The Dominance of Dublin GAA *Mod warning post#1*

dunnerc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122531367#Comment_122531367

I'm inclined to agree with you ledwithhedwith , tis very worrying alright.

blanch152

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122531277#Comment_122531277

That is just deluded stuff. Shows an ignorance of the evolution of Gaelic Football under Dublin.

blanch152

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122531367#Comment_122531367

I wonder, as his criticism of Dublin's style of play is delusional. Here is Joe Brolly on the subject:

"Brolly wrote, “Kerry are the new Donegal. Half-forwards are defenders now. Midfielders are defenders. The obsession with defending has left them without a forward plan, just a hope that Geaney and O’Donoghue can work their magic."

"RTE pundit Joe Brolly has likened the current crop of Kerry players as the ‘new Donegal’ and has lamented them for their style of play and their obsession with defensive football.

Brolly was full of praise for Dublin, and also singled out Armagh club giants Crossmaglen for refusing to be dragged into implementing defensive systems.

He said both teams stick rigidly to their principles of playing attacking football, positive football, football the former Derry players describes as ‘real football’."

https://www.donegaldaily.com/2016/08/15/fear-is-killing-gaelic-football-kerry-are-the-new-donegal-joe-brolly/

It is almost like @gaffer91 never watched a football match over the last decade.

Charlo30

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122531826#Comment_122531826

The Op is clearly and conveniently forgetting the 2014 All Ireland Final between his own County, Kerry & Donegal. Which was a dour and defensive affair and not one for the ages, at a time when Dublin were playing brilliant attacking football

dunnerc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122531901#Comment_122531901

Yep mentioned that match in a previous post , he's obsessed with Dublin !

Past30Now

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122531901#Comment_122531901

Just to note that as a result of the Donegal semi final defeat, Dublin under JG became more measured than they had been in 2013 and 2014.

I won't get embroiled in a detailed exchange but want to offer a couple of contrary views from a Dublin perspective. I've stopped attending Leinster Champo games in the last eighteen months, along with a large cohort of other supporters, as they are not competitive. Wondering whether Dublin will win by 15 or 20 points does not float my boat.

Games like the Mayo game in Roscommon or the Galway game are much more enjoyable, despite the draw and defeat. They are competitive and there is an uncertainty about the result present, which is a must for me. Division 1 league games are much more competitive, and consequently of interest.

Splitting Dublin, similar to splitting Kerry, is not, and never will be a palatable solution for supporters of either county. Ensuring Leitrim or Louth are as likely to win Connaught/Leinster/All Ireland is all but impossible without a complete reform of the structure of the intercounty game. I don't believe that will ever happen, so to me the obvious solution is to reduce the provincial championships to pre season tournaments and merge the league and championship, giving opportunities and competition to all counties, using the Senior (Top 16), Intermediate (Next 8) and Junior (Bottom 8) structure that we have been using on the club side since time began. Plenty of competitive games, structured so that the vast majority are meaningful.

gaffer91

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122531826#Comment_122531826

That's not a rebuttal. The post details how Dublin legally, and in a astute way introduced and perfected dour, negative tactics to improve their chances of success. Not sure I'd call it "evolution" but that's more a matter have opinion. Others have imitated them since and they're entitled to do so, but I think we can all agree it's not great to watch.

gaffer91

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122531894#Comment_122531894

Joe Brolly is just one person, with one person's opinion. He also isn't a particularly good person to quote from as he ended up being abruptly and permanently banned from RTE for making outrageous comments and his opinions lacking credibility.

There were defensive teams before (like Donegal in 2011) or teams who handpassed a lot (like Tyrone in the 2000s). But there can be no doubt that the full complement of endless handpassing, only taking high percentage shots, no high fielding, 15 men behind the ball i.e. the standard way of playing nowadays, was introduced and perfected by Dublin the late 2010s. It's on the GAA to fix this though and improve the game as a spectacle, not Dublin.

Btw if you base your views solely off elite opinions, a far better and more highly respected source would be Colm O'Rourke. He has some excellent proposals on how to improve inter-county football.

gaffer91

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122531901#Comment_122531901

As before, there have been boring games before, defensive teams etc. But the full complement I referred to in my last post was used routinely and repeatedly was unquestionably introduced by Dublin. It's tactically sound but just not good to watch for supporters.

gaffer91

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122532665#Comment_122532665

A lot of good and interesting points there, although I disagree on certain ones too. I definitely agree with the difference in Dublin's style of play in 2013 and 2014 vs later in the decade, there was a big and noticeable shift. I'm sorry that you no longer enjoy the Leinster Championship, I assume this was something you previously did enjoy in your life and now it's gone. It shows how the harm to the Leinster Championship is bad for everyone in the province, even the county that is dominating.

blanch152

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122534850#Comment_122534850

How about Pat Spillane, similar to all leading pundits, he has praised Dublin for their style of play, while also criticising recent Kerry teams. You really are delusional. O'Rourke might be your hero, because he echoes your stupid idea of splitting Dublin, but when it comes to the football they play, this is what he says:

"Most GAA supporters generally like to see a new team taking down a county which is dominating, but I don't get that sense to any great degree with Dublin. There is admiration for their quality, athleticism and perhaps most of all their approach to the game itself and their respect for what the GAA stands for. They may be heroes but they are humble heroes who understand their place in society."

"in an age where football has become almost unwatchable and uncompetitive, Dublin in full cry represent a thing of beauty."

https://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/colm-orourke-no-team-is-unbeatable-but-dublin-have-cards-stacked-in-their-favour/37273803.html

dunnerc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122534832#Comment_122534832

And once again you lie !! Kerry introduced dour negative tactics to improve there chances of beating Donegal in the 2014 All Ireland final ,they then perfected this dour and negative tactic , to try and beat the best team to ever play the game the 6 in a row Dublin All Ireland winners , thankfully they failed . And yes that rubbish from Kerry is not great to watch .

dunnerc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122534850#Comment_122534850

Nope there can be no doubt it was Kerry who introduced the endless handpassing in 2011 All Ireland FINAL V Dublin in the last 10 minutes , thinking they had the game won , thankfully that didn't work out for them , they then perfected it in 2014 All Ireland final and unfortunately won a horrible final , one of the worst ever , this led to other Counties copying this dour negative football started by Kerry .

dunnerc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122534857#Comment_122534857

And once again more lies , the full complement i referred to in my previous post was unquestionably introduced by Kerry, its a very poor tactic as is proven by Kerry's poor success in winning All Irelands compared to Dublin since 2011 .

dunnerc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122534870#Comment_122534870

Unfortunately the harm that Kerry has done to the Munster Championship is bad for everyone in the province , including Kerry , coming out of Munster undercooked is not helping them atall atall .

Needmoretea

I do not know if I can add anything to this discussion and it looks like a lot of points were made and re-made already, to the point of Enoch Burke levels of trolling. Of course, a poster is entitled to state their view, and people are entitled to disagree with him/her. Here is my tuppence worth:

I would not like to see any county split; Dublin, Kerry or anyone else. Inter county GAA is a brand, and people like to get behind their county. There would be no joy for me to see a rival country split in two. Our footballers have given us more than we could have ever hoped for and I am incredibly proud of them. They do not owe us anything. We just happened to have a freakishly good team over the past 14 years. The players, men and ladies, worked extremely hard and sacraficed a lot, like every inter county player up and down the country, and deserve to enjoy every win. Especially after all the barren years, this really was a golden era.

I dont understand a posters comments about Dublin's dour style of football. From what I have seen and what is reported, its always been free flowing, attacking and exiting to watch. We have had Brian Fenton and Ciaran Kilkennys brilliant fielding and Jack McCaffreys surging runs, among other things. Warriors like Stephen Cluxton, James McCarthy and Michael Fitzsimons, never losing their appetite.

Regarding population, Dublin has always had a large population and of course people will always gravitate to a capital. For home games, many games are going to be in Croke Park anyway, as HQ, but for Dublin league matches I would like to see home games back in Parnell Park. Capacity is the big issue here, as Parnell Park is in such a built up area that increasing capacity will definitely be a problem.

For funding, I am not sure how this works and am open to correction, but do county boards and clubs always need to apply for grants for funding, or is funding generated from a pool for example Leinster Council funds? I agree funding should be well distributed for counties who need it the most (if not already), and each county board to use it as well as they can. The funding can be used specifically for inter country teams centre of excellence and promotion of the games for development squads within counties ( Again, I am not sure if this is done already)

I would like to see Leinster rise again, and have our great battles with Meath and Kildare like we did in the 90's, and for other Leinster counties to come through. It might need a change of championship structure, with no split or amalgamation, but funding could help and counties to look at their own structures.

Finally I would really, really like to live long enough to see Dublin win a Hurling All Ireland :)

tritium

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122534857#Comment_122534857

if ever there was a poor trolling attempt to rewrite history this is it. Whatever hope you had of credibility, making this guff, already refuted by many many of the biggest and most respected figures in the game, the core of your argument, is surely a poor approach

so go on deluding yourself while anyone with access to YouTube can treat themselves to the exciting, free flowing attacking football that Dublin pioneered in the face of teams playing dour defensive systems. Treat themselves to the full range of skills displayed by that team. Even post losing to Donegal, the change was very much in terms of applying the superior game intelligence and will to win of the players to manage games well, as demonstrated by the many times this team pulled tight, exciting games out of the fire to cement my their status as GOAT, an accolade acknowledged even by members of Kerry’s great team of the 70s/80s

Charlo30

In the 2017 semi final Dublin faced Tyrone. Tyrone that year employed a very defensive style, which had been widely criticized. The final score was Dublin 2-17 - Tyrone 0-11. In what was a very one sided game and one which Dublin should have won by more. It's odd that for a team that was apparantly dour and defensive they managed to rack up a big score against a team that was equally dour and defensive. You would have expected them to cancel each other out and play out a low scoring game.

Or could it be that maybe Dublin could play free flowing attacking football and a certain poster is gilding the lily a bit in a childish attempt to wind up Dublin supporters

dunnerc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122538288#Comment_122538288

That poster hates anything and everything to do with Dublin .

blanch152

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122538288#Comment_122538288

Any team that has beaten Dublin over the last decade (other than in winter league games with wind and rain) has needed a plan to score 20 points as the Dublin team nearly always managed to get to that total through attacking football.

gaffer91

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122534894#Comment_122534894

Colm O'Rourke isn't one of my heroes! He's just correct on probably the biggest issue facing the GAA at the moment. I don't need mainstream pundits to have my opinion before adopting it myself, but I appreciate a lot of people do have that point of view. So that's the main reason I cite them. I recommend reading O'Rourke's views on what Dublin should be split- very persuasive stuff, if you approach it with an open mind I feel you should be persuaded.

I disagree with him and others who saw Dublin played attractive football, at least on and after the mid 2010s. They did in the early 2010s for sure but let's be honest there is nothing attractive about 15 men behind the ball, endless handpassing, no high fielding, only shooting from close in. That's why so many supporters are critical of this style of play as other counties have copied Dublin.

gaffer91

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122537908#Comment_122537908

As in my previous post- people don't like the style of football- look at all the outcry over the last few years. And it's important to draw a distinction between Dublin's style in the early 2010s (which was attractive) and the late 2010s, which was very effective but absolutely awful to watch. You acknowledge in your post that there was a difference in style after the Donegal loss in 2014. There is nothing "free-flowing" about endless handpassing for instance. Dublin had some great players for sure but the style as a whole was unattractive. Hard to fully credit the close wins vs Mayo for instance coming as they did in Dublin's home stadium. If Dublin were in Mayo's home stadium they could easily have lost or drawn some of those games. Another reason why home advantage has been such a big and unfair advantaged contributing to Dublin's success.

gaffer91

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122538288#Comment_122538288

You can rack up big scores and still play dour football. As Dublin did and do. For instance the lack of high fielding, endless handpassing, only shooting from close in that Dublin introduced and perfected is not necessarily that defensive but was awful to watch as a spectacle. Tactically very clever but just not unappealing for neutral spectators. The 15 men behind the ball undoubtedly is defensive but that's only a part of what made Dublin so dour to watch.

gaffer91

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122538414#Comment_122538414

They might have planned to score 20 points or more but the truth is Dublin's 3 losses since 2021 have all come against teams scoring less than 20 points! And defensiveness is only one part of Dublin's tactics that made them so dour and negative.

dunnerc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122545516#Comment_122545516

No you're talking nonsense, It's your own county Kerry, who started and perfected the dour boring football that other Counties copied.The biggest issue facing the Gaa is sorting the mess that's Munster, and splitting Kerry .

dunnerc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122545545#Comment_122545545

Again you must be thinking of Kerry, everything you mention above is how they play lol…..

dunnerc

Go away with your anti Dublin nonsense .nothing new here thread should be closed .

jack67

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122547542#Comment_122547542

The ranting and raving of this lone Kerry man has gone on long enough , same rubbish over and over again

Agreed thread should be closed , i really can't believe it has been allowed to continue to be honest.

mobby

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122547757#Comment_122547757

I think he gets a kick out of it now at this stage and ye are just adding to his entertainment by replying to his rants.

Best just left alone.

RoyalCelt

I think it can be agreed the association shouldn't be aiding Dublin or Kerry in anyway although it's obvious Dublin have more natural advantages.