Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie
Toxic Masculinity harming MEN
Options
Comments
-
The purpose of ' toxic masculinity ' is to instil a sense of inadequacy in men to force them to follow the herd. Humans are social beings and so exclusion is a tactic, along with other ways of making them feel threatened or pressured in some way.
Again, I don't know how many times you need to be told and how many people you need to tell you, but that is not toxic masculinity.
Just look at any of the "women's" magazines. Constantly showing pictures of gorgeous women or shaming women because they had the cheek to get a little older or fatter.
It is simply human behaviour. Women do exactly the same to other women. And it's not simply man vs man or women vs women. People do it to other people.Is it ? The guidelines / rules or aspired for goals are set by the loudest gang and by whatever they knew from their influences. The rules long ago even in America was to have one diner for one race, and another diner for the other folks. People evolved. The issue is similar in respect of the seemingly most populist voice. People feel the pressure to conform / are afraid to fall out of the normal voice or just want to fit in. They may wish men were more like themselves but they subconsciously or consciously make an assessment and err on the side of caution.
The basic parameters that you all expect and defend have been imprinted on your minds like a religion or a bias. The men you are today may not be the men you would have been with different parents or surroundings. It would not even necessitate a different era, merely a different region in the world and influences like elderly relatives, religion and television etc. could have made you all more or less of a man.
I do feel very sorry for you. You seem to have bought wholesale into the "nothing is your fault, bad men made it that way" mantra that is 3rd wave feminism 101.
Your desire to fit in and your seeming inability to do so, isn't anyone else's fault. Telling everyone else they're wrong because YOU don't fit in, is delusional.0 -
Deleted User wrote: »Again, I don't know how many times you need to be told and how many people you need to tell you, but that is not toxic masculinity.
Did you not see the irony in that before posting ... how many times do I need to be told in order to understand that you are right ... isn't that called brainwashing ? If I and others told you something enough times you would learn and fit in right ? In that case if you happened to live somewhere else you would now be a proud fighter for some kind of nonsense with great comradery.
Informing people is the way to win over clever people not just saying because I say so.Deleted User wrote: »Just look at any of the "women's" magazines. Constantly showing pictures of gorgeous women or shaming women because they had the cheek to get a little older or fatter.
It is simply human behaviour. Women do exactly the same to other women. And it's not simply man vs man or women vs women. People do it to other people.Deleted User wrote: »Your desire to fit in and your seeming inability to do so, isn't anyone else's fault. Telling everyone else they're wrong because YOU don't fit in, is delusional.
Like that's never happened before. People haven't fitted in for generations because of skin colour. The white folk that felt sympathy for the situation, or heaven forbid felt they could relate to them on the same level ( all being human ) were cautious of being shunned. Men and women were aware to keep their thoughts to themselves, but little by little individuals spoke out until change occurred.
The bullies too were afraid; for all sorts of reasons from selfish to practical and hate filled to just plain fear of what comes next. You are afraid that all the real men will die out ... but there will always be men and women able and willing to fight in whatever capacity, even if it's not brute force, physical or traditional.0 -
Did you not see the irony in that before posting ... how many times do I need to be told in order to understand that you are right ... isn't that called brainwashing ? If I and others told you something enough times you would learn and fit in right ? In that case if you happened to live somewhere else you would now be a proud fighter for some kind of nonsense with great comradery.
Informing people is the way to win over clever people not just saying because I say so.
What are you talking about? Plenty of people have explained, in detail, that this has nothing to do with masculinity, toxic or otherwise. It is normal human behaviour.
Nobody is trying to brainwash you, people are pointing out how you are demonstrably wrong.Like that's never happened before. People haven't fitted in for generations because of skin colour. The white folk that felt sympathy for the situation, or heaven forbid felt they could relate to them on the same level ( all being human ) were cautious of being shunned. Men and women were aware to keep their thoughts to themselves, but little by little individuals spoke out until change occurred.
The bullies too were afraid; for all sorts of reasons from selfish to practical and hate filled to just plain fear of what comes next. You are afraid that all the real men will die out ... but there will always be men and women able and willing to fight in whatever capacity, even if it's not brute force, physical or traditional.
Look, you obviously have been bullied and you obviously feel inadequate and I am sorry that you feel that way and for what happened to you, but I do think that instead of blaming the individuals that bullied you and instead of working on aspects of your personality that have excluded you from groups, you instead shift the blame onto the myth of toxic masculinity.
Honestly, if I knew someone who spoke like you did, I wouldn't associate myself with you or socialise with you. From what you said, that could be toxic masculinity but it isn't. I just don't like the demeanour you present and wouldn't bother including you or people like you in my social circle. I will listen to your opinions but I am under no obligation to agree or change to suit any of your behaviours or fragilities, just like you are under no obligation to listen to or socialise with me.0 -
Can we just ban this stupid phrase please? Particularly in this forum.
"Toxic Masculinity" is not a thing.
It's a misandrist phrase developed by pseudo-intellectual female supremacists to denigrate men in the same fashion that white supremacists use a word beginning with N to refer to black people.
Polite society doesn't tolerate the use of the latter word and neither should we tolerate the use of the former phrase.0 -
Maybe you aren't perceptive regarding other's behaviour ? Maybe you are not aware of your own behaviour ? Maybe you have not been around such males ? Maybe you aren't one ? Or maybe it's not noticeable towards yourself because (a) you weren't informed and were blind to it ? or (b) you only receive minimal amounts of it due to your place on the spectrum of masculinity making it less obvious while around most of the toxic ones ?
Perhaps if you stood on a stage on front of a group of strangers ( manly toxic ones ) and disclosed your likes / dislikes, hobbies, opinions and some life experiences etc. then during or afterwards chatting with these men you may pick up on what you have blindly missed ...
What if it occurs before you arrive, after you've left or to someone else ? You may only hear about it, that's what.
So if you haven't witnessed or noticed it therefore it does not exist ?
But people can be thoughtful, kind, interested, eager and seem sincere and positively pleasant. They may come across as a gentleman but turn out contrived. It is not always lowbrow. They may not directly say what they mean, but they will speak volumes by playing games but yet you can be made to feel an unreasonable fool. Remember what I said about motive, you can't see it or understand as the situation occurs initially. It gets more confusing from there and changes your own perspective. You question your own take on events, and try to clarify or discuss it and more game playing follows ... they run circles around you. It is less noticeable as in a bf/gf relationship people may be more aware that it may be a possibility. You are less likely to think of your peers gaining something from control games, as they won't benefit in the same way from having someone under the thumb as someone in a couple.
You don't believe in it but it is prevalent, and it is not the definition of masculinity. Post Natal Depression is not the definition or part of a pregnancy but it is connected and common. Some people might say things like there is not much racism in a particular area because they don't encounter it. However, the person targeted may take stock of the sort of venues and time of day it occurs. They may eventually operate around that but can't stamp it out or avoid being in the firing line. You won't be able to avoid ' toxic masculinity ' either if there are a percentage of people who manage themselves naturally in such a way. They won't just charge at you with a bat like a caveman or on steed.
It can be apparent but in many instances it is very well hidden with the polite manners, seemingly appropriate behaviour and charm you might admire. The people doling out the intolerance may be otherwise highly functioning and often respectable contributors to society. The former makes it easier for them to influence people and exclude them from any inferences of wrong doing. The person themselves will wonder if and what they have done wrong, they will be totally confused and belittled. They will then have the person play more games and run more circles around them. It is bullying but even the perpetrator may not grasp it. It is a particular classification of bullying. I go back to ' racism ' because that is also bullying but it is classified with it's own sub term like ' toxic masculinity '.
It should be brought into the classroom but it's more than manners needed. The whole Irish education system lets down males and females. It does not bring socialising, psychology, confidence building and life skills into the mix enough. This should be as important as learning English. How can a person know to recognise mental issues properly and act accordingly unless they are given information and advice ? What about show and tell, and drama plays etc. like the kids in America do ? If children presented all the way through school it would be immediately picked up on by teachers once any struggles might start to form, and be assisted from then on. Kids can be crueller than many adults themselves, or than they realise. They actually make a hobby of tormenting certain individuals.0 -
Advertisement
-
"Perhaps if you stood on a stage on front of a group of strangers ( manly toxic ones ) and disclosed your likes / dislikes, hobbies, opinions and some life experiences etc.
Why in the name of all that is holy would I do that?
You have gone into a rant there and unfortunately, whatever message you are trying to get across is lost in a mish-mash of jumping from one topic to another without ever getting to a point.
If this is how you convey an opinion when you have the time to sit down in front of a keyboard, I can only imagine the struggle you have when trying to talk to someone in real time, in real life. It must be torture, both for you and for them.
You bring up that it is the Educational system that is letting everyone down. It isn't. Not in the way you have explained anyway. Every person is different and I get that you feel you are different to most. That isn't everyone else's fault. It isn't your fault. It is the way humans are.
What you seem to have done is surround yourself with ideals that absolve you of any blame for the way you feel, and project it onto the myth that toxic masculinity did this to you.
I seriously hope that you get the help you need.0 -
Deleted User wrote: »Why in the name of all that is holy would I do that?
I thought that actually imagining such a scenario would open your mind to what if - then what would happen etc. It doesn't need to be done in order for you to be able to imagine possible outcomes / reactions0 -
Skippyme wrote:I thought that actually imagining such a scenario would open your mind to what if - then what would happen etc. It doesn't need to be done in order for you to be able to imagine possible outcomes / reactions
Such hypothetical situations are only useful if done within the boundaries of realism or common occurrences.0 -
It should be brought into the classroom but it's more than manners needed. The whole Irish education system lets down males and females. It does not bring socialising, psychology, confidence building and life skills into the mix enough. This should be as important as learning English. How can a person know to recognise mental issues properly and act accordingly unless they are given information and advice ? What about show and tell, and drama plays etc. like the kids in America do ? If children presented all the way through school it would be immediately picked up on by teachers once any struggles might start to form, and be assisted from then on. Kids can be crueller than many adults themselves, or than they realise. They actually make a hobby of tormenting certain individuals.
I hear American schools are great, no bullying or dysfunctional kidsA belief in gender identity involves a level of faith as there is nothing tangible to prove its existence which, as something divorced from the physical body, is similar to the idea of a soul. - Colette Colfer
0 -
-
Advertisement
-
Just because somebody steps up and says something new to you doesn't make it untrue / inconceivable
Just because it's not a popular view to express among the masses, or isn't the loudest doesn't mean it's not true
Just because you don't like it or it offends you doesn't make it untrue
Just because you never thought about it, noticed it, and don't want to think about or struggle to understand it ...
The average guy is not going to either notice it as much or be treated to the same extent of whatever tricks are in the deck of cards. The average guy is closer in estimations of the the perceived status and traits appropriate for his take on male behaviour. If you already sport the typically acceptable male stereotype to a reasonable extent, as well as mindset, behaviour / abilities and interests there is less for them to pick at. They would also value your role in the tribe of society much more than those weaker or lagging behind. This was the way in tribes of humans and animals for generations but we are an evolved species that are supposedly more intelligent or at least guardians of the earth etc. Humanity is where we differ apparently but people can be devoid of a conscience and discard others like trash.
It may have been so engrained in the individual that they can't see their own behaviour as anything other than a positive outlook. They may be well aware of it but deem it to be a strong masculine idolised stance or attitude. It can be part of their sense of self and belief system like being radicalised. Religions around the world managed for centuries to have strong believers that have blind belief because it was drummed into them from birth, or as condition of the belief existence or their God. Religion usually tells people not to question their God.
They may want to be the leader but they want to be the leader of a pack they relate to, feeling inclusive to them as well. They will include and pressure the weaker ones while enjoying top dog status among those they consider closer in status to their own. They don't want someone overtaking them but they are happy when people aspire to be just like them and they enjoy the competition. They won't mind treating men shoddily or increasingly callously the further outside of their own bracket they identify those guys being. The actual emotions or reactions of others are not his responsibility, or even a concern for him unless it can benefit either himself or maintain the existing ideals. He just won't care about hurting others ' feelings ' as that is not an acceptable manly reaction or outlook on either side in his Action Man mind. It would actually serve to make the weak learn that they let themselves down and allowed themselves to be disrespected, rather than be hurt again in the future - like it's a decision because proper men use their logical calculating practical mindset. The hurt should be rebranded ( or in other words given no relevance ) as value, position and respect instead and add incentive to progress becoming part of the process to Man Up. This just gives men an excuse to treat others without regard or real respect, ascribing and virtually pushing a sense of inferiority onto them through game playing / manipulative interaction.
I can bring it back to more basic examples because you may think the intelligent male with ' toxic masculinity ' playing games is infrequent or remote for such situations to arise. The situations, perceptions, fall out and trickery encompassing the clever Macho Dude are going to be more intricate and drawn out; than for someone holding the same belief system but with a lower threshold ability to control their own / other's behaviour so I'll dumb it down ...
I'll give some examples like a man wearing ill suited attire to a venue and a male gym instructor or life guard laying down the law reacting first before realising that he could actually get himself into a lot of trouble. The reason being that he had passed no comment on the females doing the same thing daily while stipulating that rules are rules firstly targeting the male. The slightly smarter Alpha Male might suddenly one day tell all women and men simultaneously that rules are rules for all so he is witnessed playing fair, but only repeat it on days any males don't meet his approval letting it slide otherwise. There was a guy in the UK made headlines as well for refusing to get on a gay bus because the advert was on the side and he had a Macho strop. You see intelligence is involved and their life circumstances as well. There are men who won't wear pink in case someone might make assumptions. There are men that will beat up another with the sole purpose of impressing their peers. There are men that won't usually start an altercation unless it's something they need to address to prove their dominance or masculinity. There are guys that beat up gay guys but lust after lesbian women, or that are certain he could turn her.0 -
Skippyme, you're confusing ignorant, xenophobic, bigoted, bullying or other "toxic" :rolleyes: behaviour as being inherently masculine and mislabelling it as such.
You've allowed third wave feminists to indoctrinate you into their "women victims, men villains" bullshit and have internalised their misandry along with their language.0 -
Sleepy ... it is not mislabelled. I am simply pointing out the spectrum of ' toxic masculinity ' based on a guy's personality, intelligence and self control.
It's the same with other forms of control, abuse, bullying, or misinterpreting or being afraid of the existence or expansion of other groups.
Let's stop heading back up to the broader overall matter of bullying in general. It is a particular classification like any other. Racism is not the fear / hatred of the same race, same nationality, same culture etc.
Toxic Masculinity is a term reserved for men, and the way in which they mistreat and misjudge others - holding with their caveman attitudes.0 -
-
Toxic masculinity is simple imo.
It's the 'craic' of making fun of the sensitive lad in the dressing room for not acting all macho like so many do.
It's implying a fella is weak for crying or opening up about his feelings.
It's shaming a guy for not knowing how to do the jobs that men would have be in charge off years ago.
It's shaming a guy for being a stay at home Dad or working with young kids.
Of course there are varying degrees but it's all valid imo.0 -
-
In the opinion of a group of women who hate men.
This is the Gentlemen's Club forum.
I am a man. I have not been conferring with feminists. I am recounting my established experiences with other men and the culture of being a man.
I have not encountered any gentlemen in this Gentleman's Club yet.
Men's culture is not a very supportive one. You all fail to see that whoever is more in line with these standards doesn't stand side by side with you. They want to tower above you and maintain their dominance.
You may be at 70 % approval rating but as more men sign up and supposedly upgrade gradually and consistently your own rating will not remain the same. The older you get, the more tired you become, the less you choose to conform or have the ability to do; the further down the ranks you go.
The more it escalates the less manly you all become in the end ... nobody will ever be able to keep up only initially and until someone bolder, stronger and more resilient or better honed comes along.0 -
Toxic masculinity is simple imo.
It's the 'craic' of making fun of the sensitive lad in the dressing room for not acting all macho like so many do.
It's implying a fella is weak for crying or opening up about his feelings.
It's shaming a guy for not knowing how to do the jobs that men would have be in charge off years ago.
It's shaming a guy for being a stay at home Dad or working with young kids.
Of course there are varying degrees but it's all valid imo.
Is it "toxic femininity" if women:
aren't sexually attracted to the sensitive lad for not acting macho?
considers a guy to be weak for crying or opening up about his feelings?
expects a guy to be able to do the DIY or dirty jobs around the house like taking out the bins / climbing into the attic / unblocking drains etc?
shames a stay at home Dad for being emasculated and not "bringing home the bacon"?
Or is it simply a fact that ****ty behaviour isn't gendered and is only being considered as such because idiots who wasted their educations studying feminism and gender studies are trying to sell books, sell worthless degrees to young women with victim complexes or justify their exalted positions in sexist organisations like the WCI?0 -
Toxic masculinity is simple imo.
It's the 'craic' of making fun of the sensitive lad in the dressing room for not acting all macho like so many do.
It's implying a fella is weak for crying or opening up about his feelings.
It's shaming a guy for not knowing how to do the jobs that men would have be in charge off years ago.
It's shaming a guy for being a stay at home Dad or working with young kids.
Of course there are varying degrees but it's all valid imo.
If a woman does that to a man is it toxic masculinity too?
*skippy beat me to it0 -
-
Advertisement
-
I am a man. I have not been conferring with feminists. I am recounting my established experiences with other men and the culture of being a man.
I have not encountered any gentlemen in this Gentleman's Club yet.
Men's culture is not a very supportive one. You all fail to see that whoever is more in line with these standards doesn't stand side by side with you. They want to tower above you and maintain their dominance.
You may be at 70 % approval rating but as more men sign up and supposedly upgrade gradually and consistently your own rating will not remain the same. The older you get, the more tired you become, the less you choose to conform or have the ability to do; the further down the ranks you go.
The more it escalates the less manly you all become in the end ... nobody will ever be able to keep up only initially and until someone bolder, stronger and more resilient or better honed comes along.
To be honest, I don't blame people for not supporting you.
You come across as negative, unwilling to listen, pious, rambling and unwilling to adapt or take responsibility.
I am only going by your posts here, but you sound like someone who hates men and blames men for everything that is wrong with you.
Of course other men, especially ones who you don't know, won't like being labelled as the crux of what is wrong with society.
You seem to be of the opinion that anything that goes against your way of thinking is toxic and needs to change.
Perhaps the solution lies firstly in your own mirror.0 -
You seem to be arguing that there is “toxic femininity” also. The thing is that most who use the term “toxic masculinity” don’t use the term “toxic femininity”. The latter is not a widely accepted term.
Is it racist when ..Sleepy wrote:Is it "toxic femininity" if women ...
Is it homophobic when ...
Is it ageist when ...
Is it sexist when ...
Is it cyber bullying when ...
Is it socially unacceptable when ...
What's your point ... forget about the ladies ... they have their troubles too.0 -
You think women's culture is supportive? lol.I am a man. I have not been conferring with feminists. I am recounting my established experiences with other men and the culture of being a man.
I have not encountered any gentlemen in this Gentleman's Club yet.
Men's culture is not a very supportive one. You all fail to see that whoever is more in line with these standards doesn't stand side by side with you. They want to tower above you and maintain their dominance.
You may be at 70 % approval rating but as more men sign up and supposedly upgrade gradually and consistently your own rating will not remain the same. The older you get, the more tired you become, the less you choose to conform or have the ability to do; the further down the ranks you go.
The more it escalates the less manly you all become in the end ... nobody will ever be able to keep up only initially and until someone bolder, stronger and more resilient or better honed comes along.
Where do you thing the pressure on women to be thin comes from?
Or the pressure to return to work within days of childbirth?
Or the idea that it's unacceptable to be seen in the same outfit at a social function?
Or the idea that a woman should be able to be a perfect mother devoting all her time to her kids whilst also maintaining an executive level position in the business world?
Or the idea that women shouldn't be "promiscuous"?
We're a competitive species. Most mammals are. It's literally how our sexual selection works at it's basest level.
I'm not some macho guy btw. I'd conform to certain historic masculine roles like being the breadwinner and doing the DIY but I changed my fair share of our kids nappies, I do the majority of the cooking in our household, would have little or no interest in sports, and would generally be into "nerdy" hobbies like fantasy reading, fishkeeping, brewing etc. and I got the **** kicked out of me fairly regularly in school for not conforming to the norms of the all-boys secondary schools I attended in the 90s. I got over it though. I take satisfaction knowing that I've done better in life than 90% of those who bullied me in school and that while I'm far from rich, I have a decent life.
You didn't invent the phrase "toxic masculinity", nor pick it up from other (non feminist indoctrinated) men. You adopted it from a group whose sole purpose is to identify men as the perpetrators of every problem a woman could possibly face when the reality is that the average woman (in the western world at least) has more rights, opportunities and advantages than the average man and most of the pressures they face are, in fact, dumped on them by other women (though I'm sure most would blame men for the pressures I listed above).0 -
I'm not talking about pc terms. I'm talking about blatant stupidity, ignorance or negative mindsets against people just being themselves. Men have emotions, even the stoic men and some eventually have a meltdown or difficulty when it reaches boiling point. It can also really cast a shadow long term causing worry and stress ruining other or all parts of their lives. Why do you think people are known to find Xmas a real struggle ?
People often find life hard but if someone is condemned or looked down on, or if they get repetitive little remarks or immediately cut down to size over certain innocent aspects of themselves or their behaviour ... ? The point is men may find some other guys chipping away at them making things worse before they even attempt to speak out, and then to a less than eager ear that doesn't get it. They may be given some regimented instructions or choices - rather than support they might end up with sort yourself out with an obvious WTF by the macho dude to end.
I didn't realise what it was for a long time. I just thought it was people playing games or being themselves or a control thing. It is not applicable to women hence the reason for whomever classifying it as they did. It is a recognised term displaying an exaggerated and stony macho outlook with certain unwavering set criteria and behaviour expected to be reached by others. It dominates their own behaviour in a way that is carefully measured and sought by them to conform with their archaic view of the male stereotype. They discourage any overstepping or blurring of the gender stereotypes and make their opinions more like standards, demands and expectations. It means things like expecting others to man up, talk is for women, men are doers, men should earn more, men don't wear pink ever and boys should play sport etc. and the list goes on. They will react disapprovingly and often in a premeditated manner in order to control and remove undesirable traits or behaviour. It can put pressure on others to reach unrealistic expectations and seek to diminish others.
The main problem with your post is the language used, toxic masculinity as a term has very negative connotations in both social and regular media. Its a divisive term that essentially groups all men into one homogeneous group and paints the sins of the world on us and forgets the positive contribution to society.
Maybe its my generation but i don't really know many people like you have described above.
One thing i think you also miss is the societal pressure that is on men, those who are in a position of being "toxic" maybe do so from the perspective of defense mechanism. Your least likely to get help when in trouble if your a single male in Ireland, look at the likes of the homeless crisis as an example men only get a mention when dying close to the dail.
Its a shame you didn't go at it from the other side and having a general conversation about the positives and negatives of being a man. Rather we just get another men are bastards post.
I am also very curious of your intent, you went out of your way as a new poster to find this forum and post this in it. What are your motives?0 -
Men's culture is not a very supportive one. You all fail to see that whoever is more in line with these standards doesn't stand side by side with you. They want to tower above you and maintain their dominance.
How supportive do you think you are in thinking you’re better than other men whom you describe as cavemen, and using terms like toxic masculinity to perpetuate a negative stereotype of men?
Your whole rhetoric sounds like a weird mish mash of feminist and PUA theories - it’s completely disjointed nonsense. You imagine yourself as the greatest victim in all this, but at the same time you speak as though you’re a leader of some ‘new’ movement?
There’s nothing new in anything you’re saying that hasn’t been said before in dozens of different ways. You aren’t offering anything new, or insightful or inspiring. It’s just... meh. Whatever.0 -
Deleted User wrote: »Of course other men, especially ones who you don't know, won't like being labelled as the crux of what is wrong with society
I don't think all guilty of ' toxic masculinity .' I think it is holding society back on one side.
It is bad for all, even those currently happy with it.
It is stunting those already wanting to undo the shackles and break free to being the best man that they can be, as well as others from forming naturally and developing.0 -
I don't think all guilty of ' toxic masculinity .' I think it is holding society back on one side.
It is bad for all, even those currently happy with it.
It is stunting those already wanting to undo the shackles and break free to being the best man that they can be, as well as others from forming naturally and developing.
I think that feminists both male and female who try and group the opposite sex and call them toxic is also holding society back.
As rather than having a mature conversations on how we can collectively bring about change we just end up dividing people.
The male feminist is probably the worst though as they essentially replace the so called toxic masculinity structure with another, there is an air of self righteousness and most conversations you have with them are dismissed because they apparently are always right.
As we have seen in a couple of cases across the world they have used the cloak of feminism to take advantage of the other sex. Although not surprising considering how right on and self righteous they are.0 -
You are changing topic to other bullying already given their respective sub-classifying termsYou think women's culture ...
I already answered as belowIs it "toxic femininity" if women:
See BELOW Sleepy and again what is your point ? WOMEN harming others is NOT toxic masculinity. Attacking the elderly is NOT child abuse.
Is it racist when ..
Is it homophobic when ...
Is it ageist when ...
Is it sexist when ...
Is it cyber bullying when ...
Is it socially unacceptable when ...
What's your point ... forget about the ladies ... they have their troubles too.0 -
I don't think all guilty of ' toxic masculinity .' I think it is holding society back on one side.
It is bad for all, even those currently happy with it.
It is stunting those already wanting to undo the shackles and break free to being the best man that they can be, as well as others from forming naturally and developing.
See the thing is.... you are wrong.
The only person holding you back is you.
It has never been more widely accepted and encouraged to break free of the stereotypes of gender. Sometimes in my opinion it goes too far in the name of inclusivity.
I'm interested though...what is the "best man YOU can be" and what is stopping you achieve it?0 -
Advertisement
-
My point is that you're adopting the language of feminism to castigate your fellow men for not conforming to your expectations of their behaviour.You are changing topic to other bullying already given their respective sub-classifying terms
I already answered as below
See BELOW Sleepy and again what is your point ? WOMEN harming others is NOT toxic masculinity. Attacking the elderly is NOT child abuse.
Is it racist when ..
Is it homophobic when ...
Is it ageist when ...
Is it sexist when ...
Is it cyber bullying when ...
Is it socially unacceptable when ...
What's your point ... forget about the ladies ... they have their troubles too.
My point is that when women engage in identically competitive behaviour, we don't label it as "toxic" so lets not make a gender issue out of something that isn't one. Humans are a mammalian species that practice sexual selection. Part of that selection process is intrasexual selection or competition between members of the same sex.
My point is that your whinging about your perceived victimhood is as puerile and irritating as that of the feminists whose language you're adopting. You live in a time and culture where you are more in control of your own destiny than 99% of your ancestors: wealth and status can be acquired without the need to kill or maim your opposition (while risking the same treatment at their hands), the class systems of the past were steadily eroded in our culture throughout the 20th century, modern science has extended your life expectancy. Stop whinging about what others are doing and go make your life what you want it to be.0
![[Deleted User]](/applications/dashboard/design/images/defaulticon.png)
This discussion has been closed.
Advertisement