Munster Team Talk Thread - Snymans are(n't) Forever

Canyon86

Eod100 wrote: »

I'm the same. Can't see it being much less than 10 or 15 and could be far worse

The bookies have racing at 1/4 and Munster 16/5...

yerrahbah

https://www.the42.ie/jj-hanrahan-munster-racing-out-half-4956516-Jan2020/?utm_source=shortlink

JJ and Conway in line to be fit for Sunday

Tomtom364

yerrahbah wrote: »

https://www.the42.ie/jj-hanrahan-munster-racing-out-half-4956516-Jan2020/?utm_source=shortlink

JJ and Conway in line to be fit for Sunday

Honestly, if this requires rushing JJ back I'd rather they just didn't. Trust Healy or scannell to do a job. Rushing JJ back just for him to go off early or further injure himself for later in the season is absolutely no good.

sydthebeat

maybe stander smuggled curwin bosch back with him in his luggage??

Eod100

Canyon86 wrote: »

The bookies have racing at 1/4 and Munster 16/5...

See Munster are 11/4 now so seems to have gone down for some reason. Dunno would word on JJ being back cause it to move that much. Maybe some chanced at higher price too I guess. Handicap seems to be Racing -9 which seems about right.

awec

Eod100 wrote: »

See Munster are 11/4 now so seems to have gone down for some reason. Dunno would word on JJ being back cause it to move that much. Maybe some chanced at higher price too I guess. Handicap seems to be Racing -9 which seems about right.

Bookies will also move the odds slightly to try encourage people to back a certain side of the bet if they need to balance the books a bit.

randomrb

yerrahbah wrote: »

I guess if we are moving Scannell to 10 then the question becomes who moves to 12.

Goggin or Arnold?

Or Farrell to 12 with one of the above going to 13.

If we are to try and play the more expansive style that we showed in glimpses this season, then we need Scannell at 12, which means Healy at 10.

It was interesting listening to ROG on off the ball, he was not keen on Scannell at 10 at all. He said you would be much better having Healy with Scannell outside him as a 2nd distributor. Thats if JJ isn't back obviously but tbh if there is any risk of injury its not worth it

Eod100

https://twitter.com/sineadkissane/status/1214900179347869697?s=19

Sabre0001

randomrb wrote: »

It was interesting listening to ROG on off the ball, he was not keen on Scannell at 10 at all. He said you would be much better having Healy with Scannell outside him as a 2nd distributor. Thats if JJ isn't back obviously but tbh if there is any risk of injury its not worth it

At least Healy has been playing 10. Not an enviable position, but we'll see Murray control a lot of the game anyway and he'll learn so it'll help build for the future. As you say, injury risk has to be considered too.

Ironic listing Scannell as a second distributor; he's been crashing ball up a lot of late. And when Farrell is outside him it really seems like they should be swapping places for that move!

Cookiemunster

Three changes to the Euro squad.

Craig Casey, Gavin Coombes and Diarmuid Barron in for Alby Mathewson, Tadhg Beirne and Jed Holloway

Develd

Does it suggest that Tyler has a better chance of playing this season than Beirne? I had given up hope of seeing Tyler play again.

Canyon86

Its a shame Ben Healy wasnt getting minutes here and there earlier in the season seems like a massive stretch starting him against Racing.

I guess he has to start somewhere,

aloooof

Canyon86 wrote: »

Its a shame Ben Healy wasnt getting minutes here and there earlier in the season seems like a massive stretch starting him against Racing.

I guess he has to start somewhere,

He started and got 60+ mins versus Edinburgh. Not an enormous amount of time, but better than nothing. That could stand to him more than getting 15-20 mins as a sub over 4 games.

Interested Observer

Just saw the news on Carbery, so between the ankle and this he's effectively missing the entire season. What a disaster for him.

Cookiemunster

Canyon86 wrote: »

Its a shame Ben Healy wasnt getting minutes here and there earlier in the season seems like a massive stretch starting him against Racing.

I guess he has to start somewhere,

True, but if someone told you at the start of the season that we'd be going into this game with all three senior 10s injured, you'd probably have laughed at them. Even with Munsters injury history.

Cookiemunster

Interested Observer wrote: »

Just saw the news on Carbery, so between the ankle and this he's effectively missing the entire season. What a disaster for him.

He'll miss the 6N, but might be back for the Pro14 run in and possible play offs.

Interested Observer

Cookiemunster wrote: »

True, but if someone told you at the start of the season that we'd be going into this game with all three senior 10s injured, you'd probably have laughed at them. Even with Munsters injury history.

Someone said this on another thread too, it only needs 2 injuries for him to make the bench and Tyler really can't be relied on at all so it's not a stretch at all that he'd make a matchday squad at some point.

lawrencesummers

Ben Healy needs to be developed and given more gametime.
Carbery is going to be available very little for Munster, between injury and Ireland he won’t be available for long periods of any season.
I can’t see Tyler being kept on next season, they need to make a call on him and it’s possible that this level of rugby is just to much for him physically.
JJ does what it says on the tin, he’s not going to make that jump to international level but will be a sturdy league player.
Munster have been unlucky with Johnny holland, he was a big part of the plan and Bill Johnson has made what looks like a shrewd move.

Time to promote Healy, the hand has been forced.

Caranica

Cookiemunster wrote: »

He'll miss the 6N, but might be back for the Pro14 run in and possible play offs.

Pro14 Final isn't until the middle of June so there's plenty of rugby to potentially play.

thomond2006

If Bleyendaal doesn't retire then Munster should come to a deal and let him go. He's under contract for another year but this can't go on. Healy will hopefully take his opportunities over the next few months to the point where (a fit) Bleyendaal would be surplus to requirements. There's also Jake Flannery to consider, though his future may lie at fullback.

Interested Observer

thomond2006 wrote: »

If Bleyendaal doesn't retire then Munster should come to a deal and let him go. He's under contract for another year but this can't go on. Healy will hopefully take his opportunities over the next few months to the point where (a fit) Bleyendaal would be surplus to requirements. There's also Jake Flannery to consider, though his future may lie at fullback.

If his contract is renewed (as a player at least) then someone is off their rocker. There's been talk here and there about him taking a coaching role. This is his 5th season at Munster, his 2nd season is the only one where he was injury-free and accounts for just under half of all his Munster caps. All the other seasons have been ruined by injury and it's hard to see him playing again this season.


I haven't been following the permutations but I heard earlier Munster winning will knock out Saracens. That would be rather excellent if true.
Edit - actually looking at the tables I don't see how it is true actually. Looks to me a Munster 4-0 or 4-1 win would give Saracens a chance to win the group.

Jump_In_Jack

thomond2006 wrote: »

If Bleyendaal doesn't retire then Munster should come to a deal and let him go. He's under contract for another year but this can't go on. Healy will hopefully take his opportunities over the next few months to the point where (a fit) Bleyendaal would be surplus to requirements. There's also Jake Flannery to consider, though his future may lie at fullback.

Just checked and his contract was extended to June 2021, so perhaps they will allow him to see out that contract if there is any chance of his neck healing.
If the doctors recommend he stop playing rugby, then the contract will have to be terminated as soon as that becomes apparent.
Pity for the guy if that becomes the reality.
I hope he is able to come back playing, but if not we have Carbery, JJ, and Healy which should be plenty of cover for the foreseeable future.

Buer

Interested Observer wrote: »

I haven't been following the permutations but I heard earlier Munster winning will knock out Saracens. That would be rather excellent if true.

It will actually give Saracens a great shot at topping the pool. If Munster win (without a BP) and Saracens win (with BP as expected) they automatically go ahead of Munster.

They then have Racing coming to town on 17/18 points. Saracens will be on 15 points knowing that a BP win would guarantee them top spot or any win whilst denying Racing a BP will secure them second spot and, given how the other pools are this season, make them almost certain to qualify on 19 points.

Interested Observer

Buer wrote: »

It will actually give Saracens a great shot at topping the pool. If Munster win (without a BP) and Saracens win (with BP as expected) they automatically go ahead of Munster.

They then have Racing coming to town on 17/18 points. Saracens will be on 15 points knowing that a BP win would guarantee them top spot.

Yes I edited my post above, it isn't the case at all.

Caranica

Jump_In_Jack wrote: »

I hope he is able to come back playing, but if not we have Carbery, JJ, and Healy which should be plenty of cover for the foreseeable future.

"Plenty of cover”? 2/3 are currently injured so surely we're more aware than ever that 3 players covering a position like 10 is not enough.

Jump_In_Jack

Caranica wrote: »

"Plenty of cover”? 2/3 are currently injured so surely we're more aware than ever that 3 players covering a position like 10 is not enough.

Flannery is also in the academy, a classy operator from the Irish U20's.
So, it looks like (besides Tyler), Carbery will be back in 3 months, JJ will be back in the next week or two, and Healy is showing promise, and Flannery is training with the seniors too.
Rory Scannell is capable of stepping in if needed also, so there is plenty of cover, and it's about time Munster got back to developing 10's again.
O'Gara was 20 when he debuted for Munster at 10, Healy and Flannery can play senior at that age as well, if they were good enough to represent Irish U20's they should be good enough to play the Pro14.

randomrb

Caranica wrote: »

"Plenty of cover”? 2/3 are currently injured so surely we're more aware than ever that 3 players covering a position like 10 is not enough.

3 10's excluding the academy is a realistic figure, there aren't many clubs who would have more. This has just been an unlucky spell and I think that Bleyendaal should be perhaps moved to the coaching side of things to free up another spot for someone a bit less injury prone. By all accounts he has a fantastic rugby brain so would be good to keep him around.

aloooof

Jump_In_Jack wrote: »

Flannery is also in the academy, a classy operator from the Irish U20's.
So, it looks like (besides Tyler), Carbery will be back in 3 months, JJ will be back in the next week or two, and Healy is showing promise, and Flannery is training with the seniors too.
Rory Scannell is capable of stepping in if needed also, so there is plenty of cover, and it's about time Munster got back to developing 10's again.
O'Gara was 20 when he debuted for Munster at 10, Healy and Flannery can play senior at that age as well, if they were good enough to represent Irish U20's they should be good enough to play the Pro14.

I think people occasionally forget about Johnny Holland when discussing the 10 situation at Munster. I suspect if he didn't have to retire, and kept progressing, Carbery may not have moved to Munster at all.

kuang1

lawrencesummers wrote: »

... and Bill Johnson has made what looks like a shrewd move.

I never heard the full story behind the logic of this move.. Thought he was a great prospect myself?

Jump_In_Jack

aloooof wrote: »

I think people occasionally forget about Johnny Holland when discussing the 10 situation at Munster. I suspect if he didn't have to retire, and kept progressing, Carbery may not have moved to Munster at all.

Jonny Holland was definitely a pity to have to retire, he looked like he would have been the first choice 10 for a few years.
I meant we need to look at developing the guys that are there now, and not look outside.
Keatley, Bleyendaal, and Carbery, were all brought in instead of developing JJ, and whatever academy talent was coming through.
Maybe the talent hasn't been there for the past 5 years, we need to get back to developing the guys coming thorugh now, they must have some talent to get onto the Irish U20's teams.