Bob Flavin (motoring journalist) & his views on EVs

Kramer

I just caught some of Bob's weekly podcast earlier & was surprised by his largely antagonistic attitude to EVs. He has an EQC apparently at present & seems very uninformed with regards to charging speeds.
He quite likely has a 16A cable as he can only draw 3kW from his home chargepoint, but says he can pull 7kW from ECars SCPs. He is aggrieved he can't get the full 22kW.
He confused kW & kWh & bounced between chargers & charge points (I hate that )

He referred to the EQC as "a paperweight" & said it was useless :eek:.

He also intimated EVs can stop abruptly on the motorway & pose a significant safety hazard. He said EVs can't be put into neutral & thus can't be towed or pushed...............

He said heating water with salt in it produces hydrogen. He said hydrogen fuels atomic bombs & if a hydrogen fuel station went up, it would wipe out a whole town, basically like an atomic bomb :eek:.

I forget how many other inaccuracies were in there (I didn't even listen much past half way).
If I was considering an EV I'd certainly be looking at staying in an ICE after watching Bob today. I must say, I was very disappointed.

0lddog

All true journalists never let the facts get in the way of a good storey


( ran his name thru a search engine - still dont know what rag he journalists for )

Kramer

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pop9RVMkbGA

0lddog

:eek: 2 hour 10 minute 'tube video :rolleyes:


Does someone need help ?

Lumen

0lddog wrote: »

:eek: 2 hour 10 minute 'tube video :rolleyes:

He does the same thing as Bjorn does, if you ask a question he says the answer is in another two hour video. :pac:

I guess it's for people who work in the trade and/or have nothing better to do with their time.

He was slagging off another YouTuber today for, amongst other things, making 5-10 min videos. Hmmm.

Mickeroo

0lddog wrote: »

:eek: 2 hour 10 minute 'tube video :rolleyes:


Does someone need help ?

That's a live stream, his normal vids are regular length, car reviews and the like.

He's not actually staunch anti EV really, he does come across as very misinformed on some things but he's quite enthusiastic about them at other times which seems a bit odd.

He's gone to a fair few IEVOA gatherings and been involved with a few EV conferences and things around the country.

JohnC.

I’ve watched some of his EV videos. I never felt he came across as anti-EV. He seems to enjoy driving them. Even the Twizzy. His knowledge of them is just a bit lacking.

159conor

I have heard him say you get hydrogen from water by boiling it more than once. The mixing up of kW and kWh drives me mad. Link to the timestamp about hydrogen in his video https://youtu.be/pop9RVMkbGA?t=1305

unkel

And to think he is probably one of the better informed Irish motoring journos out there

kanuseeme

159conor wrote: »

I have heard him say you get hydrogen from water by boiling it more than once. The mixing up of kW and kWh drives me mad. Link to the timestamp about hydrogen in his video https://youtu.be/pop9RVMkbGA?t=1305

Its not boiling per say but heating it up to about 3000 C, some gen 4 reactors could do it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_mJ3S-VQuHY 4.16 minutes

liamog

Most of the time I find him good on EVs. I think he's been quite critical on the Premium Electric SUVs which are super heavy and as such very inefficient.

ELM327

I've seen him at IEVOA agms and events.
He hasn't a clue of the proper EV parlance but do people who drive fossil fuel cars generally use the right words for EGR and DPF? They just drive...

The EQC and the ETron like it, are just paperweights. Crap compared to Tesla, less range, more inefficient, less charging speed or opportunities. When big auto wants to play the EV game I'm sure they will outspend Tesla and blow them out of the park with a 1000km range EV with 350kW charging but they are no where near that.

ei9go

You can't take him seriously.

He has a review of a Passat GTE PHEV which he left uncharged for the review!

The one thing everybody wanted to know is how far it went in EV mode.

ELM327

Kramer wrote: »

I just caught some of Bob's weekly podcast earlier & was surprised by his largely antagonistic attitude to EVs. He has an EQC apparently at present & seems very uninformed with regards to charging speeds.
He quite likely has a 16A cable as he can only draw 3kW from his home chargepoint, but says he can pull 7kW from ECars SCPs. He is aggrieved he can't get the full 22kW.
He confused kW & kWh & bounced between chargers & charge points (I hate that )

He referred to the EQC as "a paperweight" & said it was useless :eek:.

He also intimated EVs can stop abruptly on the motorway & pose a significant safety hazard. He said EVs can't be put into neutral & thus can't be towed or pushed...............

He said heating water with salt in it produces hydrogen. He said hydrogen fuels atomic bombs & if a hydrogen fuel station went up, it would wipe out a whole town, basically like an atomic bomb :eek:.

I forget how many other inaccuracies were in there (I didn't even listen much past half way).
If I was considering an EV I'd certainly be looking at staying in an ICE after watching Bob today. I must say, I was very disappointed.

If he's anti hydrogen then thats a good few points in his "PRO" column

Lumen

ELM327 wrote: »

The EQC and the ETron like it, are just paperweights. Crap compared to Tesla, less range, more inefficient, less charging speed or opportunities.

They have objectively much better cabin refinement (lower noise) and subjectively better interior materials.

The etron also has very fast charging and a decent top buffer.

They are not paperweights.

ELM327

Lumen wrote: »

They have objectively much better cabin refinement (lower noise) and subjectively better interior materials.

The etron also has very fast charging and a decent top buffer.

They are not paperweights.

Yes, better interior "premium" for sure.


THey do not have better charging speeds. The ETron charges at 150kW sustained but as it's so much less efficient, the rate in terms of range gained is much lower than Tesla

Wildly Boaring

Nobby had the Etron lately

https://youtu.be/6yEWEtbc7vA

Relatively impressed

Lumen

ELM327 wrote: »

Yes, better interior "premium" for sure.

THey do not have better charging speeds. The ETron charges at 150kW sustained but as it's so much less efficient, the rate in terms of range gained is much lower than Tesla

For people who have access to fast charging (e.g. Ionity), the e-tron is a good car.

Bjorn did a back-to-back 1000km test of the Model X and e-tron 55 last September, and they got the same time, around 10:15.

He said:

"My point is that there are alternatives. If you don't want to have a Tesla, you want to have an EV with premium stuff, you can get an etron".

This video about 38 minutes in.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TFu9pkpunuo

ELM327

Absolutely .
But the range is less, the charging speed is slower in real terms. However it feels like a premium german SUV.

Good review here on fifth gear showing the pros and cons of both.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mh9v7zludUs

Old diesel

Wouldn't panic lads.

If you look at the main motors section you will see a thread about Mazda 6 2.2 diesel issues.

Ask someone like Bob and he will probably tell you the Mazda is a great chariot.

The real world input from sites like boards and wider social media wins out eventually.

Someone drew Bob's attention to this thread on twitter and his reply was "does boards still exist".

Mark N is passing him out rapidly imo

Mickeroo

Who is Mark N?

drunkmonkey

Mickeroo wrote: »

Who is Mark N?

Nobby on cars he's here on boards...you'll probably find him drooling over a 640d before an EV the same as Bob and I'd agree with both of them...
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCMKLV2Fehfuw-E3eoXsulDQ

drunkmonkey

and he's probably the only chap here to literally hammer a Tesla:D

Mickeroo

drunkmonkey wrote: »

Nobby on cars he's here on boards...you'll probably find him drooling over a 640d before an EV the same as Bob and I'd agree with both of them...
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCMKLV2Fehfuw-E3eoXsulDQ

Will give him a look cheers.

Nothing wrong with drooling over a nice car

drunkmonkey

Find his Tesla post, the young fella got trapped inside and he went at it with a lump hammer to get him out.

Lantus

Will check out the vid but generally he is balanced about all cars. Loves a good few ev's and dislikes others. Has a good understanding of the flawed economic arguments a lot of people use to convince us a 40k ev will save us money. (spoiler, a 12k car will save more money...)

jusmeig

Lantus wrote: »

Will check out the vid but generally he is balanced about all cars. Loves a good few ev's and dislikes others. Has a good understanding of the flawed economic arguments a lot of people use to convince us a 40k ev will save us money. (spoiler, a 12k car will save more money...)

It could be true...what is your 12k car and how would said flawed economic person charge their 40k wonder car?

Gile_na_gile

It's YT so you take your pic and run with whatever or whoever confirms your own biases.

Bob has his good points, and has lots of knowledge based on talking to drivers and dealers, but will clearly ad lib entirely factfree nonsense. Also wears sunglasses over his crown - I hate that (and Bjorn licks his dog's face, and is always slurping food).

The other guy, Nobby, reminds me of Dan Pilkington, but he is similarly likeable to me (and not really like Dan Pilkington). His review on the LEAF was informed for someone who reviews a lot of ICEs as one must.

duploelabs

I've watched a few of his videos, mainly because he's an Irish reviewer. Couldn't manage any more as I found him to have all the charisma and knowledge in front of the camera of Alan Partridge. Half expected him to say 'Lexii' at one stage

beauf

I like Bob. Watched him build his channel from nothing. He comes across more as reporter than car nut, maybe I'm mistaken. Either way that's ok, it's just a different perspective. Also it gives you an insight into the Irish motor industry etc. He does a load of work to make that content. I look forward to his videos dropping. He's only getting better. I don't always agree with him and he's not always right. But so what. Thumbs up for Bob.

Lantus

beauf wrote: »

I like Bob. Watched him build his channel from nothing. He comes across more as reporter than car nut, maybe I'm mistaken. Either way that's ok, it's just a different perspective. Also it gives you an insight into the Irish motor industry etc. He does a load of work to make that content. I look forward to his videos dropping. He's only getting better. I don't always agree with him and he's not always right. But so what. Thumbs up for Bob.

+1. Listening to people that only say what you want to hear or nothing new or challenging is a pointless exercise. And hydrogen is very flammable. Korea and Asia are having safety issues. Not nuke issues but it's a concern currently.

Lumen

What are motoring journalists for? They're supposed to experts. Otherwise, what's the point?

When I read a car review I want an opinion from someone who has driven a lot of cars and is sensitive to the differences.

Apologies for the length, but this recent podcast with Chris Harris and Jethro Bovingdon is worth a listen. Now they're from the driving-it-on-the-doorhandles end of the spectrum, but the point stands.

Why would I spend an hour of my time listening to someone who doesn't know what they're talking about?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=unRFJu1zqeY

unkel

+1

Nothing made me want a Tesla Model S more than after I watched the (EV sceptic) Chris Harris drive one here

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mHhZ9jk-DrU

He is far from raving about it, but driving it at speed over some twisty country roads, he does like some aspects of the car that would be very high priority to me (and that I did not really get a chance of testing on my testdrive 3 years ago of a facelift 2016 S90D from Sandyford):

"The surprise of the package is how good it is on the road."

"Brutally effective thing. Brutally."

beauf

Lumen wrote: »

What are motoring journalists for? They're supposed to experts. Otherwise, what's the point?...

Chris Harris is great. But I've learnt zero from him about Irish specific motoring issues. Also these guys are very niche. They do very little content on more mainstream parts of motoring.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HaDWPBco07w

Lumen

beauf wrote: »

Chris Harris is great. But I've learnt zero from him about Irish specific motoring issues. Also these guys are very niche. They do very little content on more mainstream parts of motoring.

Sure, but the wider point remains: to be useful, you need to be knowledgeable about the thing you are talking about, or else you're just another a-hole with an opinion.

I've listened to/watched a couple of hours of Bob and learned precisely nothing.

unkel

beauf wrote: »

Chris Harris is great. But I've learnt zero from him about Irish specific motoring issues. Also these guys are very niche. They do very little content on more mainstream parts of motoring.

Can't say I agree. Chris Harris owns what is arguably the most modest family car ever made and he is very passionate about that car.

beauf

You could watch top gear for years and learn nothing about cars. Thats 99% opinion and 1% fact.

Kramer

beauf wrote: »

I don't always agree with him and he's not always right. But so what. Thumbs up for Bob.

I agree - fair play to Bob for creating the content & proffering a uniquely Irish perspective on Irish motoring. No issues from me there & I hope he evolves.

My only issue is with misinformation. Bob has a viewership & as such, has influence. Disparaging a €100,000 EV because, as I suspect, he's not aufait with charging parameters, cables etc., doesn't do anyone any good, most especially himself.
His intro does state "expert care reviews".

Be an expert then, educate yourself & be a better journalist. Learn the difference between kW & kWh, AC & DC charging, charge points & chargers, how hydrogen is produced etc.

A little constructive criticism shouldn't cause offense to Bob & I haven't seen anyone attack him here. Hopefully he's reading (you know he is - hi Bob ) & takes some good from this thread anyway.

beauf

unkel wrote: »

Can't say I agree. Chris Harris owns what is arguably the most modest family car ever made and he is very passionate about that car.

You think a 1957 Citroen 2CV is mainstream for the average person in Ireland buying a car in 2020.

beauf

Kramer wrote: »

I agree - fair play to Bob for creating the content & proffering a uniquely Irish perspective on Irish motoring. No issues from me there & I hope he evolves.

My only issue is with misinformation. Bob has a viewership & as such, has influence. Disparaging a €100,000 EV because, as I suspect, he's not aufait with charging parameters, cables etc., doesn't do anyone any good, most especially himself.
His intro does state "expert care reviews".

Be an expert then, educate yourself & be a better journalist. Learn the difference between kW & kWh, AC & DC charging, charge points & chargers, how hydrogen is produced etc.

A little constructive criticism shouldn't cause offense to Bob & I haven't seen anyone attack him here. Hopefully he's reading (you know he is - hi Bob ) & takes some good from this thread anyway.

I already made that point about what Bob isn't.

But its a bit daft to be comparing him to Chris Harris, or Vettel.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lmM0Jwx-Bjo

Lumen

beauf wrote: »

I already made that point about what Bob isn't.

But its a bit daft to be comparing him to Chris Harris, or Vettel.

Why? Before Top Gear picked him up Harris was doing exactly what Bob is doing now, albeit with slightly different subject material. Freelance motor journalism and bits of Youtube.

Here's Chris Harris talking freestyle about cars.

Show me one clip or article from Bob that demonstrates similar depth of knowledge, on any subject.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fiLImHQbjis

beauf

You're basically saying every Motoring journalist has to be a clone of Chris Harris.

...or that every video even if produced by a fraction of the resources, should have the same production quality, same editing. Its ridiculous.

Maybe you should find a Chris Harris Video on Irish Irish issues.

Nickindublin

I look at a lot of motoring journalists on YouTube from Carwow to Honestjohn and Bob. To be fair to Bob he hasn't the resources of the others but he does a good video and review and tries to be different. The Sunday show is live and a bit long for my liking. He claims he doesn't take sponsorship from motoring companies etc.

Lumen

beauf wrote: »

You're basically saying every Motoring journalist has to be a clone of Chris Harris.

...or that every video even if produced by a fraction of the resources, should have the same production quality, same editing. Its ridiculous.

Maybe you should find a Chris Harris Video on Irish Irish issues.

If you re-read my posts I'm very much not saying that. I'm talking about the expertise, not the packaging.

The Collecting Cars podcast is an example of having zero production expenses - it's audio only.

Does it wind you up that they're not Irish? I don't really care where the content comes from, I learn as much from US and (eh, one) Norweigan youtubey people as I do from the British stuff.

beauf

Seems like you don't really care what the content is unless its Chris Harris lol...

Lumen

beauf wrote: »

Seems like you don't really care what the content is unless its Chris Harris lol...

:rolleyes:

DrPhilG

Can't be arsed with Bob. Ever since one of his videos when he reviewed (I think) an Ioniq. It was one of his earliest EV reviews and came across like a hatchet job.

He demonstrated charging the car and made such a meal of how confusing it was to get the correct plug for the car, even though the charging station had a dirty great picture of the sockets on it.

Plus as others have said he seems very uninformed on details for someone who is supposed to be an expert.

beauf

Could be worse, could be Doug going through the manual...

un5byh7sqpd2x0

beauf wrote: »

I like Bob. Watched him build his channel from nothing. He comes across more as reporter than car nut, maybe I'm mistaken. Either way that's ok, it's just a different perspective. Also it gives you an insight into the Irish motor industry etc. He does a load of work to make that content. I look forward to his videos dropping. He's only getting better. I don't always agree with him and he's not always right. But so what. Thumbs up for Bob.

That you Bob?

beauf

Zeke Fancy Manufacturer wrote: »

That you Bob?

No this is Chris...

high horse

Bob is on boards alright. Bodhan is his user name.