Clare GAA Discussion part 2 , No Purple Jumpers Allowed !!

letowski

French Toast wrote: »

Showing the full game on TG4 now.

Cleary/Conlan spine at the back looks poor even on paper.

I think so too. I’d just move on from Conlon there, I think Conlon would be better at 11 where he’d have more of a presence. But I really don’t know who to play at 6. We might have Davy Mc and Colm Galvin back next week, I’d try Davy Mc at 6 and figure out who to play at midfield after with Colm Galvin. Malone, Conlon and Reidy as the half forwards.

I think the cornerbacks need to be replaced, they are just too loose. Donnellan has potential but it’s maybe a year too soon. Aidan McCarthy was also very poor, Lohan should increase competition for left half back as well.

Feenie

letowski wrote: »

I think so too. I’d just move on from Conlon there, I think Conlon would be better at 11 where he’d have more of a presence. But I really don’t know who to play at 6. We might have Davy Mc and Colm Galvin back next week, I’d try Davy Mc at 6 and figure out who to play at midfield after with Colm Galvin. Malone, Conlon and Reidy as the half forwards.

I think the cornerbacks need to be replaced, they are just too loose. Donnellan has potential but it’s maybe a year too soon. Aidan McCarthy was also very poor, Lohan should increase competition for left half back as well.

I don't know what we were at not playing Rory Hayes. He's an exceptional hurler. At 6 perhaps Cian Galvin but throwing him in there straight away might be a kneejerk reaction. Eitherway not a bad idea to build him up. Cleary and Mcinerney just aren't natural centre backs. Give Diarmuid Ryan ago aswell. I heard he did well today.
Conlon played his best game at the full forward line but half forward he could also be very handy. Eitherway centre back didn't work out.
The only way is up. Try to be positive I suppose.

Clareman

Conlon's role is as a target for our puckouts and on the edge of the square as a target man at all other times, having him winning possession with those forwards is our best hope.

Sunny Disposition

I wouldn’t worry about today too much in the circumstances, would be much more concerning in a normal year when a lot more work is done per NHL. But it is important to bounce back next week.

Feenie

Sunny Disposition wrote: »

I wouldn’t worry about today too much in the circumstances, would be much more concerning in a normal year when a lot more work is done per NHL. But it is important to bounce back next week.

positive thinking lads, I like it. Sunshine follows thunder.

letowski

I'd like to see Cian Nolan and Aaron Fitzgearld get an opportunity during the league to see what they have to offer the backs. It was good to see Diarmuid Ryan play well today, while Rory Hayes emerged last year as a good player. Just need to find more. On second viewing, I taught Paddy Donnellan settled more in the second half, so hopefully can push on this season. Cian Galvin at 19 is very young, and midfield isn't his position. I think he should be competing for left half back. There are options but trying to get a rearguard settled, compact and in form is proving a huge challenge for Lohan so far in his tenure. I'm not sure about McCarthy as a half back being honest, he doesn't impose himself as a wing back and isn't great in the air. I think midfield would be his best role at this level as he is a good runner and can score.

Treble double

Aaron Fitzgerald, had forgotten he had switched over to the hurlers, I can only comment on him as a footballer and in that code, he was an excellent, very physical stopper of a centre back, he was a very strong tackler and had a great refuse to lose attitude. His actual ball playing skills were limited and it was always a wise option for him to move the ball on swiftly if he won it.
I don't know what he is like as a hurler, but with his attitude and physical attributes I presume he could be very effective.
From watching inter county hurling recently it appears there is a big emphasis now on having physically imposing players, possession is key so a lot of hand passing and tackling to cause turnovers and winning ruck ball is key. I'd be interested to see how he would fare at inter county level.
He is coming back from a very severe career threatening injury, how that has impacted on him physically will also have a bearing.

bonzothedog

On paper that team was always going to struggle and so it showed. No harm in trying a few things in the league though, we shot the lights out last February only to struggle later in the year.

Clareman

On paper that's close to our best team, not everyone is in their best positions but it's close to our championship XV.

Our main problem is in the middle third, I don't know why but my theory is that we are dropping our half backs back in front of our full back line to minimize goal threat, then we are pushing our half forwards up on top of our full forwards to make space in front of them. Against a team playing a sweeper (like Wexford last year) this approach works well but when you have the opposition half backs pushing forward it means that our half forwards are non-existent and possession keeps getting lost, when you're playing a team like Limerick they'll just keep popping over points from distance, other teams will just wait until the last 10 minutes to pull away as we'll be out on our feet from chasing shadows.

In my opinion our strength is our forwards, our weakness is out backs, instead of setting up to stop the opposition I think we should be setting out to score as much as possible.

Clareman

A major concern for me at this stage as well is the lack of a centre back, we played 3 different players there in 4 championship matches last year, hopefully Galvin can get a run there and bring some stability.

letowski

Clareman wrote: »

A major concern for me at this stage as well is the lack of a centre back, we played 3 different players there in 4 championship matches last year, hopefully Galvin can get a run there and bring some stability.

Yes Lohan needs to get that position established asap. I think the problem is manifesting itself moreso from not having a full back, as in we do have an experienced centre back in Cleary on the panel alright, but nobody to play full back.

I think its destabilising the whole team to be honest. I get why is moving players to knew positions to plug holes, but I think he is over doing things now. Like Cleary at full back is a natural centre back, Conlon is a forward, Cian Galvin is a back, Guilfoyle is a full forward, Reidy is better on the wing.. its hard for those players to find form and play cohesively when they are all playing out of position.

I think if Lohan could somehow find a full back, bring Cleary to centre back, Conlon in the half forward line and get Colm Galvin and Davy Mc in midfield, we'd have a much more stronger presence between the 40s. But I don't know who to put at full back to be honest. I know Cian Nolan plays there for SO'B, maybe they should try him.

Sunny Disposition

Why were Colm Galvin and David McInerney out?

Clareman

letowski wrote: »

Yes Lohan needs to get that position established asap. I think the problem is manifesting itself moreso from not having a full back, as in we do have an experienced centre back in Cleary on the panel alright, but nobody to play full back.

I think its destabilising the whole team to be honest. I get why is moving players to knew positions to plug holes, but I think he is over doing things now. Like Cleary at full back is a natural centre back, Conlon is a forward, Cian Galvin is a back, Guilfoyle is a full forward, Reidy is better on the wing.. its hard for those players to find form and play cohesively when they are all playing out of position.

I think if Lohan could somehow find a full back, bring Cleary to centre back, Conlon in the half forward line and get Colm Galvin and Davy Mc in midfield, we'd have a much more stronger presence between the 40s. But I don't know who to put at full back to be honest. I know Cian Nolan plays there for SO'B, maybe they should try him.

Last year I think there was a case of putting his own slant on the team and not just copying what was done before, so David Mc was moved out from full, Cleary moved back but that hasn't worked though as it has unbalanced the whole team. I think David Mc is wasted at full back BUT we don't have a better option so I'd play him there with Cleary at 6.

Saying that, a lot of the changes happened as a result of the amount of goals we conceded in challenge matches between league and championship last year, 12 goals in 2 games I think, Lohan doesn't have confidence in his players not to let that happen again so he seems to be protecting against that, as a former full back you can understand that from his point of view.

Clareman

Sunny Disposition wrote: »

Why were Colm Galvin and David McInerney out?

Slight injuries I think, nothing major just strains

letowski

Clareman wrote: »

Last year I think there was a case of putting his own slant on the team and not just copying what was done before, so David Mc was moved out from full, Cleary moved back but that hasn't worked though as it has unbalanced the whole team. I think David Mc is wasted at full back BUT we don't have a better option so I'd play him there with Cleary at 6.

Saying that, a lot of the changes happened as a result of the amount of goals we conceded in challenge matches between league and championship last year, 12 goals in 2 games I think, Lohan doesn't have confidence in his players not to let that happen again so he seems to be protecting against that, as a former full back you can understand that from his point of view.

I agree with alot of that, although I don't think the robbing Peter to pay Paul situation with Davy at full back was 'paying Paul', in his final two seasons in '18 and '19 at the position. He had very bad outings against the likes of Gillane and Callinan in '19 and Patrick Horgan won the Munster final for Cork in '18. He was regressing significantly I think moving him back there again wouldn't bring value to the team or to his career.

Clareman

letowski wrote: »

I agree with alot of that, although I don't think the robbing Peter to pay Paul situation with Davy at full back was 'paying Paul', in his final two seasons in '18 and '19 at the position. He had very bad outings against the likes of Gillane and Callinan in '19 and Patrick Horgan won the Munster final for Cork in '18. He was regressing significantly I think moving him back there again wouldn't bring value to the team or to his career.

Good point, he was badly exposed on a couple of occasions alright. We've 4 league games to get it sorted so hopefully we'll figure something out so hopefully we will.

dohboy

Must say, I thought Antrim played very well yesterday, took all their chances and made none of the mistakes that usually blight the performances of the so-called lesser counties. Clare weren't great tbf, but it's early days.

Clareman

Antrim were very good yesterday and well worth their win, if anything they should have won by more.

PeggyShippen

letowski wrote: »

Yes Lohan needs to get that position established asap. I think the problem is manifesting itself moreso from not having a full back, as in we do have an experienced centre back in Cleary on the panel alright, but nobody to play full back.

I think its destabilising the whole team to be honest. I get why is moving players to knew positions to plug holes, but I think he is over doing things now. Like Cleary at full back is a natural centre back, Conlon is a forward, Cian Galvin is a back, Guilfoyle is a full forward, Reidy is better on the wing.. its hard for those players to find form and play cohesively when they are all playing out of position.

I think if Lohan could somehow find a full back, bring Cleary to centre back, Conlon in the half forward line and get Colm Galvin and Davy Mc in midfield, we'd have a much more stronger presence between the 40s. But I don't know who to put at full back to be honest. I know Cian Nolan plays there for SO'B, maybe they should try him.

Cleary can't play centre back effectively. He ll give away tonnes of ball. He doesn't have the vision or skills. He's effective at fullback...with 2 good corners. Id play Galvin centre back even though hes small. Coleman is gone there for Cork and he's very effective. Galvin would have to be protected by two wing backs for puck outs but he's the best centre back ball player in Clare.

letowski

PeggyShippen wrote: »

Cleary can't play centre back effectively. He ll give away tonnes of ball. He doesn't have the vision or skills. He's effective at fullback...with 2 good corners. Id play Galvin centre back even though hes small. Coleman is gone there for Cork and he's very effective. Galvin would have to be protected by two wing backs for puck outs but he's the best centre back ball player in Clare.

Personally I’m not a big fan of Colm Galvin to centre back, but I get the idea.

I’m not comfortable him standing beside the likes of Harnedy, Bonner, Chin or if Limerick wanted to put Kyle Hayes back to centre forward. The problem isn’t just the size or aerial ability that Galvin lacks, it’s also his ability in the tackle. The way teams look to get runners through midfield, it vital you have a centre back who can hit in the tackle and hold the centre. I think Galvin at 6 would be a similar situation to what we had with Seadna last year, a lightweight allowing team to run through us at will. So I don’t see him fixing the situation being honest.

Cleary no doubt didn’t play well in 2019 and the business end of 2018. But at least he give a presence there. I’m not too pushed about his stick work or distribution, we have players around him that he can pass to (Galvin, Ryan, Davy Mc). They are excellent stickmen. In 2018, the distribution into the forwards was not an issue imo, Conlon and SOD were in top class form that year.

Figerty

letowski wrote: »

Personally I’m not a big fan of Colm Galvin to centre back, but I get the idea.

I’m not comfortable him standing beside the likes of Harnedy, Bonner, Chin or if Limerick wanted to put Kyle Hayes back to centre forward. The problem isn’t just the size or aerial ability that Galvin lacks, it’s also his ability in the tackle. The way teams look to get runners through midfield, it vital you have a centre back who can hit in the tackle and hold the centre. I think Galvin at 6 would be a similar situation to what we had with Seadna last year, a lightweight allowing team to run through us at will. So I don’t see him fixing the situation being honest.

Cleary no doubt didn’t play well in 2019 and the business end of 2018. But at least he give a presence there. I’m not too pushed about his stick work or distribution, we have players around him that he can pass to (Galvin, Ryan, Davy Mc). They are excellent stickmen. In 2018, the distribution into the forwards was not an issue imo, Conlon and SOD were in top class form that year.

Slow down there Letowski! I think Cleary was suspeded for the first match in 2019, the was then not played in the second match and there were holes all over the place..When he was put in there, the holes were filled at centre back and we were way tighter. He is probably better suited to mid-field than full back.

The problem for Clare is we get skinned down the sides of the field. We don't have enough tightness down the sides and we get opened up. The real problem we have is not being able to win first primary ball in the air.. you can't build without that.. Waterford destroyed Kilkenny last year that way.

The problem we have is balance and quality.

letowski

Figerty wrote: »

Slow down there Letowski! I think Cleary was suspeded for the first match in 2019, the was then not played in the second match and there were holes all over the place..When he was put in there, the holes were filled at centre back and we were way tighter. He is probably better suited to mid-field than full back.

The problem for Clare is we get skinned down the sides of the field. We don't have enough tightness down the sides and we get opened up. The real problem we have is not being able to win first primary ball in the air.. you can't build without that.. Waterford destroyed Kilkenny last year that way.

The problem we have is balance and quality.

Yeah that's true he did miss the first half of Munster that year. Probably wouldn't be fair to be too hard on him versus Limerick considering everyone was terrible that day. I don't know would he have the legs for midfield.

We definitely have a problem with winning aerial possession, absolutely no doubt about that. Peter Duggan is such a huge loss for this county, it saddens me (though I don't blame him at all for going to Australia)

Clareman

We have a massive problem winning possession full stop, we can't secure our own puck out and we're terrible on the opposition puck out. Our setup however is to protect against goals, we pull everyone back towards our goal which in turn leaves the center third of the pitch to the opposition, now add in the fact that we don't have any ball winners in the forwards and have a complete reliance on TK means we're not going anywhere without major changes. We did well with Conlon and Duggan in 2018, even when TK wasn't playing well, last year we lost Conlon and Duggan, this year we have Duggan back, we need to build on that

keeponhurling

Even if Conlon was a good center back, surely we have a bigger dearth of talent in the forward line then the half back line ?
At least Conlon can actually score, he’s usually pretty accurate.

Clareman

If Conlon was a good center back he would have played there for at least his club, maybe college, maybe underage, not for the first time in his 30s in the national league. Maybe if we were playing a zonal type game he could have a role but we aren't, well I don't think we are, watching the matches I don't know what kind of tactics we have, I think it's to try to open up the middle of the pitch but I'm not sure.

Gael85

Conor Jordan from Austin Stacks called up to Clare football panel. His father is a Kilkee man.

https://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/gaa/arid-40286114.html

caddy16

Clareman wrote: »

If Conlon was a good center back he would have played there for at least his club, maybe college, maybe underage, not for the first time in his 30s in the national league. Maybe if we were playing a zonal type game he could have a role but we aren't, well I don't think we are, watching the matches I don't know what kind of tactics we have, I think it's to try to open up the middle of the pitch but I'm not sure.

He played centre back for Clonlara under Stack.

Look it was effectively a challenge game so I don't see the harm in trying it albeit I don't think he'll stay there.
The reality is we don't have 6 good enough backs to go man to man with any decent team so Lohan has to find a solution, there's no easy answer.

Treble double

Gael85 wrote: »

Conor Jordan from Austin Stacks called up to Clare football panel. His father is a Kilkee man.

https://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/gaa/arid-40286114.html

Played minor/21 for Kerry, captained stacks to County title in 2014, has had some very bad injuries since, seemed to be in and out of stacks team last year.
What age is he?
I suppose its no harm having a look at him, would be wary that injuries have blighted him.

Gael85

Treble double wrote: »

Played minor/21 for Kerry, captained stacks to County title in 2014, has had some very bad injuries since, seemed to be in and out of stacks team last year.
What age is he?
I suppose its no harm having a look at him, would be wary that injuries have blighted him.

Think is he around 26.

Very worrying developments this evening re Clare county board monthly May meeting. Tweets below do not suggest a sign of a more transparent and open CCB that we all hoped in December last year with a new Chair and vice Chair in situ.

https://twitter.com/ClareFM/status/1392176151867625474

https://twitter.com/ClareFM/status/1392176153071325193

And....

https://twitter.com/ClareFM/status/1392183566688264196