Achill asylum centre cancelled - mod warning in OP (01/11/19)

The Satanist

PowerToWait wrote: »

I’m not posh in the slightest but they’re welcome to house any decent people anywhere near me.

Nice get out clause there

Doctors room ghost

ebbsy wrote: »

+1

It is a bad choice of where to put them.

Why not just give them all separate apartments mortgage free ?

Mortgage free.
We can’t even look after our own population of homeless people without taking to importing more.
Charity starts at home

PowerToWait

PowerToWait wrote: »

I’m not posh in the slightest but they’re welcome to house any decent people anywhere near me.

I consider myself a decent person with a capacity for empathy and compassion for all people, no matter their colour, origin or religion.

Basically I’m not a thundering backwards, racist, sectarian arsęhole.

What about those who aren’t decent? Who should they be housed beside?

MadYaker

BarryD2 wrote: »

Of course there are basic services, three primary schools I think plus a secondary at the Sound. Doctors in Dooagh & the Sound.. Shops, coffee shops. What do you mean as regards anything to do? No cinemas or fancy kids play centres but plenty of opportunity for good healthy exercise.

Is this a serious post? Have you been to achill? Everything is miles apart and there’s no public transportation how will these people get around? I just asked a friend who surfs on keel and he says there’s one doctor there part time! How is that supposed to be ok for 30 something asylum seekers? These people are going to need to all kinds of medical support and probably counselling etc you can just dump in a hotel in the middle of nowhere for the winter it’s totally mad.

MadYaker

Why don’t they just put them all in Galway? I live in Salthill and around the corner from me there’s a hotel that’s been a direct provision centre for as long as I can remember. You don’t even notice it’s there. There’s a few other buildings around the town that would be suitable too. The schools and hospitals here can handle 30 or 40 extra people plus they can find jobs and actually build lives for themselves.

carolmon

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

No basically just to save time when typing using a mobile phone. Thanks anyway

Hmmm ... so you save 3 letters and every other word spelt in full?
But no agenda calling people "asy seekers"?

PowerToWait

Mules wrote: »

The thing about the asylum system in Ireland is that it's the most generous in Europe
That's why the numbers of people coming from safe democracies has shot up. The media and some politicians say that direct provisions centres aren't good enough but direct provision is the norm throughout Europe. Tent cities are the norm everywhere else. The alternative for those who want to give them more seems to be taxpayer funded houses. This would obviously be a massive pull factor that, if implemented would overwhelm infrastructure

The asylum seekers receive free meals, €40 a week spending money, are allowed to work, free healthcare and education. That's all the benefits of an advanced welfare state plus free food and accommodation. There seems to be a lot of naivity in this country about conditions in the rest of the world. Direct provision in Ireland represents a huge increase in living standards than people have most of the world.

What is the point you’re trying to make? You would prefer we have these people live in shanty towns and cardboard cities?


I’m certain that those in receipt of these allowances are very grateful.

The allowance increased by almost 100% just this year, before it was 21 quid for years and only after more than a decade of lobbying have they been granted the right to work.

Are you in favor of a less ‘generous’ scale of allowances and maintenance as you see it?

Doctors room ghost

Brad Whitaker wrote: »

I'm sick to death of all the closet racists saying there is "nothing for these people to do" in rural areas. wtf are they going to be doing in an urban area either with 30 quid a week?

That’s just people using a bit of practical thinking.
Put any person of any nationality below in Achill living in a run down kip of a hotel in the depths of winter.
No transport,no work,not able to communicate with the locals.
It’s a recipe for disaster.
I know several people from Achill and not one of them are working there,simply because there is nothing to do there.

humberklog

Brad Whitaker wrote: »

I'm sick to death of all the closet racists saying there is "nothing for these people to do" in rural areas. wtf are they going to be doing in an urban area either with 30 quid a week?

38.80 would go further in Dublin than Achill as that money would be swallowed up pretty quick in getting transport to amenities.

Mantis Toboggan

As soon as they get to Achill and realise they're in the wilderness in the middle of nowhere they'll soon want to return to whatever country they came from.

humberklog

humberklog wrote: »

38.80 would go further in Dublin than Achill as that money would be swallowed up pretty quick in transport alone.

Cycling costs nothing, what do you think they would spend money on?
38.80 doesn't go far in Dublin, particularly on public transport!

Mules

PowerToWait wrote: »

What is the point you’re trying to make? You would prefer we have these people live in shanty towns and cardboard cities?


I’m certain that those in receipt of these allowances are very grateful.

The allowance increased by almost 100% just this year, before it was 21 quid for years and only after more than a decade of lobbying have they been granted the right to work.

Are you in favor of a less ‘generous’ scale of allowances and maintenance as you see it?

No, I think it's good that we have safe, secure places for people, I wouldn't want it any other way. However we have created a pull factor with our current system. It is too generous. They are receiving benefits that only citizens are granted in other high income welfare states. I get that people want to give the best we can but our health system and housing stock are overwhelmed. If we scrap direct provision our public services will no longer function. I don't think people who want to scrap it have genuinely thought this through.

PowerToWait

Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »

What about those who aren’t decent? Who should they be housed beside?

There’s the rub. We don’t know.

I assume people are decent until proved otherwise. Unlike the majority posting here who assume the worst based on ethnicity / religion / colour. Sectarian racists in other words.

humberklog

bubblypop wrote: »

Cycling costs nothing, what do you think they would spend money on?
38.80 doesn't go far in Dublin, particularly on public transport!

Cycling doesn't cost nothing.

I don't care what people spend their money on. But you need anenities to use your money.

You can cycle in Dublin too. Although cycling still doesn't cost nothing althoough with the use of Dublin Bikes the cost would be a lot less.

Mules

I think very few Irish people have lived and worked in less fortunate countries. We don't know how good we have it, a welfare state is the norm to us, it's a dream for everyone else. All I'd say is to be careful taking on board what politicians and those in the media say, because they have no idea how good we have it either. Some tend to be ideological rather than practical and some have agendas that aren't necessarily what's best for the country.

PowerToWait

Doctors room ghost wrote: »

That’s just people using a bit of practical thinking.
Put any person of any nationality below in Achill living in a run down kip of a hotel in the depths of winter.
No transport,no work,not able to communicate with the locals.
It’s a recipe for disaster.
I know several people from Achill and not one of them are working there,simply because there is nothing to do there.

Ah yeah, they’re only thinking of the asylum seekers, looking out for them sure.

Maybe these people will prove adaptable, resilient and ambitious? There’s a good chance seeing the obstacles they’ve already overcome.

They didn’t factor in the entrenched sectarian attitudes of a few slobbering gobshįtesin Mayo though.

biko

PowerToWait wrote: »

slobbering gobshįtesin Mayo though.

The racism shines through

Thelonious Monk

Regardless of whether they should be here or not in the first place - I understand rural areas may be weary given their small population, but if 50 asylum seekers moved into a hotel in my area I honestly couldn't care less and it would make no difference to my life, so for all these people calling people virtue signallers who wouldn't want them in their own area, personally I couldn't care less, they can't be any worse than some of my current neighbours.

Ulysses Gaze

Brad Whitaker wrote: »

I'm sick to death of all the closet racists saying there is "nothing for these people to do" in rural areas. wtf are they going to be doing in an urban area either with 30 quid a week?

More chance they'll get employment eventually. If they are from places like Syria, access to Mosques and religious centres where they can find a community and access to supports.

Mules

PowerToWait wrote: »

Ah yeah, they’re only thinking of the asylum seekers, looking out for them sure.

Maybe these people will prove adaptable, resilient and ambitious? There’s a good chance seeing the obstacles they’ve already overcome.

They didn’t factor in the entrenched sectarian attitudes of a few slobbering gobshįtesin Mayo though.

I doubt they are thinking of the asylum seekers and you may well be right that the asylum seekers may be resilient and ambitious but we can't help the whole world. Direct provision is imo the best system we can realistically provide but I do wonder about putting people in small towns and islands of all places! I'd imagine there is some reasoning behind it but I doubt the government will share it with us.

weldoninhio

98FM now have a propaganda piece on about a pakistani family who have been given to the 25th of this month to leave after their asylum claim was turned down.

Ulysses Gaze

Ulysses Gaze wrote: »

I agree with him and I agree that DP is a failed system that does not work.

Time to move these refugees into the leafy suburbs of Dublin (D4, Castleknock, Howth, Malahide, Sutton, Clontarf, Terenure, Tempelogue, Monkstown, Blackrock, Stillorgan, Shankill), Cork (Montenotte., South Douglas, Blackrock) and Galway (Salthill).

We have a chance to show the Swedes and Germans how to do proper integration rather than throw AS and Refugees into **** accommodation in run down estates or in the middle of nowhere.

#RefugeesforLeafySuburbs

There is a direct provision centre in Salthill:
https://www.google.com/amp/s/connachttribune.ie/more-than-70-kids-under-12-in-direct-provision-in-salthill-099/amp/
It is no bother to anyone with all the facilities of a city within walking distance or close by for a city bus fare. An ideal location.

bubblypop wrote: »

Cycling costs nothing, what do you think they would spend money on?
38.80 doesn't go far in Dublin, particularly on public transport!

Have you any idea how remote this place is?
Cycling to the SuperValu in the sound would be about an hour up over a mountain.

There is one bus a day to Westport which leaves at 8.30 arrives at 10.30 in the morning and returns back at about 6pm arriving after 8.
An adult return fare is... €25

Ulysses Gaze

Deleted User wrote: »

There is a direct provision centre in Salthill:
https://www.google.com/amp/s/connachttribune.ie/more-than-70-kids-under-12-in-direct-provision-in-salthill-099/amp/
It is no bother to anyone with all the facilities of a city within walking distance or close by for a city bus fare. An ideal location.

I'm not talking about putting them into DP centres in these areas.

I'm talking about moving them into houses and apartments that are not isolated from the local community. DP creates an "us and them" mentality that does not help integration at all.

It does allow politicians and others give themselves a nice big clap on the back because they "feel good" about what is essentially half-hearted help.

The Swedes and Germans are guilty of that and Sweden has serious problems with integration.

We need to learn lessons from the Swedish "model" and not replicate it but better it.

US2

Ulysses Gaze wrote: »

I'm not talking about putting them into DP centres in these areas.

I'm talking about moving them into houses and apartments that are not isolated from the local community. DP creates an "us and them" mentality that does not help integration at all.

It does allow politicians and others give themselves a nice big clap on the back because they "feel good" about what is essentially half-hearted help.

The Swedes and Germans are guilty of that and Sweden has serious problems with integration.

We need to learn lessons from the Swedish "model" and not replicate it but better it.

So you'd give them houses before they are even granted asylum? You know how many of them are bogus and turned down ? You'll have the whole of Albania here in houses while working Irish people sleep in cars.

Ulysses Gaze

US2 wrote: »

So you'd give them houses before they are even granted asylum? You know how many of them are bogus and turned down ? You'll have the whole of Albania here in houses while working Irish people sleep in cars.

You'd need to reform the entire AS process and limit the appeals to one and that's it. With a fast track mechanism. You'd also need to actually implement the concept of the First Safe State that seems to be ignored routinely here.

An Albanian should not be claiming asylum here. They should be claiming it in a Central European country or in Italy at the least. In fact, if an Albanian arrives here claiming Asylum, they should be put on the next plane back to their port of departure.

BarryD2

MadYaker wrote: »

Is this a serious post? Have you been to achill? Everything is miles apart and there’s no public transportation how will these people get around? I just asked a friend who surfs on keel and he says there’s one doctor there part time! How is that supposed to be ok for 30 something asylum seekers? These people are going to need to all kinds of medical support and probably counselling etc you can just dump in a hotel in the middle of nowhere for the winter it’s totally mad.

Yes I have been to Achill and I know it reasonably well. Do you? Or do you rely on what your surfer pals tell you?

As far as I know there is (or certainly was until recently) a health centre nearby in Dooagh and there's certainly one in the Sound. As for transport, it's been reported already that a minibus service will be provided to bring people out of Keel to the Sound or perhaps more occasionally into Westport or Castlebar. That's how the kids there get about to school and so on. The accommodation is in Keel I believe, just a short down the road to a playground at Tra Mór beach which itself is likely one the beaches that your pal surfs at. There are small shops in Keel & Dooagh. It's not as remote or as lacking in facilities as people make out.

Mules

Ulysses Gaze wrote: »

I'm not talking about putting them into DP centres in these areas.

I'm talking about moving them into houses and apartments that are not isolated from the local community. DP creates an "us and them" mentality that does not help integration at all.

It does allow politicians and others give themselves a nice big clap on the back because they "feel good" about what is essentially half-hearted help.

The Swedes and Germans are guilty of that and Sweden has serious problems with integration.

We need to learn lessons from the Swedish "model" and not replicate it but better it.

Would you seriously give everyone who claims asylum a taxpayer funded house/ apartment? How would we afford it? If I was offered a free house on top of free healthcare and other benefits in a first world country, I'd move tomorrow. I obviously have no claim for asylum but that system would attract people with just as spurious a claim as I'd have.

Mules

Ulysses Gaze wrote: »

You'd need to reform the entire AS process and limit the appeals to one and that's it. With a fast track mechanism. You'd also need to actually implement the concept of the First Safe State that seems to be ignored routinely here.

An Albanian should not be claiming asylum here. They should be claiming it in a Central European country or in Italy at the least. In fact, if an Albanian arrives here claiming Asylum, they should be put on the next plane back to their port of departure.

I hadn't read this post before I replied to your other one. All I'd say is that I couldn't see the reforms you suggest being implemented. I think a guaranteed house would overwhelm the asylum system no matter what controls were put in place

Beechwoodspark

carolmon wrote: »

Hmmm ... so you save 3 letters and every other word spelt in full?
But no agenda calling people "asy seekers"?

Sorry now but I routinely hear them called FAR worse by random ppl I interact with on a daily basis. Some ppl are so sheltered and naive in this country ffs

BarryD2

Ulysses Gaze wrote: »

I'm not talking about putting them into DP centres in these areas.

I'm talking about moving them into houses and apartments that are not isolated from the local community. DP creates an "us and them" mentality that does not help integration at all.

But they are only supposed to be in direct provision until their applications are processed. If given, then that would be the time to settle people in dispersed housing if we have the means. DP is supposed to be a temporary measure. That it isn't is a function of how we process the applications and sometime it appears of those who are refused but who choose to game the system by engaging in lengthy appeals.