Formula 1 2020 - General Discussion Thread (See MOD warning on first post)

Man with broke phone

Man with broke phone wrote: »

I dont know anything about NASCAR, does that make me stupid?

That's quite the hair-trigger daddy defence you've got there.

pjohnson

Tbf there was issues (mentioned a few pages ago) between Shwartzman and his Russian backers and their ability to link up with the American Haas team.

GarIT

Harika wrote: »

Both are part of the academy, if illott would win the championship, (don't worry too much doesn't look like it) there will be questions why the worse placed driver does get promoted over the winning driver. Congratulations you just made Mick a pay driver.

No there won't. Drivers are always picked based on which junior program they are linked to, who their sponsors are and marketing potential. Mick is a pay driver.

GarIT

pjohnson wrote: »

Tbf there was issues (mentioned a few pages ago) between Shwartzman and his Russian backers linking up with the American Haas team.

That's due to an actual embargo on accepting money from Russians, not because it would look bad to be associated with someone a slightly different colour.

pjohnson

GarIT wrote: »

That's due to an actual embargo on accepting money from Russians, not because it would look bad to be associated with someone a slightly different colour.

Oh yeah the idea of the Mexico/America thing is nonsense but I was just mentioning that there was very recently that type of scenario where a driver was "blocked" from a seat due to political factors rather than any on track incidents.

El_Duderino 09

I know Albon is almost certainly gone from red bull anyway, but today wasn’t a bad result on paper. 6th is an alright finish but he’s a full .400s behind Max. That’s just not good enough.

Similar to the gap from LeClerc back to Seb. .450s gap in q1 and .350s in q2. Must be a very embarrassing season for poor aul Seb.

Perez beat the shyte out of stroll too. .400 in each of q1 and 2.

Gap between Ric and Ocon was about 2.5 in q2. Ric really has the upper hand all season.

Gasley the star of the show. Kvyat is back in 8th but wasn’t all that far off Gasley in each part .250s, .350s and .200s respectively. But still always behind. Great performance from Gasley.

I wonder if red bull will keep Kvyat? I wouldn’t keep him. Albon vs Gasley would be a good battle.

Dont be at yourself

Apparently Helmut Marko said to Sky Germany that Kvyat will be replaced by a very young driver (Tsunoda, I guess) next year.

That leaves Red Bull and Haas as the only 3 open seats.

pjohnson

Tsunoda just needs to finish high enough in F2 to get his super licsence. If Tsunoda fails then they probably will keep Kvyat in the AlphaTauri.

Infoanon

Perez has already said Red Bull is his only option for 2021

chicorytip

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

I know Albon is almost certainly gone from red bull anyway, but today wasn’t a bad result on paper. 6th is an alright finish but he’s a full .400s behind Max. That’s just not good enough.

Similar to the gap from LeClerc back to Seb. .450s gap in q1 and .350s in q2. Must be a very embarrassing season for poor aul Seb.

Perez beat the shyte out of stroll too. .400 in each of q1 and 2.

Gap between Ric and Ocon was about 2.5 in q2. Ric really has the upper hand all season.

Gasley the star of the show. Kvyat is back in 8th but wasn’t all that far off Gasley in each part .250s, .350s and .200s respectively. But still always behind. Great performance from Gasley.

I wonder if red bull will keep Kvyat? I wouldn’t keep him. Albon vs Gasley would be a good battle.

I think Seb is just having a gigantic sulk.

vectra

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Yeah I agree it’s a pretty big assumption that they developed the 2019 car to suit LeClerc. Having presumably designed the 2019 car to suit Vettel (because LeClerc wasn’t at ferrari yet, LeClerc still beat him. So what does that tell you?

It’s also a big assume that they are developing the car to suit LeClerc and that development is at vettel’s expense. I would ask you to form an argument or provide some evidence, but you get touchy when I ask you to do that.

But since you brought it up, how much of the gap between LeClerc back to Vettel do you ascribe to the car not suiting Vettel?

Sometimes it feels like talking to the wall when talking to you

Every viewer and their mother would know the car was designed the year before.( 2018 )
How do you know what Ferrari's plans were back then?
Wasn't it already said the Charles was on his way in 2019? > Happened
How do you know that moving Vettel on was not already part of the plan? > Happening

So why would they develop that car to suit Vettel if they already knew he wouldn't be around long term?
As for asking me to provide evidence of Ferrari developing the car at Vettels expense !
Are you actually being serious?
I wouldnt even bother trying to answer than one.

But as we are on the topic of evidence.
I still await your evidence of your bold claim of them Cheating.

El_Duderino 09

vectra wrote: »

Sometimes it feels like talking to the wall when talking to you

Every viewer and their mother would know the car was designed the year before.( 2018 )
How do you know what Ferrari's plans were back then?
Wasn't it already said the Charles was on his way in 2019? > Happened
How do you know that moving Vettel on was not already part of the plan? > Happening

So why would they develop that car to suit Vettel if they already knew he wouldn't be around long term?
As for asking me to provide evidence of Ferrari developing the car at Vettels expense !
Are you actually being serious?
I wouldnt even bother trying to answer than one.

But as we are on the topic of evidence.
I still await your evidence of your bold claim of them Cheating.

I asked if you could form an argument or show evidence. An argument would be... don’t worry, it would take too long to coach you on forming a cogent argument. Evidence would be something like ferrari saying they developed the car with LeClerc in mind.

But lol at the mess of an argument you created above.
1 How do I know the 2019 car was developed with Seb in mind?
2 you assert they knew Seb was moving on when they hadn’t even signed the replacement yet.

Seriously, lol ant how far you have to go to avoid then obvious truth: Seb is on terrible form for the last 2 years, spanking 3 seasons. He’s been beaten by a rookie and is being humiliated this year by the same guy. The conclusions are obvious. Vettel is not a good driver any longer - let alone a top driver.

If there was a single metric where Seb looks like a good driver, you’d have mentioned it instead of making up conspiracy theories about Ferrari sabotaging the man they pay $30m a year to.

pjohnson

vectra wrote: »

Sometimes it feels like talking to the wall when talking to you

Every viewer and their mother would know the car was designed the year before.( 2018 )
How do you know what Ferrari's plans were back then?
Wasn't it already said the Charles was on his way in 2019? > Happened
How do you know that moving Vettel on was not already part of the plan? > Happening

So why would they develop that car to suit Vettel if they already knew he wouldn't be around long term?
As for asking me to provide evidence of Ferrari developing the car at Vettels expense !
Are you actually being serious?
I wouldnt even bother trying to answer than one.

But as we are on the topic of evidence.
I still await your evidence of your bold claim of them Cheating.

Cmon man how do you keep falling for the bait? You knew what the rambling answer was gunna be.

El_Duderino 09

pjohnson wrote: »

Cmon man how do you keep falling for the bait? You knew what the rambling answer was gunna be.

Much easier to say it’s not true than to come up with an argument that Seb isn’t both on terrible form and being humiliated by the youngster in the other Ferrari.

tipp_tipp_tipp

https://twitter.com/F1MikaHakkinen/status/1322620828660490241

pjohnson

pjohnson wrote: »

Oh yeah the idea of the Mexico/America thing is nonsense but I was just mentioning that there was very recently that type of scenario where a driver was "blocked" from a seat due to political factors rather than any on track incidents.

Just to entertain it, Trump lost the popular vote last time and will lose it again on Tuesday. So a majority don't support Trump. Not many companies have publicly gone in that direction either so there's no reason to think that even if Haas was a massive racist he'd let that get in the way of money.

flazio

Ordinarily I'd be the same, it's just the way America is these days nothing would surprise me. For me Haas is the perfect team for someone like Checo. He'd be a good rival to Russell if Haas and Williams are scrapping for points.

vectra

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

I asked if you could form an argument or show evidence. An argument would be... don’t worry, it would take too long to coach you on forming a cogent argument. Evidence would be something like ferrari saying they developed the car with LeClerc in mind.

But lol at the mess of an argument you created above.
1 How do I know the 2019 car was developed with Seb in mind?
2 you assert they knew Seb was moving on when they hadn’t even signed the replacement yet.

Seriously, lol ant how far you have to go to avoid then obvious truth: Seb is on terrible form for the last 2 years, spanking 3 seasons. He’s been beaten by a rookie and is being humiliated this year by the same guy. The conclusions are obvious. Vettel is not a good driver any longer - let alone a top driver.

If there was a single metric where Seb looks like a good driver, you’d have mentioned it instead of making up conspiracy theories about Ferrari sabotaging the man they pay $30m a year to.

And still no evidence of your Blatant accusation of Ferrari cheating.
You are some man for one man I'll tell ya.

You know what, Toto is leaving his role in Mercedes. Why don't you go for it seeing as you "know" everything. :rolleyes:

vectra

pjohnson wrote: »

Cmon man how do you keep falling for the bait? You knew what the rambling answer was gunna be.

Maybe I like winding up Trolls

rock22

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Much easier to say it’s not true than to come up with an argument that Seb isn’t both on terrible form and being humiliated by the youngster in the other Ferrari.

Your anti-Vettel diatribe is becoming extremely tedious at this stage -

pjohnson

vectra wrote: »

Maybe I like winding up Trolls

It shytes the thread though

weisses

vectra wrote: »

And still no evidence of your Blatant accusation of Ferrari cheating.
You are some man for one man I'll tell ya.
Mmm
You know what, Toto is leaving his role in Mercedes. Why don't you go for it seeing as you "know" everything. :rolleyes:

Ferrari was cheating.... Everyone who follows F1 knows this, as for the evidence, the FIA couldn't get the actual evidence but knew enough to make Ferrari stop using whatever workaround they used. Resulting in running an engine that is slower then last year and a car that is more difficult to drive because the aero package is not reflecting the engine power anymore.

Let me ask you this ... If Ferraris engine was legal why aren't they using it now ?

weisses

rock22 wrote: »

Your anti-Vettel diatribe is becoming extremely tedious at this stage -

What do you make of Vettel let's say, .. last3 seasons ? .... Given his history in f1 and the team he is driving with now ?

vectra

weisses wrote: »

Ferrari was cheating.... Everyone who follows F1 knows this, as for the evidence, the FIA couldn't get the actual evidence but knew enough to make Ferrari stop using whatever workaround they used. Resulting in running an engine that is slower then last year and a car that is more difficult to drive because the aero package is not reflecting the engine power anymore.

Let me ask you this ... If Ferraris engine was legal why aren't they using it now ?

Cheating is a very strong word with no hard evidence of what they were doing.
The same could be said of Mercedes this season using the das system.

Finding and using a grey area in the rules and using it until such a time as the rules are amended so as it can no longer be used has been done for as long as the sport exists.
This still does not constitute Cheating.

Cheating was done by Mclaren. That was blatant cheating and when they got caught they paid dearly for it.
If Ferrari were Cheating as blatant as you say. Why did they not get a hefty punishment?

El_Duderino 09

vectra wrote: »

And still no evidence of your Blatant accusation of Ferrari cheating.
You are some man for one man I'll tell ya.

You know what, Toto is leaving his role in Mercedes. Why don't you go for it seeing as you "know" everything. :rolleyes:

Not sure how many times I’ve told you I don’t have evidence for ferrari cheating last year. But the argument I made for it is all pretty common knowledge

Anyway, since you brought it up, how much of the gap from LeClerc back to Vettel do you ascribe to the car not suiting Vettel?

vectra

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Not sure how many times I’ve told you I don’t have evidence for ferrari cheating last year. But the argument I made for it is all pretty common knowledge

Anyway, since you brought it up, how much of the gap from LeClerc back to Vettel do you ascribe to the car not suiting Vettel?

Common "Knowledge" to who?

Charles Vs Seb.

Where do you think this gap is coming from over a lap?

skipper_G

vectra wrote: »

Common "Knowledge" to who?

Charles Vs Seb.

Where do you think this gap is coming from over a lap?

Common knowledge to anybody not blinded by Ferrari loyalty. The world and his dog suspects Ferrari cheated because they got a special secret settlement with the FIA

vectra

skipper_G wrote: »

Common knowledge to anybody not blinded by Ferrari loyalty. The world and his dog suspects Ferrari cheated because they got a special secret settlement with the FIA

Ah,
"Suspect" that is different to blatant accusing.
BTW,
I have zero loyalty to Ferrari, as a matter of fact I detest their ways.

skipper_G

vectra wrote: »

Ah,
"Suspect" that is different to blatant accusing.
BTW,
I have zero loyalty to Ferrari, as a matter of fact I detest their ways.

You could have fooled me

El_Duderino 09

vectra wrote: »

Common "Knowledge" to who?

Charles Vs Seb.

Where do you think this gap is coming from over a lap?

Its common knowledge to people who follow f1. The Ferrari engine of last year being the best on the grid, the investigation and secret FIA deal, the Ferrari engine of this year being much slower to comply with the rules. This is such a strange hill for to those to die on. And it’s funny to me because as far as I can see you only chose this ridiculous argument because I argued Ferrari cheated last year.

I’ll answer the Seb Vs LeClerc question but I’ll note that I’ve asked you the same question 3 or 4 times so it would be great if you’d answer the question I asked you which was: since you brought up the development to excuse Vettel’s performance, how much of the gap from LeClerc back to Seb to do ascribe to the car not suiting Seb?

I just go with the evidence we have available so put it down to Seb failing to be as fast as LeClerc. I think LeClerc might be doing something special in the car and that will only become clear when we see LeClerc up against a good driver so we’ll know more when Sainz moves there next year. At the moment Seb isn’t even good let alone very good or a top driver so I think that explains the gap.

Now, your turn.