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So who's going to see the Pope?

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  • Registered Users Posts: 15,206 ✭✭✭✭ Spanish Eyes


    It will be a huge international event and I hope it is a success for the organisers.

    Even though I live by the park I don't think I could cope with the crowds, the hours of walking to the papal cross, bringing my own seat and a packed lunch, wondering where the loos are, sitting there for hours probably having to listen to inspirational speakers and holy music.

    Each to their own, but it'll be a very long and tiring day. I'll watch the news reports instead I think.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,118 Lackey


    Taytoland wrote: »
    I'd probably lose my loyalist credentials if I did, so that would be a no. But good luck to all the real Catholics who will go to see him, not these fake repeal 8th Catholics.

    And the priests who welcomed families into Churches and graveyards to bless and pray for and to bury their dead babies, that had to be born in England because we didn't cater for FFA in our hospitals?
    Are they fake priests?
    If that's the case, no Catholic, including Priests, cant do right no matter what they do.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,482 ✭✭✭ wexie


    That's a big question, about which lots of books have been written. I don't have time to argue a position like that and it wasn't my point.

    The point is, many atheists consider religion, including personal faith, to be harmful on balance. I guess many vegans take the same line.

    If they really believe that, doesn't it make sense they'd get in people's faces about it? Not be annoying or superior, but because they care that harm is being done?

    Yeah I guess if that's your point then you might be right. I don't, however, agree with that point of view. I take major issues with quite a few organised religions. But not so much from the point of religion but because I feel it's inherent in organisations that once they get large enough they have a tendency to start protecting the continued survival of the organisation at any costs up to and including at a cost of their perceived values and morals.

    And I believe that goes for any organisation be it organised religion, political parties, charities, businesses. I think it's just a sad reality of how humans deal with power.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,046 ✭✭✭ Berserker


    Not sure why people are going on about the cost. The hotels, bars and businesses will make a fortune from it.
    As Bill Shankly once said about Everton FC "If they were playing in my front garden i would close the curtains"

    Nice piece of OT trivia for you. He ended up going to watch Everton after he left LFC. LFC had a 'No Shanklys' policy at the time.
    Shenshen wrote: »
    Will he pull the same size crowd as Garth Brooks, though?

    Don't mention the war.
    I could really do without it. Traffic will be a massive pain in the arse.

    We are going to have to avoid the Phoenix park side of the city. Traffic was a mere around there when the Ed Sheeran concerts were on, so this is probably going to be worse. The place will be full of coaches and people from the country who are not familiar with that part of the city.
    RobertKK wrote: »
    They are non transferable tickets and it was said the organisers and the Gardai would be involved if the person with the ticket is not the person who bought the ticket.

    Is that not the case when pretty much every ticketed event? Would imagine that you'd get in without a problem on the day.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,482 ✭✭✭ wexie


    Berserker wrote: »
    We are going to have to avoid the Phoenix park side of the city.

    And the M50 and each and every single road leading to it I'd imagine.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,189 ✭✭✭ Malayalam



    I haven't been able to shake the desire for faith, despite agreeing with the rational and factual inconsistencies of religions.

    Can empathise. I'm not involved in any religion but I think about existential things and philosophy almost all the time. Projecting my mind out to contemplate the immeasureable vastness of the Universe and the huge amount of unknowns inspires that feeling of wonder or faith, or whatever the word might be. Plus watching the seasons roll round and nature do her thing. The ocean alone inspires awe in me. The whole everyday mundane experience of being alive is so pinch-oneself unbelievable and unusual, to be exquisitely conscious in such an unexpected scenario hurtling through an uncharted Void. The ideas people have about 'God' seem in general to be very limited and childish - metaphysics is an endless source of fascination and God as an idea is almost impossible to fathom. So to hurl abuse at an idea that is so potent seems too casual, too trite. People not having 'faith' in anything more than the material world is a valid and completely understandable position to take, but why would that genuinely cause the desire to denigrate others who feel otherwise?
    I know the church here has caused serious harm. Religions everywhere have. But I find the fervour with which people condemn those who choose faith makes me feel very uncomfortable, it has a cult-like intensity that often borders on the lower forms of religiosity.
    If hundreds of thousands were gathering to go to a Sufi ceremony, or a Tibetan Buddhist ritual, or a Taoist celebration, I would wish them well and feel joy for their shared faith, even though all those religions have caused harm throughout history in different ways. They really have. As has every human institution. So in the same spirit I also wish well to the hundreds of thousands who will likely gather here in the name of their faith.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,642 ✭✭✭ Teyla Emmagan


    I was supposed to be going with my mother but she has dumped me to go to some golf competition and I am all sad now :(

    I want to see the Pope!!


  • Registered Users Posts: 18,982 ✭✭✭✭ kneemos


    Lackey wrote: »
    I'm bringing my mother....one of the 'blue rinse brigade'

    She and I both voted yes in SSM and repeal the 8th.

    THIS JUST IN:
    Its 2018 you can have faith AND believe in equal rights for all people....And in even more exciting news Not all people are the same :pac:


    As a rule the pope oglers wouldn't be the most progressive types.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,482 ✭✭✭ wexie


    Malayalam wrote: »
    But I find the fervour with which people condemn those who choose faith makes me feel very uncomfortable, it has a cult-like intensity that often borders on the lower forms of religiosity.

    I tried having this debate with a very vocal atheist once, tried to explain that from my point of view he's just the other side of the coin of a religious person.

    It did not go over particularly well


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,457 ✭✭✭ Bubbaclaus


    klaz wrote: »
    And do you have these issues with the general population, various councils/organisations and the government who knew many of the "dodgy" priests and did nothing about it? It's incredibly naive to believe that only the priests were involved in the child abuse and subsequent cover-ups over decades. But, nah, you'll focus on the Church and heap all the blame on it, and by the manner of your posts, everybody who has served in the Church.

    There are millions of people who have served the Church faithfully, and without any connection to the child abuse. You, and others here, with their sweeping statements throw dirt all over them.

    I have an Aunt who is a nun. She's been a nun since she was 15, trained as a nurse, served as a missionary abroad, returned to Ireland working with the poor, and has provided a more help to others than you have. Your stance on the child abuse labels her just as much as anyone else.

    I do understand the outrage about the Child abuse, but can we have some maturity about it? Be a little bit more reasonable and stop including millions in the behavior of a minority.

    Thats some leap you've taken from my one paragraph post.

    Of course the main source of blame for child abuse and subsequent cover up within the Catholic Church should be pinned on the Catholic Church. Everything else is just whataboutery.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,046 ✭✭✭ Berserker


    wexie wrote: »
    And the M50 and each and every single road leading to it I'd imagine.

    Didn't realize there will be 500,000 in the Phoenix park. Just googled it there. :eek: Thought it would be more like a concert.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,334 ✭✭✭ Fighting Tao


    Graces7 wrote: »
    Rome is paying. That was made very public many months ago.

    Rome is paying some. Us taxpayers are also paying millions for the visit.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,457 ✭✭✭ Bubbaclaus


    Rome is paying some. Us taxpayers are also paying millions for the visit.

    No point in responding to Grace. She'll continue to say Rome is paying regardless of the facts.


  • Registered Users Posts: 18,982 ✭✭✭✭ kneemos


    What does it take to reach the top job?
    Presumably these guys are upwardly mobile types?


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,334 ✭✭✭ Fighting Tao


    Bubbaclaus wrote: »
    No point in responding to Grace. She'll continue to say Rome is paying regardless of the facts.

    I know and probably disappear for a while and then reappear to post the same thing again.

    However, a statement that is missing a key fact should be picked up on.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,482 ✭✭✭ wexie


    Berserker wrote: »
    Didn't realize there will be 500,000 in the Phoenix park. Just googled it there. :eek: Thought it would be more like a concert.

    Kinda like if Garth Brooks, Ed Sheeran, Beyonce, Take That and One direction were all doing a gig together concert


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,911 ✭✭✭ begbysback


    I have heard this pope makes a priority of visiting prisons and has irish prison(s) on itenary- so maybe a short stint at her majesty's pleasure could be arranged?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,482 ✭✭✭ wexie


    begbysback wrote: »
    so maybe a short stint at her majesty's pleasure

    I don't think we call it that anymore :pac:


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,025 ✭✭✭ TheRiverman


    Rome is paying some. Us taxpayers are also paying millions for the visit.

    Donation envelopes were in the local churches where I live(Offaly/Westmeath)over the past few weeks,and massgoers were asked to make a voluntary contribution towards the cost of the events.


  • Registered Users Posts: 18,982 ✭✭✭✭ kneemos


    Bubbaclaus wrote: »
    No point in responding to Grace. She'll continue to say Rome is paying regardless of the facts.


    And lying is a sin.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9,046 ✭✭✭ Berserker


    begbysback wrote: »
    I have heard this pope makes a priority of visiting prisons and has irish prison(s) on itenary- so maybe a short stint at her majesty's pleasure could be arranged?

    Sounds like you want us back.


  • Registered Users Posts: 29,299 ✭✭✭✭ Mint Sauce


    Donation envelopes were in the local churches where I live(Offaly/Westmeath)over the past few weeks,and massgoers were asked to make a voluntary contribution towards the cost of the events.

    Could these have been for coaches ran for churches and parishes, rather than the actual event/visit?


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,334 ✭✭✭ Fighting Tao


    Donation envelopes were in the local churches where I live(Offaly/Westmeath)over the past few weeks,and massgoers were asked to make a voluntary contribution towards the cost of the events.

    That doesn’t change the fact that the trip is costing the state millions.


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,025 ✭✭✭ TheRiverman


    :p
    begbysback wrote: »
    I have heard this pope makes a priority of visiting prisons and has irish prison(s) on itenary- so maybe a short stint at her majesty's pleasure could be arranged?

    So he's visiting the UK also:rolleyes:


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,025 ✭✭✭ TheRiverman


    That doesn’t change the fact that the trip is costing the state millions.

    Agreed,asking for donations on top of that is a bit much.


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,556 ✭✭✭✭ JupiterKid


    That doesn’t change the fact that the trip is costing the state millions.

    No penny from the State coffers should be paying for this event. Not a single cent. I'm sure many taxpayers would be very angry at this.

    The Vatican is obscenely rich - let them pay for it themselves.

    Anyone remember the 2000 "sweet deal" between the religious institutions and the FF govt? - the State picked up the vast bulk of the compensation tab. Scandal!!:mad:


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,334 ✭✭✭ Fighting Tao


    JupiterKid wrote: »
    No penny from the State coffers should be paying for this event. Not a single cent. I'm sure many taxpayers would be very angry at this.

    The Vatican is obscenely rich - let them pay for it themselves.

    Anyone remember the 2000 "sweet deal" between the religious institutions and the FF govt? - the State picked up the vast bulk of the compensation tab. Scandal!!:mad:

    Completely agree. They could sell off one of their minor paintings and it would probably fund the whole trip.


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,810 ✭✭✭ Hector Savage


    Does he say a good long mass ? - as long as Fr. Clippert ? he does 4 hours since his stroke ...


  • Registered Users Posts: 21,817 ✭✭✭✭ Dyr


    Ah Lad's most Irish people would show up for an envelope opening if they thought it was a big event and they might miss out.

    Add to that our Polish contingent and Frank is guaranteed great door reciepts


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  • Registered Users Posts: 14,313 ✭✭✭✭ Galwayguy35


    JupiterKid wrote: »
    No penny from the State coffers should be paying for this event. Not a single cent. I'm sure many taxpayers would be very angry at this.

    The Vatican is obscenely rich - let them pay for it themselves.

    Anyone remember the 2000 "sweet deal" between the religious institutions and the FF govt? - the State picked up the vast bulk of the compensation tab. Scandal!!:mad:

    Did you say the same thing when Lizzie Windsor visited, sure she was well able to pay for it herself as well.

    He's only coming for 36 hours and half of ye on this thread are twisting yourselves up in knots about it.

    Lot's of people want to see him so get over it.


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