The Dominance of Dublin GAA *Mod warning post#1*

blanch152

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121691656#Comment_121691656

At least they have two grounds to use, one team could have home games in Killarney, the other in Tralee.

gaffer91

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121691626#Comment_121691626

I'd split Dublin only. I think at least 4 ways for Dublin, maybe more, based on geography.

dunnerc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121691574#Comment_121691574

Not sure you are aware but Kerry advantages include far higher funding and playing pool than Leitrim Longford Carlow etc , playing in a hurling province etc.... tis great we are having these friendly discussions .

dunnerc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121691669#Comment_121691669

The split must happen 😁

dunnerc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121691673#Comment_121691673

It is with a heavy heart i say this , but in the interest of fairness to all Counties , id split Kerry only , these friendly discussions are great , circles circles going around in circles 😂🤣

nerd69

Dont feed the trolls id say

dunnerc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121691755#Comment_121691755

Indeed 100% agreed .

NJSC1980

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121691755#Comment_121691755

Yep. This thread is a joke now. One person with a contrary opinion who just repeats it over and over and over and over who doesn’t seem to realise that people are just openly taking the piss out of him, especially since he made the mistake of disclosing which county he is from.

It was funny for a while but it’s just sad now. And personally I wouldn’t say a word against anyone standing up for the continued existence of their county.

But Christ, if ever a thread has run its course…

dunnerc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121691821#Comment_121691821

It is a joke for sure 👍️

munster87

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121691673#Comment_121691673

What do you reckon the population of Dublin will be in 10 years?

No point splitting in 4 now and realizing later that it should have been split into 6 or even 8. Might as well do it right the first time!

dunnerc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121692628#Comment_121692628

2.2 million split in 10 😂🤣

Yeah Right

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121691562#Comment_121691562

More blatant hypocrisy and barefaced contradiction.

You're aware that Munster is far more competitive than Leinster these days?

This is a transparent attempt at trivialising the genuine points brought up by other posters, which has again, exploded in your face spectacularly. Munster has NEVER been competitive. Ever.

From 1936 to 1992, a span of 56 years, Cork and Kerry won every single Munster SFC between them, with Kerry taking just over 40 of them, or about 72%. (Edit: Kerry went on to win 20 All-Irelands in that timespan, so half of their provincial wins led to AI wins, in case you're doubting the correlation). Since 1993, when Tipp won it, there has only been one non Cork/Kerry team to win the Munster SFC in 30 years. That’s two years out of 88 where Cork or Kerry didn’t win. How the fcuk is that more competitive than Leinster? Gaffer would have you believe that those other Munster teams with a 2.2% chance of making it out of the provincials will be better off and have a higher chance of making it past Cork AND Kerry if there are fewer teams.

Between them, Cork and Kerry have won 90% of all Munster titles…..ever. Even the rivalry between the big two is an absolute joke. Kerry have more All-Ireland titles than Cork have Munster titles, FFS. Jokeshop of a province in football.

You are also indirectly admitting that a province which was once dominated by a single team can become competitive again given time. Which is in direct contradiction to your position that Dublin will continue to dominate forever and need to be broken up because of this.

Well done.

And that the provincials are not the only path to the All Ireland series unlike 2000 and before. So your information is a little out of date unfortunately

Correct. Good point. But, again, you are indirectly admitting that it WAS the only path to the finals in the years I’ve quoted above. It has been put to you that Kerry have had easier routes to all of those questionable AI titles over the years and you’re trying to claim that it’s all in the past and shouldn’t factor into any dissection of the province. Tell me, Mr. "I don’t dodge any questions", How many games did Kerry play in 2022 when they won the AI? Why is his information out of date when this exact scenario took place the in the championship before last?

But as Dublin's population is a larger population gap than the next largest county (itself and outlier) than the next largest county is than Leitrim, only Dublin should be split.

You have been shown that this isn’t true, many times. The gap from Cork to Leitrim is many times greater than the gap from Dublin to Cork. You brought this argument up then shifted the goalposts so that you tried to pretend you were talking about absolute numbers, not percentages (which is how any reasonable person would measure this gap). But, yet again, you’re ignoring the elements of this point that contradict your overall stance. How many more people live in New York than live in Dublin? If population is such a huge advantage, how come tjhey aren’t beating all around them? How come India and China don’t win every single sporting event ever, with their gigantic populations? Could it be, maybe, that you’re talking out of your hole, as per?

Neutrals like myself

Bahhahahahahahahahahahhahaahahahhaaahah…..Neutral! Pull the other one

Yeah Right

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121691241#Comment_121691241

There was a team in 2022 who only had to win four matches to win the whole thing after getting a bye to the provincial final. Anyone remember who that was?

blanch152

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121692628#Comment_121692628

You have a point in relation to splitting into 8 when it comes to Kerry.

Kerry have 8 divisional teams - St. Brendan's, Shannon Rangers, Feale Rangers, West Kerry, South Kerry, East Kerry, Mid Kerry and St. Kierans. These would all be capable of beating Leitrim or New York or Waterford.

If there are sufficient grounds - and places like Listowel, Dingle, Kenmare etc. - could reasonably host matches as well as Tralee and Killarney, then it would be a no-brainer. There is the additional advantage that you are not creating regions out of nothing. The divisional sides all exist and have loyal supporters already. Just imagine how the Munster Championship would suddenly improve with the 8 Kerry divisions plus the five other teams. It would be more or less the size of Leinster.

If that doesn't work, just put the first four into Kerry North based out of Tralee and the second four into Kerry South based out of Killarney.

munster87

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121706902#Comment_121706902

Kilmacud probably have as many members as some of those divisional side’s clubs put together!

Kerry into 8 might work, should bring Leitrim etc more into play.

I’d look at Dublin into 20 maybe to balance 😂

gaffer91

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121706143#Comment_121706143

I can answer that. The answer is nobody. Kerry won in 2022 and played five games. Plus there was a backdoor option unlike in 2000 and before. So we see again how your knowledge of facts is lacking.

gaffer91

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121706902#Comment_121706902

This would actually be decent input if Kerry were unfairly advantaged like Dublin are. But they're not- Dublin alone have unique advantages in population, funding, playing at home etc., which is the reason they should be split. It's not about the fact that Dublin are winning, as I said before, I'd be delighted for them if it was done fairly but this isn't the case.

But if we take your logic and apply it to Dublin, I agree that there are merits to an 8-way split for sure. But it would warrant further discussion before the GAA makes this reform to benefit all counties. At least a 4-way split is now necessary but above that we can debate things.

gaffer91

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121706133#Comment_121706133

No hypocrisy or contradictions at all, just a desire for the GAA to make reforms that really enhance the game. I've comprehensively dealt with most of these points before, but as ever, happy to do so again.

You missed the important caveat of "these days" meaning at present/currently/now etc. I agree Leinster was more competitive historically but due to Dublin's success off their platform of unfair advantages, this is no longer the case. I'm not sure when the tipping point was but as of now, Munster is far, far more competitive than Leinster. Cork won in 2012, there was a drawn game in 2015, Tipperary won in 2020. Leinster could only dream of this level of competitiveness these days. Even worse, the lack of competitiveness stems from a situation of unfair advantages that only benefit Dublin rather than one team trumping others on a level-playing field, as in Munster! I think the provincials should be scrapped regardless but there can be no doubt that Munster is now more competitive than Leinster. I'm not even saying it is that competitive, just relative to Leinster which is a complete shambles nowadays. (Just an aside, Tipperary didn't win in 1993, Clare won in 1992; another one of your factual inaccuracies for the list!).

As another side, while Leinster was historically more competitive than Munster before Dublin's overfunding and other advantages really kicked in from the mid-2000s, Leinster was never a fair competition- Dublin were always unfairly advantaged from their unique population advantage.

Competitions can become competitive again after a period of dominance for a particular team (e.g. hurling after 2012 for Kilkenny), but only if there is a level playing field which will enable teams to compete effectively. This is not the case in Leinster or the All-Ireland due to Dublin's unique combination of unfair advantages so there is no reason to expect it in either competition there; this is what I've repeatedly said, splitting Dublin helps all counties competing in either competition because of the enhances fairness (as well as prestige and integrity).

Regarding All-Ireland structure before 2000, the information is out of date because that setup no longer applies- there are backdoor routes (meaning teams get second chances), Super-8s and Group Stages since over the years. The provincial only way of competing hasn't applied in years, other than during the exceptional period of Covid. To answer your question, Kerry won with five games in 2022, not four as you falsely stated, and there was a backdoor option- so the situation absolutely did not apply there.

I've dealt with the NYC question before so please review my previous posts. The population gap between Dublin and Cork is larger than between Cork and Leitrim hence why I say that Dublin has a unique population advantage. The absolute gap is more important than the relative gap as I've said before, this is easy to understand. I have also said that is the unique combination, nature, scale and duration of advantages that Dublin enjoy that mean they should be split, in terms of population, funding, home advantage etc; not just any one of these things individually.

So taking all the above on board, it's easy to see why neutrals like myself are in favour of splitting Dublin alone to help the GAA and every county.

dunnerc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121718808#Comment_121718808

And we are off again 🙄 Kerry are unfairly advantaged , Kerry alone have unigue advantage playing in a hurling province, funding and population advantage over Leitrim Longford Carlow etc which is the reason they should be split, a 2 way split might be enough but it would warrant further discussion before the GAA makes this reform to benefit all Counties as a 3 way split might be needed .

dunnerc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121718835#Comment_121718835

And once again pure nonsense of a post , Kerry have and still do dominate Munster for over a Century , 84 Munster titles total domination

Once again you are not neutral , you are a Kerry supporter looking to gain yet more advantages for Kerry to continue to dominate , its easy to see why posters on here are in favour of splitting Kerry alone to help the GAA and every County.

gaffer91

Just to pre-empt something that sometimes comes up. No matter what happens in the NFL final in Dublin's home stadium this weekend, whether the 1.5 million population home team of Dublin win, or if the 250,000 population away team of Derry win, I continue to believe that Dublin should be split in order to rectify the unfairness that currently persists in the GAA. It's not about the results in a single game, it's more about addressing the terrible injustice that arises from Dublin alone being unfairly advantaged over every other county. So win or lose this weekend, Dublin should still be split.

dunnerc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121947121#Comment_121947121

And here we go again with his nonsense ,Just to pre-empt something that comes up , no matter what happens in Munster , I continue to believe that Kerry should be split in order to rectify the unfairness that currently persists in the GAA. It's not about the results in a single game , it's more about addressing the terrible injustice that arises from Kerry being unfairly advantaged with them playing in a hurling province dominating Munster with a ridiculous 84 Munster titles and then having won most of them titles in 2nd/3rd gear , having a huge advantage in the All Ireland series ,with less injuries and only having to peak for 2/3 games etc which helped them win 38 All Irelands . so win or lose Munster in a few weeks , Kerry should be split .

threeball

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121948140#Comment_121948140

You can't really claim Munster is weaker than leinster anymore though by your own reasoning Dublin should be split in 3 on population advantage alone.

dunnerc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121948267#Comment_121948267

I'm not claiming anything , i'm just humoring a bitter anti Dublin poster who surprise surprise is from Kerry 😂🤣

gaffer91

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121948140#Comment_121948140

The provincial-All Ireland only route hasn't existed since 2000 (with the exception of the covid years). So your information is a little out of date. But even when that model existed, it still wasn't a patch on the advantages Dublin had, and that was even before the overfunding of the 2000s started!

gaffer91

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121948267#Comment_121948267

Exactly, people complaining about population gaps between say Cork and Leitrim would have to accept first that Dublin should be split before anyone else, where the absolute gap is the largest. And while provincials should be scrapped, by far the least competitive one nowadays is Leinster. Munster is poor too but still far, far better and more competitive than Leinster these days. I don't mind a level of dominance in a competition as long as it comes fairly but sadly this is not the case with Dublin.

blanch152

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121948960#Comment_121948960

It was the greatest advantage ever. It is the reason why Kerry have dominated so much. I would guess that around 60-70 of their Munster titles were won without being given a game.

gaffer91

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121949168#Comment_121949168

Nah, population, funding, home pitch advantage are far bigger advantages than that. Munster had fewer teams but was at least a level playing field in terms of one county not being unfairly advantaged over all others. This was never the case in Leinster and is definitely not the case in the All-Ireland now due to Dublin's advantages. As I said before, winning fairly, dominating for periods even, isn't an issue once it comes fairly. Sadly, this is not the case with Dublin which is why I and others want them to be split to help the GAA.

Take the NFL final this weekend, which is what sparked the thread up again. If Derry win, they can take real pride in a great achievement. Their supporters can be very pleased. But if Dublin win, what can they think? Really, if they're honest with themselves, all they can do is recognise their success came in large part because of their population, funding and playing at home. It's hard to take any pride at all in such a victory, as it's not a fair competition. And then the follow-on question should be how we can reduce the unfairness. I think you know the measure I'd recommend: split them to disperse the advantages.

dunnerc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121948960#Comment_121948960

Have to disagree , the ridiculous advantages Kerry have had over the last 100+ years has won them a ridiculous 84 handy Munster titles and 38 ridiculously advantaged handy All Irelands .

dunnerc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121948968#Comment_121948968

Only one genuinely complaining on here is you lol......