Working From Home Megathread

Cyrus

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119761528#Comment_119761528

you are making assumptions as to the importance of the issues and in lots of cases its far more efficient than the alternative. i'm talking about big stuff, not day to day issues clearly.

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119761533#Comment_119761533

You didn't describe big stuff. Its the exact opposite of efficient. Habits die hard I guess.

Frank Bullitt

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119761520#Comment_119761520

I guess my experiences would counter that in my professional life. The company I was with as Covid hit was a hive of wasted time but a huge advocate for in person time etc. Meetings (with no agenda) would start with 10 minutes of wasted time talking about rubbish. When I was remote for the following company, the meetings had agendas so we knew exactly what we were to talk about and address. This sped things up really well and kept us all on track.

If you wanted to just shoot the breeze, you could do that in another meeting if you felt the need.

It wasn't an assembly line, like you put it, it was efficient with the main objective to get your work done, so you could have more free time to do what you wanted. So for me, it was for me to get to the gym, do some shopping, clean the house, etc etc. I was there for meetings and got my work done, no need to be sitting at my desk if I had nothing pressing to do.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119761345#Comment_119761345

Most CEO's i have worked with will jump on a flight at short notice to sort an issue face to face with a bank or a supplier or customer or whatever it is, as thats a quicker solution than people in management positions thrashing it out for weeks with each other across 2 organisations.

Like I said, a bigger problem.

Seriously, the CEO is the head of the company. Having him/her waste time on a flight to go have 1 conversation with one person to fix something that shouldn't come near his desk speaks volumes about the company in terms of micromanagement.

Yes I've seen it, but only in small Irish companies where the boss has to "be the boss" and be the fixer. Once you go beyond a certain size, if your CEO is still doing that, then your company is, well, fkd. It speaks to having a lack of trust and not empowering your people to resolve issues.

Imagine having VP's who have Directors who have Managers, all working for a company who would have to get the CEO to fix something for them that they could not resolve. They'd all be shown the door and rightfully so.

Going down to work station level on production lines, all the way up to global level, the higher ups want to hear how you have resolved an issue or, and this is for as low a level as possible depending on the costs/impacts involved, they want you to present a CBA/decision matrix of potential solution options for them to sign off the cost/impact.

Also, my previous post wasn't directed at you, just jumping into the discussion at that point, apologies if it came across that way, wasn't my intention

Flinty997

I think it's a very hard sell to suggest that in person meeting effeciency can in anyway balance the vast resources sucked up by commuting. The majority of the time. Unless there's a specific business process that requires it.

AdamD

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119761520#Comment_119761520

Dunno why you're bothering, this thread has been the same since day 1. They are arguing for WFH because it suits them, they won't accept one single scenario where it would be preferable to work in person. Its not an argument in good faith whatsoever.

There are pros and cons to both, but this thread will never accept that.

Flinty997

Won't accept daft examples certainly.

Flinty997

Reminds of when you automate something or streamline a process or pipeline. But someone insists doing it the old way. It's just better "because".

Mrs OBumble

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119761693#Comment_119761693

It's amazing how some people think that things are the same in companies of all sizes and market sectors, and that they all need to scale.

And that because things worked well-enough in a crisis (when everyone was scared for their health and that their job might disappear), they can continue to work that way.

Cyrus

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119761705#Comment_119761705

I’m a big advocate of streamlining processes , new systems, having a system to drive behaviours rather than the other way around. Come to think of it another thing I find you need to be together for, new system implementations , people around a whiteboard designing something or nutting something out ,

anyway I don’t need to try nor would I be successful in changing anyone’s mind so ill leave it as this is an incredibly inefficient use of my time 😀

Cyrus

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119761647#Comment_119761647

Like I said I must tell guy whose co made a 9 figure profit last year that his co is fked he will be pretty concerned 😂

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119762149#Comment_119762149

That's a bit like holding up the 100yr old smoker as example of how to do things.

Cyrus

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119762213#Comment_119762213

Maybe

Or maybe the boards wfh advocates aren’t the best placed people to dictate how best to run a company ?

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119762139#Comment_119762139

There are virtual whiteboards for remote working....just saying.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119762149#Comment_119762149

You'd have to wonder what the large shareholders would have to say if they were to see a CEO with such little trust in his CFO & COO and other VP's/Directors. It honestly wouldn't inspire confidence if I was an investor.

Oh well, if he's happy let him off. Doesn't bode well for the company though, long-term, being so reliant on one man (single point of failure) and is the exact reason for delegation

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119762223#Comment_119762223

I think you'll need a better example than a CEO running around firefighting, putting out fires that they started as example of anything.

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119762247#Comment_119762247

Exactly he becomes his own bottleneck that only he can fix. Catch 22 in effect.

Cyrus

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119762258#Comment_119762258

im reminded of eamon dunphy and Graeme souness a bit in this thread , anyway will leave you all to it, need to be up early will be going into the office tomorrow !

come to think of it Steve jobs would be frowned upon by the posters in this thread too!

God, reading this I'm glad I'm not some high powered CEO/CFO type.

I'd hate to have to jump on a plane to go solve an issue with some bank or supplier.

What's wrong with a Teams call? The same discussion can be had, and problems solved, and be home in time for dinner, with no time wasted on unnecessary travel. Travelling sounds a lot less efficient to me. And less friendly to the environment.

But then again, I work to live, not live to work, like it sounds some of these people do, and I guess that's fine if they're wired that way, but most would agree it's not "better".

Besides, how would those who have never worked fully remote, even by going into offices against advice during a pandemic, know what is "better"?

Flinty997

Steven jobs doesn't work for your theory. He almost bankrupted Apple before he got the boot. Then when he was back Gates bailed them out. Ives really was the one put Apple back in the game Jobs was brilliant but he surrounded himself with better people than himself. At the end his stubbornness delayed his treatment from a treatable illness.

That you think it was all Jobs suggests you don't know Jobs that well or you're blinded by the cult of Jobs. Or as it seems you value people solely by the size of their wallet. As you repeat that so often.

Sunny Disposition

I would have been what i suppose you’d call the CEO of a large construction company years ago, it was my own company. I did feel I had to be on sites fairly often, I just had to see how work was going.

In that kind of case I can see why people do feel they need to be physically present at least sometimes, even if they don’t do any manual work. But for most white collar situations it’s very hard to see why it’s required specifically. Even if there are in-person benefits it’s hard to believe they make keeping an office open and commuting worthwhile.

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119762603#Comment_119762603

We had a similar But sites are filled with people who act first think later. It used to be very hard to get people to follow plans or instructions. They'd try to lash stuff in and hope it was too far past the point of return so they wouldn't be made to redo it. Its why the standard of workmanship is often so bad. Also way a good tradesman, foreman or builder is so valuable.

But I would agree in a professional level white collar job, its not the same thing at all. Once you get above certain size its not possible to micro manage everything. Even if Jobs tried to, ringing people at 4am with an idea and expect you do start work immediately.

Cyrus

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119762497#Comment_119762497

I don’t know where to start with this, you are making some pretty big leaps, I never said I value people by their wallet either which shows you aren’t understanding what I’m saying either that or you are trying to have a sneaky dig at me.

let me spell it out, exclude charities, companies exist to make money, if they make a lot of money we can say the person running is doing a good job . So having some boards poster deducing that a company making huge profits is fked is a bit hard to swallow. Similarly being the most efficient, zero waste, no in person meeting outfit in the world is worth sweet fa if you can’t turn a profit, how else will they pay flinty997 to sit in his spare room being super efficient?

Cyrus

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119762489#Comment_119762489

I’ve already said for someone who works to live as you put it, wfh is ideal, that didn’t go down that well either though.

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119762780#Comment_119762780

You bring it up a lot. "9 figure profit", "multi millionaire" you're doing it again in this post.

Something can be badly run/managed and still make money. They are not mutually exclusive.

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119762788#Comment_119762788

LOL.

Cyrus

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119762829#Comment_119762829

As I said companies exist to make money not to be well run. You can be both but I’d rather work somewhere that was poorly run and making money than somewhere ‘well run’ and loosing it.

anyway flinty sounds like you have it all sussed .

Cyrus

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119762885#Comment_119762885

Lol indeed.

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119762980#Comment_119762980

I'd prefer to be working somewhere that is well run AND making money. (if thats its aim).

Also not mutually exclusive.

Kelly778

I’ve been more or less working from home for 2.5 years and going in occasionally to the office. My workplace implemented a hot desk policy and you need to book a desk.

Today I went in after a six week break since I was last there. No one was sat near me, no one to speak to so I may as well have been at home and I left this evening feeling so isolated and lonely and if I’m honest quite upset. I feel lonelier in the office than at home which seems ridiculous. I’m meant to go in tomorrow but I’m not sure I can face it.