more nimbyism in Chapelizod ***Read Mod Note in OP***

AulWan

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

At least I work for a living, bought my own house and never got a penny from the State, and wouldn't want to either.

What's your own situation if you don't mind me asking.

I do mind because its not relevant, but I'll answer you anyway.

Management level public service job, home owner. 3rd level education. Never a day unemployed since I was 17 years of age.

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

.. never got a penny from the State, and wouldn't want to either.

I take it this means you see receiving assistance from the State as something to be ashamed of, as well as look down on those who receive it.

I hope life never throws you some unexpected curveball, like redundancy, illness or seperation, that could see that changing for you.

AulWan

anewme wrote: »

I'm happy with where I come from and where I live now.

Your posts would suggest otherwise.

Is you father aware of your attitude towards social housing?

anewme

AulWan wrote: »

Your posts would suggest otherwise.

Is you father aware of your attitude towards social housing?

.

It's your own posts come across with a major chip as someone else said.

My Father?

Hes in a care home with dementia so he could not give a flying fck about social housing at this point.

Tipping point, they like that, and the Chase . People with dementia like quiz shows.

AulWan

anewme wrote: »

.

It's your own posts come across with a major chip as someone else said.

My Father?

Hes in a care home with dementia so he could not give a flying fck about social housing at this point.

Tipping point, they like that, and the Chase . People with dementia like quiz shows.

I'll rephrase that then. You said your father lived in a council area.

Before his decline, was he aware of your distainful attitude towards those who live in social housing?

anewme

AulWan wrote: »

I'll rephrase that then. You said your father lived in a council area.

Before his decline, was he aware of your distainful attitude towards those who live in social housing?

He hated that place at the end . Always shootings.

AulWan

anewme wrote: »

He hated that place at the end . Always shootings.

Thats not what I asked. Twice. But your unwillingness to give a straight answer is answer enough.

anewme

AulWan wrote: »

Thats not what I asked. Twice. But your unwillingness to give a straight answer is answer enough.

I'm not sure where the directive is, that people have to answer to to you, to your level of satisfaction.

You aleady said that there are no serious drug dealers only junkies in council areas, which is absolute rubbish.

As others have pointed out already, you have a persecution complex over where you live.

That's not anyone else's fault or issue, only your own.

AulWan

anewme wrote: »

I'm not sure where the directive is, that people have to answer to to you, to your level of satisfaction.

It was a simple question. Just be honest, you didn't want to give a straight answer!

anewme wrote: »

You aleady said that there are no serious drug dealers only junkies in council areas, which is absolute rubbish.

That is not what I said, and I have already clarified this. You are either being deliberately obtuse at this point, or have comprehension issues.

anewme wrote: »

As others have pointed out already, you have a persecution complex over where you live.

That's not anyone else's fault or issue, only your own

For the record, I couldn't give two f**** what you or anyone else here thinks about where I live.

If anyone has a persecution complex here, its those who are so utterly horrified at the thought of any social housing anywhere near them, to the point that they'd actually consider selling up and leaving to avoid it.

I've been totally honest in all my replies, they are just not what you want to hear and go against the popular opinion that social housing tenants are all troublemakers, that I should resent living in the same area I do because I paid for my house myself.

I'd far rather live alongside the ordinary decent people I do, then some of the snobs posting here, anyday, thats for sure.

Night now.

LuckyLloyd

This is happening folks, to varying extents depending on government formation. But make no mistake: more social housing is coming. More affordable housing is coming. And it will be in and around private estates. It has to happen, and the will of the electorate is for it to happen.

You can spend money and time objecting, you may even want to lie down in front of diggers if it comes to it. But for the political parties to deliver on their promises at the election just gone you have to lose in the end. The political incentive is finally there.

Cyrus

Cyrus wrote: »

Waste of time trying to debate if that’s your response

I will think I know enough about crime.
You clearly don't if you don't understand there are different types of crimes

Cyrus

Cyrus wrote: »

Waste of time trying to debate if that’s your response

I will think I know enough about crime.
You clearly don't if you don't understand there are different types of crimes

Spanish Eyes

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Where are you moving from and why? None of my business I know that, but what would your considerations be in buying a hard worked for house? Be honest now!

I have already moved. I sold a house in sth Co. Dublin & am renting in the northside.
I was to buy a well built house, with some character, with the rear facing south or west. A garage or big she'd would be nice too. .
Honestly, I really don't care whether the people in the area have bought their house or are renting from the council.

Spanish Eyes

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

There is some amount of bollixology going on here withe regard to certain posters.

Most people want a quiet life and if honest, want to live with like minded people who have also saved hard to get their gaff and respect their neighbours.

But there will always be the naysayers who would not live beside ASB heads but will never admit it, but will pretend they do. For the craic like.

Everybody wants a quiet life I would imagine.
I don't care how much the neighbors paid for their houses!
& no, obviously no-one wants to live beside someone who has an asbo, not sure why you think they would.

zerosugarbuzz

ligerdub wrote: »

Quite a lot in this so not reading through all the previous pages. My apologies if I'm repeating anything.

This is absolutely not NIMBYISM.

There are several reasons that locals are objecting to this.

1. This site had been lined up as a new scouts den for many years. There were a lot of fundraisers for it over the years and now those plans are obviously over. So the fundraising effectively went for nothing.

2. Chapelizod is a small town, but even in this small town there are 2 nursing homes, an old folks commune, an estate built exclusively of social housing which I understand was built for single mothers. There are only 4 small estates in the town where there are family friendly style housing. On top of this there are 3 new apartment blocks, mostly used by young renters. Adding in another construction for social housing (non-families too I understand) hardly helps to make a cohesive community in a town already very top heavy with homogeneous communes (be it the elderly, single mothers, long term unemployed).

3. Transport links. People who have an issue with this proposal being opposed by locals would do well to take a look at the Chapelizod Chap Lips facebook page and see the queues at the bus stops every morning. Absolutely no buses stop between 7.45 and 8.30 in the morning. The only one that's feasible is a specifically scheduled one that leaves Chapelizod at 8.20. There's no DART, no LUAS, and on top of this shambles with the bus service the already sporadic service is going to get even more sparse. With the new Bus Connects plan most of the public transport links from West of the town will bypass the town entirely. Adding more people into this already shambolic situation will only make things worse.

4. Parking. Parking in the town is an absolute disaster. Pretty similar to number 3. The plan for this build will only have parking for about half the amount of dwellings.......so where will the rest of them park?!

Chapelizod has never had an issue in having social housing built, but there is a limit. If there wasn't such an issue with parking and transport this build would pretty much be a non-issue. The number of isolated living quarters in the mix is also another factor, but secondary to the other ones.

Where is the housing estate dedicated to single mothers? I spend time with friends in Chapelizod and never heard of such a place.

LuckyLloyd

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

This is happening folks, to varying extents depending on government formation. But make no mistake: more social housing is coming. More affordable housing is coming. And it will be in and around private estates. It has to happen, and the will of the electorate is for it to happen.

You can spend money and time objecting, you may even want to lie down in front of diggers if it comes to it. But for the political parties to deliver on their promises at the election just gone you have to lose in the end. The political incentive is finally there.

Yep dead right.
Surely that's why everyone voted Sinn Fein right?
That's the change they want right?

Cyrus

bubblypop wrote: »

I will think I know enough about crime.
You clearly don't if you don't understand there are different types of crimes

i clearly do, and there are a multitude of statistics about crime in areas, if you want to pretend like the rate of crime isnt higher in clondalkin than it is in blackrock there really isnt any point in engaging with you.

Cyrus

Cyrus wrote: »

i clearly do, and there are a multitude of statistics about crime in areas, if you want to pretend like the rate of crime isnt higher in clondalkin than it is in blackrock there really isnt any point in engaging with you.

No, like I said, it depends on what type of crime you mean.
For example, burglaries would be higher in blackrock

Cyrus

bubblypop wrote: »

No, like I said, it depends on what type of crime you mean.
For example, burglaries would be higher in blackrock

i mean all crime, stop being obtuse.

and the burglars in blackrock wont be local will they.

Cyrus

Cyrus wrote: »

i mean all crime, stop being obtuse.

and the burglars in blackrock wont be local will they.

No they probably won't.

You want to take all crimes lumped together without anythung else taken into account. That's how statistics are used incorrectly. For example, there is probably a huge crime rate on Henry St Dublin, taken alone it may say 75 crimes for every one person living there. But then we know there is huge shoplifting incidents, begging & not many people actually living there.
So, yes the type of crime does matter, as does other factors.

Cyrus

bubblypop wrote: »

No they probably won't.

You want to take all crimes lumped together without anythung else taken into account. That's how statistics are used incorrectly. For example, there is probably a huge crime rate on Henry St Dublin, taken alone it may say 75 crimes for every one person living there. But then we know there is huge shoplifting incidents, begging & not many people actually living there.
So, yes the type of crime does matter, as does other factors.

i dont need to be nuanced when saying there is less crime and less chance of living beside a criminal in blackrock versus clondalkin. for some reason you think its a point worth debating.

Ray Palmer

Any body claiming social welfare housing does not have major social issues is lying. It is very simple the majority of prisoners in jail come from social housing backgrounds. The buying running Moutjoy prison has specifically named the areas in the past and if memory services me it is Ballymun, Tallagh, Coolock and Finglas.

Every study under the sun will tell you large areas of social housing causes such problems. This is not unique to Ireland. The phrase a few bad apples often misses the last part if destroying the barrel. People join in with the bad apples until they are. They see some guy with tons of money and look at their parents working hard but little money. What way will they go? That is the problem. What is normal in these areas is seen to be the way to live to the people there. So you end up producing more criminals.

If everybody around you is scamming social welfare are you going to be the moral one or do the same? We know the answer already for the majority and it is you join in and scam.

Given 60% of rent is not paid by social housing recipients in Dublin it is safe to say their is a large percent that do not act responsibly.

woohoo!!!

Ray Palmer wrote: »

Any body claiming social welfare housing does not have major social issues is lying. It is very simple the majority of prisoners in jail come from social housing backgrounds. The buying running Moutjoy prison has specifically named the areas in the past and if memory services me it is Ballymun, Tallagh, Coolock and Finglas.

Every study under the sun will tell you large areas of social housing causes such problems. This is not unique to Ireland. The phrase a few bad apples often misses the last part if destroying the barrel. People join in with the bad apples until they are. They see some guy with tons of money and look at their parents working hard but little money. What way will they go? That is the problem. What is normal in these areas is seen to be the way to live to the people there. So you end up producing more criminals.

If everybody around you is scamming social welfare are you going to be the moral one or do the same? We know the answer already for the majority and it is you join in and scam.

Given 60% of rent is not paid by social housing recipients in Dublin it is safe to say their is a large percent that do not act responsibly.

I had a look at the 2018 audit figures for Dublin City Council. It gives 76% rental yield with 61% of social houses in arrears but doesn't break it down into how many never paid, arrears of say 3 months or say less than 3 weeks. Arrears total is 27.3 million. Clearly the City Council have a huge issue with arrears and have got to get the finger out.

Ray Palmer

woohoo!!! wrote: »

I had a look at the 2018 audit figures for Dublin City Council. It gives 76% rental yield with 61% of social houses in arrears but doesn't break it down into how many never paid, arrears of say 3 months or say less than 3 weeks. Arrears total is 27.3 million. Clearly the City Council have a huge issue with arrears and have got to get the finger out.

First and foremost the issue is people not paying. I don't need to be chased to pay my bills I am responsible and pay them. The rent they pay is minuscule in comparison to private rent and costs of providing the service they recieve.

If 60% aren't responsible enough to pay rent how many are going to be socially responsible in a general sense?

LuckyLloyd

bubblypop wrote: »

Yep dead right.
Surely that's why everyone voted Sinn Fein right?
That's the change they want right?

Not just SF. All of the parties were promising more social and affordable housing. And given the end result, FFG will be incentivised to deliver their relatively more modest proposals.

anewme

bubblypop wrote: »

I have already moved. I sold a house in sth Co. Dublin & am renting in the northside.
I was to buy a well built house, with some character, with the rear facing south or west. A garage or big she'd would be nice too. .
Honestly, I really don't care whether the people in the area have bought their house or are renting from the council.

Sounds really lovely.

In all fairness though, if you are buying a property like that, there's probably not much chance ending up with social housing next door.

Ush1

anewme wrote: »

Sounds really lovely.

In all fairness though, if you are buying a property like that, there's probably not much chance ending up with social housing next door.

Why, they've just described anywhere on the northside pretty much?

anewme

Ush1 wrote: »

Why, they've just described anywhere on the northside pretty much?

Sounds like an older area, character and a garage are not what I've seen in any of the new build social housing schemes in West Dublin anyway.

This in in Chapelizod is apartments. I dont think they will get a garage.

anewme

anewme wrote: »

Sounds really lovely.

In all fairness though, if you are buying a property like that, there's probably not much chance ending up with social housing next door.

Ah won't be anything fancy, just house build 40/50 years ago. Plenty of work needed to them.
& the council are buying plenty of them, probably because they are not building any!
So, you can get any type of residents in private estates. People who own, council houses bought for families, people renting & also people on hap.
No body has any say in who their neighbours are really

Graces7

bubblypop wrote: »

Ah won't be anything fancy, just house build 40/50 years ago. Plenty of work needed to them.
& the council are buying plenty of them, probably because they are not building any!
So, you can get any type of residents in private estates. People who own, council houses bought for families, people renting & also people on hap.

No body has any say in who their neighbours are really

Oh so true. The worst , and I mean bad, neighbours I ever had were when I lived in a rather lovely area in the UK in private accommodation.

Since then I specified NO NEIGHBOURS when seeking rentals. And was not interested in council housing until this place came up. Life is too short.

bubblypop

bubblypop wrote: »

No body has any say in who their neighbours are really

Some people do thankfully

To me having to do out and spend 3 or 400k on a house and get stuck living near council tenants, paying a fraction of the cost and almost certainly impacting on area is just totally and utterly unacceptable and I'm damn glad to be able to avoid such a situation.

Its laughable that some posters are unwilling to admit that there is a vastly higher chance of anti-social behaviour and crime in social housing estates or private estates with social housing compared to fully private estates.