CHAdeMO v CCS

innrain

Based on the data collected by liamog I've played with the graphing functions in excel
Here is the normalized distribution of the different plugs in time


CHAdeMO is squeezed to less than a third in the last two years. Fast AC seems pretty constant although it will die out in the next few months

liamog

Great work.

The numbers for Fast AC are probably lower, there isn't a way to distinguish via the beepbeep data whether a Zoe has CCS or the AC43 upgrade, so I'm just lumping them all as Fast AC.

ELM327

Also the "tesla" numbers are all CCS

slave1

unkel wrote: »

Grants are always poor use of public funds as the money mostly ends up in someone's pocket it wasn't intended for. SEAI grant for new EVs goes mostly to the manufacturer / dealer. SEAI grant for charger install goes mostly to the installer. SEAI grant for PV install goes mostly to the installer. Etc.

So, no. No grant!

Ah, here now, the €5k VRT exemption is grant in another word, we both welcomed that

liamog

I'd be more interested in the grant kickstarting a place to do the conversions.

the_amazing_raisin

ELM327 wrote: »

Also the "tesla" numbers are all CCS

Are older model S/X not using the type 2 connector for supercharging?

liamog

cruisey1987 wrote: »

Are older model S/X not using the type 2 connector for supercharging?

All currently sold, and second hand models are capable of utilising CCS, but at the time we started the CCS vs CHAdeMO bet, they were excluded, so I'm only including the Model 3's, ELM327 like's to post a monthly reminder

innrain

I looked at November new reg figures and it seems that Nissan sold 4 cars while at a rough count CCS added 42. Didn't count Zoes as CSS is optional. Last month CHAdeMo had a lead of 32 so is November the month when crossover happened? The imports may have not let that. Waiting for the official figures

ELM327

I'm glad I won my bet.
Covid made it a bit closer IMO than it would have been. But finally now, we see more CCS cars than Chademo on the road in 2020!

Stealthirl

Those used CHAdeMo imports will still keep CHAdeMo healthy for years to come, The Leaf really needs an update to CCS and thermal battery management but doubt it's going to come

Black_Knight

Stealthirl wrote: »

Those used CHAdeMo imports will still keep CHAdeMo healthy for years to come, The Leaf really needs an update to CCS and thermal battery management but doubt it's going to come

Not if import duty and additional vat rates come into play. Won't be worth it

ELM327

Ding Dong the big plug is dead!

Laviski

ELM327 wrote: »

Ding Dong the big plug is dead!

Not until every leaf is scrapped or a converter is brought out which is not likely to happen for a few years

The hate will continue for some time

AndyBoBandy

The Tesla Model 3 alone has outsold the Leaf in 2020 (up to November). Add in the (CCS) Zoe & ID.3 and its 2:1 against the Leaf... and that's before you add up everything else....



In fairness though if you rely a lot on public charging, now would be a great time to get a Leaf thanks to eCars continued insistence on installing CCS to CHAdeMO in a 50/50 capacity. Granted a lot of teh newer CCS cars have much higher ranges, so would need the public charging infrastructure less that the older Leaf's would, but eventually we'll reach a point where the current Leaf's are dead and buried (or stripped and connected to homes), and today's CCS cars will be older and with some battery degradation, will need the public chargers a lot more..

ELM327

Laviski wrote: »

Not until every leaf is scrapped or a converter is brought out which is not likely to happen for a few years

The hate will continue for some time

To be fair, if I'm at a 50kW FCP I'm also charging on chademo (model S) as if I'm on CCS and someone connects the chademo plug it can end my session due to an ecars bug.

Black_Knight

CCS is forging ahead in usage too. The date is from that date to +2 weeks. What a difference 200+ ID3s make.
2020-12-01 10:57:41 TYPE_COMBO_GERMANY 7.21 week
2020-12-01 10:57:41 TYPE_4_CHADEMO 6.72 week
2020-12-01 10:57:41 TYPE_2_TETHERED 2.83 week
2020-12-01 10:57:41 TYPE_2_MENNEKES 1.17 day



2020-10-22 12:00:32 TYPE_4_CHADEMO 6.03 week
2020-10-22 12:00:32 TYPE_COMBO_GERMANY 5.94 week
2020-10-22 12:00:32 TYPE_2_TETHERED 2.78 week
2020-10-22 12:00:32 TYPE_2_MENNEKES 1.04 day

Laviski

ELM327 wrote: »

To be fair, if I'm at a 50kW FCP I'm also charging on chademo (model S) as if I'm on CCS and someone connects the chademo plug it can end my session due to an ecars bug.

if that is the case for everyone then the hatred should directed towards ESB than the leaf/chademo plug. But the general feel on this thread is that their should be a final solution implemented for Chademo.

but the look down' and piffs will continue when ccs user's roll up to see a leaf charging or not charging as the case maybe. For the new triple units they have deployed (CCS/Chademo/Type2), does that same issue happen?

ELM327

The hatred is not for the plug for that reason.
It's because its a waste of resources, especially on the 150kW units that can have 2*CCS, they have instead gone with 1*CCS and 1* chademo.

CCS is the EU standard

EDIT: It does not occur on the newer units (44kW DC + 6-22kW AC) that they installed. It seems to be limited to the 50kW Efacec triple heads when used by ecars *(other providers do not have the same bug with that unit)

Black_Knight

ELM327 wrote: »

The hatred is not for the plug for that reason.
It's because its a waste of resources, especially on the 150kW units that can have 2*CCS, they have instead gone with 1*CCS and 1* chademo.

CCS is the EU standard

EDIT: It does not occur on the newer units (44kW DC + 6-22kW AC) that they installed. It seems to be limited to the 50kW Efacec triple heads when used by ecars *(other providers do not have the same bug with that unit)

I'll have to look at my code, see can I pull out that data to see when a 150kW + 50kW site is DC occupied, what sockets are occupied.

Kramer

Black_Knight wrote: »

I'll have to look at my code, see can I pull out that data to see when a 150kW + 50kW site is DC occupied, what sockets are occupied.

No need to delve into complicated code...............just need 4x Tesla Model 3s to park up near, but facing, all four 150kW units, activate sentry mode, sit back & wait.

I guess we could call it "straight from the source" code :pac:.

Black_Knight

Kramer wrote: »

No need to delve into complicated code...............just need 4x Tesla Model 3s to park up near, but facing, all four 150kW units, activate sentry mode, sit back & wait.

I guess we could call it "straight from the source" code :pac:.

Somewhat pricey though. Can I get some government funding on that?

Kramer

Black_Knight wrote: »

Somewhat pricey though. Can I get some government funding on that?

A quick email to sleepy Eamon should see you right for funding. Just stick an "e" in front of everything. You're looking for efunding, for an estudy, into echarging regarding emobility & you require e€uros .

ELM327 will likely contribute too - I forget what the bet was again, possibly him eating a hat or skinny dipping or driving his Tesla naked or similar, if it turned out Chademo was still more popular by the end of 2020?

Hopefully, it'll be live streamed anyway - TikTok is my preferred service .

ELM327

Kramer wrote: »

A quick email to sleepy Eamon should see you right for funding. Just stick an "e" in front of everything. You're looking for efunding, for an estudy, into echarging regarding emobility & you require e€uros .

ELM327 will likely contribute too - I forget what the bet was again, possibly him eating a hat or skinny dipping or driving his Tesla naked or similar, if it turned out Chademo was still more popular by the end of 2020?

Hopefully, it'll be live streamed anyway - TikTok is my preferred service .

No one needs to see that!

Thankfully that wont be necessary as CCS outperformed Chademo this year to the point there are now more CCS than Chademo cars overall. Which was the bet.

McGiver

ELM327 wrote:

The hatred is not for the plug for that reason. It's because its a waste of resources, especially on the 150kW units that can have 2*CCS, they have instead gone with 1*CCS and 1* chademo.

Exactly, there is and will not be a SINGLE 75kW capable Chademo car in Ireland. So WTF are the chargers set up as 75 kW CCS and 75 kW Chademo split????

If it was 100 kW CCS and 50 kW then maybe OK.

ELM327 wrote:

CCS is the EU standard

Exactly. This needs to be repeated until especially Ecars/ESB get it.

The CHAdeMO situation is akin an electrical shop selling a device with a Japanese plug and hotels actually installing 1 European and 1 Japanese socket in all their rooms to support customers who bought the devices with the wrong plug

unkel

Kramer wrote: »

A quick email to sleepy Eamon should see you right for funding. Just stick an "e" in front of everything. You're looking for efunding, for an estudy, into echarging regarding emobility & you require e€uros .

Don't forget to mention eCars and the eSB a few times. He'll likely give you 10 million up front if you make him a promise about installing a few eHubs

Black_Knight

Black_Knight wrote: »

CCS is forging ahead in usage too. The date is from that date to +2 weeks. What a difference 200+ ID3s make.
2020-12-01 10:57:41 TYPE_COMBO_GERMANY 7.21 week
2020-12-01 10:57:41 TYPE_4_CHADEMO 6.72 week
2020-12-01 10:57:41 TYPE_2_TETHERED 2.83 week
2020-12-01 10:57:41 TYPE_2_MENNEKES 1.17 day



2020-10-22 12:00:32 TYPE_4_CHADEMO 6.03 week
2020-10-22 12:00:32 TYPE_COMBO_GERMANY 5.94 week
2020-10-22 12:00:32 TYPE_2_TETHERED 2.78 week
2020-10-22 12:00:32 TYPE_2_MENNEKES 1.04 day

Copying from the Ecars thread.

CCS CHAdeMO usage split on those HPC over the last 2 weeks
Max Power|Socket|Minutes in use
150|TYPE_COMBO_GERMANY| 12760
70|TYPE_4_CHADEMO| 2625


2020-10-22 12:00:32 TYPE_4_CHADEMO 87910 minutes
2020-10-22 12:00:32 TYPE_COMBO_GERMANY 137455 minutes
2020-10-22 12:00:32 TYPE_2_TETHERED 43205 minutes
2020-10-22 12:00:32 TYPE_2_MENNEKES 1985 minutes

Massive shift over the last 6 months (now we can driving again)

McGiver

@ELM327

You won the bet we made in 2019. There were more CCS cars than ChaDeMO cars by the end of 2020.

€10 donated to a charity of my choice...

JohnC.

Across the pond, Electrify America will stop installing Chademo from January (except California where a different group runs the company).

https://cleantechnica.com/2021/09/22/electrify-america-to-phase-out-chademo-in-2022/

Chademo accounts for 5% of use on their network.

AndyBoBandy

Thats Toyota & Lexus fcuked so........

the_amazing_raisin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117952907#Comment_117952907

They used Chademo? I thought they were still betting on the hydrogen train