Munster Team Talk Thread - Snymans are(n't) Forever

Eod100

kilns wrote: »

Bad news for Irish rugby, good news for Munster in the short term but the long term. The identity of the province is really being watered down

Funny how that was never an issue with Elsom, Hines, Nacewa to name a few at Leinster. Its professional sport and way more global than amateur era, if these players help Munster to get further in competitions it surely benefits province as a whole with players getting experience in these games. It's not just one way either, obviously Munster have lost out on Ryan and Zebo going thr other way.

thomond2006

Kevin O'Byrne 2020
Rhys Marshall 2021
Niall Scannell 2021

Diarmuid Barron Year 2
Eoghan Clarke Year 2

James Cronin 2021
Dave Kilcoyne 2020
Liam O'Connor 2022
Jeremy Loughman 2020

James French Year 2
Josh Wycherley Year 2

Stephen Archer 2022
John Ryan 2022
Brian Scott 2020
Ciaran Parker 2020

Keynan Knox Year 3 & 2022

Tadhg Beirne 2022
Billy Holland 2020
Jean Kleyn 2022
Sean O'Connor 2020
Darren O'Shea 2020
RG Snyman 2022
Fineen Wycherley 2021

Thomas Ahern Year 2
Paddy Kelly Year 1
Eoin O'Connor Year 1

Arno Botha 2020
Gavin Coombes 2021
Chris Cloete 2022
Tommy O'Donnell 2021
Jack O'Donoghue 2021
Peter O'Mahony 2021
Jack O'Sullivan 2023
Conor Oliver 2020
CJ Stander 2021

Jack Daly Year 2
John Hodnett Year 1

Craig Casey 2021
Neil Cronin 2021
Nick McCarthy 2021
Conor Murray 2022

Jack Stafford Year 3

Tyler Bleyendaal 2021
Joey Carbery 2022
JJ Hanrahan 2021

Jake Flannery Year 1
Ben Healy Year 2

Sam Arnold 2020
Damian de Allende 2022
Chris Farrell 2022
Dan Goggin 2022
Alex McHenry 2021
Rory Scannell 2021

Sean French Year 2

Andrew Conway 2020
Liam Coombes 2021
Shane Daly 2021
Keith Earls 2021
Matt Gallagher 2022
Mike Haley 2021
Calvin Nash 2021
Darren Sweetnam 2021
Alex Wootton 2021

Alan Tynan Year 3
Jonathan Wren Year 2

2019/20 NIEs:
Arno Botha (capped), Chris Cloete (uncapped)

IN: RG Snyman (LK, Honda Heat), Damian de Allende (CT, Panasonic Wild Knights), Matt Gallagher (FB, Saracens)
OUT:

aloooof

kilns wrote: »

Bad news for Irish rugby, good news for Munster in the short term but the long term. The identity of the province is really being watered down

If Botha isn't re-signed (which I don't think he will be) these will be the only 2 NIQ's next season.

We've heard countless examples of players saying how playing alongside Langford, Howlett, Botha, Nacewa, Hines, Elsom, Thorn, Fardy, Pienaar etc. all made them better players, so I'm not convinced it is bad news for Irish rugby.

The fact that Munster can still attract guys of that calibre is overall, a good thing imo.

cadaliac

kilns wrote: »

Bad news for Irish rugby, good news for Munster in the short term but the long term. The identity of the province is really being watered down

:pac::pac::pac::pac:

Bazzo

Serious bit of business from Munster

They really are game changing appointments.

Farrell is the only centre at Munster that I rate as international standard and he still has some weaknesses to his game.

Munster need a replacement for Holland, Holland to my mind is a better player than he's ever been given credit - but he's at the end of his career.

In the back three there is a lot of ordinary players, Haley is excellent but inconsistent and I think his defensive game is poor. Conway likely to be with Ireland a good deal. Having someone with the potential to be a top class international is ideal.

These are brilliant signings and if kept fit will give Munster a solid run at silverware. Exciting times.

Shefwedfan

Is Gallagher been signed as a winger? or a 15?

Rockbeast2

Project Munster continues. AKA get POM and Murray a medal before they retire.

This is terrible indictment of munster rugby. They really don't give two fecks about developing players.

Depending on contract renewals munster may have the following on their books next year. * I'm probably forgetting a couple.

1. Loughman
2. Marshall
3. Knox
4. Snyman
5. Kleyn
6. Botha
7. Cloete
8. Stander
9. McCarthy
10. Carbery
11. Gallagher
12. De Allende
13. Farrell
14. Conway
15. Haley

16. Clarke
17.
18. Parker
19. Beirne
20. Oliver
21.
22. Bleyendaal
23. Arnold

Rumours a couple leinster lads being approached as well.

Best of luck to you lads but this is past the point of ridiculousness now.

Dubinusa

So where does Beirne fit in? Don't see him starting in the 2nd row. Unless, Kleyn is on the bench. I would assume that D.O.S and S.O.C are gone now. Good signings though. Munster becoming Transvaal north.
If Beirne is shifted to 6 what position does POM play?
Coombes won't get a look in now which is disappointing.
DDA will obviously bench Scannell, but Haley will most likely retain his spot. I reckon Arnold will leave. Maybe back to Ulster?
Munster will be a tough team next year.
Oliver also will be released. With his injury history, he will not get too many offers.
Interesting situation amongst the backs, Sweetnam and Wooten will struggle for game time. I hope Daly doesn't get lost in the mix, as he is developing nicely and I think will be a cracking player.

thomond2006

Rockbeast2 wrote: »

Project Munster continues. AKA get POM and Murray a medal before they retire.

This is terrible indictment of munster rugby. They really don't give two fecks about developing players.

Depending on contract renewals munster may have the following on their books next year. * I'm probably forgetting a couple.

1. Loughman
2. Marshall
3. Knox
4. Snyman
5. Kleyn
6. Botha
7. Cloete
8. Stander
9. McCarthy
10. Carbery
11. Gallagher
12. De Allende
13. Farrell
14. Conway
15. Haley

16. Clarke
17.
18. Parker
19. Beirne
20. Oliver
21.
22. Bleyendaal
23. Arnold

Rumours a couple leinster lads being approached as well.

Best of luck to you lads but this is past the point of ridiculousness now.

The players in bold probably won't be on the squad next year. Eoghan Clarke is in the Munster academy. If he's not Munster then Caelan Doris isn't Leinster.

A minority of people can't get past this small minded view that foreign players in the provinces are not good for local players. It's long shown to be bollocks. As for other Irish players, would you rather an Andrew Conway or Joey Carbery line out for Wasps or Montpellier?

easy peasy

Rockbeast2 wrote: »

Project Munster continues. AKA get POM and Murray a medal before they retire.

This is terrible indictment of munster rugby. They really don't give two fecks about developing players.

Depending on contract renewals munster may have the following on their books next year. * I'm probably forgetting a couple.

1. Loughman
2. Marshall
3. Knox
4. Snyman
5. Kleyn
6. Botha
7. Cloete
8. Stander
9. McCarthy
10. Carbery
11. Gallagher
12. De Allende
13. Farrell
14. Conway
15. Haley

16. Clarke
17.
18. Parker
19. Beirne
20. Oliver
21.
22. Bleyendaal
23. Arnold

Rumours a couple leinster lads being approached as well.

Best of luck to you lads but this is past the point of ridiculousness now.

Agree entirely with this.

The fact that only recently the IRFU bailed Munster out with a cash injection just further highlights the madness of it all.

Throw in Earls, O'Mahony and Murray likely being on their last central contracts with no one from Munster stepping up to fill that gap, meaning Munster will probably have to pay every player in their squad and this just gets more crazy.

Squidgy Black

Meh, personally don't see the point in whinging about what other provinces do in terms of players. Fair play to Munster, savage signings. I'm looking forward to seeing them play in the league, and more importantly see the two lads get smashed by Fardy and Tomane (if they're retained) alongside the Leinster academy in next years derby

bennyl10

Rockbeast2 wrote: »

Project Munster continues. AKA get POM and Murray a medal before they retire.

This is terrible indictment of munster rugby. They really don't give two fecks about developing players.

Depending on contract renewals munster may have the following on their books next year. * I'm probably forgetting a couple.

1. Loughman
2. Marshall
3. Knox
4. Snyman
5. Kleyn
6. Botha
7. Cloete
8. Stander
9. McCarthy
10. Carbery
11. Gallagher
12. De Allende
13. Farrell
14. Conway
15. Haley

16. Clarke
17.
18. Parker
19. Beirne
20. Oliver
21.
22. Bleyendaal
23. Arnold

Rumours a couple leinster lads being approached as well.

Best of luck to you lads but this is past the point of ridiculousness now.

its a professional rugby team. You need to build the best team possible.

What team in the world would say no to players like Snynam and De Allende being willing to join?

Leinster have a production line over and above the capabilities of any other team in the country, and they still have brought in international talent.

for the IRFU its give these talented, home-grown players a place to play in the country, be it Munster or Ulster, or its lose them from rugby.

How dare the other provinces not be able to compete with a basically professional school system.

The Munster academy is doing fine, look at the u-20s irish team. but unfortunately the pro game is not about 'oh look at the development' its about getting as close to the best team possible.

Rockbeast2

thomond2006 wrote: »

The players in bold probably won't be on the squad next year. Eoghan Clarke is in the Munster academy. If he's not Munster then Caelan Doris isn't Leinster.

A minority of people can't get past this small minded view that foreign players in the provinces are not good for local players. It's long shown to be bollocks.

Yeah, Kleyn, Snyman, and Beirne are going to teach Wycherly and Ahern everything they know, etc...

Clegg

No more excuses for Van Graan now. He has the players and coaching set up he wants. If Munster are still without silverware in 18 months he should be out on his ear.

thomond2006

Rockbeast2 wrote: »

Yeah, Kleyn, Snyman, and Beirne are going to teach Wycherly and Ahern everything they know, etc...

Wycherley's future is probably at blindside. Ahern will still be in the academy next year, he's got plenty of time.

And yes they'll learn from experienced players. Who wouldn't?

Come back to me when provinces are winning silverware with a fully in house developed squad.

hahashake

One thing that's amazing about these signing is the age profile. They aren't looking for an easy retirement paycheck like many post RWC winning signings as they still have 5 or 10 years of pro level in them.

slingerz

Rockbeast2 wrote: »

Project Munster continues. AKA get POM and Murray a medal before they retire.

This is terrible indictment of munster rugby. They really don't give two fecks about developing players.

Depending on contract renewals munster may have the following on their books next year. * I'm probably forgetting a couple.

1. Loughman
2. Marshall
3. Knox
4. Snyman
5. Kleyn
6. Botha
7. Cloete
8. Stander
9. McCarthy
10. Carbery
11. Gallagher
12. De Allende
13. Farrell
14. Conway
15. Haley

16. Clarke
17.
18. Parker
19. Beirne
20. Oliver
21.
22. Bleyendaal
23. Arnold

Rumours a couple leinster lads being approached as well.

Best of luck to you lads but this is past the point of ridiculousness now.

Dont Leinster have 3 NIQ players in Fardy, Tomane and Lowe? Surely they are blocking the production line of the best academy that ever was ever???

arsebiscuits1

thomond2006 wrote: »

Wycherley's future is probably at blindside. Ahern will still be in the academy next year, he's got plenty of time.

And yes they'll learn from experienced players. Who wouldn't?

Come back to me when provinces are winning silverware with a fully in house developed squad.

Wycherly was the first name I thought of when I saw these signings.

Many people touting him as a future international.

Personally I think he's too small to feature at second row internationally. As you say he probably will prosper at blindside more.

Where does he fit? With Kleyn, Beirne and Snyman you're well covered at second row and you've got CJ, Peter and JOD who are all viable 6 options

If I were in his shoes I'd be straight up to Ulster. Plenty of potential game time up there at 4/6

arsebiscuits1

slingerz wrote: »

Dont Leinster have 3 NIQ players in Fardy, Tomane and Lowe? Surely they are blocking the production line of the best academy that ever was ever???

Lowe is IQ this year

EDIT: I should probably distance myself from Rockbeats comments. I don't really agree with them. High performance sport means getting the best players on the pitch.

I think we all would like to see provinces playing locally developed players. And I am sure it is something Munster is looking to do as their academy has gone though a bit of a barren spell recently. Ulster have started producing recently. I have no doubt Munster will too

Cookiemunster

Rockbeast2 wrote: »

Project Munster continues. AKA get POM and Murray a medal before they retire.

This is terrible indictment of munster rugby. They really don't give two fecks about developing players.

Depending on contract renewals munster may have the following on their books next year. * I'm probably forgetting a couple.

1. Loughman
2. Marshall
3. Knox
4. Snyman
5. Kleyn
6. Botha
7. Cloete
8. Stander
9. McCarthy
10. Carbery
11. Gallagher
12. De Allende
13. Farrell
14. Conway
15. Haley

16. Clarke
17.
18. Parker
19. Beirne
20. Oliver
21.
22. Bleyendaal
23. Arnold

Rumours a couple leinster lads being approached as well.

Best of luck to you lads but this is past the point of ridiculousness now.

I'm curious. Do you have the same worries for Ulster or is it just Munster you're obsessed with?

Just for your information, there were 10 Munster born players in the starting XV and another 5 on the bench against Racing and 11 in the starting XV with 6 on the bench against Ospreys.

Time to get off your high horse.

Rockbeast2

Cookiemunster wrote: »

I'm curious. Do you have the same worries for Ulster or is it just Munster you're obsessed with?

Just for your information, there were 10 Munster born players in the starting XV and another 5 on the bench against Racing and 11 in the starting XV with 6 on the bench against Ospreys.

Time to get off your high horse.

Obsessed. LOL

It is what it is. A list of names.

As I said, best of luck to munster. Two fantastic signings and gallagher with plenty of room to develop into one.

randomrb

arsebiscuits1 wrote: »

Wycherly was the first name I thought of when I saw these signings.

Many people touting him as a future international.

Personally I think he's too small to feature at second row internationally. As you say he probably will prosper at blindside more.

Where does he fit? With Kleyn, Beirne and Snyman you're well covered at second row and you've got CJ, Peter and JOD who are all viable 6 options

If I were in his shoes I'd be straight up to Ulster. Plenty of potential game time up there at 4/6

People keep saying they want better depth but then as soon as you bring in players people act like half the team will have to leave.

The simple fact here that people don't seem to get is that at the moment munster have only 3 or 4 international starters in the team. Thats just not good enough. That has to be rectified now and we don't have them coming through fast enough (the potential reasons for this I won't get into) to stay competitive and win things we need to bring in foreign players its simple...

slingerz

arsebiscuits1 wrote: »

Lowe is IQ this year

EDIT: I should probably distance myself from Rockbeats comments. I don't really agree with them. High performance sport means getting the best players on the pitch.

I think we all would like to see provinces playing locally developed players. And I am sure it is something Munster is looking to do as their academy has gone though a bit of a barren spell recently. Ulster have started producing recently. I have no doubt Munster will too

Yea and i've no issue with Fardy, Tomane and Lowe being with Leinster.

But the salt from some fans of other provinces over any signings is unreal.

You say Ulster have started producing recently and have no doubt Munster will too. Another poster has pointed out the numbers of Munster players that played in Europe this season.

Ulster/Munster/Connacht academies could all do with producing more players but there is an element of fake news to it. Leinster have a considerable demographic advantage when it comes to participation and wealth surrounding their clubs & schools.

salmocab

slingerz wrote: »

Yea and i've no issue with Fardy, Tomane and Lowe being with Leinster.

But the salt from some fans of other provinces over any signings is unreal.

You say Ulster have started producing recently and have no doubt Munster will too. Another poster has pointed out the numbers of Munster players that played in Europe this season.

Ulster/Munster/Connacht academies could all do with producing more players but there is an element of fake news to it. Leinster have a considerable demographic advantage when it comes to participation and wealth surrounding their clubs & schools.

Look all 4 provinces have people that pick at what is happening elsewhere for their own reasons. What happens though is over time supporters of a particular province all get tarred by what a small minority spout. Most supporters of other provinces either don’t give a shiny one or are happy with these signings.

arsebiscuits1

randomrb wrote: »

People keep saying they want better depth but then as soon as you bring in players people act like half the team will have to leave.

The simple fact here that people don't seem to get is that at the moment munster have only 3 or 4 international starters in the team. Thats just not good enough. That has to be rectified now and we don't have them coming through fast enough (the potential reasons for this I won't get into) to stay competitive and win things we need to bring in foreign players its simple...

There is nothing wrong with having depth. No one is disputing this.

What am am referring to is if someone has international ambitions and are being touted as an international, they'd want to be getting all the first team rugby they can. If they're looking like they'll be 3rd choice in one team then why wouldn't they look at another team?

It's all well an good to say Fineen can add to the depth. But if I were him I'd be looking to do what Jordi Murphy, Jack McGrath, Joey Carbery, Robin Copeland and many others did - move to get first team rugby.

arsebiscuits1

slingerz wrote: »

Yea and i've no issue with Fardy, Tomane and Lowe being with Leinster.

But the salt from some fans of other provinces over any signings is unreal.

You say Ulster have started producing recently and have no doubt Munster will too. Another poster has pointed out the numbers of Munster players that played in Europe this season.

Ulster/Munster/Connacht academies could all do with producing more players but there is an element of fake news to it. Leinster have a considerable demographic advantage when it comes to participation and wealth surrounding their clubs & schools.

At the risk of sounding callous... who cares? You've just gotten 2 world cup winners. Who gives a flying whatsit as to what other people think?

People can bitch and moan to be about Lowe and Fardy all they want to me. I just sit back and enjoy the good they produce on the pitch

Buer

Munster don't have locks coming out of their ears. Beirne is now a flanker, apparently. Holland is on his way out. Darren O'Shea is filler at best. Seán O'Connor is 24 this year and doesn't look like he's gonna reach the top level.

If Wycherley can't reach his full potential, it absolutely will not be due to the signing of Snyman and his path being blocked.

If he's viewed as a back row player, then Munster need to start playing him there. All 8 of his starts this season have been at lock.

easy peasy

slingerz wrote: »

Yea and i've no issue with Fardy, Tomane and Lowe being with Leinster.

But the salt from some fans of other provinces over any signings is unreal.

You say Ulster have started producing recently and have no doubt Munster will too. Another poster has pointed out the numbers of Munster players that played in Europe this season.

Ulster/Munster/Connacht academies could all do with producing more players but there is an element of fake news to it. Leinster have a considerable demographic advantage when it comes to participation and wealth surrounding their clubs & schools.

Only one Munster produced player in the Irish squad is under 30, and he isn't within an arses roar of the team. One of the key mandates of the provinces is to produce players to play at the top level for Ireland. Munster are failing.

yerrahbah

thomond2006 wrote: »

Kevin O'Byrne 2020
Rhys Marshall 2021
Niall Scannell 2021

Diarmuid Barron Year 2
Eoghan Clarke Year 2

James Cronin 2021
Dave Kilcoyne 2020
Liam O'Connor 2022
Jeremy Loughman 2020

James French Year 2
Josh Wycherley Year 2

Stephen Archer 2022
John Ryan 2022
Brian Scott 2020
Ciaran Parker 2020

Keynan Knox Year 3 & 2022

Tadhg Beirne 2022
Billy Holland 2020
Jean Kleyn 2022
Sean O'Connor 2020
Darren O'Shea 2020
RG Snyman 2022
Fineen Wycherley 2021

Thomas Ahern Year 2
Paddy Kelly Year 1
Eoin O'Connor Year 1

Arno Botha 2020
Gavin Coombes 2021
Chris Cloete 2022
Tommy O'Donnell 2021
Jack O'Donoghue 2021
Peter O'Mahony 2021
Jack O'Sullivan 2023
Conor Oliver 2020
CJ Stander 2021

Jack Daly Year 2
John Hodnett Year 1

Craig Casey 2021
Neil Cronin 2021
Nick McCarthy 2021
Conor Murray 2022

Jack Stafford Year 3

Tyler Bleyendaal 2021
Joey Carbery 2022
JJ Hanrahan 2021

Jake Flannery Year 1
Ben Healy Year 2

Sam Arnold 2020
Damian de Allende 2022
Chris Farrell 2022
Dan Goggin 2022
Alex McHenry 2021
Rory Scannell 2021

Sean French Year 2

Andrew Conway 2020
Liam Coombes 2021
Shane Daly 2021
Keith Earls 2021
Matt Gallagher 2022
Mike Haley 2021
Calvin Nash 2021
Darren Sweetnam 2021
Alex Wootton 2021

Alan Tynan Year 3
Jonathan Wren Year 2

2019/20 NIEs:
Arno Botha (capped), Chris Cloete (uncapped)

IN: RG Snyman (LK, Honda Heat), Damian de Allende (CT, Panasonic Wild Knights), Matt Gallagher (FB, Saracens)
OUT:

Need to resign:
Killer and Conway

I think we should resign:
O'Byrne, Loughman and Holland