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Dublin ranks 3rd in terms of the amount of time spent in cars due to congestion

  • 13-02-2019 10:29am
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 2,810 ✭✭✭ Beta Ray Bill


    Read this in the news this morning.

    https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/report-ranks-dublin-as-one-of-the-worlds-worst-cities-for-commuters-904088.html

    Had a check of the Data myself.
    http://inrix.com/scorecard/

    I think "Impact Rank" is the volume of cars/people in an area, Dublin comes 52nd in this out of 200.

    However if you sort by the amount of time an average commuter spends in their car as a result of congestion, Dublin ranks 3rd, with an average of 246 hours per commuter spent in their car every year.

    I'm not surprised, there is a war on cars/private transportation in Dublin at the minute. But what the councils don't seem to get is that Irish people like their cars, and are prepared to sit in them, stuck in traffic for 10 days a year! :eek:

    We've a hell of a long way to go with regards transport in Dublin.


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Comments

  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,281 ✭✭✭ CrankyHaus


    Things seem to be getting better.

    In recent years we've had extension of the Luas (though part of it may be flawed), some improvements of cycle lanes and expansion of bus services beyond the Dublin Bus monopoly. We've a long way to go obviously. Decent park and rides to service those coming in from the commuter belt seems to be something we could improve upon.


  • Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 9,289 Mod ✭✭✭✭ CatInABox


    CrankyHaus wrote: »
    Things seem to be getting better.

    In recent years we've had extension of the Luas (though part of it may be flawed), some improvements of cycle lanes and expansion of bus services beyond the Dublin Bus monopoly. We've a long way to go obviously. Decent park and rides to service those coming in from the commuter belt seems to be something we could improve upon.

    Realistically, we'll need the Dart Expansion and the Metrolink to be built before park and rides become viable. Almost all PT in and out of the city is running at capacity, or near enough to it that any increase in passenger numbers will push it over.

    No one is going to get out of their car to be left behind on the platform.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,281 ✭✭✭ CrankyHaus


    I never really take PT at rush hour so I wasn't aware of that but if it's true then definitely greater PT capacity is required.

    There are options other than PT though. I know people who drive in from Drogheda on the M1/N1, park at Whitehall and cycle from there. Co-location of Dublin bike stations with such car parks may be something to consider as a complement to more PT.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,810 ✭✭✭ Beta Ray Bill


    CatInABox wrote: »
    Realistically, we'll need the Dart Expansion and the Metrolink to be built before park and rides become viable. Almost all PT in and out of the city is running at capacity, or near enough to it that any increase in passenger numbers will push it over.

    No one is going to get out of their car to be left behind on the platform.

    I'd agree with you on that.
    I go to work either extra early or a bit late to avoid being crammed into a Dart/Luas

    I still think the number of hours spent in a car not moving, is shocking

    As CrankyHaus said, things are definitely improving.
    The Luas extension is great (or at least up until the part from the Liffey to Stephen Green)
    New Signalling system for DART is an improvement (but again there were a number of important elements that were not thought out)

    I think though that all the crap with public expenditure given the Childrens hospital mess will mean that all big projects such as: Metro, Further Luas extensions, DART underground, etc will be heavily scrutinized and/or put on hold (or even scrapped)


  • Registered Users Posts: 17,529 ✭✭✭✭ Idbatterim


    The absolute definition of a banana republic! The luas extension to bray and a spur further south to Hoover cars off the n11 is needed! Along with Dublin metro and dart underground, also the extension of green line to far side of m50 for another park and ride!

    Ideally metro west equivalent and metro south west. But they are god knows how long off. What I outlined above should be in planning now!


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  • Registered Users Posts: 9,764 ✭✭✭ Hurrache


    grahambo wrote: »
    I'm not surprised, there is a war on cars/private transportation in Dublin at the minute. But what the councils don't seem to get is that Irish people like their cars, and are prepared to sit in them, stuck in traffic for 10 days a year! :eek:

    Doesn't matter if the council "don't get" it, that's not the problem here.


  • Registered Users Posts: 17,529 ✭✭✭✭ Idbatterim


    These morons build an entirely car dependent city. Then spend minuscule amounts on proper public transport solutions , actually scratch that , we don’t have a segregated metro here. They won’t get me out of my car for the vast majority of my trips. Bus journeys that are longer than frodos trek to Mordor!

    How in gods name does this kip not have twenty four hour bus services and luas should be operating longer too !


  • Registered Users Posts: 13,828 ✭✭✭✭ CIARAN_BOYLE


    I work in city centre. I moved my start time to 8am to avoid traffic.

    My morning bus can be full in the mornings but usually isn't.

    I don't see much more capacity in public transport at rush hour. more people moving their hours from 9-5 would be a good thing.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,216 ✭✭✭ sharper


    grahambo wrote: »
    I'm not surprised, there is a war on cars/private transportation in Dublin at the minute. But what the councils don't seem to get is that Irish people like their cars, and are prepared to sit in them, stuck in traffic for 10 days a year! :eek:

    If there's a war then private cars are winning. Traffic measures meant to improve the total number of people moving about (by prioritising public transport) routinely fail at the last minute in favour of private cars.

    Transport capacity for single occupancy vehicles is an unsolvable problem. The more space you allocate the more cards on the road you get.

    A lot of people think the financial crisis of 2007 is long over but we're still carrying the weight of having the capital investment slashed to maintain day-to-day expenditure. Even as we inch towards the next crisis we have no real plans or funding for the major improvements needed.
    I work in city centre. I moved my start time to 8am to avoid traffic.

    I think the earliest possible Dublin Bus (leaving a bit after 7am) and I find traffic is already very heavy. In some places people would need to be leaving before 6am because 7am-10am and 4pm-7pm seem to be the new peak hours for traffic.


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 6,367 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Macha


    Higher density development. If you don't do that, the rest is an uphill battle.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,810 ✭✭✭ Beta Ray Bill


    sharper wrote: »
    If there's a war then private cars are winning. Traffic measures meant to improve the total number of people moving about (by prioritising public transport) routinely fail at the last minute in favour of private cars.

    Transport capacity for single occupancy vehicles is an unsolvable problem. The more space you allocate the more cards on the road you get.

    You're totally right that most of the cars heading into town have only one person in them and it's without a doubt the most inefficient way to do things.
    I think for a lot of people though, they're either dropping kids off at school/creche before hand and it's just to much hassle to go home get on a train/bus/luas and then do the whole lot in reverse in the evening.

    I think though that those that do NOT have kids to look after first, should be using a motorcycle / bicycle / maybe even a twizy!!!!

    But even then there's a problem
    Motorbikes / Bicycles both face the problem of parking and thieves
    Bicycles have issues with cycle lanes
    Motorbikes have a stigma attached to them that they are dangerous.

    Twizy would only work if everyone has a twizy

    sharper wrote: »
    A lot of people think the financial crisis of 2007 is long over but we're still carrying the weight of having the capital investment slashed to maintain day-to-day expenditure. Even as we inch towards the next crisis we have no real plans or funding for the major improvements needed.

    Well there's plans.... there's just no money...

    sharper wrote: »
    I think the earliest possible Dublin Bus (leaving a bit after 7am) and I find traffic is already very heavy. In some places people would need to be leaving before 6am because 7am-10am and 4pm-7pm seem to be the new peak hours for traffic.

    Again no money, late night services need to be paid for by someone ya know?


  • Registered Users Posts: 17,529 ✭✭✭✭ Idbatterim


    I think though that those that do NOT have kids to look after first, should be using a motorcycle / bicycle / maybe even a twizy!!!!

    But even then there's a problem
    Motorbikes / Bicycles both face the problem of parking and thieves
    Bicycles have issues with cycle lanes
    Motorbikes have a stigma attached to them that they are dangerous.

    Its not the motorbikes that are dangerous! You could be the best motorbike driver, do you drive on Dublins roads everyday with the morons I do? Not a chance I'd put myself my life at the mercy of the said morons!


  • Registered Users Posts: 17,529 ✭✭✭✭ Idbatterim


    Macha wrote: »
    Higher density development. If you don't do that, the rest is an uphill battle.

    totally agree, build on Irish glass bottle site and possibly even the port, can house hundreds of thousands and they can walk or cycle to work! Get them out of house shares in the suburbs and free them up for families!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,907 ✭✭✭ Stephen15


    Idbatterim wrote: »
    The absolute definition of a banana republic! The luas extension to bray and a spur further south to Hoover cars off the n11 is needed! Along with Dublin metro and dart underground, also the extension of green line to far side of m50 for another park and ride!

    Ideally metro west equivalent and metro south west. But they are god knows how long off. What I outlined above should be in planning now!

    Extending the green line is not going to work until the Metro is built and the line between Charlemont and Sandyford is upgraded to Metro as the Green line is currently at capacity.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,070 ✭✭✭ Franz Von Peppercorn


    Macha wrote: »
    Higher density development. If you don't do that, the rest is an uphill battle.

    There’s no convincing Irish people to live in apartments long term. You just have to look at the discussions on buying apartments when that happens


  • Registered Users Posts: 17,529 ✭✭✭✭ Idbatterim


    There’s no convincing Irish people to live in apartments long term. You just have to look at the discussions on buying apartments when that happens

    yes but we have a large "young" population. They would gladly live in city centre in compact space that was there own, if it was in any way reasonably affordable, which it currently isnt with the building "standards" we currently have. Funny how they are so concerned with size and light, yet noise isnt even a consideration :rolleyes:


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,861 ✭✭✭ techdiver


    There’s no convincing Irish people to live in apartments long term. You just have to look at the discussions on buying apartments when that happens

    I don't think you have to even convince people to live in apartments long term per se. Younger people will happily live in apartments closer to city centres thus freeing up 3 and 4 bed house shares for families.

    This is one way of easing pressure on housing.


  • Registered Users Posts: 331 ✭✭ ExoPolitic


    Idbatterim wrote: »
    totally agree, build on Irish glass bottle site and possibly even the port, can house hundreds of thousands and they can walk or cycle to work! Get them out of house shares in the suburbs and free them up for families!

    The higher the density of people, the more realistic it becomes to have a better transport network. There's no point building a metro system if every stop only has a small catchment of people living in the area. Dublin is too sprawled out to support a better metro. Unless we build a metro and designate areas for redevelopment around it for high density, it would be unsustainable.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,216 ✭✭✭ sharper


    grahambo wrote: »
    Again no money, late night services need to be paid for by someone ya know?

    They sure do though in case what I was thinking was that the time span of peak traffic is already so wide people have a limited ability to avoid it via changing their working hours.

    It's still insane the amount of traffic generated by schools being open. A proper schoolbus transport system similar to the US would likely help a lot.


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 6,367 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Macha


    There’s no convincing Irish people to live in apartments long term. You just have to look at the discussions on buying apartments when that happens
    Sadly true. If you ask me if I'd rather live in decent sized, well designed apartment with his amenities nearby like parks etc or spend 2+ hours a day commuting, plus all the additional associated costs including extra childcare, possible second car etc, I think it's a no brainer.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,070 ✭✭✭ Franz Von Peppercorn


    Idbatterim wrote: »
    yes but we have a large "young" population. They would gladly live in city centre in compact space that was there own, if it was in any way reasonably affordable, which it currently isnt with the building "standards" we currently have.

    That’s the rental market. And in fact a lot of people do of course live in the centre in apartments, a lot of them immigrants.
    Funny how they are so concerned with size and light, yet noise isnt even a consideration :rolleyes:

    Who is the “we” here.


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,219 ✭✭✭ Calina


    Idbatterim wrote: »
    yes but we have a large "young" population. They would gladly live in city centre in compact space that was there own, if it was in any way reasonably affordable, which it currently isnt with the building "standards" we currently have. Funny how they are so concerned with size and light, yet noise isnt even a consideration :rolleyes:

    What we build now is too compact, even for young people. Hence people don’t want to live in apartments in Dublin.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,810 ✭✭✭ Beta Ray Bill


    Calina wrote: »
    What we build now is too compact, even for young people. Hence people don’t want to live in apartments in Dublin.

    Ding Ding!!!

    Exactly right.
    People don't want to live in a little box. which is what a lot of apartments in town are.

    Get anything moderately sized and your talking a price that would be close enough to the price of a 3 bed Semi-D.

    None of these people grew up in apartments, so why the hell would they buy one when they could live in a house for the near enough the same price.


  • Registered Users Posts: 24,683 ✭✭✭✭ punisher5112


    What's needed is more buses, more trains(much faster as in better tracks and points), Luas and something done with the M50.

    We need to look seriously at why buses are so slow and getting held up so badly.

    We need 24hour clearways which need enforcement, yellow box enforcement, bus lane enforcement with much bigger fines, bus only streets and bus only turns enforcement (all this could be CCTV operation and no need for Garda which there are none around anyway),

    Double red lines like in the UK where you can't load or unload which you are entitled to do on double yellow lines for 30 minutes.

    Bus cage(bus stops) enforcement where you receive fine and points and a big one at that.

    The amount of complete tools I come across daily and numerous times where they block bus stops and park for hours in some and this is even in the city centre which is ridiculous.

    We need lights that give priority to buses and the ones in rathmines that are there already and on but do nothing. These should be utilised to give buses space and to get ahead so as they have a clear run.

    Traffic is only going one way and it's getting worse all the time.

    Many manyore things can and really should be done.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,216 ✭✭✭ sharper


    We need 24hour clearways which need enforcement, yellow box enforcement, bus lane enforcement with much bigger fines, bus only streets and bus only turns enforcement (all this could be CCTV operation and no need for Garda which there are none around anyway),

    Waiting at a bus stop on the quays is an exercise in anger management. Watching the number of cars drive down the bus lane and even worse, the number of cars that enter the yellow box with nowhere to go and block and the bus lane for a full light cycle is hard to deal with when everything moves so slowly overall.

    At this point a garda twitter account you could tweet pictures of this to and have some enforcement happen would at least be something which could be implemented cheaply (though won't ever happen due to privacy and so on)


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,544 ✭✭✭ facehugger99


    Plenty of solutions being thrown around but they all cost money.

    Our Capital investment is still way below what it should be - it's never recovered fully from the last recession. Overruns like the Children's Hospital don't really help and the public sector unions seem to have first dibs on any revenue increases.

    I can't really see anything improving - there seems to be a huge amount of commercial development currently on-going in places like the IFSC - it's good to see in some ways but it's only going to put more strain on the existing infrastructure which is already over-capacity.


  • Registered Users Posts: 24,683 ✭✭✭✭ punisher5112


    This is something that needs fixing and fast.

    There is no need for the way things are going and it's quite frankly nowhere fast at all.


  • Registered Users Posts: 17,529 ✭✭✭✭ Idbatterim


    Who is the “we” here.

    the morons in planning...


  • Registered Users Posts: 17,529 ✭✭✭✭ Idbatterim


    Calina wrote: »
    What we build now is too compact, even for young people. Hence people don’t want to live in apartments in Dublin.

    well the minimum sizes here a lot more generous than what standards and britain and germany mandate to the best of my knowledge. Of course what would that shower of fools know compared to a rock on the edge of europe, totally against urban living and that has one "city"...


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  • Registered Users Posts: 17,529 ✭✭✭✭ Idbatterim


    Plenty of solutions being thrown around but they all cost money.

    Our Capital investment is still way below what it should be - it's never recovered fully from the last recession. Overruns like the Children's Hospital don't really help and the public sector unions seem to have first dibs on any revenue increases.

    I can't really see anything improving - there seems to be a huge amount of commercial development currently on-going in places like the IFSC - it's good to see in some ways but it's only going to put more strain on the existing infrastructure which is already over-capacity.

    what is your point about them costing money? they do cost money, the total lack of investment has us in this state. Other countries just invest in it as a matter of course. Here? LOL! if its not an increase on welfare, its wasted :rolleyes:


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