Poppy

RandomName2

Berserker wrote: »

I can tell you what will be in place by then, a nice hard border between Northern Ireland and Southern Ireland. And the Southern Irish are going to end up paying for the EU's portion of that bill.

It's Ireland, not 'Southern Ireland'.

FrancieBrady

Folkstonian wrote: »

The appeal is not on the way out though, not just yet.

I have no doubt about that. The BA needs the support obviously. And it gives the Irish branch their annual chance to wave the flag.

Folkstonian

Deleted User wrote: »

The UK mightn't be on any map after 11pm on 29 March next year.........

Oh and believe me I’m very sad at the referendum result. I voted the other way. Not sure what your point is though. Other than to be vaguely snide.

Deleted User

Deleted User wrote: »

Has Donegal been expelled?

The status of Donegal has always been uncertain.........

Originally posted by Berserker: I can tell you what will be in place by then, a nice hard border between Northern Ireland and Southern Ireland. And the Irish are going to end up paying for the EU's portion of that bill.

Thanks for crystallizing Arlene Foster's dreams/hopes/delusions (take your pick) into an actual paragraph. A 'leader' willing to destroy her own country just to stay 'British'.

citytillidie

Berserker wrote: »

Think it's going to disappear into nothing? I think not.

I can tell you what will be in place by then, a nice hard border between Northern Ireland and Southern Ireland. And the Southern Irish are going to end up paying for the EU's portion of that bill.

Where is this Southern Ireland?

There is Northern Ireland and Ireland, Republic of Ireland only for football

FrancieBrady

Folkstonian wrote: »

Oh and believe me I’m very sad at the referendum result. I voted the other way. Not sure what your point is though. Other than to be vaguely snide.

The point being that the biggest poppy wearing community on this island are likely to be the ones to precipitate or speed up the break up of the UK.

Folkstonian

Folkstonian wrote: »

Oh and believe me I’m very sad at the referendum result. I voted the other way. Not sure what your point is though. Other than to be vaguely snide.

Not being snide at all. In a way the gif represents the diminishing influence of the UK on the European & world stage illustrated by the act of Brexit. You still have time to stop the madness IMO.

Hoboo

Berserker wrote: »

Think it's going to disappear into nothing? I think not.

I can tell you what will be in place by then, a nice hard border between Northern Ireland and Southern Ireland. And the Southern Irish are going to end up paying for the EU's portion of that bill.

So people from Cork, Waterford, Tipperary and Kerry are going to pay 'the bill'? To quote Oscar Wilde, "You can never be overdressed or overeducated". I'd imagine you walk around in your underwear.

citytillidie

Spook_ie wrote: »

Ireland as a state didn't, Ireland as an island within the geographical term of The British Isles did.

1st use of British Isles was 1577, i say Ireland existed long before then

Folkstonian

FrancieBrady wrote: »

I have no doubt about that. The BA needs the support obviously. And it gives the Irish branch their annual chance to wave the flag.

I have a former Royal Marines Commando Officer and a former Puma helicopter pilot (which is RAF) in my extended family.
They’d also be eligible for RBL support even though none were in the Army, but thankfully they are happy and healthy with a good support base around them, very lucky as there appears to be no particular rhyme nor reason to the way PTSD chooses its victims
but I certainly agree that the MoD could do more to support former service personnel.
But the reality is they don’t, or can’t, because of politically motivated austerity that has hit the MoD as it has every other ministry on Whitehall
It’s to politicians’ eternal shame that they ask so much of men and women and then fail them so appallingly when the fighting stops. Maybe we’ve found one thing we agree on at last..
And with the reality being as it is, I think it’s a basic human need to want to give charitably despite the responsibility not truly being their own

RandomName2

citytillidie wrote: »

1st use of British Isles was 1577, i say Ireland existed long before then

In fairness, you don't seem to be in any position to teach people about history..

Edward M

[Deleted User] wrote: »

The UK mightn't be on any map after 11pm on 29 March next year.........

I'm no fan of British colonialism, but I wonder how that map might look but for them too.

FrancieBrady

Folkstonian wrote: »

I have a former Royal Marines Commando Officer and a former Puma helicopter pilot (which is RAF) in my extended family.
They’d also be eligible for RBL support even though none were in the Army, but thankfully they are happy and healthy with a good support base around them, very lucky as there appears to be no particular rhyme nor reason to the way PTSD chooses its victims
but I certainly agree that the MoD could do more to support former service personnel.
But the reality is they don’t, or can’t, because of politically motivated austerity that has hit the MoD as it has every other ministry on Whitehall
It’s to politicians’ eternal shame that they ask so much of men and women and then fail them so appallingly when the fighting stops. Maybe we’ve found one thing we agree on at last..
And with the reality being as it is, I think it’s a basic human need to want to give charitably despite the responsibility not truly being their own

I give to charity all the time. By donation and by direct debit. Charity is not the point here.

The Rape of Lucretia

FrancieBrady wrote: »

The point being that the biggest poppy wearing community on this island are likely to be the ones to precipitate or speed up the break up of the UK.

Wouldnt be too sure about that.

Despite their loyal allegiance to the crown, they know which side their bread is buttered on.

I think we could be hearing some very conciliatory overtures from them if a rough Brexit goes ahead, where they will suddenly have a lot of interest in being very accomodating of the southern Irish in order to entice the republic back into the the UK.

Samuel Vimes

Edward M wrote: »

[Deleted User] wrote: »

The UK mightn't be on any map after 11pm on 29 March next year.........

I'm no fan of British colonialism, but I wonder how that map might look but for them too.

Pretty much as it does now.
However were it not for the former USSR and the USA it might look very different ,.

Edward M

Samuel Vimes wrote: »

Pretty much as it does now.
However were it not for the former USSR and the USA it might look very different ,.

I doubt it.
If the ussr had its way it wouldn't look like now either.

FrancieBrady

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

Wouldnt be too sure about that.

Despite their loyal allegiance to the crown, they know which side their bread is buttered on.

I think we could be hearing some very conciliatory overtures from them if a rough Brexit goes ahead, where they will suddenly have a lot of interest in being very accomodating of the southern Irish in order to entice the republic back into the the UK.

So after wrecking the economy of northern Ireland and damaging ours they will turn to sweeties and try and get us to rejoin the UK?

They will be lucky to survive as a party if things go as predicted in northern Ireland.

zapitastas

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

Wouldnt be too sure about that.

Despite their loyal allegiance to the crown, they know which side their bread is buttered on.

I think we could be hearing some very conciliatory overtures from them if a rough Brexit goes ahead, where they will suddenly have a lot of interest in being very accomodating of the southern Irish in order to entice the republic back into the the UK.

How does that scenario make any sense? You sound like you are on the British negotiating panel

pleas advice

citytillidie wrote: »

Where is this Southern Ireland?

There is Northern Ireland and Ireland, Republic of Ireland only for football

or to describe the State of Ireland (Capital 's' on 'State' there) to avoid ambiguity

Thomas_IV

Patww79 wrote: »

I can see them getting trendier here with the "oooh look how modern and progressive I am" attitude that's infesting the country these days.

What's wrong with being progressive? There is a sense and meaning for that poppy remembrance culture beyond the usual associating it with the former British Empire. In fact, it is a symbol for peace and and reminder to how many lives it has cost to get it.

I think that it is a positive development which has even reached another country which was the former enemy they fought in both world wars. For example, in Munich there is a poppy field installed at the Königsplatz, the very same place on which the Nazis held their annual 'commemoration' for the 'fallen' of the Hitler plot of 9th November 1923. This was going on from 1933 to 1944 (in 1945 at the turn of that annual 'commemoration' the Thrid Reich was already gone).

This poppy instalation in Munich, not quite the same like that at the Tower of London which has been completed already in 2014 at the centenary of the start of WWI, is meant to be a symbol for peace. This is how I see it for myself as well and yes, I have such a Royal British League Poppy to wear as well.

You can see, when looking beyond the usual Irish anit-British sentiments, that things are progressing and that symbols and their true meaning are being adopted in a country in which rather less people really know or even care about that British tradition unless they are a bit familiar with it.

FrancieBrady

Thomas_IV wrote: »

What's wrong with being progressive? There is a sense and meaning for that poppy remembrance culture beyond the usual associating it with the former British Empire. In fact, it is a symbol for peace and and reminder to how many lives it has cost to get it.

I think that it is a positive development which has even reached another country which was the former enemy they fought in both world wars. For example, in Munich there is a poppy field installed at the Königsplatz, the very same place on which the Nazis held their annual 'commemoration' for the 'fallen' of the Hitler plot of 9th November 1923. This was going on from 1933 to 1944 (in 1945 at the turn of that annual 'commemoration' the Thrid Reich was already gone).

This poppy instalation in Munich, not quite the same like that at the Tower of London which has been completed already in 2014 at the centenary of the start of WWI, is meant to be a symbol for peace. This is how I see it for myself as well and yes, I have such a Royal British League Poppy to wear as well.

You can see, when looking beyond the usual Irish anit-British sentiments, that things are progressing and that symbols and their true meaning are being adopted in a country in which rather less people really know or even care about that British tradition unless they are a bit familiar with it.

Support, via the RBL, for an army mired in blood and still involved in belligerent interference in pursuit of it's aims, will always be regressive in Chez Francois.

What we need, as a former victim of this army, is our own symbol of remembrance, for all that fell in war and conflict here and abroad. One that doesn't support but indicts imperialist belligerence.
Our remembrance should criticise what happened here to have any value.

murpho999

Spook_ie wrote: »

Do you not toast the bride and groom at a wedding or have you not been to any weddings?

Yes, but then they are not strangers. Nobody is toasting the Queen or people who are not there.

Really strange comparison you're making.

Thomas_IV

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Support, via the RBL, for an army mired in blood and still involved in belligerent interference in pursuit of it's aims, will always be regressive in Chez Francois.

What we need, as a former victim of this army, is our own symbol of remembrance, for all that fell in war and conflict here and abroad. One that doesn't support but indicts imperialist belligerence.
Our remembrance should criticise what happened here to have any value.

Well, that is the way you see it and the angle from which you look at it. That isn't mine and, for what ever reason, plenty of Irishmen joined that Army in both world wars. But well, I don't have the Irish view on that matter, as mine is very different from that without embracing any sort of imperialism, as in fact it was one Empire fighting an even more aggressive imperialism in both world wars.

When you say that remembrance in Ireland should criticise what happened in Ireland to have any value, you surely should bear in mind the responsibility of Irishmen in supporting and serving the growing of this former Empire. But that is a matter on which many - Irish Republicans in particular - get rather upset about cos they do have a problem with recognising the role and the part they had in building up the BE. Aside from the BE subject, there is still the contribution of Irish people in colonising the USA and in building up this modern state which has been built on the land grabbing and murdering of the native American Indians.

World history and the interwoven connections of people are too complex as to have a simple answer on what went down in the past. To be honest in all this, one really has to look at both sides of the coin and talk about all of it.

In Ireland, through the centuries, the Irish were the victims of their colonial masters. In the colonies, some (I avoid to say 'all' or even 'many') Irish were the active part in oppressing other native folk. That means, either way, they have always been part of one system or the other.

arybvtcw0eolkf

This thread, will it be over by Christmas?.

FrancieBrady

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Support, via the RBL, for an army mired in blood and still involved in belligerent interference in pursuit of it's aims, will always be regressive in Chez Francois.

What we need, as a former victim of this army, is our own symbol of remembrance, for all that fell in war and conflict here and abroad. One that doesn't support but indicts imperialist belligerence.
Our remembrance should criticise what happened here to have any value.

Just like you were critical of the Shankhill bomber?

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=108502061&postcount=26

corner of hells

Allyson Obnoxious Tailgate wrote: »

This thread, will it be over by Christmas?.

Dunno , there might be a ceasefire though.

citytillidie

RandomName2 wrote: »

In fairness, you don't seem to be in any position to teach people about history..

ahh personal attacks

end of the road

Aegir wrote: »

Just like you were critical of the Shankhill bomber?

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=108502061&postcount=26

has nothing to do with this thread. + the post responded to the part of the quoted post which stated that such acts carried out by what the poster considers to be "terrorists" shouldn't be remembered, when of course they should given innocent people died in the particular event mentioned within the post quoted.

end of the road

end of the road wrote: »

has nothing to do with this thread. + the post responded to the part of the quoted post which stated that such acts carried out by what the poster considers to be "terrorists" shouldn't be remembered, when of course they should given innocent people died in the particular event mentioned within the post quoted.

it isn't the event being remembered, it is the person who carried it out. At his graveside maintained by the National Graves Association, the recipient of money from the sales of Easter Lillies.

It has nothing to do with this thread, but it has everything to do with highlighting the Republican hypocrisy.

You can not defend commemorating one and criticise the other.

RandomName2

citytillidie wrote: »

ahh personal attacks

You're fast to correct others, but need recourse to history books yourself. Or even just google. A decent enough dictionary would even suffice .