Why do you never see female bin collectors?

up for anything

areu4real? wrote: »

Sorry if this feels like a personal attack, I promise you it's not. It's an attack on the "us and them" concept. Everyone should have equal opportunity to apply for any position, and if it turns out that as I suspect that, generally, men happen to be more willing and able to follow a smelly truck lifting heavy bins then that's how it will be. Just like any other job, certain characteristics will make a certain type of person more willing and more able to do it. But please try to see it from a "me and you" perspective rather than "us and them". That's the only way real equality can happen, equal opportunity for everyone and then we can have the best people doing the best job possible.

To be honest I don't care if it is a personal attack. Just don't patronise me with your "me and you" perspective shite. I don't need to be lectured by you. I wrote an off the cuff post which obviously missed being entertaining by a nautical mile and was just full of crap with my English writing skills letting me down with the sentence " Because we're not completely stupid and we do more than enough of the gicky jobs without adding another one to our repertoire." My apologies to those of you who were upset by my seeming unPCness that I didn't hang the sentence together properly so the stupid obviously related to adding another one to our repertoire rather than the actual refuse collectors who do this job.

There's a lot of threatened and frightened men out though, especially in AH.

tuxy

weldoninhio wrote: »

That’s why they get paid less.

But they don't.

up for anything

TeaBagMania wrote: »

or maybe its because women are sitting on a gold mine

The 70s want their quip back. :rolleyes:

Do you really not think that digging gold out of that mine you believe we are sitting on is not the MOST DISGUSTING JOB in the world? To me it would be. I won't speak for all women this time. A series of revolting slobbering men (and maybe even some women so as not to upset the newly PC) day after day poking around in and on my body... that's a gold mine I'm willing not to open.

BENDYBINN

EmmetSpiceland wrote: »

Statistically girls do better than boys at school. This would have a massive bearing on where they go once school finishes.

I’m guessing this would have something to do with why we don’t see very many hanging off the back of a bin truck.

64.7%of statistics are made up

Ave Sodalis

SoundsRight wrote: »

Buchanan was one of the design staff of the Sydney bridge. It was Freeman who was in charge of the actual design.

Re. Brooklyn Bridge, Robeling designed it. His son took over construction after his death, and was aided by his wife. She didn't design the bridge.

Someone has already beat you to this and it's completely missing the point of my post.

The moon landing involved a team of 400,000. For someone to suggest it wouldn't have happened but for a woman is quite disingenuous.

Actually, it wouldn't have. It very nearly failed at the last minute.

SoundsRight

Ave Sodalis wrote: »

Someone has already beat you to this and it's completely missing the point of my post.





Actually, it wouldn't have. It very nearly failed at the last minute.

You said those bridges were designed by women. That's wrong.

And if you want to credit the moon landing to some girl who helped with the inflight software, you're deluded. Wernher von Braun and his mates were building rockets when she was playing with dolls.

areu4real?

up for anything wrote: »

To be honest I don't care if it is a personal attack. Just don't patronise me with your "me and you" perspective shite. I don't need to be lectured by you. I wrote an off the cuff post which obviously missed being entertaining by a nautical mile and was just full of crap with my English writing skills letting me down with the sentence " Because we're not completely stupid and we do more than enough of the gicky jobs without adding another one to our repertoire." My apologies to those of you who were upset by my seeming unPCness that I didn't hang the sentence together properly so the stupid obviously related to adding another one to our repertoire rather than the actual refuse collectors who do this job.

There's a lot of threatened and frightened men out though, especially in AH.

You think the concept of treating each other as individuals is shíte? Can't agree with you there, by creating groups we create divisions naturally, no avoiding it with a tribe mentality. I'm also not sure how my post was misconstrued as "threatened and frightened" since it was simply a call for genuine equality, not this faux gender war that's going on. If you're not talking about me, I agree that some people in this thread have serious issues with their perception of the opposite sex.

The problem is not whether people's genitals point inwards or outwards, the problem is the grouping of people based on an average sample. My GF would know a lot more about cars than most blokes I know, and I have witnessed blokes who really don't have a clue about mechanical issues trying to bluff her, explaining something to her when really they have no idea. Same guys are then genuinely stunned that she knew anything about how the car worked, which to me is the perfect example of problems with the split between genders: guy is afraid a woman knows more about a car, girl is presumed to know nothing. That's just a personal example, and there are thousands more like that out there I'm sure.

Also, my post was not a "lecture". I'm not 'mansplaining' (Christ I hate that term). This is a discussion forum, and I'm discussing a topic which you waded into quite heavily with a tone that suggested you spoke for all women. And your sentence wasn't a misunderstood "off the cuff" remark as the very next sentence after the "we're not stupid" was that nobody wants to collect bins except your kids before they grew up. So please don't try bs your way out of your attitude, the post quoted above shows again the herd mentality and some kind of 'poor women' tone that I don't appreciate. "adding another one to our repertoire" doesn't mean anything, as I said before plenty of men and women have shít jobs, shít life situations, shít pay, etc, etc. It's not a competition to be the worst off, it should be a competition to be the best person for any given job, regardless of gender. The ironic thing about all this is the most vocal advocates of certain things tend to be the ones who drive the wedge in when it comes to 'equality'. So my point about "me and you" still stands. Judge the individual, not the genitals/complexion/headscarf/whether their socks match/etc and we'll be much better off.

BuboBubo

Force Carrier wrote: »

My old man's a Recycling Technician in the Environmental Sector.

Does he wear a recycling technician in the environmental sector's hat?

PARlance

My wife is 5ft nothing and 7 stone but that wouldn't hold her back.

Shouting in letter boxes might....YOU FORGOT THE BINS AGAIN, YOU USELESS....

Pkiernan

up for anything wrote: »

The 70s want their quip back. :rolleyes:

Do you really not think that digging gold out of that mine you believe we are sitting on is not the MOST DISGUSTING JOB in the world? To me it would be. I won't speak for all women this time. A series of revolting slobbering men (and maybe even some women so as not to upset the newly PC) day after day poking around in and on my body... that's a gold mine I'm willing not to open.

Apt user name so....

Graces7

never seen female road repair workers either..

Ave Sodalis

SoundsRight wrote:

You said those bridges were designed by women. That's wrong.

It doesn't matter that one of them was "only" part of the design team when you take the post I was replying to into context.

SoundsRight wrote:

And if you want to credit the moon landing to some girl who helped with the inflight software, you're deluded. Wernher von Braun and his mates were building rockets when she was playing with dolls.

I said the moon landing wouldn't have happened if it wasn't for her. This cannot be disputed. As I said, the whole thing nearly didn't happen at the last minute and the only reason it did was because of "some girl" (are you really calling one of the most intelligent people in the world "some girl"?). It was her software that saved the entire mission.

babi-hrse

Omackeral wrote: »

Don't go on a little known crossover called the Brooklyn Bridge, just in case. A chick oversaw much of its construction and engineering.

I think the lead architect was cut in half by a snapping suspension cable when he went to view it.

Guy:Incognito

up for anything wrote: »

. I wouldn't willingly follow that smell around five days a week, 52 weeks of the year.

I'm sure they get holidays.

up for anything

areu4real? wrote: »

You think the concept of treating each other as individuals is shíte? Can't agree with you there, by creating groups we create divisions naturally, no avoiding it with a tribe mentality. I'm also not sure how my post was misconstrued as "threatened and frightened" since it was simply a call for genuine equality, not this faux gender war that's going on. If you're not talking about me, I agree that some people in this thread have serious issues with their perception of the opposite sex.

The problem is not whether people's genitals point inwards or outwards, the problem is the grouping of people based on an average sample. My GF would know a lot more about cars than most blokes I know, and I have witnessed blokes who really don't have a clue about mechanical issues trying to bluff her, explaining something to her when really they have no idea. Same guys are then genuinely stunned that she knew anything about how the car worked, which to me is the perfect example of problems with the split between genders: guy is afraid a woman knows more about a car, girl is presumed to know nothing. That's just a personal example, and there are thousands more like that out there I'm sure.

Also, my post was not a "lecture". I'm not 'mansplaining' (Christ I hate that term). This is a discussion forum, and I'm discussing a topic which you waded into quite heavily with a tone that suggested you spoke for all women. And your sentence wasn't a misunderstood "off the cuff" remark as the very next sentence after the "we're not stupid" was that nobody wants to collect bins except your kids before they grew up. So please don't try bs your way out of your attitude, the post quoted above shows again the herd mentality and some kind of 'poor women' tone that I don't appreciate. "adding another one to our repertoire" doesn't mean anything, as I said before plenty of men and women have shít jobs, shít life situations, shít pay, etc, etc. It's not a competition to be the worst off, it should be a competition to be the best person for any given job, regardless of gender. The ironic thing about all this is the most vocal advocates of certain things tend to be the ones who drive the wedge in when it comes to 'equality'. So my point about "me and you" still stands. Judge the individual, not the genitals/complexion/headscarf/whether their socks match/etc and we'll be much better off.

Roll up those keyboard debating sleeves. A few years back I might have bitten at the herd mentality and 'poor women' tone bits but now they slide right off me. These days I have internet ennui and can't be arsed enough.

the_syco

up for anything wrote: »

Q: Why do you never see female bin collectors?

A: Because we're not completely stupid and we do more than enough of the gicky jobs without adding another one to our repertoire.

So you agree we should force some women into the role to make a quote. Seems it's all teh rage these days; having a quota of women working in your job.

areu4real?

up for anything wrote: »

Roll up those keyboard debating sleeves. A few years back I might have bitten at the herd mentality and 'poor women' tone bits but now they slide right off me. These days I have internet ennui and can't be arsed enough.

Is it because I'm talking sense you don't want to debate? I really don't feel there's a debate to be had about my points. We both want equality I assume, I'm not of any herd mentality I can assure you. And I also don't feel there was a tone of 'poor women' within my posts. If you don't want to discuss it that's fine, but don't try misrepresent what I'm saying please.

Both sexes have negative and positive aspects in different areas. Historically women have been more oppressed, that's for sure but I feel there's a lot of double standards allowed in the opposite direction now as some form of moral compensation. That will only lead to more problems. Gender quotas are a dangerous game to play, even more so if they're selective about which occupations have them.

My opinion on the matter is equality and getting even are vastly different things. And again this isn't aimed at you specifically, I just took issue with your original post which was a little bit insulting to people who are in the pointy end of waste management.

mariaalice

Woman are caught in a bid a lot of the time especially if they have children unless you are going for some very well paid senior position woman are better off in traditional female employment such as nursing or teaching or in modern terms lecturing, doing a PhD, part-time GP, owning a small business, in other words, work and careers that work around having children.

On the other hand in senior management, it makes no difference Glanbia CEO Siobhán Talbot is an example she is on over a million a year someone in that position can afford housekeeping and top class nannies no dropping a child to a creche for 50 hours a week, they will be looked after generous parental leave no booking annual leave for an appointment or the school nativity play they make their own working day.

The issue is how do you get from the starter job to senior management while keeping a home, a marriage and children going.

Fifty grades of shay.

mariaalice wrote: »

Woman are caught in a bid a lot of the time especially if they have children unless you are going for some very well paid senior position woman are better off in traditional female employment such as nursing or teaching or in modern terms lecturing, doing a PhD, part-time GP, owning a small business, in other words, work and careers that work around having children.

On the other hand in senior management, it makes no difference Glanbia CEO Siobhán Talbot is an example she is on over a million a year someone in that position can afford housekeeping top class nannies no dropping a child to a creche for 50 hours a week, they will be looked after generous parental leave no booking annual leave for an appointment or the school nativity play they make their own working day.

The issue is how do you get from the starter job to senior management while keeping a home, a marriage and children going.

I'm a male and I'd echo that.
My wife used to work in a labarotary for an agricultural firm, a well paid job with a bit of a commute, about 1 hour.
When we had our first she experienced great difficulty in getting to work for 8 am when she went back and add in the cost of childcare as well as travel it left her with a hard week for a lot less in her pocket afterwards.
She was in line for promotion too when no 2 came along, but when she went back after her maternity leave then, she actually found herself further back down the line from that as others had passed her on the list because of her absence.
Then came no 3, and if she had gone back after that, with commute and childcare she would only have been clearing less than £80 at the time and her chances of advancement gone back again.
Anyway, she ended up staying at home.
It's probably happened to loads of women.

SoundsRight

Ave Sodalis wrote: »

It doesn't matter that one of them was "only" part of the design team when you take the post I was replying to into context.


I said the moon landing wouldn't have happened if it wasn't for her. This cannot be disputed. As I said, the whole thing nearly didn't happen at the last minute and the only reason it did was because of "some girl" (are you really calling one of the most intelligent people in the world "some girl"?). It was her software that saved the entire mission.

Of course it can be disputed. Men designed and built the rockets. Men piloted the spacecraft. They put their lives on the line, having seen collegues killed along the way. To try and argue that it only happened because of a girl is revisionism on a grand scale.

Grayson

On the "it's too disgusting for women" angle. Does anyone really believe that?

My mum was a nurse. She always told me not to go for it because it was just cleaning sh1tty bums. She worked in a nursing home at one stage. people pissing, sh1tting and vomitting everywhere. And then dying. My sis is a paramedic. You don't want to know the stuff she puts up with. Being a bin man kinda pales in comparison to those jobs. Plus the hours are better.

And that's before the fact that both are parents. Both have told me that they've never seen anything as disgusting as their own children

Ave Sodalis

SoundsRight wrote: »

Of course it can be disputed. Men designed and built the rockets. Men piloted the spacecraft. They put their lives on the line, having seen collegues killed along the way. To try and argue that it only happened because of a girl is revisionism on a grand scale.

Did you just completely ignore what I said on that post?

NIMAN

Because they only want equality when it suits them and on their terms?

meeeeh

I have a man at home who will get sick if he has to deal with kid's puke or toilet accidents. It's so much hassle watching him gag that I usually tell him to stop helping me. However if someone has an awkward scratch, verruca or some sort of a wound that requires more than plaster I'm completely useless.

However this has nothing to do with quotas which are usually implemented for highly desirable and well paid positions of power. Bin collection is not one of them and as an argument for quotas completely irrelevant and only peddled by morons.

handlemaster

In other european countries its normal to see female workers in what would be considered in Ireland as Men only work. A lot of the manual labour jobs are not as such manual anymore, machinery has taken over , but the mindset is still in ireland anyhow not moved on.

SoundsRight

Ave Sodalis wrote: »

Did you just completely ignore what I said on that post?

I think it's called 'taking credit for someone else's work'. It's like someone spending ages doing a jigsaw then some pup comes along and puts in the final piece and tries to take all the glory.

Omackeral

meeeeh wrote: »

However this has nothing to do with quotas which are usually implemented for highly desirable and well paid positions of power. Bin collection is not one of them and as an argument for quotas completely irrelevant and only peddled by morons.

Gender quotas in general are moronic.

Ave Sodalis

SoundsRight wrote:

I think it's called 'taking credit for someone else's work'. It's like someone spending ages doing a jigsaw then some pup comes along and puts in the final piece and tries to take all the glory.

To use your own analogy, it would be more like a group of people doing a jigsaw and someone notices and puts a stop to someone else who was going to smash the jigsaw all up.

I think it's incredibly unfair the level of dismissal you are giving Margaret Hamilton, and incredibly patronising to refer to her as "some girl" and "some pup" considering her level of intelligence and what she has achieved.

meeeeh

Omackeral wrote: »

Gender quotas in general are moronic.

You are welcome to your opinion. But it is completely understandable average men would feel threatened by them.

monkeybutter

Omackeral wrote: »

Gender quotas in general are moronic.

If you have a situation when people are actually being kept out of jobs they want on a basis such as gender, then forcing change can be a good idea


When there is an unbalance due to non participation, then they are moronic


Plenty of Jobs women don't want to do, plenty men don't want


No need for people to try an make a stupid point over it by saying women don't want to go "down mine"



No one wants these jobs, men do the bins because they don't want to do child minding and the like