Jastine Valdez found dead. No Ana discussion please. Mod warning post 1

strandroad

The Nal wrote: »

Seems he was a on a drink and drugs bender for weeks, issues at home, existing mental issues, he just snapped.

What existing mental issues?
He may have been a psychopath who didn't like how his life was turning out and felt entitled to a binge, planning to get away with it. That's a personality disorder and not a mental health issue. There is no element of psychosis in what he did that we know of.

TomOnBoard

strandroad wrote: »

What existing mental issues?
He may have been a psychopath who didn't like how his life was turning out and felt entitled to a binge, planning to get away with it. That's a personality disorder and not a mental health issue. There is no element of psychosis in what he did that we know of.

Cocaine-induced psychosis is a known risk/side-effect of cocaine usage.

Textronic

Do the gardai have enough expertise to deal rapidly with these situations ?

A different situation but I recall a knife attacker was shot dead minutes after appearing on a London bridge.

How was he able to go out socializing that night?

snotboogie

strandroad wrote: »

The Nal wrote: »

Seems he was a on a drink and drugs bender for weeks, issues at home, existing mental issues, he just snapped.

What existing mental issues?
He may have been a psychopath who didn't like how his life was turning out and felt entitled to a binge, planning to get away with it. That's a  personality disorder and not a mental health issue.

If he planned to get away with it, he didn't do much planning. He abducted a woman in broad daylight, with a vehicle behind him, in his wife's car. He wasn't "spotted" all reports indicate that he did it in full view of a car that had to stop behind him: 
"The woman said her friend had been driving along the R760 road, south of Enniskerry, when the car in front “suddenly stopped” and a man “forced a woman who was walking along into his car"
https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/i-think-ive-seen-something-terrible-what-eyewitness-said-after-spotting-suspected-abduction-36928400.html
I imagine that the coke and booze was a last piss up rather than a celebration of getting away with it.

Textronic

Textronic wrote: »

Do the gardai have enough expertise to deal rapidly with these situations ?

A different situation but I recall a knife attacker was shot dead minutes after appearing on a London bridge.

How was he able to go out socializing that night?

& you don't see the difference between those two incidents?
Maybe leave the police work to the Gardai.....

strandroad

TomOnBoard wrote: »

Cocaine-induced psychosis is a known risk/side-effect of cocaine usage.

That's definitely a possibility, but no evidence so far.

I wouldn't touch the mental health card until there is clear evidence, out of respect for real mental health issues sufferers.

Textronic

bubblypop wrote: »

& you don't see the difference between those two incidents?
Maybe leave the police work to the Gardai.....

Are you happy the gardai did everything they could in this situation?

Textronic

Textronic wrote: »

Are you happy the gardai did everything they could in this situation?

Well we don't know the full story of what exactly happened so we?
I would rather wait until an investigation has been completed & all the facts are known.

But then, I wouldn't be an expert like a lot on this thread...............

Suckit

Captain Obvious wrote: »

Was the cocaine not after the murder though?

He may have had some that he had got previously.

MaccaTacca wrote: »

Cocaine story is 100% true, have heard from people who were in the pub that he was asking anyone at all if they were selling, even people who clearly wouldn’t be selling drugs. He then returned later asking again.

The video of him in the pub with the girls is the Martello in Bray, and the photo is the ramblers rest.

I have seen the video, what photo?
Are they both from Saturday night?

The Nal

strandroad wrote: »

That's definitely a possibility, but no evidence so far.

I wouldn't touch the mental health card until there is clear evidence, out of respect for real mental health issues sufferers.

He tried to break into some random house a few weeks ago and was chased away.

He abducted and murdered a girl at random in broad daylight.

He was found by the police trying to stab himself to death with a stanley knife in his car in broad daylight.

These aren't the actions of someone with a healthy mindset.

Seems the gardai may not have shot him in the head. They shot him in the shoulder and it hit an artery.

http://www.thejournal.ie/garda-mark-hennessy-4029195-May2018/

Suckit wrote: »

He may have had some that he had got previously.


I have seen the video, what photo?
Are they both from Saturday night?

The video is apparently from a few weeks ago in the Martello in Bray. This photo is apparently from Saturday night in The Ramblers Rest in Ballybrack.

kunst nugget

Textronic wrote: »

Are you happy the gardai did everything they could in this situation?

You were comparing two scenarios that were poles apart. It was an absolutely ridiculous comparison.

Considering we only have mainly speculation and hearsay to go on at the moment, I don't think a judgement call can really be made on the effectiveness of the Garda investigation.

strandroad

The Nal wrote: »

He tried to break into some random house a few weeks ago and was chased away.

He abducted and murdered a girl at random in broad daylight.

He was found by the police trying to stab himself to death with a stanley knife in his car in broad daylight.

These aren't the actions of someone with a healthy mindset.

That's what psychopaths do though. They feed their entitlement, and protect their ego when cornered, even if it means self-destruction.

kingofclay

I don't think he'd write sorry before killing himself if he was a psychopath.

jiltloop

The Nal wrote: »

He tried to break into some random house a few weeks ago and was chased away.

He abducted and murdered a girl at random in broad daylight.

He was found by the police trying to stab himself to death with a stanley knife in his car in broad daylight.

These aren't the actions of someone with a healthy mindset.

Seems the gardai may not have shot him in the head. They shot him in the shoulder and it hit an artery.

http://www.thejournal.ie/garda-mark-hennessy-4029195-May2018/



The video is apparently from a few weeks ago in the Martello in Bray. This photo is apparently from Saturday night in The Ramblers Rest in Ballybrack.

Clearly he didn't have a healthy mindset but that doesn't mean that he had mental health issues. Why the urge to associate his actions with mental health issues?

Get Real

Textronic wrote: »

Do the gardai have enough expertise to deal rapidly with these situations ?

A different situation but I recall a knife attacker was shot dead minutes after appearing on a London bridge.

How was he able to go out socializing that night?

Point re London attacker-yeah because he was still at the bridge and a call came in about it. Are you suggesting if I rang in about a knife wielding stabbed in a central city centre location there wouldn't be a car there in minutes?

How was he able to go out socialising that night? Well what would you have done? Released a picture of him and his name during a live situation in order to panic him and make drastic decisions? We unfortunately saw what results his panic yielded. And many posters in the early beginnings of this thread were calling for him to be identified immediately.

If your idea was to somehow throw 25 cars on a search of possibly anywhere at the time, you'd have absolutely zero police coverage for the entire of Dublin on a Saturday night.

So what was your solution? Because anywhere I look for one, it seems to be confronted by either the realities of real life, or clouded by hindsight in a could've, would've, should've mess.

lawred2

kingofclay wrote: »

I don't think he'd write sorry before killing himself if he was a psychopath.

Why not?

A pyschopath would most definitely write something self serving that they didn't mean.

kingofclay

Hmmm, not long self-indulgent spiel, just 1 word sorry on a piece of paper, I don't think that's what a psychopath would do just based on the other ones I've read. I'm not an expert or even that well informed, just my opinion.

TomOnBoard

strandroad wrote: »

That's what psychopaths do though. They feed their entitlement, and protect their ego when cornered, even if it means self-destruction.

Im not sure why you believe that a psychosis is a form of mental illness, while an antisocial personal disorder is not. The World Health Organisation's International Classification of Diseases(v10) considers both to be.

The Nal

jiltloop wrote: »

Clearly he didn't have a healthy mindset but that doesn't mean that he had mental health issues. Why the urge to associate his actions with mental health issues?

Not having a healthy mindset is associated with mental health, clearly.

Stonedpilot

kingofclay wrote: »

I don't think he'd write sorry before killing himself if he was a psychopath.

Maybe he realized he couldnt live with himself and made some half arsed attempt at an apology before his suicide attempt.

Regarding mental health issues dont understand people getting upset with those saying he had mental health issues.

Having worked in community centre in a "colourful" area shall we say I met many with mental health problems (myself included).

Some are as harmless as a fly and kind beyond belief other people might have dark or violent tendencies.
Its totally totally subjective and dependent on the individual person and their own personal issues.

But for people to say oh it wasnt mental health issues dont suggest that because thats insulting to those with mental health issues.Thats just silly in my opinion.

Laois_Man

The Nal wrote: »

The video is apparently from a few weeks ago in the Martello in Bray. This photo is apparently from Saturday night in The Ramblers Rest in Ballybrack.

I could be wrong but I could swear that one of the news reports last night said he was wearing the same clothes when shot as those he was wearing in the video of him buying the Nissan. If so, then that photo is not from Saturday night - unless he had a change of clothes with him in the Nissan and changed between Saturday night and Sunday evening.

Suckit

Laois_Man wrote: »

I could be wrong but I could swear that one of the news reports last night said he was wearing the same clothes when shot as those he was wearing in the video of him buying the Nissan. If so, then that photo is not from Saturday night - unless he had a change of clothes with him in the Nissan and changed between Saturday night and Sunday evening.

That is very possible if he planned to murder somebody.

jiltloop

The Nal wrote: »

Not having a healthy mindset is associated with mental health, clearly.

Clearly in some cases it can be yes, I'm asking why people are so quick to attribute these acts with mental illness? Is this an easier outlook than accepting that there are some bad/evil people out there that are capable of these acts while not suffering from a mental health issue?

pawdee

What did this nutjob do for a living? So far I've read that he was a building contractor, a sub-contractor, a window fitter, a quantity surveyor, a crane banksman and that he worked in a well known DIY store. Not that it makes any difference to this terribly sad and tragic story. Just wondering.

jiltloop

Stonedpilot wrote: »

Maybe he realized he couldnt live with himself and made some half arsed attempt at an apology before his suicide attempt.

Regarding mental health issues dont understand people getting upset with those saying he had mental health issues.

Having worked in community centre in a "colourful" area shall we say I met many with mental health problems (myself included).

Some are as harmless as a fly and kind beyond belief other people might have dark or violent tendencies.
Its totally totally subjective and dependent on the individual person and their own personal issues.

But for people to say oh it wasnt mental health issues dont suggest that because thats insulting to those with mental health issues.Thats just silly in my opinion.

If it is subsequently comes out that he had a history of mental illness well then fair enough I don't think anyone would dispute that. What people are disputing is the diagnosis of mental health issues from people on the internet who have as much of a clue as anyone else on this man's mental state.

Can you not see how insulting this is for people who may suffer from mental health issues? When people see the abduction and murder of a woman as a symptom of ill mental health without any other evidence?

The Nal

Laois_Man wrote: »

I could be wrong but I could swear that one of the news reports last night said he was wearing the same clothes when shot as those he was wearing in the video of him buying the Nissan. If so, then that photo is not from Saturday night - unless he had a change of clothes with him in the Nissan and changed between Saturday night and Sunday evening.

Possible I guess.

jiltloop wrote: »

Clearly in some cases it can be yes, I'm asking why people are so quick to attribute these acts with mental illness? Is this an easier outlook than accepting that there are some bad/evil people out there that are capable of these acts while not suffering from a mental health issue?

Being a bad/evil person and committing bad/evil acts is a mental illness.

iamwhoiam

Laois_Man wrote: »

I could be wrong but I could swear that one of the news reports last night said he was wearing the same clothes when shot as those he was wearing in the video of him buying the Nissan. If so, then that photo is not from Saturday night - unless he had a change of clothes with him in the Nissan and changed between Saturday night and Sunday evening.

He could have thrown a jumper over the t shirt and taken his jumper off later

ConnyMcDavid

Just reading on rte that they are searching for her handbag.
Further into the report it says that she dropped her handbag shopping and phone during the attack.

So if the handbag is still missing is it possible some opportunist has taken a bag lying on the ground? Without handing it in to garda?

Stonedpilot

jiltloop wrote: »

If it is subsequently comes out that he had a history of mental illness well then fair enough I don't think anyone would dispute that. What people are disputing is the diagnosis of mental health issues from people on the internet who have as much of a clue as anyone else on this man's mental state.

Can you not see how insulting this is for people who may suffer from mental health issues? When people see the abduction and murder of a woman as a symptom of ill mental health without any other evidence?

You said it yourself. People online who dont know.

No I dont see it as insulting.

Think you missed my point.

Some with mental illness might be gentle and meek as a lamb others might have violent ideas and tendencies. Totally dependent on the individual and their circumstance.

Taking offence is just silly. Why?.
No one is saying all mental illness is the same. In fact Im saying the opposite.

listermint

Laois_Man wrote: »

I could be wrong but I could swear that one of the news reports last night said he was wearing the same clothes when shot as those he was wearing in the video of him buying the Nissan. If so, then that photo is not from Saturday night - unless he had a change of clothes with him in the Nissan and changed between Saturday night and Sunday evening.

Isnt the Nissan video from ages ago, possibly even last year. 171 ? brand new car.