Is anyone else starting to become a bit worried? mod note in first post

dubrov

lifeandtimes wrote:

"Meow, Saucer of milk,table grindle"

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grindle

dubrov wrote: »

Information transferred = 0

Somebody suggests that an asset has no inherent value, I point out it's value.

Apparently that's nothing, so what do you want?

Edit: nvm, you're probably just pointing out that I'm speaking to a wall.
I have a habit of that.

dubrov

grindle wrote:

Somebody suggests that an asset has no inherent value, I point out it's value.

grindle wrote:

Apparently that's nothing, so what do you want?

I agree on all your points.

Then you had to go and blow it

MayoSalmon

NIMAN wrote:

I just hope people haven't invested their life savings or entire livelihoods into these things.

Plenty fools about I'd say

grindle

dubrov wrote: »

I agree on all your points.

Then you had to go and blow it

I'm sorry. My knickers get fully twisted when a crash happens and the told-you-so brigade pop out with their pyramid fetishism and nothingness-backed arguments.

Yours in debt,

Some guy.

JohnnyFlash

When dogecoin has a market cap of 500 million then you know your dealing with a scam market.

makeorbrake

I'm interested in principal in buying back in to crypto - but with a sane proportion of my savings this time (i.e. no more than 10%). However, I'm not sure I'd be comfortable doing so until the whole tether thing gets dealt with - once and for all. Is that situation likely to get forced at some point? I understand they can ignore the subpoena??

I might think in terms of spreading my crypto risk also. With that, I've never really gone there. I never felt that I knew enough about other coins (apart from the fact that the vast majority of them are pump n' dumps!) to go there. How do you research other coins? i.e. aside from the white paper and promotional blurb, is there any independent review of coins that you recommend as a starting point in researching them?...one that you put 'some' level of faith into?

worded

Interested in people’s opinions to dabble or not at this late stage

grindle

makeorbrake wrote: »

I'm not sure I'd be comfortable doing so until the whole tether thing gets dealt with - once and for all. Is that situation likely to get forced at some point?

Hopefully.

makeorbrake wrote: »

How do you research other coins? i.e. aside from the white paper and promotional blurb, is there any independent review of coins that you recommend as a starting point in researching them?...one that you put 'some' level of faith into?

Hmm... Not really any great independent reviewers - you're trusting somebody else's assessment of a situation, so you should be wary.

worded wrote: »

Interested in people’s opinions to dabble or not at this late stage

If you want to take the risk, there is never a bad time. Even when the market itself is peaking, if a good ICO is going on at the time with good prospects and an interesting use-case & it's aiming to push against whatever market it's born from and you feel confident in the names behind it or how it's being run - take whatever chance you think is reasonable.

chakotha wrote: »

Yes good question. At 12:50 and within 10 minutes a 10%ish hike across the board. 7:50 east coast time. So much buying power across the board.

Most bots and a large proportion of humans are trading with and against BTC or ETH's value as benchmarks. CMC reports and charts values in dollars, soooo...

Selik

Sleeper12 wrote:

Too risky for me. Biggest risk I took washing buying BOI and AIB shares for a few cent & selling them for euros.

Really, what price did you buy at and what price did you sell at and was this before or after the reverse stock splits?

h0neybadger

worded wrote: »

Interested in people’s opinions to dabble or not at this late stage

For the record, I’ve been around Crypto long enough at this stage, and seen this many times.
Granted maybe not to this scale.

A correction is always good. And needed. And following a large correction, there is always a climb.

It depends on what you’re after really.
If your expecting to turn a 20% gain, then sure. That would be quick.
If you want to turn 1k into 10k, it’ll take a lot longer.

Anthracite

grindle wrote: »

If you want to take the risk, there is never a bad time. Even when the market itself is peaking, if a good ICO is going on at the time with good prospects and an interesting use-case & it's aiming to push against whatever market it's born from and you feel confident in the names behind it or how it's being run - take whatever chance you think is reasonable.

Again, I think we can all acknowledge that we are dealing with a bubble market at this stage. Is there some gold in their amidst all the dross? Possibly.

Do you like your odds of picking out one of the tiny proportion of coins with a future out of the thousands out there? And paying bubble prices for the privilege?

It's possible prices will go up from here, but there's no way I'd enter the market at this point. I sold a proportion of my coins to the extent that I'm gambling with free money, that's the only reason I'm still in - and I'm looking at the exit.

h0neybadger wrote: »

If you want to turn 1k into 10k, it’ll take a lot longer.

You probably didn't intend to mean it this way, but this suggests it's almost inevitable if you hold a coin long enough. I'd suggest turning 1k into 0k is at hundred times more likely.

grindle

Anthracite wrote: »

Again, I think we can all acknowledge that we are dealing with a bubble market at this stage. Is there some gold in their amidst all the dross? Possibly.

Do you like your odds of picking out one of the tiny proportion of coins with a future out of the thousands out there? And paying bubble prices for the privilege?

It's possible prices will go up from here, but there's no way I'd enter the market at this point. I sold a proportion of my coins to the extent that I'm gambling with free money, that's the only reason I'm still in - and I'm looking at the exit.

The market as a whole is hugely overvalued, I'd say everybody gets that at this stage. There's certainly gold amidst the dross, even amongst those which are currently overvalued in comparison to their utility.
A long term view has to be taken, that's the point of speculation. A lot of people are making or have made crazy decisions through FOMO, chasing green candles and driving prices to insane levels - but not every project is overvalued & some haven't been affected by bubble pricing at all thanks to everybody ignoring the fundamentals of a project in favour of quick moons.
I prefer to hold my positions in good projects until they've hit my targets - I don't dump low and FOMO into whichever coin is being shilled to the hilt which seems to be the strategy of most - some get lucky, others get burnt.
If the price drops and I still see the project moving forward at a good pace I'll probably buy more and set lower sell targets for those cheaply bought tokens/coins.

I do quite like my odds of picking the right projects - it's not too hard to filter the crap from the whole market. Your perspective seems to be that all cryptos are created equal and have an equal chance of success? The stupidity of the market as a whole is what leads to bad projects becoming overvalued but that doesn't mean to say you have to buy into the bad projects. If you can see work being done on a project with a good USP rather than marketing fluff and pro-shilling going on you should consider that a great pick even if it drops 50% in a market that's up 50% in the same day. Buy more of it with some profit made from a coin that has exceeded your expectations - take advantage of other people's bad trading decisions.

I've got some heavy bags, multiple coins where the devs don't care about marketing at this stage at all because they're working on the project, then closer to launch the marketing starts (like any sane business) and those bets will probably (imo) pay off in time because they're actually being worked on and have a great use-case.

The fundamentals of a product still matter, even in this market. Will betting on fundamentals hypothetically make as much money in as short a time frame as vapourware going 10x-100x?
Probably not, but I prefer my odds of picking out a few good projects with decent returns rather than the roullette wheel of picking the random projects that get shilled to the moon (although sometimes the stars align and the good project gets it's day in the sun).
This idea in the crypto markets that everything has to 100x or that the only good projects are in the top 10 or 20 or 100 is absurd and contradictory to boot - the newer coins that go 10x or 100x came from a place much further down the list. Smarter people were buying at that stage.

lifeandtimes

Anthracite wrote: »

Again, I think we can all acknowledge that we are dealing with a bubble market at this stage. Is there some gold in their amidst all the dross? Possibly.

Do you like your odds of picking out one of the tiny proportion of coins with a future out of the thousands out there? And paying bubble prices for the privilege?

It's possible prices will go up from here, but there's no way I'd enter the market at this point. I sold a proportion of my coins to the extent that I'm gambling with free money, that's the only reason I'm still in - and I'm looking at the exit.


You probably didn't intend to mean it this way, but this suggests it's almost inevitable if you hold a coin long enough. I'd suggest turning 1k into 0k is at hundred times more likely.

This is the type of FUD that effects people and makes them cash out and take a loss.

No I don't think we can agree with what you're saying

You say a tiny proportion will make it, how do you know that? Do you have a magic crystal ball?

Every coin that enters the market with a strong development team and is backed accordingly has the potential to make it big and it's easy for people to see which coins have the most potentional.

By your pessimistic comment everyone should just cash out and now and keave crypto forever.

Anthracite wrote: »

You probably didn't intend to mean it this way, but this suggests it's almost inevitable if you hold a coin long enough. I'd suggest turning 1k into 0k is at hundred times more likely.

With the right research and patience it can be done, the people who turn 1k into 0 are the ones who dont know what they are doing or took a gamble that didn't pay off

lifeandtimes

grindle wrote: »

the newer coins that go 10x or 100x came from a place much further down the list. Smarter people were buying at that stage.

As a rule of thumb I kinda stay away from the top 150 and invest in the lower coins that I feel have potential. Low investment can return big gains if as you say "the stars align"

Anthracite

grindle wrote: »

I do quite like my odds of picking the right projects - it's not too hard to filter the crap from the whole market. Your perspective seems to be that all cryptos are created equal and have an equal chance of success? The stupidity of the market as a whole is what leads to bad projects becoming overvalued but that doesn't mean to say you have to buy into the bad projects. If you can see work being done on a project with a good USP rather than marketing fluff and pro-shilling going on you should consider that a great pick even if it drops 50% in a market that's up 50% in the same day. Buy more of it with some profit made from a coin that has exceeded your expectations - take advantage of other people's bad trading decisions.

I've got some heavy bags, multiple coins where the devs don't care about marketing at this stage at all because they're working on the project, then closer to launch the marketing starts (like any sane business) and those bets will probably (imo) pay off in time because they're actually being worked on and have a great use-case.

I don't mean to pull the 'old man investor' card here, but that genuinely sounds like something I could have written back in 2000/2001 when I was putting money into Parthus Technologies and Cable and Wireless during the tech bubble - one a solid company with good management and great technology, the other a hugely well-established company with a long history and a great future.

I lost a packet on both. Turns out I couldn't see the future as well as I thought.

Anthracite

lifeandtimes wrote: »

This is the type of FUD that effects people and makes them cash out and take a loss.

Applying the label 'FUD' to something you don't like does not constitute an argument.

Let's look at your position: hold whatever you have, and you will get rich. If you don't get rich, it's because you are stupid.

Again, I've heard all this before, with the tech bubble, with the property bubble, and there were countless bubbles before that I could only read about (I trust you have done some reading on finance?).

I'm sure you sincerely believe what you are saying, but sincerity does not guarantee results and does not put money in your bank account.

Can you at least reassure me that you have done some reading into the history of speculative bubbles, and perhaps point out why you feel as you state above that the cryptocurrency market is not a bubble?

lifeandtimes

Anthracite wrote: »

Applying the label 'FUD' to something you don't like does not constitute an argument.

Let's look at your position: hold whatever you have, and you will get rich. If you don't get rich, it's because you are stupid.

Again, I've heard all this before, with the tech bubble, with the property bubble, and there were countless bubbles before that I could only read about (I trust you have done some reading on finance?).

I'm sure you sincerely believe what you are saying, but sincerity does not guarantee results and does not put money in your bank account.

Can you at least reassure me that you have done some reading into the history of speculative bubbles, and perhaps point out why you feel as you state above that the cryptocurrency market is not a bubble?

You've been burned before, I understand that and it's made you very apprehensive to this market.

It's not my job to try and convince it's a good market and you should stay investing, that's up to you mate.

But as a young(ish) person myself I see crypto is the way the world is going, just like cards were adopted as a means of payment over cash and tapping your phone to pay has taken over, cryptos with the ease of access to them, simple usage and no fees involving a 3rd party everyone (in my opinion) will adopt to them like everyone has a mobile phone, coincidently your phone will hold your wallet so nobody has to worry about banks etc. Employers will just lodge crypto to employees wallets.

lifeandtimes

Anthracite wrote: »

why you feel as you state above that the cryptocurrency market is not a bubble?

Also I did not say that so please don't quote me as saying such

dubrov

lifeandtimes wrote:

But as a young(ish) person myself I see crypto is the way the world is going, just like cards were adopted as a means of payment over cash and tapping your phone to pay has taken over, cryptos with the ease of access to them, simple usage and no fees involving a 3rd party everyone (in my opinion) will adopt to them like everyone has a mobile phone, coincidently your phone will hold your wallet so nobody has to worry about banks etc. Employers will just lodge crypto to employees wallets.

That may all be true. That doesn't mean cryptos are a buy at the moment.

I'm pretty convinced this is a bubble but cryptos are here to stay

lifeandtimes

dubrov wrote: »

That may all be true. That doesn't mean cryptos are a buy at the moment.

I'm pretty convinced this is a bubble but cryptos are here to stay

Like I said I'm not here to convince anyone, that's not my job.

I believe what I believe and that's that

Anthracite

lifeandtimes wrote: »

You've been burned before, I understand that and it's made you very apprehensive to this market.

It's not my job to try and convince it's a good market and you should stay investing, that's up to you mate..

You misunderstood, I'm asking how you you convinced yourself.

lifeandtimes wrote: »

But as a young(ish) person myself I see crypto is the way the world is going, just like cards were adopted as a means of payment over cash and tapping your phone to pay has taken over, cryptos with the ease of access to them, simple usage and no fees involving a 3rd party everyone (in my opinion) will adopt to them like everyone has a mobile phone, coincidently your phone will hold your wallet so nobody has to worry about banks etc. Employers will just lodge crypto to employees wallets.

So...you know nothing about the history of speculative bubbles, and haven't cared to learn?

(the Bluetooth technology that Parthus pioneered is ubiquitous now: it didn't mean their shares retained more than a fraction of their value)

Squozen

Dades wrote: »

You obviously haven't tried to buy a house in Dublin or Apple shares recently!

I’m trying to buy a house in Dublin right now actually, hence I can’t be speculating. And I sold my Apple shares a couple of years ago, made a pretty decent profit.

I wouldn’t call either of them bubbles. Dublin has a massive housing shortage and that’s not going away any time soon - supply and demand. And Apple made $20B profit in the last quarter, it’s hard to argue their market cap isn’t justified right now.

lifeandtimes

Anthracite wrote: »

You misunderstood, I'm asking how you you convinced yourself

How I was convinced is not relevant, what convinced me may not convince someone else and vice versa and as I've said it's not my job to do it either. Sell because you think the bubble will burst or hold, I honestly don't care.

You've made you opinions known which you are entitled to do and I've made mine

Anthracite wrote: »

So...you know nothing about the history of speculative bubbles, and haven't cared to learn

Again making assumptions when I haven't madeany specific comment to confirm or deny that question.

Enjoy whatever you got out of crypto and good luck whatever else you decide to put your money into....if you ever do

Anthracite

lifeandtimes wrote: »

Again making assumptions when I haven't madeany specific comment to confirm or deny that question.

If you chose to answer a simple question, no assumptions would be needed.

Look, you seem like a nice fella and I wish you well. I'm just falling back into old habits, having spent years on boards and elsewhere trying to warn people about the property bubble. I hate to see it happening again.

grindle

Anthracite wrote: »

...having spent years on boards and elsewhere trying to warn people about the property bubble. I hate to see it happening again.

The crypto market will ebb and flow dramatically for years yet to come, you're a while away from needing to warn us about the bubble popping.

In relation to the property bubble, the crypto market is likely in the very early stages of it, think late 90s Ireland. That period when most idiots thought house prices could annually maintain 4x the growth of our wages and that would be fine. Ideal even! Sher we'll all be rich!

I see why you'd worry about people throwing their money away, there's a shocking amount being thrown towards absolute muck.

WhiteMemento9

Drop in the ocean crash when you compare it

Stock market loses nearly $1 trillion on the week

JohnnyFlash

I understand the hype around Blockchain. But the valuation of these coins? Not getting it. Ethereum for example. They launched coins that now have a value of around 900 dollars. How will this 900 dollar coin be practically implemented into a financial system, and what will it be used for? And why would society, a bank, or a community use this ethereum coin instead of just launching their own? I see hype for these coins being mixed up with hype around the tech behind it. It looks like a huge scam to me. Create shît coins out of thin air, get people to give you ethereum for them, then cash out into FIAT.

Load of cock to be honest. You’ll all get burned.

JohnnyFlash

WhiteMemento9 wrote: »

Drop in the ocean crash when you compare it

Stock market loses nearly $1 trillion on the week

Another bubble, but at least shares are based on companies producing something, not magicing coins out of thin air.

lifeandtimes

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

I understand the hype around Blockchain. But the valuation of these coins? Not getting it. Ethereum for example. They launched coins that now have a value of around 900 dollars. How will this 900 dollar coin be practically implemented into a financial system, and what will it be used for? And why would society, a bank, or a community use this ethereum coin instead of just launching their own? I see hype for these coins being mixed up with hype around the tech behind it. It looks like a huge scam to me. Create shît coins out of thin air, get people to give you ethereum for them, then cash out into FIAT.

Load of cock to be honest. You’ll all get burned.

I've seen your comments all over this forum johnny, you have some hatred for crypto. I'm sure a lot people felt the same when the stock market first took off.

I wish everyone well in this market and always trust your gut, trade what you can afford to lose and get out when you can