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ESB eCars

liamog

Details from the dail on the eCars €10,000,000 expansion programme.

The key elements include six high speed charging hubs on motorways capable of charging eight vehicles simultaneously; 16 high speed charging hubs capable of charging four vehicles simultaneously; additional high power chargers at 34 current 50 kW locations; upgrading over 50 22 kW chargers to 50 kW, and replacing up to 264 locations with 528 charge points at the pre-existing pilot grade of 22 kW to next generation high reliability models.

https://www.oireachtas.ie/en/debates/question/2019-01-24/10/?fbclid=IwAR1eGLQjNFuywCoaB__FJADns7gNOD09DaR9XLueHAKZ8vljfd-kL-_LpDs

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Black_Knight

ELM327 wrote: »

I was working from home this morning. Came in in the afternoon to a near deserted office, to charge my S and my phone for free

Charge the phone off the house, and the house off the S and the S off work!

ELM327

Oh believe me that's the future state plan

jhegarty

Black_Knight wrote: »

Charge the phone off the house, and the house off the S and the S off work!

And then use Toyota logic to charge work off the phone.

unkel

Black_Knight wrote: »

Charge the phone off the house, and the house off the S and the S off work!

Pretty much. Or get paid €0.50 / kWh by the utility company so they can take electricity out of your car at peak hours, only for you to fill it up again at the night rate of about €0.05 / kWh. This sort of scenario is a near certainty.

ELM327

unkel wrote: »

Pretty much. Or get paid €0.50 / kWh by the utility company so they can take electricity out of your car at peak hours, only for you to fill it up again at the night rate of about €0.05 / kWh. This sort of scenario is a near certainty.

Once v2g comes in this will be a great leveler for the grid

Black_Knight

Wait lads, I was just talking ****e. No need to get all logical about it all.

liamog

More updates from eCars.

In the next two weeks, we will be upgrading our 22kW AC Standard Charger at Farnham Street, Cavan and Off Circular Road, Kells to a new fast charger.

This is a new type of fast charger and will provide up to 44kW on CHAdeMO and CCS connectors, and between 2-6kW on the AC connector depending on your car type.

The AC charger is free to use in the short term while the DC connectors will be subject to pay for use. An overstay fee will be applied after 45 minutes on the CCS and CHAdeMO connectors only. Please note that no charging will be available at these sites while works are underway.

unkel

"and between 2-6kW on the AC connector depending on your car type"

Surely this must be some mistake? If not, the ESB are bringing slow charging to a new level of slow :rolleyes:

"Up to 44kW on CHAdeMO and CCS". Wow, the progress there too in "fast" chargers. Slower than they managed 10 years ago :rolleyes:

liamog

Either a mistake or they're restricting the input due to the local grid connection. This should really help with the current North West badlands

ELM327

Better than the unit that was there. 44kW is a lot faster than the 7kW most will draw from the AC.

Adding a mild fast DC spot into the black spot of Cavan is better use f the available power imo

Black_Knight

unkel wrote: »

"Up to 44kW on CHAdeMO and CCS". Wow, the progress there too in "fast" chargers. Slower than they managed 10 years ago :rolleyes:

I noticed a few months back that some of the fast chargers in/around Belfast say 44kW

ELM327

Black_Knight wrote: »

I noticed a few months back that some of the fast chargers in/around Belfast say 44kW

All the super old ones (DBT mostly) were 44kW for DC. I remember templeville in Dublin 6 was 44kW chademo only for ages.

NI never gets upgrades so they are all at that.

unkel

liamog wrote: »

they're restricting the input due to the local grid connection.

For Jaysus sake. Aren't we all supposed to go EV over the next few decades? Now is not the time to restrict ourselves to working with 3rd world levels of infrastructure that remain from when Ireland was the poorest country in Europe a few decades ago. Now is the time to start bumping up the grid.

ELM327 wrote: »

NI never gets upgrades so they are all at that.

They don't make money up there, they live on handouts from London. Over here we do make money and we need our tax money to be spent properly.

ELM327

unkel wrote: »

For Jaysus sake. Aren't we all supposed to go EV over the next few decades? Now is not the time to restrict ourselves to working with 3rd world levels of infrastructure that remain from when Ireland was the poorest country in Europe a few decades ago. Now is the time to start bumping up the grid.

Have you been to Kells or Cavan?
It's still in that time :P

[Deleted User]

It would answer them better to replace the 2 X 22 KW AC points with 2 x 22 Kw DC, they do exist though haven't seen any with ChaDEMo but I'm sure they exist.

Won't be long until we're half way through 2020 and still no such thing as a 150 Kw DC charger from the ESB.

Maybe the ESB are leaving it to Ionity to install the high power chargers.

2020 and we got what, 2 sites with 2 DC chargers from the ESB ? laughable to say the least. And still no signs of getting some kind of protection from the elements either.

ELM327

They said in the IEVOA meeting minutes that apparently they will be adding 150kW load sharing chargers at the current dual charger locations
So one car can charge at 150 and 1 at 50, or all 3 at 50

unkel

Deleted User wrote: »

Maybe the ESB are leaving it to Ionity to install the high power chargers.

That's grand. Private companies can do that far more competently and far cheaper too. I hope I'll get my tax dollars back from the ESB then though.

[Deleted User]

ELM327 wrote: »

They said in the IEVOA meeting minutes that apparently they will be adding 150kW load sharing chargers at the current dual charger locations
So one car can charge at 150 and 1 at 50, or all 3 at 50

wow real progress lol

ELM327

Deleted User wrote: »

wow real progress lol

I'm not saying it is!
I rarely use the esb network anyway, only the destination chargers and only then for free parking and free juice which I dont need.

When you have a Tesla all major routes are covered by Ionity and/or SuC.
Easygo and Circle K are getting in there too, ecars are lagging.

liamog

We're up to 3 sites with dual 50kW chargers and I think they've started cracking on the upgrade of AC chargers to DC, it's progress.
Every time I post an update on here, the same people complain about lack of progress.

unkel

liamog wrote: »

Every time I post an update on here, the same people complain about lack of progress.

That'll be me. The lack of progress is just ridiculous though. For years the ESB were giving out they had no funding. Which was fair enough, although a lame excuse not to invest some of their own profits into the network. Now they are getting millions from the tax payer and we don't see it go to any fast chargers to speak of. Where is it going is the pertinent question.

Apologies if it appears I was shooting the messenger though, liamog. That was not my intention at all.

Thankfully, like ELM327, I now own a long range Tesla. Personally I don't need the network at all. That doesn't make me less passionate about the sorry state of our public network though. So I'm afraid you'll have to bear with me

markpb

ELM327 wrote: »

When you have a Tesla all major routes are covered by Ionity and/or SuC.

All major routes except for the N2, N3 and N4 (without a decent detour via Athlone) and the west of Ireland.

[Deleted User]

ELM327 wrote: »

I'm not saying it is!

I was commenting at the ESB not on what you said.

zg3409

From:

https://www.irishevowners.ie/ievoa-esb-ecars-meeting/?fbclid=IwAR28U6BFjHfuM0po6ZSlXPocN85OFYQDk6oIv8dy9Gg8rKwDsE8ROYQZ-Us

The IEVOA met with ESB Ecars on Thursday 19th March 2020 to discuss about its contingency plan during the COVID19 pandemic, but also the current and future infrastructure.

Contingency planning
o Maintenance and operation of the network is continuing as normal, the situation will remain under review

o Customer Call Centre is business as usual and have the ability to work remotely also

o ESB will stay in communication with IEVOA as the situation develops

o IEVOA will assist with messaging their members to ensure compliance with HSE guidance in relation to Covid 19 when using chargers. ESB to share planned posts or communications.(Done)

Climate Action Fund Project
· AC replacement programme

o 130 chargers replaced since October – replacements will continue as issues arise with the chargers

o Uptime significantly improved with the replacement programme (≥ 95% network uptime)

o Some issues with a small number of new chargers and this is being investigated with the manufacturer

o Dublin Port first trial unit of new ‘compact’ fast chargers – these units will be used to replace up to 50 existing AC chargers over the next three years

o The first of these installations are planned for the coming weeks

o Focus will be on routes and large towns such as the M/N3

o As they will be using existing electrical supply they will prioritise connector power based on the number of vehicles connected – this will be clearly labelled on the online map

· Multi charger site hubs

o Galway Plaza, M6 and Kilcullen, M9 are the first multi charger sites but the current set up is temporary. – One of the existing fast chargers will be replaced with a charger which can charge one car at 150kW or split the charge between two cars. Meaning three cars can charge simultaneously at those locations. We expect delivery of the 150kW chargers in the summer

o These type of sites (50kW + 150kW) will be quicker and require less infrastructure to build than the 4-8 vehicle hubs and so it is expected that more of these will be delivered in 2020

o Once final commercial details are worked out with site hosts an announcement will be made on the first phase of hub locations. IEVOA will be issued with these locations in advance of them being published. ESB to confirm likely timing

Introduction of pricing for AC charging
o As stated previously, ESB had intended to introduce pay for use of the Standard AC chargers following a replacement programme, given that over 130 chargers have been replaced to date and that availability levels on the network have improved significantly, ESB had intended to introduce pricing in the coming months. However, these plans are now on hold in light of current COVID-19 situation. ESB are reviewing IEVOA’s feedback on the service and potential pricing options, and will provide at least a month’s notice of the introduction of pay for use of the Standard AC network.

o Given the number of locations and types of use case for the Standard AC chargers it is not intended to introduce an overstay fee. However, the option will be retained to introduce one if the network isn’t being used appropriately.

Overview of the results of the IEVOA survey
o IEVOA provided an overview of the results of their member survey (c.200 respondents)

o IEVOA to provide a distilled version of the comments for written response by ESB

o ESB to provide a written response for each of the chargers which were identified as having an issue

o ESB to look at issues around the accuracy of the information being provided on the map, particularly availability

[Deleted User]

unkel wrote: »

That'll be me. The lack of progress is just ridiculous though. For years the ESB were giving out they had no funding. Which was fair enough, although a lame excuse not to invest some of their own profits into the network. Now they are getting millions from the tax payer and we don't see it go to any fast chargers to speak of. Where is it going is the pertinent question.

Apologies if it appears I was shooting the messenger though, liamog. That was not my intention at all.

Thankfully, like ELM327, I now own a long range Tesla. Personally I don't need the network at all. That doesn't make me less passionate about the sorry state of our public network though. So I'm afraid you'll have to bear with me

As fair as I'm aware the ESB haven't received the millions.

liamog

[Deleted User] wrote: »

As fair as I'm aware the ESB haven't received the millions.

It's the first post on this thread, they were given €10,000,000 from the climate action fund to invest in the network, I think it's for the next 5 years.

unkel

o These type of sites (50kW + 150kW) will be quicker and require less infrastructure to build than the 4-8 vehicle hubs and so it is expected that more of these will be delivered in 2020

Tesla can do it in Ireland within months (relying of course on the ESB to provide the connection for 8 vehicle 300kW each hubs). Ionity can do it in Ireland within months (relying of course on the ESB to provide the connection for 4-6 vehicle 350kW each hubs)

Yet the ESB itself can't do it. They can't even do 4 vehicle hubs at 150kW each. How come? A matter of the shoemaker's children go barefoot? :rolleyes:

[Deleted User]

The ESB will use load balancing because it saves them money no other reason.

They're a joke and they should be pulled up on wasting taxpayers money and they should be held accountable for every cent and questioned about whether this approach of low power hubs is really the in the best interests of the taxpayer.

45-50 Kw was the standard in 2011 when the Leaf was released and nearly a decade later the ESB seem to think this is still the best approach. I Fail to see where the value for money here is.

Removing 2 AC points for a single DC point is not a good solution either where other more practical solutions exist such as 2 x DC points, charging 2 cars at 20 Kw DC is better than having one car charging at 45 Kw.

I've no idea who makes these decisions in the ESB but they really need to take a look at their strategy and rethink.

liamog

eCars currently show 76 sites with a CCS charger on the island. If they replace 50 2xAC22 with these 1xDC44 then that means there will be at least 125 sites where I can gain about 125km of range in 30 minutes.
It's not a brilliant expansion, but it does massively improve the geographic spread of basic rapid charging.

The 6 8 car hubs, plus 16 4 car hubs on major interurban routes are where the real investment should be, and it is coming. From the IEVOA minutes, it would appear these hubs are going to be 4x150kW and 2x150kW.
It's going to a bit annoying that CHAdeMO support is still required as it somewhat limits the load sharing ability, I would love to see a charger with 2xCCS and 1xCHAdeMO, it's probably the optimum for max utility whilst still providing support for what is fast becoming the Nissan proprietary connector.

[Deleted User]

It's a bit pathetic if these new 150 Kw sites have load balancing. Seriously, it's just madness.

More cars are capable of faster charging so this means if two cars are charging at max rate you will see around 75 Kw not a massive leap forward, it's just ridiculous but typically Irish.

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