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La Flamme Rouge **off topic discussion**

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    #5222
    tomasrojo
    Registered Users Posts: 11,747 ✭✭✭✭tomasrojo


    Hurrache wrote: »
    Westland Row getting the orcas put down this morning, Gardai amongst the worse offenders on that particular street living up to the stereotype when getting coffee and donuts.

    https://twitter.com/DormanArchs/status/1258683248839921664

    (On the second point, I was told by an American friend that there's a photo of a protest in the USA -- not sure the era or the city -- and one of the protesters is taunting the cops with a doughnut on a fishing line.)


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    #5223
    Get In There
    Registered Users Posts: 679 ✭✭✭Get In There


    Looking to get a cargo bike, the one at the front with a canopy. Want to use it for school runs (my son's not even 1 year old yet but still!) and for food shops in the locality.

    I'd consider a second hand one.

    How much should I budget for?


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    #5224
    tomasrojo
    Registered Users Posts: 11,747 ✭✭✭✭tomasrojo


    First-hand, you can get a 7-speed bakfiets with a canopy for something around €2k from Greenaer in Dublin. I did anyway, but it was four years ago. You can get a few hundred off if you qualify for the cycle-to-work scheme.

    They might have a second-hand or display model in stock, but it might not be much cheaper than a first-hand bike under the c2w, and it would almost certainly be in worse condition. Only first-hand bikes qualify for the c2w.


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    #5225
    tomasrojo
    Registered Users Posts: 11,747 ✭✭✭✭tomasrojo


    The Dutch Bike Shop (online only now) does Babboe cargo bikes, which are quite similar, and I think are somewhat cheaper, albeit by reputation less likely to last a lifetime, but you may only need it as long as it lasts.
    https://dutchbikeshop.ie/


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    #5226
    Hurrache
    Registered Users Posts: 10,167 ✭✭✭✭Hurrache


    Hurrache wrote: »
    not discounting the stupidity of many city drivers when it comes to parking in places they obviously shouldn't,

    Didn't take long.

    https://twitter.com/discountcodez1/status/1259577019458879488


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    #5227
    Seth Brundle
    Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 39,098 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    Hurrache wrote: »
    Didn't take long.

    https://twitter.com/discountcodez1/status/1259577019458879488
    How many traffic offences is the truck driver commiting there?


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    #5228
    LollipopJimmy
    Registered Users Posts: 5,442 ✭✭✭LollipopJimmy


    There arent many options for unloading into the Supervalu there, the back entrance is height restricted and not a chance of pulling a pallet truck or combi trolley up the street there.


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    #5229
    Seth Brundle
    Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 39,098 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    LollipopJimmy wrote: »
    There arent many options for unloading into the Supervalu there, the back entrance is height restricted and not a chance of pulling a pallet truck or combi trolley up the street there.
    ...and what?
    That's an issue for MSVC to resolve and should not be allowing their drivers to break the law simply to unload.


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    #5230
    tomasrojo
    Registered Users Posts: 11,747 ✭✭✭✭tomasrojo


    Well, we did guess they were going to start destroying council property, rather than obey the law. Very entitled, need to get their house in order, yada yada.


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    #5231
    LollipopJimmy
    Registered Users Posts: 5,442 ✭✭✭LollipopJimmy


    Seth Brundle wrote: »
    ...and what?
    That's an issue for MSVC to resolve and should not be allowing their drivers to break the law simply to unload.

    The only point I'm making is that spaces need to be shared, common sense sometimes needs to prevail. I cycled that stretch every morning for a couple of years and tbh I don't have an issue with businesses conducting business.

    What I'm saying is if wands are being put in then provisions need to be made for loading and unloading because being able to buy food is pretty handy


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    #5232
    tomasrojo
    Registered Users Posts: 11,747 ✭✭✭✭tomasrojo


    They know full well they've been unloading illegally there for years. This is SuperValu, not some mom & pop store, or whatever we call those in Ireland. They've had years to find an alternative. Instead, brm-brm - crunch.


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    #5233
    tomasrojo
    Registered Users Posts: 11,747 ✭✭✭✭tomasrojo


    Does anyone know did SuperValu ever try to get that cycle track turned into a non-mandatory one? I presume they thought they could go on parking on it forever anyway


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    #5234
    LollipopJimmy
    Registered Users Posts: 5,442 ✭✭✭LollipopJimmy


    tomasrojo wrote: »
    They know full well they've been unloading illegally there for years. This is SuperValu, not some mom & pop store, or whatever we call those in Ireland. They've had years to find an alternative. Instead, brm-brm - crunch.

    What does it matter who owns it? It's been trading there for years, if an enclosed cycle lane is going to be placed outside the door then a provision needs to be made for loading and unloading. I'm not arguing for either or, what I'm saying is provisions need to be in place for both.


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    #5235
    tomasrojo
    Registered Users Posts: 11,747 ✭✭✭✭tomasrojo


    LollipopJimmy wrote: »
    What does it matter who owns it? It's been trading there for years, if an enclosed cycle lane is going to be placed outside the door then a provision needs to be made for loading and unloading. I'm not arguing for either or, what I'm saying is provisions need to be in place for both.

    Because SuperValu has resources and contacts with councillors


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    #5236
    tomasrojo
    Registered Users Posts: 11,747 ✭✭✭✭tomasrojo


    It's basically part of Musgrave's. It's not even a franchise.


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    #5237
    LollipopJimmy
    Registered Users Posts: 5,442 ✭✭✭LollipopJimmy


    tomasrojo wrote: »
    Because SuperValu has resources and contacts with councillors

    That's pretty ridiculous. So what you're saying is it would be ok for Nick's coffee up the way to have a van pull in?

    This is going to be the same case on Westland Row. These wands arent the fix all solution and just throwing them up without any consideration is a plaster over a crack and not a solution to poor infrastructure


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    #5238
    Hurrache
    Registered Users Posts: 10,167 ✭✭✭✭Hurrache


    Unless the county council told Supervalu at the time of planing being granted that they're entitled to park outside their door, unlikely, there's no obligation.

    Musgraves should have detailed delivery plans, based on ROTR, staff and public safety and I can be sure that had the person being doing their job correctly before the wands were put down that parking like they do now was not part of the plan. There's a long loading bay across from their store.

    It's a pain in the ass for them to manage in such a village, but it's their job to manage it correctly.


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    #5239
    Hurrache
    Registered Users Posts: 10,167 ✭✭✭✭Hurrache


    LollipopJimmy wrote: »
    This is going to be the same case on Westland Row. These wands arent the fix all solution and just throwing them up without any consideration is a plaster over a crack and not a solution to poor infrastructure

    The consideration, or lack thereof, has always been down to cars, vans and trucks not giving a **** about anyone else.


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    #5240
    LollipopJimmy
    Registered Users Posts: 5,442 ✭✭✭LollipopJimmy


    tomasrojo wrote: »
    It's basically part of Musgrave's. It's not even a franchise.

    And it's been operating there serving the area for quite some time


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    #5241
    tomasrojo
    Registered Users Posts: 11,747 ✭✭✭✭tomasrojo


    LollipopJimmy wrote: »
    That's pretty ridiculous. So what you're saying is it would be ok for Nick's coffee up the way to have a van pull in?


    No, of course it wouldn't be "ok". But you're saying that it's understandable that a multinational company goes on unloading illegally in peak traffic year after year. It would be *more* understandable that a much smaller family-run business would expect to get away with turning a blind eye, because they are less able to negotiate favourable conditions for themselves.

    Why couldn't SuperValu sort something else out?


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    #5242
    tomasrojo
    Registered Users Posts: 11,747 ✭✭✭✭tomasrojo


    LollipopJimmy wrote: »
    And it's been operating there serving the area for quite some time

    Illegally unloading, yes.


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    #5243
    tomasrojo
    Registered Users Posts: 11,747 ✭✭✭✭tomasrojo


    To make it worse, SuperValu used to put cones on the cycle track to stop anyone else parking there. So they used to act as if they de facto had exclusive right to park on that stretch of cycle track. And now their driver is destroying council property.


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    #5244
    LollipopJimmy
    Registered Users Posts: 5,442 ✭✭✭LollipopJimmy


    tomasrojo wrote: »
    Illegally unloading, yes.

    There was no cycle lane there when the store opened. Firing one in after the fact and then subsequently enclosing it is not the answer. These wands have been put in with no provision for businesses to conduct their necessary tasks.


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    #5245
    Hurrache
    Registered Users Posts: 10,167 ✭✭✭✭Hurrache


    LollipopJimmy wrote: »
    These wands have been put in with no provision for businesses to conduct their necessary tasks.

    They have a carpark, and a long loading bay directly across from the store. They have a number of stores in cities, I'm sure they have vans that are more suitable. The height restriction in their carpark is not that low.

    There's already enough provisions for them not to be lazy and destructive.


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    #5246
    tomasrojo
    Registered Users Posts: 11,747 ✭✭✭✭tomasrojo


    LollipopJimmy wrote: »
    There was no cycle lane there when the store opened. Firing one in after the fact and then subsequently enclosing it is not the answer. These wands have been put in with no provision for businesses to conduct their necessary tasks.

    I'm going to have to assume you're right about the cycle track being relatively recent as I don't know whether that's true.

    It's still their problem to deal with, not to be breaking a law that, whatever you think about it, was written to help people getting about by bike, and now destroying council property. They had *years* to do something about this. They even could have been restricted unloading to exclusively off-peak hours, which they most definitely didn't do.


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    #5247
    LollipopJimmy
    Registered Users Posts: 5,442 ✭✭✭LollipopJimmy


    Hurrache wrote: »
    They have a carpark, and a long loading bay directly across from the store. They have a number of stores in cities, I'm sure they have vans that are more suitable. The height restriction in their carpark is not that low.

    There's already enough provisions for them not to be lazy and destructive.

    Pallets and combis across the road? Ever pulled one of those combis?

    Theres no way you'd get a truck in or out if that car park.

    Anyway, I can see here asking for a provision to be made for business before putting down these wands is too much to ask for some


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    #5248
    tomasrojo
    Registered Users Posts: 11,747 ✭✭✭✭tomasrojo


    LollipopJimmy wrote: »
    Pallets and combis across the road? Ever pulled one of those combis?

    Theres no way you'd get a truck in or out if that car park.

    Anyway, I can see here asking for a provision to be made for business before putting down these wands is too much to ask for some

    Whatever about your arguments -- and they're not especially strong -- your non-stop sarcasm is extremely wearying.


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    #5249
    Hurrache
    Registered Users Posts: 10,167 ✭✭✭✭Hurrache


    tomasrojo wrote: »
    They even could have been restricted unloading to exclusively off-peak hours, which they most definitely didn't do.

    I've seen delivery plans from other large retailers which are all specific to individual stores and they're incredibly detailed. Type of vehicle, exact route to take, where to park, guide to getting the goods into the store, acceptable and unacceptable times for unloading, directions to turn off vehicle when doing so, and on and on and on.

    The only obstruction to Supervalu are their own policies and drivers.


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    #5250
    Hurrache
    Registered Users Posts: 10,167 ✭✭✭✭Hurrache


    LollipopJimmy wrote: »
    Pallets and combis across the road? Ever pulled one of those combis?

    They don't need to use either combis or pallets, you'd be lucky to see any other retailer use them within a city. In fact such retailers tend not to use either at all outside of warehouses.

    Like I said, the provision to deliver to their store has always been there. They alone chose not to use it appropriately.


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    #5251
    LollipopJimmy
    Registered Users Posts: 5,442 ✭✭✭LollipopJimmy


    tomasrojo wrote: »
    Whatever about your arguments -- and they're not especially strong -- your non-stop sarcasm is extremely wearying.

    I'm suggesting provisions be made for business before sticking wands or mandatory lanes in front of them. That's not a big ask and is far better for the wider stakeholders. If you think that's weak then fair enough.


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