Fox hunting

gozunda

Blazer wrote: »

They’re cats, not bloody lions and tigers mauling sheep and people across the country.
Christ you read some fair ****e on here sometimes but the above takes the biscuit.

The problem as highlighted previously are the known risks of Neospora or Toxoplasmosis to livestock from cats and dogs fouling in open fields. The OP appeared not to have given any thought on the issue. Hence the comments.

Bigbagofcans

Feisar wrote: »

Maybe it was just a turn of phrase and I am not one to nit pick however you dont think you'd have a problem!?!

What's your issue exactly?

Discodog

Blazer wrote: »

They’re cats, not bloody lions and tigers mauling sheep and people across the country.
Christ you read some fair ****e on here sometimes but the above takes the biscuit.

The cat thing is bizarre. Lots of so called animal lovers say that cats should be kept under control. The new Animal Welfare Act states that you must provide safeguards for the health and welfare of the animal. In some countries a lot of cats live permanently in the house but you would have to wonder if that would comply with the law here.

Feisar

Bigbagofcans wrote: »

What's your issue exactly?

Basically that in an instance described that no harm was being done to anyone or anything that you might not have a problem with someone else's pastime.

Not out for a huge arguement on it however it comes across as very entitled sounding.

Unearthly

gozunda wrote: »

Lol. The irony is amazing. You obviouly missed what was posted previously.

What the most bizarre thing about the whole vegan thing is that many of the thinkers behind the movement (ie the movers and shakers) - are now seriously proposing that wild predators be completly eradicated so as to stop what they refer to as 'wild animal suffering' ie foxes killing rabbits etc.

So forget about hunts dispersing or taking out a couple of foxes. It will be the widespread eradication of foxes as a species instead - by vegans! You do really sometimes have to wonder about the absolute lack of logic inherent in a movement which wants to dictate what others should do and what others should eat, wants to prevent well managed hunting but who now also want to play God by dictating which species will be allowed to live on this planet ...

The only wild predators I'd be in favour of being extinct are the likes of yourself and your hunting pals

Doctors room ghost

AudreyHepburn wrote: »

Yes the fox tears it’s prey apart once dead. But the foxhounds do it while the prey is still alive.

Can you really not see the difference?

Go on you tube and there's plenty of evidence on how a fox kills its prey.it doesn't cast a spell and magic it dead. They cause mayhem around lambs and fowl

Doctors room ghost

Bigbagofcans wrote: »

A trail hunt, is that like drag hunting? As long as the people on horses don't interfere with other people's property or pets/livestock then I don't think I'd have a problem.

Here's one of the easily offended commenting on a subject which they need verification on what it is they are actually responding to,stating in a self entitled way that they might not be offended by someone else's pass time depending on what that pass time actually is.a classic

Sheep breeder

gozunda wrote: »

You have to be having a laugh

The Bray Harriers Hunt? It's a freekin drag hunt. No foxes are hunted. A once off accident. How many foxes get smashed by fookers in cars?

Have to disagree with you that this was not a once off accident, several cases of hounds being lost around this time and the hunt master has since gone. This case of the hunt riding into these people’s property and not going back to sort until it was too late.

Sheep breeder

gozunda wrote: »

You know what a drag hunt is? Or do I have to explain no foxes are hunted. Pets and domestic animals get smashed on roads all the time but I see no complaints from the like of youse. Typical hypocritical bs from English inspired anti rubbish. The drag hunt apologised. More than most motorists would bother doing ffs.

The hunt apologised when they were forced to and only then.

gozunda

Discodog wrote: »

I am a country person & it's never been part of my culture or the many country people that I know. Lots of things were part of our culture eg child labour but we grew up & realised that they were unacceptable.

Depends what century and what country tbh. Industrial child labour was part of the industrial revolution - something I certainly never experienced in my lifetime growing up here anyway. We did have 'industrial' schools and hellish mother and baby homes - the leftover from victorian catholic hiarchy and puritancial domination. Ditto country - this is no little england and definitly do not want the class war bull**** beloved of many antis in england which goes on there - being spread here either. Mais c'est la vie.

Sheep breeder

gozunda wrote: »

So you know it was a Drag Hunt (no hunting whatsoever) and It would appear to have been an unfortunate and sad accident. And there wasn't even a conviction. So what's your point making milage about a news story nothing to do with any fox hunting whatsoever. your exaggeration is noted btw.

A little bit more behind this story with the hunt loosing a lot of ground to hunt on over this incident.

Buford T. Justice XIX

AudreyHepburn wrote: »

Yes the fox tears it’s prey apart once dead. But the foxhounds do it while the prey is still alive.

Can you really not see the difference?

Jaysus, Audrey, foxes don't wait till a lamb is dead before eating it. I've had to put lambs down and shoot foxes after seeing lambs wander around fields trailing their entrails.


I'm not sure where you got that information but it's as far from the truth as we are from the far edge of the universe!

Bigbagofcans

Feisar wrote: »

Basically that in an instance described that no harm was being done to anyone or anything that you might not have a problem with someone else's pastime.

Not out for a huge arguement on it however it comes across as very entitled sounding.

Wow you really are nitpicking. I don't know anything about draghunting hence my vague answer. I sound entitled? Get a life.

Bigbagofcans

Doctors room ghost wrote: »

Here's one of the easily offended commenting on a subject which they need verification on what it is they are actually responding to,stating in a self entitled way that they might not be offended by someone else's pass time depending on what that pass time actually is.a classic

That comment hurts my eyes.

anewme

Bigbagofcans wrote: »

That comment hurts my eyes.

Try saying it without taking a breath!!!

Doctors room ghost

Bigbagofcans wrote: »

That comment hurts my eyes.

Says the one talking about nitpicking.
When you have to resort to being a grammar nazi you really are scraping the bottom of the barrel.
Have to go now.heading out to see can I squeak a few foxes in within firing range and with this moon ill hardly even need the lamp.

anewme

Bigbagofcans wrote: »

That comment hurts my eyes.

Read it really quickly and just add.....

PARKLIFE

Bannasidhe

Doctors room ghost wrote: »

No rescues will take in hounds and no hunters will keep a load of hounds if they weren't allowed to hunt. The foxhound breed has been finely tuned over generations through selective breeding with the sole purpose of hunting a fox and running with a horse

Not true,
Every reputable Irish rescue takes in hounds. And rehomes hounds.

They also are the ones who go out in all weathers to get 'lost' hounds to safety after those responsible for the hounds have long since gone home to bed.

gozunda

Bannasidhe wrote: »

...

They also are the ones who go out in all weathers to get 'lost' hounds to safety after those responsible for the hounds have long since gone home to bed.

Again I'd say that does not match anyone I know who keeps hounds. Hounds are gathered and brought home asap. Any missing hounds are searched for until found. Locals who come across a lost or missing hound will ring and let the relevant person know or drop them off.
What I have seen in the last few years are people keeping hounds as pets and wondering why they are prone to escaping and often doing what hounds like doing. If they are used to a pack but not kept with others - they will often head of and escape looking for company. Just my own experiences of hounds.

Bigbagofcans

Doctors room ghost wrote: »

Says the one talking about nitpicking.
When you have to resort to being a grammar nazi you really are scraping the bottom of the barrel.
Have to go now.heading out to see can I squeak a few foxes in within firing range and with this moon ill hardly even need the lamp.

Animal abusers like you will get their karma some day. I'll sleep soundly tonight knowing I'm not a hunting scumbag like you.

AudreyHepburn

Buford T. Justice V wrote: »

Jaysus, Audrey, foxes don't wait till a lamb is dead before eating it. I've had to put lambs down and shoot foxes after seeing lambs wander around fields trailing their entrails.
U

I'm not sure where you got that information but it's as far from the truth as we are from the far edge of the universe!

Ok I was wrong, sorry. I didn’t mean to offend anyone.

But the point remains that there’s a world of difference between the fox doing what comes naturally out of necessity (it has to eat) and a pack of hounds doing it on the orders of people for their own entertainment.

Bigbagofcans

AudreyHepburn wrote: »

Ok I was wrong, sorry. I didn’t mean to offend anyone.

But the point remains that there’s a world of difference between the fox doing what comes naturally out of necessity (it has to eat) and a pack of hounds doing it on the orders of people for their own entertainment.

You shouldn't apologise. Hunters should be apologising for the pain and suffering of foxes.

Buford T. Justice XIX

Bigbagofcans wrote: »

You shouldn't apologise. Hunters should be apologising for the pain and suffering of foxes.

What's the hierarchy of suffering?


Are foxes 'worth' more than rabbits and hares?


Are they 'worth' more than lambs?


Is there a list out there quantifying the exact level of outrage we should be feeling and where do I find it?


We have had a major cull of foxes round here this winter because the mild winter so far has allowed more foxes to survive because of the ready availability of prey, namely rabbits and hares. Now they are mostly down below levels needed for foxes to comfortably maintain their population, they are going to try to source other prey, primarily lamb, or starve to death.


I also remember calving cows outside and one cow having difficulties in a slow calving in a mild winter like this one. I wasn't best pleased to see a fox dining on a calf, still alive, being born outside. Luckily, I was there before much damage was done but it took a lot of work to rear that calf when a portion of its lips were missing making sucking rather difficult.



There's no pain or suffering in culling foxes, one shot and the calves, lambs, rabbits and hares can breathe a sigh of relief.

Bigbagofcans

I doubt you, a hunter, cares much about hares and rabbits since you probably hunt them too.

Fox hunting causes unbearable suffering which hunters seem to get a kick out of.

Buford T. Justice XIX

Bigbagofcans wrote: »

I doubt you, a hunter, cares much about hares and rabbits since you probably hunt them too.

Fox hunting causes unbearable suffering which hunters seem to get a kick out of.

Probably?


Again writing a narrative around supposition rather than fact.


Hunting hares is illegal firstly and, as I'm lucky enough to have a number of them breeding here, I do my best to keep them from disappearing from the locality. Leaving too high a population of foxes wouldn't encourage a healthy breeding population of hares.


Rabbits, meh. I don't hunt them but they have no need for protection, breeding as they do, like rabbits.


Did you ever wonder how foxes train their cubs to kill? They bring live prey down their borrows or leave injured prey outside where their cubs can practice killing and having fun with it too.


It's not like anything I'm telling you is a great secret, there's plenty of documentary evidence and sources online available for anyone to scour for information.



Nature isn't a modern version of a Beatrix Potter novella where all animals live in peace and harmony and have high jinks down by the river.
Predators kill and eat prey, sometimes extremely horrifically, or die of starvation themselves. Bucolic, it isn't.

gozunda

Bigbagofcans wrote: »

I doubt you, a hunter, cares much about hares and rabbits since you probably hunt them too. Fox hunting causes unbearable suffering which hunters seem to get a kick out of.

Wrong. Foxes are legally shot and hunted in very small numbers because they sometimes cause problems. And yes the country has a very healthy and thrivng poplation of foxes. Yes rabbits are also legally hunted. Hares are protected. I've eaten rabbit many times and continue to do so. In my experience foxes are killed quickly and that has been pointed out many times. As 'getting a kick out of'. Thats bs. It is what It is. Most of times hunting with hounds is about making fox wary of humans and habitation and dispearsing them so they don't cause problems.

AudreyHepburn

Bigbagofcans wrote: »

You shouldn't apologise. Hunters should be apologising for the pain and suffering of foxes.

Agreed but I think we’re fighting a losing battle on that score.

But then again what would a silly Arts Alumni like me know?

AudreyHepburn

Buford T. Justice V wrote: »

Probably?


Again writing a narrative around supposition rather than fact.


Hunting hares is illegal firstly and, as I'm lucky enough to have a number of them breeding here, I do my best to keep them from disappearing from the locality. Leaving too high a population of foxes wouldn't encourage a healthy breeding population of hares.


Rabbits, meh. I don't hunt them but they have no need for protection, breeding as they do, like rabbits.


Did you ever wonder how foxes train their cubs to kill? They bring live prey down their borrows or leave injured prey outside where their cubs can practice killing and having fun with it too.


It's not like anything I'm telling you is a great secret, there's plenty of documentary evidence and sources online available for anyone to scour for information.



Nature isn't a modern version of a Beatrix Potter novella where all animals live in peace and harmony and have high jinks down by the river.
Predators kill and eat prey, sometimes extremely horrifically, or die of starvation themselves. Bucolic, it isn't.

Of course they do, no one is saying otherwise. Nature is cruel sometimes and we can all accept that.

But respectfully - can you and other supporters of the Hunt honestly not see the difference between a fox hunting out of necessity and people hunting for fun?

Doctors room ghost

Bigbagofcans wrote: »

Animal abusers like you will get their karma some day. I'll sleep soundly tonight knowing I'm not a hunting scumbag like you.

I prefer the term pest controller,big bag of cans.Many thanks.

Buford T. Justice XIX

AudreyHepburn wrote: »

Of course they do, no one is saying otherwise. Nature is cruel sometimes and we can all accept that.

But respectfully - can you and other supporters of the Hunt honestly not see the difference between a fox hunting out of necessity and people hunting for fun?

I don't hunt foxes for pleasure and I don't allow any hunts across my land. I hunt foxes out of necessity and in doing so reduce the levels of cruelty inflicted on their prey.


I neither like nor dislike foxes, a certain low level is one I can tolerate for the control they provide in reducing rabbit grazing of crops which impacts on yields and causes harvesting problems in cereal crops.


I have more tolerance for hunters than for for the glorified 'animal rights' activists who cause untold damage on farms by 'freeing' animals from housing and causing death and disease problems by their misguided antics. At least some benefit can accrue from the hunting, none at all from those activists stupidity.