Connacht Vs Ulster build up thread ( insert smart joke about both provinces here)

connemara man · 27-12-2018 12:44am #1

Dan McFarland returns to Connacht as the coach of a rival province.

The battle of the squad depth me thinks

troyzer · 27-12-2018 12:49am

Very much the undercard of the interpro weekend.

Sort of the Hurd vs Welborn to the Fury vs Wilder in Thomond Park this weekend.

They should let you lads play at half time actually, like the minis.

Peregrine · 27-12-2018 2:06am

troyzer wrote: »

They should let you lads play at half time actually, like the minis.

Well, it looks like Ulster are sending the kids down and Connacht should have the game won in fifteen minutes so it won't be far off the minis.

Burkie1203 · 27-12-2018 8:14am

Peregrine wrote: »

Well, it looks like Ulster are sending the kids down and Connacht should have the game won in fifteen minutes so it won't be far off the minis.

That gives them 65 minutes to throw it away again

ClanofLams · 27-12-2018 12:11pm

Truly shocking to see Leinster supporters living up to the stereotype of obnoxious dicks.

sydthebeat · 27-12-2018 12:12pm

Nothing wrong with that ulster team, should be a cracking game

connachta · 27-12-2018 12:20pm

Ulster lineup is strong. I'd take the 4 points
1st cap already for Fitzgerald n°2
Buckey and SOB are fit, that is massive good news

troyzer · 27-12-2018 12:21pm

ClanofLams wrote: »

Truly shocking to see Leinster supporters living up to the stereotype of obnoxious dicks.

It's true. Unless you'd argue that Connacht vs Ulster is a bigger draw?

jacothelad · 27-12-2018 12:27pm

ClanofLams wrote: »

Truly shocking to see Leinster supporters living up to the stereotype of obnoxious dicks.

That's not a stereotype.....that's just normality...:D

troyzer wrote: »

It's true. Unless you'd argue that Connacht vs Ulster is a bigger draw?

That depends on the size of your pencil.:D

troyzer · 27-12-2018 12:28pm

jacothelad wrote: »

ClanofLams wrote: »

Truly shocking to see Leinster supporters living up to the stereotype of obnoxious dicks.

That's not a stereotype.....that's just normality...:D

troyzer wrote: »

It's true. Unless you'd argue that Connacht vs Ulster is a bigger draw?

That depends on the size of your pencil.:D

HB mate.

27-12-2018 12:32pm

troyzer wrote: »

It's true. Unless you'd argue that Connacht vs Ulster is a bigger draw?

I think it might well be the better game. Connacht were box office last weekend at times, absolute joy to watch. Ulster are on a roll and will have an axe to grind.

Leinster Munster hasn't been anything much to write home about of late, not as much bite and the match threads suggest supporters are similarly subdued about it.

I'll watch both, if I was a neutral I'd say I'd be equally as excited for one as the other.

jacothelad · 27-12-2018 12:48pm

troyzer wrote: »

HB mate.

Too soft. You need a 4H.:D

connachta · 27-12-2018 12:49pm

Ulster fans are right sometimes, taken from their own forum :

Poster wrote:
Moore versus Buckley will be one of the key contests. Buckley is criminally underrated by Joe Schidt but takes apart every scrum he goes against. Not sure what else he can do to get a cap

Other Poster answer :
Move to Leinster.

:rolleyes:

its_phil · 27-12-2018 12:56pm

troyzer wrote: »

ClanofLams wrote: »

Truly shocking to see Leinster supporters living up to the stereotype of obnoxious dicks.

It's true. Unless you'd argue that Connacht vs Ulster is a bigger draw?

If you’re concerned about declaring the box office billing of a game unrelated to this thread, then yes you’ve already gone over the obnoxious line.

Right up there with the Cummiskeys, Fitzgeralds, and Fannings of the world, who remind you where any Leinster player not playing for Leinster is actually from Leinster.

connachta · 27-12-2018 1:21pm

awec · 27-12-2018 1:23pm

The Ulster team is stronger than I hoped for, which means next week is being written off

connachta · 27-12-2018 1:27pm

connachta wrote: »

Buckley | Moore | 50/50
Delahunt|Herring |45/55
Carey | EOS | 45/55
Roux | Nagle | 60/40
Thornbury | Treadwell | 50/50
SOB | Timoney | 55/45
Fainga'a | Murphy | 45/55
Butler | Coetzee | 50/50
Blade | Cooney | 45/55 (because of kicking)
Carty | McPhillips | 60/40 (no Burns)
Aki | Cave | 70/30 (no McCloskey)
Farrell | Addison | 45/55
Kelleher | Speight | 50/50
Godwin | Kernohan | 70/30
Leader | Ludik | 45/55

Yeah I think some "head-to-head" are tighter than some expect : Treadwell, Timoney, Moore, on one side, Fainga'a, Farrell, Kelleher on the other may hold the comparison with their counterparts

Bench : No Bealham and Healy, those n°18 and 23 go Ulster's way, otherwise Connacht bench seems slightly stronger

Home advantage into account : Connacht + 5 would be my prediction

Guys it's a Christmas miracle. I've made a functional table

mfceiling · 27-12-2018 1:45pm

connachta wrote: »

Guys it's a Christmas miracle. I've made a functional table

It's something more than a miracle that you've Coetzee at 50/50 with Butler.

Bridge93 · 27-12-2018 1:51pm

There is no world where Cian Kelleher is 50/50 with Henry Speight either

connachta · 27-12-2018 2:08pm

mfceiling wrote: »

It's something more than a miracle that you've Coetzee at 50/50 with Butler.

Butler is not brillant but absolutely well-rounded player. I was nice with Cootzee.

Kelleher will amaze you. I was not a fan until late, but he has progressed a lot lately

Dubinusa · 27-12-2018 2:13pm

Butler level with Coetzee, c'mon. Not even near.
Not good for Dillane? Thought he'd done enough to start.

connachta · 27-12-2018 2:20pm

Dubinusa wrote: »

Butler level with Coetzee, c'mon. Not even near.
Not good for Dillane? Thought he'd done enough to start.

Dillane/Thornbury last week
Thornbury/Roux this week
Dillane/Roux next week
Maksymiew/Cannon/Gallagher to help out vs Sale

That's just perfect squad rotation

Squidgy Black · 27-12-2018 2:20pm

Fainga'a is not even remotely close to Jordi Murphy, how on earth can you say he's within 5% of him

connachta · 27-12-2018 2:24pm

Squidgy Black wrote: »

Fainga'a is not even remotely close to Jordi Murphy, how on earth can you say he's within 5% of him

Fainga'a is a great player. Always 10 + tackles per game
He is, as Butler, just too light to be international. But he's clearly 5% from being such.
Boyle will be a storm coming off the bench too. I'm not worried at all about back-row
I'm less convinced by Copeland, so is Friend. More shinny ball-carrier, less efficient all-round

troyzer · 27-12-2018 2:28pm

connachta wrote: »

Squidgy Black wrote: »

Fainga'a is not even remotely close to Jordi Murphy, how on earth can you say he's within 5% of him

Fainga'a is a great player. Always 10 + tackles per game
He is, as Butler, just too light to be international. But he's clearly 5% from being such.
Boyle will be a storm coming off the bench too. I'm not worried at all about back-row
I'm less convinced by Copeland, so is Friend. More shinny ball-carrier, less efficient all-round

I think you might be wearing green coloured glasses there.

With very, very, very thick lenses.

connachta · 27-12-2018 2:33pm

I was spot on anyway, if you're looking to the odds Connacht are 5 to 6 points favorites now the teams are known.

Favorite but tight.
If Connacht lose, it won't be in the back-row IMO

2 real elements of fear are :
- Leader/Wingers under constant pressure from box-kick-machine-Cooney
- Delahunt/Heff throws

Former Former · 27-12-2018 3:11pm

connachta wrote: »

I was spot on anyway, if you're looking to the odds Connacht are 5 to 6 points favorites now the teams are known.

Five points with Paddy Power but it was seven before the teams were announced so it's swung towards Ulster.

Home advantage alone makes Connacht favourite, but Coetzee and Murphy are vastly superior to Butler and Fainga'a.

flatty · 27-12-2018 3:21pm

Home advantage means we will win this pulling up. Anything else is just dissembling.

connachta · 27-12-2018 3:26pm

Former Former wrote: »

Five points with Paddy Power but it was seven before the teams were announced so it's swung towards Ulster.

Home advantage alone makes Connacht favourite, but Coetzee and Murphy are vastly superior to Butler and Fainga'a.

That would make you burn alive to admit it, but this Connacht team is slightly superior to Ulster's, even more without Burns, Stockdale and McCloskey.
As Connacht XV was superior to Leinster's, and lost from the bench impacts

Clegg · 27-12-2018 3:33pm

Godwin on the wing again is a ballsy call. It's not his best position. He got a proper doing over from Adam Byrne last week.

bilston · 27-12-2018 3:33pm

connachta wrote: »

Buckley | Moore | 50/50
Delahunt|Herring |45/55
Carey | EOS | 45/55
Roux | Nagle | 60/40
Thornbury | Treadwell | 50/50
SOB | Timoney | 55/45
Fainga'a | Murphy | 45/55
Butler | Coetzee | 50/50
Blade | Cooney | 45/55 (because of kicking)
Carty | McPhillips | 60/40 (no Burns)
Aki | Cave | 70/30 (no McCloskey)
Farrell | Addison | 45/55
Kelleher | Speight | 50/50
Godwin | Kernohan | 70/30
Leader | Ludik | 45/55

Yeah I think some "head-to-head" are tighter than some expect : Treadwell, Timoney, Moore, on one side, Fainga'a, Farrell, Kelleher on the other may hold the comparison with their counterparts

Bench : No Bealham and Healy, those n°18 and 23 go Ulster way, otherwise Connacht bench seems slightly stronger

Home advantage into account : Connacht + 5 would be my prediction

Butler and Coetzee are 50/50?

connachta · 27-12-2018 3:57pm

bilston wrote: »

Butler and Coetzee are 50/50?

Stats do not mean everything. They still mean something.

The S-AF is used more often as a better carrier. Butler is lighter as I said, but not less effective to gain ground. And pretty simalar defender (1 tackle each 5 minute-period for Marcel, 1 tackle each 6 minute-period for Jarrod).

Coetzee

Apparences
14

Min Played
986

Tries
2

Passes Completed
49

Metres Gained
277

Carries
185

Defenders Beaten
35

Tackles
191

Butler

Appearances
11

Minutes Played
862

Try
1

Passes Completed
42

Metres Gained
240

Carries
83

Defenders Beaten
12

Tackles
141

irishgrover · 27-12-2018 4:03pm

connachta wrote: »

Stats do not mean everything. They still mean something.

The S-AF is used more often as a better carrier. Butler is lighter as I said, but not less effective to gain ground. And pretty simalar defender (1 tackle each 5 minute-period for Marcel, 1 tackle each 6 minute-period for Jarrod).

Coetzee

Apparences
14

Min Played
986
Tries
2

Passes Completed
49

Metres Gained
277

Carries
185

Defenders Beaten
35

Tackles 191

Butler

Appearances
11

Minutes Played
862

Try
1

Passes Completed
42

Metres Gained
240

Carries
83

Defenders Beaten
12

Tackles
141

pretty disapointing that you went and learned to do a table properly and then posted this monstrosity... :-)

connachta · 27-12-2018 4:04pm

irishgrover wrote: »

pretty disapointing that you went and learned to do a table properly and then posted this monstrosity... :-)

I've made you demanding:D

Wegians89 · 27-12-2018 4:22pm

The back row of Boyle, faingaa and butler was deemed to be weaker than rudduck, leavy and Doris last week. And personally felt the Connacht backroads were superior last week.

I think sob brings more balance to the Connacht backrow this week and as suck should be a stronger unit. I think murphy and Coetzee are very good players and was extremely impressed with Coetzee in the match between these two teams in the kingspan but I do think the Connacht backrow as a unit will come out on top again this week.

Saying that if Connacht could sign one player from ulster I’d have Coetzee a head of any of the rest

joseywhales · 27-12-2018 4:25pm

If coetzee was irish qualified I'd have him as cover for eight(after stander), he is test level, I don't think Butler is there yet

Wegians89 · 27-12-2018 4:37pm

joseywhales wrote: »

If coetzee was irish qualified I'd have him as cover for eight(after stander), he is test level, I don't think Butler is there yet

I think Coetzee would push very hard for a starting spot tbh. I don’t think there’s much between the pair apart from the injury’s.

On butler he’s more of a jordie murphy type. He’ll give an 8/10 preformance in any of the back row positions every week. Would be very useful in a World Cup type squad. He’s probably best at 7 though

KBurke85 · 27-12-2018 5:06pm

Clegg wrote: »

Godwin on the wing again is a ballsy call. It's not his best position. He got a proper doing over from Adam Byrne last week.

Not a ballsy call he’s simply the last fit option we have for the wing

stephen_n · 27-12-2018 5:20pm

ClanofLams wrote: »

Truly shocking to see Leinster supporters living up to the stereotype of obnoxious dicks.

A couple of Swallows does not a summer make, or something to that effect.

realhorrorshow · 27-12-2018 5:26pm

A French club is going to offer one of the two 500k+ a year, and it isn’t Jarrad.

connachta · 27-12-2018 5:56pm

Good for Connacht!

And French clubs are not particularly good examples. Big names, small results, some failures.

connachta · 27-12-2018 6:18pm

(all converted per 100 Minutes played)

Head-to-Head | Colby Fainga'a | Jordi Murphy
Passes Completed | 5,19 | 3,98
Metres Gained | 21,6 | 12,6
Carries | 13,5 | 11,9
Defenders Beaten | 0,3 | 1
Tackles | 14,7 | 13,9

troyzer · 27-12-2018 6:23pm

connachta wrote: »

(all converted per 100 Minutes played)

Head-to-Head | Colby Fainga'a | Jordi Murphy
Passes Completed | 5,19 | 3,98
Metres Gained | 21,6 | 12,6
Carries | 13,5 | 11,9
Defenders Beaten | 0,3 | 1
Tackles | 14,7 | 13,9

You made this just so you can deploy your new found table prowess, just admit it.

Burkie1203 · 27-12-2018 6:26pm

connachta wrote: »

Good for Connacht!

And French clubs are not particularly good examples. Big names, small results, some failures.

The stats mean very little. The Ulster lads are playing in Champions Cup. Higher level of rugby. Have you factored that in.

connachta · 27-12-2018 6:29pm

troyzer wrote: »

You made this just so you can deploy your new found table prowess, just admit it.

No you can check the figures.
But I enjoyed the table indeed

connachta · 27-12-2018 6:31pm

Burkie1203 wrote: »

The stats mean very little. The Ulster lads are playing in Champions Cup. Higher level of rugby. Have you factored that in.

That matters. A bit

I said as a precaution

Stats do not mean everything. They still mean something.

Burkie1203 · 27-12-2018 6:35pm

connachta wrote: »

That matters. A bit

I said as a precaution

But you cant use stats to judge players on two different teams with two different coaching teams.

Coetzee and Jordi will be the two best backrows on the pitch on Friday. That doesnt mean they will be the two best performers on the night but they have played at a far higher level then anyone else.

Wegians89 · 27-12-2018 6:59pm

Burkie1203 wrote: »

But you cant use stats to judge players on two different teams with two different coaching teams.

Coetzee and Jordi will be the two best backrows on the pitch on Friday. That doesnt mean they will be the two best performers on the night but they have played at a far higher level then anyone else.

Butler has 61 super rugby appearances
Faingaa has 101 super rugby appearances
I’m sure they played some high level stuff.

I think Coetzee is the best individual backrow starting and Murphy is probably the second. I do think butler and faingaa are underrated by other provinces fan basis, as Leinster found out last week.

Burkie1203 · 27-12-2018 7:09pm

Wegians89 wrote: »

Butler has 61 super rugby appearances
Faingaa has 101 super rugby appearances
I’m sure they played some high level stuff.

I think Coetzee is the best individual backrow starting and Murphy is probably the second. I do think butler and faingaa are underrated by other provinces fan basis, as Leinster found out last week.

They haven't been playing Super Rugby this season though. My post was about the stats and how they are distorted by the level of opposition.

Wegians89 · 27-12-2018 7:45pm

Burkie1203 wrote: »

They haven't been playing Super Rugby this season though. My post was about the stats and how they are distorted by the level of opposition.

Apologies thought you were speaking in general rather than this season.

connachta · 27-12-2018 7:45pm

Wegians89 wrote: »

Butler has 61 super rugby appearances
Faingaa has 101 super rugby appearances
I’m sure they played some high level stuff.

I think Coetzee is the best individual backrow starting and Murphy is probably the second. I do think butler and faingaa are underrated by other provinces fan basis, as Leinster found out last week.

That's exactly what I've been trying to say for 10 days.

And the gap, way thinner than most think, may be null or the reverse tomorrow. If you add SOB and Butler, Connacht may have the better back-row. Same was said against Leavy/Doris/Ruddock. Same will be said vs any Munster combo, except the best alltogether (TOD/POM/Stander)

And it's about back-row, not overall "green-glasses". As I pointed, Delahunt throws and Leader under high-balls may cost Connacht the game, with more likelihood..

Connacht Vs Ulster build up thread ( insert smart joke about both provinces here)

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