FTTH installation equipment ONT / ODP / Wireless Routers etc...

Andy From Sligo

fritzelly wrote: »

Breaking news - you don't own a thread you started.

You are just looking for someone to agree with you and do what is not allowed, won't work and will end up screwing everyone else up
You are not allowed to interfere with OE's network - that means implanting your own ONT on to their network. End of story, stop recycling the same crap.

I am not going to do it myself - I was mentioning though if someone else gives another ONT it a go and it works then I am all ears and would be interested . What is wrong with that - some people in this world do take chances and experiment ... even with things they are prohibited to do ,

fritzelly

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

I am not going to do it myself - I was mentioning though if someone else gives another ONT it a go and it works then I am all ears and would be interested . What is wrong with that - some people in this world do take chances and experiment ... even with things they are prohibited to do ,

Not gonna happen, good god man
Why would anyone else try it to satisfy your curiousity.

OK, I tried it and got my connection cut off and told I could never use the OE network again. Still ended up having to pay eir for the whole contract length even tho I had no service because i tried to use my own hardware.
Are you happy now.

tuxy

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

I am not going to do it myself - I was mentioning though if someone else gives another ONT it a go and it works then I am all ears and would be interested . What is wrong with that - some people in this world do take chances and experiment ... even with things they are prohibited to do ,

So fritzelly is correct. All you're waiting for is someone, anyone, to tell you it's OK to do. And this is why you keep asking the same question because eventually someone will be clueless enough to tell you to go for it?

Marlow

NEWS: "Andy from Sligo jailed, as he was found guilty in aiding and encouraging crimes against national telecoms infrastructure and thus tampering with critical emergency infrastructure."

/M

Johnboy1951

fritzelly wrote: »

Not gonna happen, good god man
Why would anyone else try it to satisfy your curiousity.

OK, I tried it and got my connection cut off and told I could never use the OE network again. Still ended up having to pay eir for the whole contract length even tho I had no service because i tried to use my own hardware.
Are you happy now.

Are they taking any legal action against you for 'interfering' with their network?

tuxy

Marlow wrote: »

NEWS: "Andy from Sligo jailed, as he was found guilty in aiding and encouraging crimes against national telecoms infrastructure and thus tampering with critical emergency infrastructure."

/M

Pleads insanity, says he hasn't been listing to his doc's(psyc) advice

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

dont worry - i go to the doctors sometimes (only when dragged) and ask questions and then use my discretion as to follow up on their recommendations and advice too

Marlow

Johnboy1951 wrote: »

Are they taking any legal action against you for 'interfering' with their network?

If you cost them money ? Absolutely.

And when you take a cluster with 30+ customers down, it's going to cost them money.

/M

Andy From Sligo

fritzelly wrote: »

Breaking news - you don't own a thread you started.

breaking news - nor do people posting replies in a thread own the thread , and cannot ask for it to be locked because they dont like it

or silence me because they are upset that I am not necessarily taking their advice or agreeing with them

if people are fed up with giving me advice why are they constantly answering back on this thread I have made why are they not going onto other threads.

when I started this thread I didnt even think anyone would answer me because it seemed I was already pee'ing of people on the FTTH rural thread ... so I started my own thread .. and then people crossed over from the FTTH rural thread and started on me ... what is the agenda here and why do people feel the urgent need to constantly reply to me when I am not after advice from them ... well not useless advice like "you have asked this question a milion time and you have got the answer a million times and you go off and do your own thing or think you know best yada yada yada" - why? - why are people even worried now whether I choose to act or not act on the advice I am given or not ?

people need a lesson in that just because someone asks for information they can choose what to do with the information they are given and do with it what they feel is right for them .

If people think its rude , or havent got patience with someone asking the same questions sorry and all that - go and answer someone else then maybe someone you think will take your advice and leave me bloody alone.

saying "you ask the same questions" and "you dont follow the advice given" and other things like that dont help me one iota to understand things any clearer its a waste of your time writing and my time reading it and repying to it I have got better things to do .. I dont know about yourselves???

Marlow

Also ... Andy ... your repetitive asking the same questions over and over and over again ..

And your asking questions, that are answered in other threads ...

Is against the Forum Charter & Broadband FAQ.

You should have read that first.

It says right there at the top, second bulletin:

-Please try to use search before posting a question as your question could be very common and asked every almost every day/week.

Gets even worse when you ask a question, you've asked yourself previously.

/M

Andy From Sligo

fritzelly wrote: »

.....

OK, I tried it and got my connection cut off and told I could never use the OE network again. Still ended up having to pay eir for the whole contract length even tho I had no service because i tried to use my own hardware.
Are you happy now.

good - have you really tried this IRL and did this really happen? or are you just being hypothetical and making this all up?

fritzelly

As Marlow said yes they would, normal people don't do it. Even a case for saying its hacking of their network which it is

Andy From Sligo

tuxy wrote: »

So fritzelly is correct. All you're waiting for is someone, anyone, to tell you it's OK to do. And this is why you keep asking the same question because eventually someone will be clueless enough to tell you to go for it?

nope, it would be handy to let someone else try it though and if something went wrong and they had the knowledge to put it right and not affect other peoples connections or the OE network then yes - why not , if someone was willing?

Already established I cant or wont do it / try it out myself

Andy From Sligo

Marlow wrote: »

NEWS: "Andy from Sligo jailed, as he was found guilty in aiding and encouraging crimes against national telecoms infrastructure and thus tampering with critical emergency infrastructure."

/M

yes thats correct I held a gun to someones head and said "put that ONT on the network now or I pull the trigger! scum!"

Andy From Sligo

Marlow wrote: »

If you cost them money ? Absolutely.

And when you take a cluster with 30+ customers down, it's going to cost them money.

/M

I am predicting this is hypothetical at this stage at the moment .. and hasnt actually happened or never happened - even when eircom /telecom eireann were a state owned company and someone damaged the copper phone network somehow?

do you want people to take you serious ? - show a case where someone has been prosecuted / jailed for damaging the network?

tuxy

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

nope, it would be handy to let someone else try it though and if something went wrong and they had the knowledge to put it right and not affect other peoples connections or the OE network then yes - why not , if someone was willing?

But it's been established that no one who understands enough about how the network works would do something that stupid. Only someone who didn't fully understand would try this.
You have people who work for ISPs and even KN field tech's telling you why it's a terrible thing to even try and you're too ignorant to listen.

oscarBravo

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

has anyone physically tried a different ONT ?

I'll repeat this again, because it's a very important point you're avoiding:

The ONT is part of open eir's network.

You're talking about replacing a part of someone else's telecommunications network. You have no right or authority to do that. If you want to faff around with ONTs, build your own PON network - Ubiquiti sell some pretty cost-effective gear.

It's not your ONT. Don't f*ck about with it. Leave it alone.

Andy From Sligo

tuxy wrote: »

But it's been established that no one who understands enough about how the network works would do something that stupid. Only someone who didn't fully understand would try this.
You have people who work for ISPs and even KN field tech's telling you why it's a terrible thing to even try and you're too ignorant to listen.

ah no, I am listening ... and i am taking note . otherwise I would have ordered one and tried it myself and I am not going to

fritzelly

One reason for this thread to be locked...
You are asking for advice as to how, or for someone to, interfere with the incumbent telco

Do you realise how stupid this is?

tuxy

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

ah no, I am listening ... and i am taking note . otherwise I would have ordered one and tried it myself and I am not going to

Now you are contradicting yourself. If you were listening you would not make idiotic comments like this.

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

nope, it would be handy to let someone else try it though and if something went wrong and they had the knowledge to put it right and not affect other peoples connections or the OE network then yes - why not , if someone was willing?

gctest50

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

good - have you really tried this IRL and did this really happen? or are you just being hypothetical and making this all up?

One reason is gpon sprays all your neighbours download traffic down "your" fibre too

If they let anyone connect anything( that's say cert'd but not tested ) - someone may get extra curios with their new toy and notice the above

You could* then watch all your neighbours downloads



*t&c's apply

Andy From Sligo

oscarBravo wrote: »

I'll repeat this again, because it's a very important point you're avoiding:

The ONT is part of open eir's network.

You're talking about replacing a part of someone else's telecommunications network. You have no right or authority to do that. If you want to faff around with ONTs, build your own PON network - Ubiquiti sell some pretty cost-effective gear.

It's not your ONT. Don't f*ck about with it. Leave it alone.

and I am not going to touch it - thanks. Just saying though if someone does feel brave / silly / inquisitive or whatever and thinks "I wonder what really would happen if I unplug the patch cable and put it into a combined wireless ONT what would happen?" - I would like to hear about it - not forcing anyone. But if they did and posted pictures up and gave a step by step on what happened regardless what anyone else thinks about it I would like to see the outcome ... nothing wrong in that is there? - I am not forcing someone to do it , but if they want to have a go like fair play to ya :rolleyes:

I dont want anyone to break the law like . If you (or anyone) thinks it will /does or are going to get caught or if OE dont even get to know about it or you think it might degrade the network ... then dont do it! ...

tuxy

But it is illegal to tamper with a network you do not own and it will degrade/comprise it so that's the end of it.
There can never be a post about it on boards as it's illegal. Go to a forum that encourages illegal activity.

Andy From Sligo

tuxy wrote: »

Now you are contradicting yourself. If you were listening you would not make idiotic comments like this.

I am going to try and find a post (I dont know if its in this thread or the other rural FTTH thread) where someone else said it could be possible "if you know what you are doing" - I am sure i didnt read it

oscarBravo

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

...if they want to have a go like fair play to ya :rolleyes:

No. Not fair play to them. I don't care whether it's you or someone else. It's not your ONT, and it's not theirs either.

If you want to know what happens when you plug random crap into a GPON network, build a GPON network and plug random crap into it. If you're not curious enough to bother building your own GPON network, then let it go.

Those of us who are interested in networks build our own networks (including fibre networks) to play with. We don't vandalise other people's networks (or try to entice others to vandalise other people's networks) just to see what happens.

gctest50

Anyway, you'd achieve nothing really


Get new box.
Measure output of old box
Measure output of remote yoke
Adjust new box to suit
Spoof serial number/password of old box
Connect it up

Yay ! internets

same as you had before, still no faster, still have to pay

tuxy

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

I am going to try and find a post (I dont know if its in this thread or the other rural FTTH thread) where someone else said it could be possible "if you know what you are doing" - I am sure i didnt read it

If I registered a new account and said I had installed my own ONT and posted a few pictures(fakes) would that make you happy? Congrats, you finally have the go ahead to do something stupid. There are plenty of trolls out there ready to take advantage of peoples stupidity and I have to say I'd be tempted if I didn't think the post would be deleted right away. :pac:

Andy From Sligo

tuxy wrote: »

But it is illegal to tamper with a network you do not own and it will degrade/comprise it so that's the end of it.
There can never be a post about it on boards as it's illegal. Go to a forum that encourages illegal activity.

I see what you are saying .. you are saying I am condoning illegal activity by saying that I would like to find out what happened if someone tried a different ONT - I am only condoning illegal activity if I forced someone to do it .. I am not forcing anyone to do anything and if they did go ahead and do it they would have to be accountable for their own actions saing in court "Andy told me to do it or suggested that I do it" is not going to hold up in court :rolleyes:

by the way - I think degrade/compromise is just a theory at this present time - if its a kosher ONT made by a Kosher manufacturer and generic and can be used on any Gpon network (and is) er then I cannot see why it would compimise or degrade anyone elses connection - nobody know because no-one as far as I can tell has physically tried out say a Huawei HG8245 unit on the network - this is the point

tuxy

Did you not read the posts about SIRO equipment not working on the Eir network even though they are the same type of network? It was in response to some of your posts so I'm sure you have.
Do you find the English language challenging?

Andy From Sligo

oscarBravo wrote: »

No. Not fair play to them. I don't care whether it's you or someone else. It's not your ONT, and it's not theirs either.

If you want to know what happens when you plug random crap into a GPON network, build a GPON network and plug random crap into it. If you're not curious enough to bother building your own GPON network, then let it go.

Those of us who are interested in networks build our own networks (including fibre networks) to play with. We don't vandalise other people's networks (or try to entice others to vandalise other people's networks) just to see what happens.

OK then lets re-word it then . Those that are interested in building Gpon networks , can you try out a generic Huawei HG8245 ONT/wireless router and if you can I would like to know if it degrades /vandalise the other connection on your Gpon network you have built ?

oscarBravo

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

OK then lets re-word it then . Those that are interested in building Gpon networks , can you try out a generic Huawei HG8245 ONT/wireless router and if you can I would like to know if it degrades /vandalise the other connection on your Gpon network you have built ?

If you really want to know, build a network. If you don't want to build a network, then you clearly don't care enough.

gctest50

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

......

Huawei HG8245 ..................

Them are only for third-world countries


HN8255W is what you need

Andy From Sligo

tuxy wrote: »

Did you not read the posts about SIRO equipment not working on the Eir network even though they are the same type of network? It was in response to some of your posts so I'm sure you have.
Do you find the English language challenging?

no sorry about that I dont recall reading it - i am only human (posts are so fast moving sometimes I may miss a few posts if they are coming in thick and fast ) - and sometimes I havent got time to re-read the whole thread all over again

why did you have to end that off personal attack at the end, did you have to add that jibe? ... say if i did find the English Language challenging ? - or say if I did have a learning difficulty or something like that? - are you a prejudice or judgmental kind of person are ye?

Andy From Sligo

oscarBravo wrote: »

If you really want to know, build a network. If you don't want to build a network, then you clearly don't care enough.

oh no, I havent got that kind of expertise - wouldnt know where to start and is it expensive? -

Do I care enough ... I dunno. when I get my FTTH I will just be glad to get it whatever equipment it comes with - would I be interested if someone tried an all in one ONT with built in wireless and it worked .. then hell yes , I'd love to know if it worked and how it worked out for them

Andy From Sligo

gctest50 wrote: »

Them are only for third-world countries


HN8255W is what you need

ah yeah - I was looking at the HG8245Q dual band 802.11ac model

the normal HG8245 only has wireless N

fritzelly

Some threads are interesting, some just start as pure trolling and prove themselves as such so...
Signing off

Andy From Sligo

fritzelly wrote: »

Some threads are interesting, some just start as pure trolling and prove themselves as such so...
Signing off

nite, sweet dreams - I was just about to retire myself ... I would have done an hour ago if i didnt have to answer people on this thread ...

Snaga

The chances of the combined Huawei RG device you are looking at working (if the serial is configured on the OLT) is very high if the OLT is also a Huawei device and both are on recent software releases. (Despite putting the PON into an unpredictable/untested state).

The point people are making is that the above knowledge doesn't help you in this case, as you will never get the serial number configured on the OLT with your existing service provider, and the overwhelming advice (from those with experience here) is that this is best practice for this kind of wholesale based network.

My specific advice to you, is go look for Ethernet based Routers, get the best WiFi you can, with all the bells and whistles you need it and connect it to your ONT's Ethernet port.

You get the Router you want, that you can upgrade whenever you want in the future - with no worries about having to get your service provider to do anything to support you.

Andy From Sligo

Snaga wrote: »

The chances of the combined Huawei RG device you are looking at working (if the serial is configured on the OLT) is very high if the OLT is also a Huawei device and both are on recent software releases. (Despite putting the PON into an unpredictable/untested state).

The point people are making is that the above knowledge doesn't help you in this case, as you will never get the serial number configured on the OLT with your existing service provider, and the overwhelming advice (from those with experience here) is that this is best practice for this kind of wholesale based network.

My specific advice to you, is go look for Ethernet based Routers, get the best WiFi you can, with all the bells and whistles you need it and connect it to your ONT's Ethernet port.

You get the Router you want, that you can upgrade whenever you want in the future - with no worries about having to get your service provider to do anything to support you.

thank you very much for the reply Snaga much appreciated. I think I have understood. so what you have said is that if both the original ONT supplied by OE is Huawei (which it is it seems, well the small one that fits into the cradle now on latest installs) and you had one of these all-in-one ONT with built in Dual Band ac wireless router and (i think someone said earlier on in the thread) if the serial was 'spoofed' and the right parameters entered from the original ONT(i wouldnt even know how to go about that - sounds like some serious hacking of the ONT , most I have hacked is rooting android phones ) If it were to be spoofed with this serial number and right parameters there is a high chance it will get the pon signal and stay on it and the OLT at the exchange would be none the wiser and keep you connected and not kick you off? am not going to do it myself i'm just fishing for information and see if it could be done , but theriotically if someone copied the required details of the OE supplied ONT and then put them into a generic huawei ONT/wireless router all in one then the chances are high it would work?

if someone did do that and successfully got such an all in one device working properly and it wasnt damaging the OE infrastructure in any way or affecting any other users how likely would OE say "you are not using the required ONT" and tell you to remove it or have your fibre connection discontinued would you reckon? - if it was all working OK or is it likely would they just turn a blind eye and let you get on with it ?

when I do finally get my FTTH installed and if my ISP agrees to it , I most probably will end up swapping out the ISP supplied wireless router and put my trusted HG659 wireless router in its place because I am used to it and i find it alright for my needs - although some people say its got weak wi-fi and some say its a rubbish router I find it alright. if permitted by my ISP I will just plug the ethernet cable from the ONT into the WAN socket of the HG659 and set up the Vlan tag and just carry on using it. I'm not getting any VOIP in the package so i shouldnt need any SIP details and the router has dual band ac wireless as well (even though I am only getting the 150mbps package)

sorry mod's if this post is classed as hacking and against boards rules because someone earlier on was mentioning about spoofing the serial number on a device or something but if it is can you just remove this post and leave the other posts intact on this thread thanks because i would still like to discuss about the equipment used in Irish FTTH installations.

Snaga

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

if someone did do that and successfully got such an all in one device working properly and it wasnt damaging the OE infrastructure in any way or affecting any other users how likely would OE say "you are not using the required ONT" and tell you to remove it or have your fibre connection discontinued would you reckon? - if it was all working OK or is it likely would they just turn a blind eye and let you get on with it ?
. [/B]

Just because it might work now, does not mean it will work later (after network upgrades for example). OE wont be testing that combination of hardware and software as part of their upgrade test plan. (This has been explained already several times, you are forgetting things that steer you away from your preferred course of action again, focus....FOCUS!)

Only OE can answer the question for you regarding staying on the network - but I can say that if it was my network and I discovered a user spoofed a serial number to get a Rogue device onto the network which caused an outage or degradation in service for others - I would have them spliced off the network in a heartbeat.

Andy From Sligo

Snaga wrote: »

Just because it might work now, does not mean it will work later (after network upgrades for example). OE wont be testing that combination of hardware and software as part of their upgrade test plan. (This has been explained already several times, you are forgetting things that steer you away from your preferred course of action again, focus....FOCUS!)

Only OE can answer the question for you regarding staying on the network - but I can say that if it was my network and I discovered a user spoofed a serial number to get a Rogue device onto the network which caused an outage or degradation in service for others - I would have them spliced off the network in a heartbeat.

thanks yes I forgot about upgrade thing - isnt that done by TR-069? so if your new ONT/wireless router had TR-069 and it was ticked in settings they could push a firmware upgrade to their supplied ONT and it would be the wrong firmware for the all-in-one ONT/wireless device and either brick it or just not accept it.

This rogue device , do you think a genuine Huaewi device would be classed as a rogue device or something that would break the infrastructure or affect other users ? - I could understand a cheap china chingyana happy day ONT device doing that but I wouldnt have though a kosher Huawei device. ?

Snaga

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

This rogue device , do you think a genuine Huaewi device would be classed as a rogue device or something that would break the infrastructure or affect other users ? - I could understand a cheap china chingyana happy day ONT device doing that but I wouldnt have though a kosher Huawei device. ?

I explained what a Rogue device is 2 days ago.

Snaga wrote: »

"Any ONT that performs outside of the OLT specification for whatever reason regardless of manufacturer or 'quality' and impacts other users on the same split."

Which part is hard to understand?

Andy From Sligo

Snaga wrote: »

I explained what a Rogue device is.

I missed it sorry - I will go searching after i have had my fry up .. was it on this thread?

Snaga wrote: »

Which part is hard to understand?

most of it

EDIT: oh God sorry - I have seen it. I am not with it today , half asleep ...

Snaga

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

I missed it sorry - I will go searching after i have had my fry up .. was it on this thread?

Yes. Page 5.

Andy From Sligo

I was misunderstanding, I thought rogue devices were cheaply made devices with terrible components inside or shoddy made that could ruin the network

BArra

How was the fry up?

tuxy

Posting LMGTFY is not smart or clever but obviously something is going wrong when you told me a month ago you would google to find out what a rouge ONT is.
I hope this helps, it mostly links to articles in layman terms. If you have problems with the written language you can search the same terms on youtube and find videos.

http://bfy.tw/Ko88
http://bfy.tw/Ko8E
http://bfy.tw/3Tyk
http://bfy.tw/5n5y

Andy From Sligo

BArra wrote: »

How was the fry up?

very lovely thanks - i substituted the black and white pudding for baked beans ...

Andy From Sligo

tuxy wrote: »

...you told me a month ago you would google to find out what a rouge ONT is.
....

I say a lot of things .. whether i get round to doing it is another matter.

My memory is shocking thing lately as well . i'm only in my 50's but sometimes I cannot even remember what i did last week or looked up - i most probably have full blown dementia by the time i get to 60 ....

maybe I looked it up - but forgot what i read

tuxy

That's ok, sounds like the your time would be better spent rereading. Make notes if you have to.
If you can came back with new questions we will have made outstanding progress.

Andy From Sligo

I dont know if i have asked this before , or did but cant remember the answer so sorry if i am repeating myself , but there is no problem when i come to get FTTH installed of swapping out the ISP supplied router with my existing Huawei HG659 router is there if I find that there is hardly any difference between the ISP supplied router and the HG659 - the only thing I suppose I would loose is any technical support from the ISP because they will say i am not using the supplied router. - is that the only thing I have to be aware of or is there anything else I should be aware of using my existing router? - I suppose I will have to set the Vlan tag .. what is that 10 is it? - and just set the settings to DHCP wan/Wlan mode wont I - it wouldnt be static address the ISP gives you on FTTH is it?