Survivor: Winners at War

stargazer 68

kingtut wrote: »

Woohoo! I had predicted that Natalie would return and Tony would win. Glad I got something right for a change!

Definitely far too long of an episode and far too much crying but an enjoyable season overall.

Way too long. I skipped over a lot of bits! I'm obviously getting mu US and Australia confused but I thought natalie was the one who had the arranged marriage - clearly not - so who was that?

tvercetti

Dovies wrote: »

Way too long. I skipped over a lot of bits! I'm obviously getting mu US and Australia confused but I thought natalie was the one who had the arranged marriage - clearly not - so who was that?

I think you're mixing her up with Karishma from the previous season.

Natalie won season 29, her twin sister was voted out first. They were also on 2 seasons of the Amazing Race prior to Survivor. Jeremy also played that season so not sure if that influenced his vote as he voted for her.

thefa

That moment when Sarah’s fire shot up early on and was singeing the rope had me on tenterhooks for Tony.

Would have been nice to see Michelle get a vote but felt her game was too much of a scramble to be considered win worthy and she was the biggest non-threat for Natalie to bring along.

Natalie’s resilience was impressive and I had a feeling it was leaning towards her but had hope when the jury question in the outwit stage made it sound like she hadn’t taken advantage of the opportunity to make many close friends on EoE. Tony had a better rapport with many of them.

Episode felt a bit bloated at stages such as after the redemption challenge but in that specific case, we probably won’t see many of those big characters again. Overall a satisfying ending.

TimeUp

Good winner, the season did drag a bit towards the end IMHO.

I know it may sound kind of random, but I'd like to see Yul return at some point.

cyberhog

Tony was great this season, his antics were hilarious but he was also a very clever player. Sarah and Ben should have listened to him about Natalie having another idol. Sarah was very dismissive of the idea and I think that was her downfall and it seemed like Ben lost his self belief after that.

Tony was definitely the best player this season and I'm glad he won.

S.M.B.

Don't have too much to add to what's been already said

- far too long an episode
- tony is a deserved winner, for a guy that was such an obvious threat not to get a vote against him all game is phenomenally impressive. 4 IC wins helped i guess, a part of his game that went from non existent to close to record equalling
- i think tony owes sarah a few quid, i do think her social game played a big hand in his win. i was happy to see her cathartic moment
- michelle is not a bad player whatsoever, was never in a position to win this season but did reasonably well with the hand she was dealt, two big IC wins towards the end

kaji

Tony definitely played the best game and deserved to win. It's bizarre how people let him get to the end when it was so obvious to the viewer and jury- how did his alliance not realise it? What kind of game was Denise playing? Ben realising he had no hope of winning then after Natalie said that everyone knew Tony was running the show. And Sarah claiming it was gender inequality that people didn't consider her game equal to Tony's- Tony played a far superior game to Sarah. It's laughable that she brought up gender inequality when Survivor is one of the few places where it doesn't matter if you're male/female/straight/gay/black/white etc. Look at the winners- 1st winner a middle aged gay man, 2nd winner a middle aged white woman, 3rd winner a young Jewish male, 4th winner a black woman, etc. I really don't enjoy watching Sarah play- she played the same stunt last season on Troyzan in a hidden scene (on Youtube) where she claimed that she couldn't afford to have another kid and was crying saying that if he doesn't bring her to the end, she won't be able to have any more kids. I thought that was pretty disgusting.

Another thing- Michele has said online that 4 people came up to her and told her that they wanted to vote for her to win but felt like they had to vote for Tony to ensure that Natalie didn't win. She said it was Danni, Adam, Wendell and Nick. It makes sense, those people knew if Natalie won this season, it would be a nail in the coffin of Survivor and it's credibility.

seligehgit

kaji wrote: »

Tony definitely played the best game and deserved to win. It's bizarre how people let him get to the end when it was so obvious to the viewer and jury- how did his alliance not realise it? What kind of game was Denise playing? Ben realising he had no hope of winning then after Natalie said that everyone knew Tony was running the show. And Sarah claiming it was gender inequality that people didn't consider her game equal to Tony's- Tony played a far superior game to Sarah. It's laughable that she brought up gender inequality when Survivor is one of the few places where it doesn't matter if you're male/female/straight/gay/black/white etc. Look at the winners- 1st winner a middle aged gay man, 2nd winner a middle aged white woman, 3rd winner a young Jewish male, 4th winner a black woman, etc. I really don't enjoy watching Sarah play- she played the same stunt last season on Troyzan in a hidden scene (on Youtube) where she claimed that she couldn't afford to have another kid and was crying saying that if he doesn't bring her to the end, she won't be able to have any more kids. I thought that was pretty disgusting.

Another thing- Michele has said online that 4 people came up to her and told her that they wanted to vote for her to win but felt like they had to vote for Tony to ensure that Natalie didn't win. She said it was Danni, Adam, Wendell and Nick. It makes sense, those people knew if Natalie won this season, it would be a nail in the coffin of Survivor and it's credibility.

Totally agree,I thought Tony simply played a superior game.He was the instigator and she was the follower in large part.Her vote for Ben was IMO a token gesture in the hopes of demonstrating to the jury she was capable of a big move.Gender played no part.

Very interesting re Michelle.

Any link to that conversation?

kaji

I read it on Reddit, but I can't remember where.. sorry. It was in an interview Michele gave. There's also this on Reddit which makes VERY interesting reading, especially about what happened on 1 tribe in the early days and all the drama from the Edge- seems like it wasn't all lovey dovey like it was portrayed.

FROM DANNI'S LIVE

- Parvati and Danni were an instant duo and Parvati initially wanted to vote out Michele, changed her mind to Natalie.

- Ben told Jeremy that Danni was the one who came up with the Natalie vote when it was Parvati. Parvati then leapt onto this to save herself and painted Danni as the mastermind.

- Jeremy went off on Danni after the Natalie vote and accused her of going through his bag (when she didn't).

- Rob, Parvati and Ethan were the ones who flipped on Danni. Adam, Jeremy, and Tony texted Danni after the episode saying how unfair the edit was and how Danni had no choice in that situation.

- Adam told her that her only option was to try and get Parvati out.- The paranoia came from people who were calling her out about the false Jeremy-bag accusation and spreading rumours.

- Natalie, Amber and Danni were amazing friends on the start, Natalie completely excluded them later in the game.

- Amber and Danni are very close friends.

- Parvati bought two jars of peanut butter with the 4 tokens from the 50/50 challenge. One jar was to be shared between Parvati, Ethan, and Danni, and the other jar was to be shared between Rob, Amber and Natalie. Natalie and Rob ate all of theirs and they barely gave Amber anything. They then stole Danni, Ethan, and Parvati's peanut butter and ate all of what was left (these three were rationing it fairly). Natalie also had her own jar during this time. *THIS PART WAS NOT IN THE LIVE* but I think the rules got broken here and production either didn't know about it or didn't do anything about it. The peanut butter was purchased under the same premise of an idol or advantage, and it's not fair that Parvati and Danni's fire tokens were effectively stolen by Rob and Natalie.

- Is incredibly respectful of Tony's game.

- Yul caught a fish for Danni because she was so skinny and he felt bad because Natalie and Rob stole her peanut butter.

- Thinks Sarah deserved a better edit than what she got

- YUL AND NATALIE HAD A MAJOR FIGHT. Yul went to get the rice from the mountain when Adam got voted out, he offered to take Adam to get the rice and it took forever. Natalie was SO mad that they took too long to get the rice and when he came back she screamed at him calling him selfish, saying that all he ever does is stay by himself and go fishing all day. Got so bad to the point where Wendell stepped in and told Natalie to drop it. This is what caused Natalie to lose those 3 votes and probably lose the game.

- People on EOE said a ton of bad things about Sarah.

- There was a "mean girls" clique on Edge who spoke down to so many people.

- Was really upset with Wendell's edit.

- Was bitter towards with Michele at the time because she didn't believe Danni's plea to keep her being that Parvati initially wanted Michele out.

- Gave her fire token to Denise because she was the only one who listened to Danni.

- Yul had to go toilet in the middle of tribal council for 20 minutes.

- Natalie probably would have won if she made fire against Tony.

- It was actually Tyson, Parvati, and Danni who were the closest in the first returnee challenge - it was edited to be Rob though.

It seems like Natalie was rude to people on the edge and that was kinda alluded to when Rob mentioned it during the final tribal council. It seems like more of the edge people would have voted for Natalie had she been nicer which shows that the edge completely breaks the game. They really need to get rid of it for good.

thefa

I hadn’t watch survivor in years and had mixed feelings on the edge. It was good as a break from the main game at points as there are episodes where the themes are quite repetitive and I also found the fire token challenges almost replaced the reward challenges I used to enjoy on older seasons.

That said, the editing focused on a few key characters on it and you I didn’t really get a feel for how people were getting on. People being kept around for up to almost 5 weeks in some cases with not one, but two opportunities to get back in the game felt a little cheap. Factor in the cast who got voted out later usually were disadvantaged by those who had a significant amount of opportunities to gather fire tokens for advantages. I would’ve preferred only one opportunity to return with those who lost to Tyson not getting another shot.

Natalie was a bit of an outlier I say in terms of dominance of the edge challenges which the produces probably hadn’t factored in but the amount of advantages she gathered, to the point of a necklace away, was overpowered.

seligehgit

It appears the edit may have been kind to Natalie.Her gesture vis a vis Tyson was nice but her near cut throat will to win did shine through.

I was really shocked when Rob referenced her isolation of certain players on EOE in the weeks leading up to the final return challenge.

Foxtrol

kaji wrote: »

Tony definitely played the best game and deserved to win. It's bizarre how people let him get to the end when it was so obvious to the viewer and jury- how did his alliance not realise it?

It was incredible positioning and reading by Tony. He built his alliance of 'lions' so they didn't turn on each other, constantly highlighting that if they let the 'hyenas' take out one then they'd all fall. Tony is also great at reading people, he turned on Sophie, Kim, Nick just as they were beginning to make moves against him. His core alliance was a player he was playing with for the third time and has a relationship with outside the game and Ben who came into the game with the mindset of being loyal this time.

What kind of game was Denise playing?

Same game as last time, playing from the bottom. I'd argue she played a much better game than Michele, making big moves early like taking out Sandra and then played from the bottom much better than Michele - building relationships with the main alliance, ending up on the right side of most votes, actually outwitted folk (pretending she wanted to go home so others wouldn't suspect). She was 1 IC win away from likely making final tribal.

Another thing- Michele has said online that 4 people came up to her and told her that they wanted to vote for her to win but felt like they had to vote for Tony to ensure that Natalie didn't win. She said it was Danni, Adam, Wendell and Nick. It makes sense, those people knew if Natalie won this season, it would be a nail in the coffin of Survivor and it's credibility.

I really dont buy that at all, it really sounds like what you say to someone when you feel bad for someone because they're embarrassed. 'If there were no repercussions to my vote then I would have voted for you to make you feel better'. If I remember right, Wendell wrote GOAT all over Tony's card so if he actually voted for Michele it would have been due to their relationship, not gameplay.

seligehgit wrote: »

It appears the edit may have been kind to Natalie.Her gesture vis a vis Tyson was nice but her near cut throat will to win did shine through.

I dont see that as a nice gesture, it was pure gameplay. She was either taking the fire tokens back a souvenirs or giving an advantage to someone to help them later and potentially secure a vote at final tribal. Tyson is generally quite vocal and his word holds some sway so a good person to have in your corner, though from the edit he was very quiet this time. If she wanted to give him a selfless gesture she could have given him an advantage in the final challenge but chose an idol instead.

S.M.B.

Not sure why Tyson has such little input last night.

Two additional things.

I really didn't think that EoE worked at all, and not just from a 'spoiling the game' perspective. The idea of holding onto these big characters who were likely to get voted out early made sense to me but in practice I had no interest in hearing what they had to say as the season went on. I adore Parvati and Tyson, Yul and Ethan really grew on me given I hadn't seen their individual seasons but whenever the camera cut to an establishing shot of the edge, I was far from engaged. That's what Ponderosa is for, no idea why they don't do more with all the additional footage they have as we've all moved away from the traditional way of consuming media over the 40 seasons.

I knew an all winners season was going to be full of great players and characters but I was surprised with how the manner of their previous win played such a major role in this season. So many of those players are carrying major baggage around with them for years and this season seemed quite cathartic. You may disagree that Sarah suffered from gender bias this season or during game changers but there's no denying that her 'victory' came with a price. The same applies to quite a large number of this cast.

Thargor

Nothing else to add myself, good season, Jeff could have done with a sound check before it went out, I have better acoustics on Skype on a laptop in my attic. Cant believe Michelle didnt get a single vote, she played well, also she looked fecking stunning on the conference call.

Bring on the season full of teenagers I say, could be absolutely hilarious.

EDIT: Oh yeah and dump the Godawful gamebreaking Edge of Extinction now please, its poison. And dump whoever came up with fire tokens aswell.

EDIT2: Did anyone feel that last immunity idol that Natalie found was fake as fcuk? It looked like the cameraman had just stuck it in a crack of abranch when Natalie was nearby then stood over it until she came over to see, it just seemed so dodgy to me.

upupup

kaji wrote: »

FROM DANNI'S LIVE


- It was actually Tyson, Parvati, and Danni who were the closest in the first returnee challenge - it was edited to be Rob though.

I noticed something odd about the end of that challenge,They had no footage of rob's face in the "exciting battle" which i thought was so strange.
Its edited to make it exciting so can't trust it to be real anymore.
Its like watching a big budget Action film now and the "reality" is gone.I understand that some bit of editing is required but to change the end of a huge challenge like that is wrong.
I was hoping for Tyson to win Survivor.....maybe he did!:D

Hopefully the teenagers will bring some realness back to the show

Hyzepher

i would to see a season where there are 4 tribes, 2+2. They play individually and then only get told of the orthers existance when they merge

Foxtrol

S.M.B. wrote: »

Not sure why Tyson has such little input last night.

Two additional things.

I really didn't think that EoE worked at all, and not just from a 'spoiling the game' perspective. The idea of holding onto these big characters who were likely to get voted out early made sense to me but in practice I had no interest in hearing what they had to say as the season went on. I adore Parvati and Tyson, Yul and Ethan really grew on me given I hadn't seen their individual seasons but whenever the camera cut to an establishing shot of the edge, I was far from engaged. That's what Ponderosa is for, no idea why they don't do more with all the additional footage they have as we've all moved away from the traditional way of consuming media over the 40 seasons.

I knew an all winners season was going to be full of great players and characters but I was surprised with how the manner of their previous win played such a major role in this season. So many of those players are carrying major baggage around with them for years and this season seemed quite cathartic. You may disagree that Sarah suffered from gender bias this season or during game changers but there's no denying that her 'victory' came with a price. The same applies to quite a large number of this cast.

I agree with the difference between the concept and what happened in practice with having the contestants on the edge. The problem is that despite how much we may like them, when they're on the edge they simply aren't playing the game. They are in purgatory, where we see them struggling to survive and do the odd challenge or solve a clue but they arent forming alliances or strategizing or facing decisions to vote someone out.

Like island of the idols, having players we like there is no substitute for them in the game.

Thargor

Survivor pulled from Fall schedule, producers only starting to negotiate with Fiji, nothing on the ground for filming yet

https://deadline.com/2020/07/survivor-pulled-fall-schedule-swat-moves-from-midseason-1202985760/

S.M.B.

Surprised they were so optimistic they were going to have something up and running in time, never felt achievable to me.

Foxtrol

S.M.B. wrote: »

Surprised they were so optimistic they were going to have something up and running in time, never felt achievable to me.

I thought they'd get away with it by having the crew and contestants isolate for 2 weeks in a hotel on arrival to Fiji, with all the associated testing, and then they'd be good to go.

From that point on they could have a pretty tight bubble, as there is minimal interactions with the crew from outsiders. It isn't like the camera men and producers are going back to their families each night. They could also pay any locals that are required to also stay inside the bubble during filming

With Fiji only having 26 cases and the US being a such a mess, I can see why they aren't welcoming them in with open arms.

Also Starring LeVar Burton

All the logistics and reasoning behind it not getting back in to production aside, I think it's no bad thing for Survivor to sit out for a season or two and come back with a renewed energy in February or September 2021 - being a fan from the very early days I had become a bit jaded in recent series and I know I'm not the only one, so I think it could be a case of absence makes the heart grow fonder and we'll all be much more invested when it eventually does return.

Foxtrol

I can say I haven't felt at all jaded with Survivor but up until now I hadn't watched any of the non-US versions of the show.

Though I'm very much enjoying the first season of Australian Survivor, the length of episodes and the very long season make it a far heavier watch (I'm saying that as someone that had no similar issues last year rewatching every season of US survivor). If the other Australian seasons, along with SA/NZ, go along the same lines I can very much understand how a person watching multiple formats would be jaded at this stage.

I'm happy that I have those to fill the void until we get fresh content.

S.M.B.

I could do only the first recent Australian Survivor, was far too much a slog. If this hiatus lasts a free years I'll go back and check out the other seasons.

Thargor

Australian Survivor is an unwatchable snooze-fest imo and I regularly rewatch seasons Ive already seen of the US one and enjoy them, dont know how anyone likes it.

norabattie

Thargor wrote: »

Australian Survivor is an unwatchable snooze-fest imo and I regularly rewatch seasons Ive already seen of the US one and enjoy them, dont know how anyone likes it.

I feel the complete opposite. I think Australian survivor is entertaining and an easier watch. This seasons alone was epic imo. Each to their own

pooch90

norabattie wrote: »

I feel the complete opposite. I think Australian survivor is entertaining and an easier watch. This seasons alone was epic imo. Each to their own

Im the same, much prefer the Australian one. You get to know the characters much more and it doesn't feel as tired. Plus they tend to get interesting mix of people. You root for people instead of watching it for the sake of it.

Thargor

What would you say is the best ever season of Survivor Oz then please and Ill give it a proper go?

upupup

Thargor wrote: »

What would you say is the best ever season of Survivor Oz then please and Ill give it a proper go?

forget about survivor 1 and 2 as these were made in 2001 and 2006 and 2 is a celebrity show.
Season 3 was made in 2016 and has a very close relationship with jeff probst's show as some of the challenges in Oz were later used in jeff's show so start with season 3.Australian survivor is much more about getting to know the survivors and not as rushed as the original survivor.

Foxtrol

upupup wrote: »

forget about survivor 1 and 2 as these were made in 2001 and 2006 and 2 is a celebrity show.
Season 3 was made in 2016 and has a very close relationship with jeff probst's show as some of the challenges in Oz were later used in jeff's show so start with season 3.Australian survivor is much more about getting to know the survivors and not as rushed as the original survivor.

I'm feeling that is far more just the bi-product of them attempting to drag out the show out for as long as possible to make up for the production costs (with it being 50+ days, a crazy number of contestants, and despite many episodes going over an hour they sometimes not even voting out 1 person).

I'm only towards the end of 2016, does each season of the Australian version keep that same format of the huge group of contestants and 50+ days? I need to mentally prepare myself for the next one

Has anyone watched NZ or South Africa? What are their format like?

S.M.B.

Foxtrol wrote: »

I'm feeling that is far more just the bi-product of them attempting to drag out the show out for as long as possible to make up for the production costs (with it being 50+ days, a crazy number of contestants, and despite many episodes going over an hour they sometimes not even voting out 1 person).

100%!

Australian Reality TV is shocking for doing this. 60+ 90 minutes episodes on some shows. Madness!