person's health will be. Since enough time hasn't passed since the pandemic has begun for people to be able to make any such assumptions about the potential long term effects of the virus.

hmmm

The vaccine of course is not rushed and is the usual anti-vaxer nonsense, the stages of development and manufacture are being run in parallel for this vaccine rather than one after the other as is normal - it will still have the same safety testing as other vaccines. Manufacturing is starting before the trials are completed, and if the trials are not successful the manufactured vaccine will be disposed of.

The Oxford vaccine in particular has been in development for related Coronaviruses for nearly 20 years. The fact that they had already spent so much time developing it meant they could very rapidly modify it for Covid.

NH2013

LessOutragePlz wrote: »

https://twitter.com/GraalTruth/status/1298385687729799170?s=19

Source: https://t.co/LG2kxE28XW?amp=1

I'd rather take my 99.99% of surviving if I got infected than the potential risks associated with taking a rushed vaccine.

Absolutely ridiculous too that people are already trying to shame or guilt people into taking a vaccine for an illness that the vast majority of people will have a 99.99% of surviving if they get infected.

And before anyone starts spouting some nonsense about the potential long terms effects after recovering from the virus. There is no way with any kind of certainty that anyone can say what the long term effects on a person's health will be. Since enough time hasn't passed since the pandemic has begun for people to be able to make any such assumptions about the potential long term effects of the virus.

Okay, but at the same time, you should be kept away from those in society that could be put at risk by catching the disease off you, ie the >20% mortality rate in 80+ males with an underlying condition.

This isn't about whether you'll suffer badly from the disease or be unlucky enough to be the one to die/have long lasting conditions, but about protecting the vulnerable in society.

So if you don't want the vaccine fine, but don't put yourself in close contact with those at risk, avoid shops, cinemas, pubs, flights etc.

dexter647

LessOutragePlz wrote: »

https://twitter.com/GraalTruth/status/1298385687729799170?s=19

Source: https://t.co/LG2kxE28XW?amp=1

I'd rather take my 99.99% of surviving if I got infected than the potential risks associated with taking a rushed vaccine.

Absolutely ridiculous too that people are already trying to shame or guilt people into taking a vaccine for an illness that the vast majority of people will have a 99.99% of surviving if they get infected.

And before anyone starts spouting some nonsense about the potential long terms effects after recovering from the virus. There is no way with any kind of certainty that anyone can say what the long term effects on a person's health will be. Since enough time hasn't passed since the pandemic has begun for people to be able to make any such assumptions about the potential long term effects of the virus.

Well if it's on twitter it must be true so:rolleyes: