ESB eCars

liamog

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118350954#Comment_118350954

Pretty much, the climate action fund was setup in such a way that it provides funds to help Ireland achieve climate and energy targets. If an organisation applies to the fund and says we will do X, then so long as you do X it's ok.

It's my major bugbear when it comes to the eCars network, they are delivering exactly what they said they would in a way that makes sense as a network operator. However it's completely at odds with what should be prioritised as part of a centrally planned transitional network. Take the comparison of Blanch and Castlebellingham, would you as a provider of charging services prefer a customer that uses a charger 4 times a year on a trip to Belfast, or prefer the customer who uses it 52 times at a local district centre as part of your weekly charging routine? We all need a national charging network to work, but the current laissez faire approach by our government is letting us down, the criticism seems to be purely aimed at eCars instead of the politicians who are avoiding responsibility.

Then there's the other piece of the argument which involves some peoples charging needs being a higher priority than others. People who don't need local DC charging are very quick to complain that local DC charging is used by people, just because one persons use case is different to your own doesn't make them wrong, it's just another customer that requires servicing.

slave1

reminds me of the old surgeon perspective

leg amputated, surgery a success, patient died

McGiver

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118350340#Comment_118350340

Yep as evidenced from other countries with more mature EV markets (NL, AT, NO). AC everywhere.

We had multiple discussions about that with @liamog

Urban DC deployment at strategic places is a good addition but massive AC is the core and essential element of urban charger deployment.

The problem here in ROI is a very weak local gov autonomy and budget - in NL and NO communal AC is deployed by local councils. Who will do it here? Nobody... Councils have no money.

cannco253

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118353027#Comment_118353027

Councils have access to funding, they choose not to use it (at least in Galway anyway)

https://www.gov.ie/en/press-release/5da6c-minister-ryan-announces-funding-approval-for-on-street-charge-points-for-electric-vehicles/#

Published on 1 July 2021

"Capital supports of 75% of the cost up to maximum of 5,000 euro per charge point is provided to Local Authorities under this scheme.

The Sustainable Energy Authority of Ireland manage the scheme and the Local Authorities must operate the charge points subject to the terms and conditions of the scheme.

Three applications have been approved for funding. Louth County Council have applied for funding for 20 charge points with Dublin City Council applying for 9 charge points under two applications."

Busman Paddy Lasty

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118350797#Comment_118350797

"That's down to people applying obligations to eCars that simply don't exist. It's the main reason I like to compare the eCars network to the charging network in Coventry. One of the networks is in Ireland and has a government who let a charging company do whatever it likes, the other has funded a city wide network and tendered out the operation of the network to an operator.

Both are provided by ESB.

Critics of eCars and their opinions being Sent to Coventry. Noice

Black_Knight

Ninja parking at ESB killmartins at the moment. EcoXpress.ie transit van charging on 50kW CCS. Never knew they existed, but he's in the middle bay so the easy access to the rear right charge port on the id4 wasn't available. I'm spread across the left bay and air/vacuum space.

I possibly could of pulled right up to the kerb and angled the 150kW CCS into the port but don't think it'll reach, and the stress it'd put on the car port would be pretty significant.

markpb

Does anyone know why Tesla adopted the single charging post per parking bay model while ESB have gone for the opposite. Tesla's seems more practical but perhaps there's a good reason for ESB decision that I'm not seeing?

Black_Knight

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118357046#Comment_118357046

Because all Tesla's charge ports are on the left side. So having 2 plugs per unit would be pointless and increase the logistical complexity. Ecars ignore that complexity and leave it as a consumer issue up solve.

TCP/IP

All this talk makes me pray that Tesla doesn't open up their supercharger network over here as you nearly never have to queue.

Black_Knight

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118357100#Comment_118357100

If they do, hopefully they work a solution for that exact issue. They're pretty consumer first in their delivery, so there's hope they'll deliver something workable for all.

slave1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118357046#Comment_118357046

Also, up to V3 SuC Tesla load shared across two stalls which is handier than two cars being hooked up to single stall with two cables. Tesla SuC cables very short to minimise losses is another reason for two stalls versus multi cable single stall. Tesla nailed it, and it really wasn't that hard

ted1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118349965#Comment_118349965

ecars should not be encouraging chargers to be hogged as personal chargers. They are no where near the volume needed for that.

slow chargers should be destination chargers. Fast chargers as en route chargers.

ELM327

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118358034#Comment_118358034

Yes that last sentence is important.

Over time, I think we will move to having 25-50kW as faster destination charging. But as we stand now, AC vs DC as destination:en route is a good split.

liamog

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118358034#Comment_118358034

Why is your custom deemed to be better than someone else's?

eCars shouldn't be tailoring a network to those who go out of their way to use it as a little as possible. Expansion is going to come from people using chargers regularly, not the person who does so 4 times a year.

sh81722

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118359818#Comment_118359818

If that's the business model ecars is going for then I suggest that they should build a purpose built multi storey carpark with say 50-100 11kW AC charging points (with a room to expand when needed) near residential areas in D15 that catered for the local users without home charging.

The entry admission with either a charge card or the ecars app.

ted1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118359818#Comment_118359818

Because my custom would encourage EV take up. Someone hogging a charger puts people off EV ownership. if you want an EV you need your own charger.

McGiver

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118353226#Comment_118353226

No.

Firstly, 75% funding is pointless when you don't have the 25% 😎They've no money. Has to be 100% funding.

Secondly, lot of paperwork. Council don't want to do it. Needs cutting red tape significantly.

Thirdly, it's a political issue - it's not seen as a policy or strategic initiative by the councils. Central government didn't set it up as a strategic policy for councils to implement. Not enough pressure or direction.

And fourthly, cultural issue, too much fossil fuel lobby in whole of Ireland, car dealers are probably the most against any sort of EV progress. Add to it the overall conservative attitude around many things in Galway, and overall GCC incompetence and you see what you see - no new chargers installed by the GCC. Ennis Council for example seems to be more progressive, at least around charging...

CH3OH

EcoXpress popped up earlier in the thread.

In Arklow,

last night they occupied both bays in Castle Park. One is charging since 17:17 yesterday evening and it is still connected at 09:30 this morning. He/she must have decided to have a lie in.

It seems great to have a green delivery option. But it doesn't seem right to hog the chargers.

handpref

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118360100#Comment_118360100

These lads bring back memories of the early leaf taxis that treated sandyford and templeville road as their private chargers. Think there was another lad in Clontarf too…

Its a pity they can’t just add chargers to suit the demand, it’s not like there’s climate chaos or any other life changing issues at stake…

Too few chargers being made ‘unavailable’ to those who may need them only has a negative effect.

AndyBoBandy

It's an awful pity eCars said they are not installing any new AC chargers!!!! Would be ideal for the above scenario.

AC chargers would seem like fairly low hanging fruit. Cheap units and reasonably easy to connect up....

liamog

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118359990#Comment_118359990

They aren't hogging, they are a customer using a service. A customer that is far more useful for the charging provider than someone who uses the network sparsely.

Networks scale with usage not with avoidance.

ELM327

I dont see why a company which has already invested in EV vans (substantially more expensive than the ICE equivalent, I know, I'm looking at a replacement for my van) wouldnt invest an additional 1-2k on 2 7kW chargers at their depot for overnight. You get 100% ACCA for it so it's all tax deductible in year 1.

CH3OH

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118360268#Comment_118360268

If he is plugged in at 17:25 yesterday and still there at 10:30 this morning.. That is 17 hours..

Is that not hogging?

Black_Knight

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118360307#Comment_118360307

It is, regardless of whatever argument you might hear to the contrary. Overnight is one thing. Still pulled in early morning is another.

And as I've mentioned lots before, AC charging on those 50kW units is blocking are least some cars from DC charging. It's a cop out from ecars. Inflated numbers at the expense of user experience.

AndyBoBandy

They’ve even announced themselves that they are ditching fast AC so therefore AC (of any kind) has no business being remotely close to a DC unit, let alone sharing a space with a DC charger.

ELM327

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118360307#Comment_118360307

Not if he's actively charging, it's not hogging. We need to get away from this idea that EVs shouldnt be charging. Hogging is only if parked for a long time not charging. Or charging past 45 minutes on DC

McGiver

Time to bring in per minute charges. Fixes the issue immediately.

If you see 3rd party resellers like Plugsurfing etc. most chargers they facilitate have already per minute charge kicking in after certain period of time.

McGiver

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118360488#Comment_118360488

How much is the AC plug giving and how much is the car pulling? Even at 3 kW, I can't see them charging 17 hours...

Putting AC plugs on the DC units is a fatal mistake, for sure. AC should be a back-up NEXT to the DC unit not ON the same unit.

McGiver

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118360418#Comment_118360418

Yep another Ecars fúck-up to put AC on the same unit....the story goes on.

Honestly, they can't do almot anything right at this stage. It's our and EU money they're using and it's a real shíshow.

CH3OH

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118360488#Comment_118360488

It is not possible to be actively charging for 17 hours.

It looks like it is an LDV EV80

With a 56 kW battery range 120km