8th amendment referendum part 3 - Mod note and FAQ in post #1

robarmstrong

Martin Micropenis wrote: »

Medical aftercare and support is just as good in England as it is in Ireland. I lived there for several years and have family supports etc. Finances would not be issue as we are quite comfortably off.

They don't get aftercare and support in England as they are not residents.

Martin Micropenis wrote: »

Because of my original answer. I don't believe abortion is very nice therefore I will vote no to keep it out of Ireland. I fully acknowledge that people will travel abroad. In the unlikely event of somebody from my immediate family needing an abortion, then there is a plan B.

You aren't keeping it out of Ireland though, legal abortions in Ireland have been provided although very few in number, only 60 documented in the last 3 years I think, I'd have to double check that number. Also women take illegal abortion pills they bought online soooooo...

You aren't keeping it out of Ireland, rather keeping it out of less restricted access for women here who need it.

kylith

Martin Micropenis wrote: »

Medical aftercare and support is just as good in England as it is in Ireland. I lived there for several years and have family supports etc. Finances would not be issue as we are quite comfortably off.

You're very lucky that you can afford to stay in the U.K. for aftercare.

What about women who aren’t so well-off? Do you think they should have to come home without aftercare, or be forced to continue with a pregnancy against their will?

_Dara_

Martin Micropenis wrote: »

Medical aftercare and support is just as good in England as it is in Ireland. I lived there for several years and have family supports etc. Finances would not be issue as we are quite comfortably off.

Because of my original answer. I don't believe abortion is very nice therefore I will vote no to keep it out of Ireland. I fully acknowledge that people will travel abroad. In the unlikely event of somebody from my immediate family needing an abortion, then there is a plan B.

On the balance of probabilities, the Yes vote is going to win this so my vote or concerns will make no difference.

“I’m all right, Jack”. Loooovely. A staggering lack of empathy for people less well off than you. Awful, awful, awful.

gctest50

Martin Micropenis wrote: »

.....

Finances would not be issue as we are quite comfortably off.

.

Says enough that

The proles will just have to make do ?

gmisk

Martin Micropenis wrote: »

Medical aftercare and support is just as good in England as it is in Ireland. I lived there for several years and have family supports etc. Finances would not be issue as we are quite comfortably off.

Lucky you what about the woman or girls in exactly the same position but without the finances to travel?!?
F#ck em eh?
Lovely

Martin Micropenis

Martin Micropenis wrote: »

Medical aftercare and support is just as good in England as it is in Ireland. I lived there for several years and have family supports etc. Finances would not be issue as we are quite comfortably off.



Because of my original answer. I don't believe abortion is very nice therefore I will vote no to keep it out of Ireland. I fully acknowledge that people will travel abroad. In the unlikely event of somebody from my immediate family needing an abortion, then there is a plan B.

On the balance of probabilities, the Yes vote is going to win this so my vote or concerns will make no difference.

Well that's all fine for you and your family, but what about people who can't afford to go to England? What about people who know their baby will die soon after they give birth, and will have to watch their child suffer? Can you put yourself in their shoes?

What if your daughter, knowing your views, didn't ask for help but ordered pills online and took them unsupervised? What if something happened to her?

Martina1991

Martin Micropenis wrote:

Because of my original answer. I don't believe abortion is very nice therefore I will vote no to keep it out of Ireland.

~Nice ~

I would like to see you tell any girl or woman going through the worst crisis of her life that can't have a say over whay happens to her because its not very nice.

Martin Micropenis

robarmstrong wrote: »

They don't get aftercare and support in England as they are not residents.

My children all have UK passports. My wife is English. Does that not help? Maybe not.

robarmstrong wrote: »

You aren't keeping it out of Ireland though, legal abortions in Ireland have been provided although very few in number, only 60 documented in the last 3 years I think, I'd have to double check that number. Also women take illegal abortion pills they bought online soooooo...

You aren't keeping it out of Ireland, rather keeping it out of less restricted access for women here who need it.

Yes, that's true. I suppose my thinking is that I would like to restrict it.

SusieBlue

Martin Micropenis wrote: »

Yes, that's true. I suppose my thinking is that I would like to restrict it.

But not for your own child. It’s other people’s daughters that you want to restrict.
You’ll be fine and dandy if what you’re saying is true. It’s other people that will suffer.

Martin Micropenis

Martin Micropenis wrote: »

My children all have UK passports. My wife is English. Does that not help? Maybe not.

Yes, that's true. I suppose my thinking is that I would like to restrict it.

Restrict it for everyone else but it's ok for your family?

Martin Micropenis

kylith wrote: »

What about women who aren’t so well-off? Do you think they should have to come home without aftercare, or be forced to continue with a pregnancy against their will?

I can't worry about everybody else. Those women need to make a choice based on their own circumstances.

gmisk

Martin Micropenis wrote: »

I can't worry about everybody else. Those women need to make a choice based on their own circumstances.

How lovely of you.
Sure they are poor screw em!

Do as I say not as I do?

gandalf

Martin Micropenis wrote: »

My children all have UK passports. My wife is English. Does that not help? Maybe not.

Are you saying that abortion is OK for foreigners and minted people then?

Yes, that's true. I suppose my thinking is that I would like to restrict it.

Tbh you strike me as a hypocrite of the highest order and a no vote doesn't keep abortion out of Ireland, it just drives it underground or asks another jurisdiction to take care of our issues. I'd prefer not to plant my head in the ground and deal with our problems in a mature fashion.

Martin Micropenis

Martina1991 wrote: »

~Nice ~

I would like to see you tell any girl or woman going through the worst crisis of her life that can't have a say over whay happens to her because its not very nice.

They can have a say. They can vote yes!

Bannasidhe

Martin Micropenis wrote: »

I don't believe abortion is very nice therefore I will vote no to keep it out of Ireland.

Then let's be upfront Martin.

You will also be voting to deny pregnant women certain vital medical treatments (it's happened).
You will be voting for asylum seekers to risk being force-fed if they wish to have an abortion (It's happened.)
You will be voting for women to have to continue with pregnancies that are not compatible with life or take a journey that ends with a coffin in their boot on the ferry or a heartbreaking courier package (It's happened).
You will be forcing women who cannot afford to travel to bring a child they cannot afford to care for into the world (It happened).

But it's ok for the comfortably well off because they, like you, can travel, even when they think abortion isn't very nice. And rest easy they they have voted to prevent others, less comfortable than they, from accessing it.

That's not very nice is it Martin?
Not very nice at all.

Martin Micropenis

Flying Fox wrote: »

Well that's all fine for you and your family, but what about people who can't afford to go to England? What about people who know their baby will die soon after they give birth, and will have to watch their child suffer? Can you put yourself in their shoes?

That's very difficult but I cannot adapt my own principles based on what happens to other people.

Flying Fox wrote: »

What if your daughter, knowing your views, didn't ask for help but ordered pills online and took them unsupervised? What if something happened to her?

She know my views and would confide in us if she needed to. I don't think that she would order pills and take them without us knowing. If she did, and if something happened then it will be horrendous for us.

baylah17

It's unreal
As soon as one spammer gets threadbanned another one pops up
More dumb illogical statements
More flaming looking for a reaction
More taunting
More attempts to derail

gmisk

Martin Micropenis wrote: »

They can have a say. They can vote yes!

If they are of voting age....

Your the definition of a hypocrite read what you are writing.

Are the mods going to bring in a 50 post limit before posting here?
It makes sense this thread has a really high proportion of new posters.... Like more than any thread I have ever seen...

robarmstrong

Martin Micropenis wrote: »

My children all have UK passports. My wife is English. Does that not help? Maybe not.



Yes, that's true. I suppose my thinking is that I would like to restrict it.

My statement applied to the majority who don't seem to have the luxuries yourself and your wealth provide.

Your "thinking" could not be any way shape or form further than reality.

It is incredibly ignorant to wave away those less fortunate in a financial sense than yourself and then say they have a choice in their circumstances, they bloody well don't due to the 8th. It's forced birth or across the water for an abortion.

Lucky for you your daughter as a UK citizen has access to medical aftercare and support that the 3000+ other women don't.

kylith

Martin Micropenis wrote: »

I can't worry about everybody else. Those women need to make a choice based on their own circumstances.

Does your hypocrisy not bother you?

Triceratops Ballet

Martin Micropenis wrote:

That's very difficult but I cannot adapt my own principles based on what happens to other people.

And what about pregnant women who have their everyday care compromised by the 8th?
I assume you're unaware that this vote is about the 8th amendment and is not actually about abortion (which as an aside is something I think most would describe as "not very nice")

kylith

Triceratops Ballet wrote: »

And what about pregnant women who have their everyday care compromised by the 8th?
I assume you're unaware that this vote is about the 8th amendment and is not actually about abortion (which as an aside is something I think most would describe as "not very nice")

Very true. The fact that I don’t get to have a say over what procedures are done on me or what medications I’m given is terrifying.

Martin Micropenis

Bannasidhe wrote: »

Then let's be upfront Martin.

You will also be voting to deny pregnant women certain vital medical treatments (it's happened).
You will be voting for asylum seekers to risk being force-fed if they wish to have an abortion (It's happened.)
You will be voting for women to have to continue with pregnancies that are not compatible with life or take a journey that ends with a coffin in their boot on the ferry or a heartbreaking courier package (It's happened).
You will be forcing women who cannot afford to travel to bring a child they cannot afford to care for into the world (It happened).

But it's ok for the comfortably well off because they, like you, can travel, even when they think abortion isn't very nice. And rest easy they they have voted to prevent others, less comfortable than they, from accessing it.

That's not very nice is it Martin?
Not very nice at all.

Those scenarios are all consequences of the 8th.
You won't find many no voters actually happy that people have to go through them.

joe40

I think the Martin guy is been deliberately provocative, with his "I'm alright jack" attitude. But the sad thing that attitude is quite widespread.

Martin Micropenis

kylith wrote: »

Does your hypocrisy not bother you?

I acknowledge my hyprocisy and yes, it does.
However I cannot bring myself to vote yes.

Martin Micropenis

Triceratops Ballet wrote: »

And what about pregnant women who have their everyday care compromised by the 8th?
I assume you're unaware that this vote is about the 8th amendment and is not actually about abortion (which as an aside is something I think most would describe as "not very nice")

I am fully aware of what the 8th represents.
My vote is primarily driven by the impact of the 8th on abortion.

uptherebels

Martin Micropenis wrote: »

I am fully aware of what the 8th represents.
My vote is primarily driven by the impact of the 8th on abortion.

You mean the impact of exporting our abortions overseas ?

Martin Micropenis

joe40 wrote: »

I think the Martin guy is been deliberately provocative, with his "I'm alright jack" attitude. But the sad thing that attitude is quite widespread.

Some people will vote no and not explain themselves.
Some people will vote no and not given it a second thought.
I am voting no and looking into myself to see why.
I am being blunt and fully admit it's driven to a certain extent by self-interest and the feeling that "I can get around this if I really have to"

I am sure that some no voters - if they admitted the above to themselves - would possibly change their views when challenged.

Triceratops Ballet

kylith wrote:

Very true. The fact that I don’t get to have a say over what procedures are done on me or what medications I’m given is terrifying.

I know one poor woman who ended up needing 100 stitches because of an excessive episiotomy, she was having a difficult delivery, requested a section was ignored and in the end they just cut her right open, she went home literally unable to sit for weeks with a newborn, and she could do nothing about it because under our system what she wants doesn't matter an iota

Hannibal_Smith

I wonder why those voting no think that others might vote yes. The more I read posts from those saying they'd vote no it's more and more apparent that they are protecting the feotus regardless of anything else.

So if they believe the reasons for voting yes are irrelevant, why do they think people might be voting yes?