Fighter jets for the Air Corps?

TheTruth89

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119404839#Comment_119404839

Site ban for what saying the Irish army will never be able to stop an invading force ? sorry some of us live in reality.

You cant debate that point though can you so you just have to resort to backhanded insults.

Sorry i didnt realize this was a thread for the delusional and reality was frowned... yeah guys hopefully we get our super duper F-15's we need em to defend our skies from invasion and deter any outside aggression we have alot of that recently super necessary to get our Air Force up and running. Anyone have any idea when we are getting our new ship?

Wonder could we get some F-35's and cross train with NATO forces? best get the boys ready for some spec ops in the Ukraine incase we have to defend europe...hmmm

Psychlops

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119405245#Comment_119405245

So many errors with that post.

TheTruth89

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119405331#Comment_119405331

Cant debate the fact the DF are incapable of defending against anyone that actually has the ability to invade. You cant even attempt a response.

A Thread about acquiring advanced fighter jets yet ye cant even give one logical reason as to why we would need them what's changed?

Stick to pointing out errors tho its all ya got.

purplepanda

Obviously some complete gobshites know more about Irelands Defence Forces & future military needs than a commission composed of defence experts from home & overseas, many with extensive military experience & knowledge.

Why shouldn't Ireland be comparable to similar nations in terms of population & national income in Europe in military defence spending.

Why shouldn't Ireland have the means to defence it's hard won independence, you'd think that some didn't notice the historical lesson on how Ireland's independence actually came about. It certainly wasn't won by pacifists!

The Defence Commission report is calling for nothing more than other nations in Europe have, it doesn't mention Aircraft Carriers & a fleet of nuclear missile submarines, nor a force of F-35 stealth bombers. It just calls for an adequate defence force for the nation including proper maritime patrol of the the Exclusive Economic Zone of the Atlantic Ocean, & the future ongoing implementation of United Nations peacekeeping missions.

Those that want the Defence Forces further reduced & even abolished are nothing but crazy pacifists or hard left Putinist apologists. A tiny minority with no serious political base, nor mandate from the Irish people.

Larbre34

That's an excellent summary of the issue.

Notmything

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119403976#Comment_119403976

The amount of people who think we're a nation of flying columns just waiting to be unleashed is scary. Some people have spent too much time watching "the wind that shakes the barley" or "Michael Collins" and not enough time in the real world.

If a well trained professional army is not going to be able to defend us, what hope has a bunch of untrained wannabes?

sparky42

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119405859#Comment_119405859

Exactly what I said, and it’s not even that, the same people seem to forget that compared to other suppression campaigns of the British Empire they were “restrained” in the War of Independence, the idea that a modern strategy should start with no defence capability but insurgent forces is beyond laughable, and that thinking is pretty much why the DF is as limited as it is.

Notmything

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119405902#Comment_119405902

Clearly a case of great minds thinking alike so

TheTruth89

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119405740#Comment_119405740

Do you know what our independence was won with ? It wasn't wannabe military gobshites on a board spouting how we need F-16s anyway that's for sure.

In what land do you ever think Ireland is ever going to compete with the UK in terms of traditional military might?

Honestly you and others on here speak as if ye are in the know on military things but you couldnt be more delusional.

In reality if we started tomorrow and went flat to the mat spending every red cent on our military it still wouldn't be enough to defeat the British in a traditional military conflict. They are nuclear armed. Fantasy over. Welcome to reality.

I can tell you one thing for certain if your fantasy war with Britain or who ever comes true it won't be the the DF that stops em.

And that's a fact. To put things in perspective the UK just increased it's spending by 2.5 million that small increase alone is nearly double the DF entire budget

We don't have jets and a large army and all the other nonsense ye dreamers dream about because we don't need it and that's just how it is.

TheTruth89

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119405859#Comment_119405859

The "untrained wannabes" are the reason there is a DF in the first place they were the ones that fought a war and won independence...

I think the Netflix has gone to the heads of the DF enthusiasts on here dreaming of black hawks and aircraft carriers defending auld Eire from imaginary attacks 🤣🤣

Stay ready lads!! There's luggage in Dublin airport that needs shifting and there could be a flood with all this climate change💪💪 the f-16s will come in handy 🤣

TheTruth89

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119405740#Comment_119405740

Also the DF have been fufilling the roles you mentioned for a long time now, without F-16s or all the other Gucci gear the baaais want on here.

Notmything

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119406076#Comment_119406076

Without a modern fighter we rely on the RAF to defend our airspace so I take it that's your definition of fulfilling a role.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119406059#Comment_119406059

A surprising number were actually trained by the British army and had fought in WWI so not exactly untrained.

Circumstances are very different today. Hard to imagine an occupying force would be as restrained as the British were.

But the reality is no matter what anyone here says you are not going to change your mind so tbh what's the point in trying to debate (not that you are debating) with you?

sparky42

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119406224#Comment_119406224

The same could be said for having to rely on the RN to patrol our subsurface environment as we lack any such capabilities even though other nations of our similar numbers can do so. Again it amuses me as to why you have so many posters so quick to say "its impossible for Ireland" and yet ignore examples of other nations that have many times out capabilities for the same population or economy.

purplepanda

"Those that want the Defence Forces further reduced & even abolished are nothing but crazy pacifists or hard left Putinist apologists. A tiny minority with no serious political base, nor mandate from the Irish people."

I should have also added the other hard left faction that despise & undermine the Irish Defence Forces at every opportunity, whilst many of this faction claim to be patriots & republicans, their leadership & philosophy still answer to Moscow & Beijing, not Ireland, just like the others mentioned above.

This other faction will even claim that we don't need the Irish Defence Forces, that there is another "Óglaigh na hÉireann" who will "defend" Ireland, so we don't need the Defence Forces "cause we've got the 'Ra!" whilst they sit on their barstools!

SF is very popular party at present, we still don't have an honest policy on what will happen to the Irish Defence Forces if they actually form a government, because they keep their plans on this issue hidden from the Irish electorate. Recently they removed Pro Russia propaganda from their website after the latest Russian invasion of Ukraine.

Would SF implement the Defence Commission report? Probably not, but they won't admit that at present, could they even downgrade the defence forces even further than previous governments have done over the decades, it is certainly a possibility.

I call those who undermine the defence of the nation traitors if that what they wish to further achieve.

Dohvolle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119405105#Comment_119405105

Babcock are just builders, they happened to own the yard where the last 4 ships were built, before that it was known as Appledore shipyard, when it built the previous 2 ships. That yard is no longer in the shipbuilding business, and Brexit has greatly complicated the process of us getting anything built in the UK again. The last 2 designs have come from what was Aker Yards, now Vard, based in Canada. It will be well flagged before you see it in Etenders, trust me on that.

Safehaven Marine do great boats, ideal workboats in open waters, they don't build any ships though. They are limited by what can be carried by road from their factory to the dock where their boats are lifted into the sea, on the other side of the Cork/Waterford Border. I believe they are currently building motor launches for the Polish Navy, and recently built a survey launch for the Royal Navy. I understand they did bid for the recent Naval service Motor Launch tender, but were unsuccessful. That's how it goes.

Back to Fighter jets. FCAS is in the very early stages yet, and seems to be expected to roll out in 2040. Or 2050 in real time, going by EFA. By which point if I'm still around I'll be in my 80s, so I'm not going to get too concerned by it yet.

TheTruth89

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119406224#Comment_119406224

You still fail to mention who these potential "occupiers" are and how they are going to just waltz in and take over Ireland.. just have a think how that would come about it is impossible 0% none zip. Unless its the US or UK in which case our few F-16's wont be doing much in any case. Is it starting to dawn on ye now how daft this whole "Ireland needs a powerful military" nonsense is? can you see why its a complete and utter waste of tax payers money?

I don't see the problem with the RAF escorting the odd Russian Ejit out of Irish Airspace, seems to be working perfectly so far as its beneficial to both countries. It would be cool to have our own F-16's but its just not needed if it was as critical as portrayed on here we'd have em already.

Now if the UK for some odd reason decided they would no longer do the role then you'd have some argument for getting F-16's or something.

TheTruth89

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119406297#Comment_119406297

You need to take a breath bud, you're talking as if you are delivering a speech to the nation, relax we aren't being invaded anytime soon. The people you are talking about just don't want an unnecessarily heavily militarized state because some pro DF fanatic is paranoid we are about to be invaded, they just want that money spent on more necessary stuff all be it those things might not be as fancy as F-16's.

Larbre34

Not a sinner is talking about being invaded you moron, we are talking about creating a defence force to secure our land, air and sea borders from military probing and interference, criminal activity, drugs, trafficking and smuggling and a vastly enhanced cyber protection infrastructure to lessen the risk of attacks similar to that on the HSE IT systems. These could manifest as DDOS on anything from banking, to welfare, to energy generation and transmission, to multinational tech companies and Data storage.

Is this even beginning to become clearer to you??

TheTruth89

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119407211#Comment_119407211

1)Exactly what I said, and it’s not even that, the same people seem to forget that compared to other suppression campaigns of the British Empire they were “restrained” in the War of Independence, the idea that a modern strategy should start with no defence capability but insurgent forces is beyond laughable, and that thinking is pretty much why the DF is as limited as it is.

2)Circumstances are very different today. Hard to imagine an occupying force would be as restrained as the British were.

3)We're currently lucky in our geographic position ...it's not really in anyone intrest to invade us ..but if we ever need an airforce in a hurry (as opposed to an air corp ) it'll be hard to get one from an almost standing start ... So a squadron of some light fighter won't make us into some massive military force pushing our weight around - but it's a good start , it'd mean we could police our own eez , train with the Brits ,the french , the norweigans or the swedes ... Which makes it all the less likely that an air-force would be needed in anger

4)Ireland as a country is from a military perspective of interest during a war, especially if it involves some kind of East-West conflict. The same applies for Iceland, or Newfoundland ( which wasn't part of Canada during WW2 and the Americans had bases there )

And that's not quoting the ones where invasion is implied as a reason for the pro DF war fantasists, reading the drivel from people like you im glad we spend **** all on the DF i hope we spend less and allocate the money to housing or other actual useful stuff rather than jets to appease gobshites like yourself who live paranoid.

TheTruth89

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119407211#Comment_119407211

Go on dish out your plans there for all this, wheres all the money coming from? lol Do you have any idea the level of investment it would take to do what your talking about? And for what? the odd time we get a cyber attack? name a time outside the HSE DDOS that we needed cyber protection branch of the DF's. Multinationals will be outsourcing to legit Cyber protection not looking to the DF's for it.

So far in this thread i just see DF enthusiast clutching a straws and fabricating threats to try justify higher spending lol

There is a reason the vast majority of us don't and wont allow higher spending on military and that's because its not need and is a waste of resources.

Do ye understand that? that's why your not getting the money end of.

Dohvolle

"vast majority of us"

https://youtu.be/FyH6vOMYSnY

Sgt. Bilko 09

Do ye understand that? that's why your not getting the money end of”

This will result in the Defence budget rising from €1.1 billion to €1.5 billion the largest increase in Defence funding in the history of the State

I said I was done with you previously but you’ve just proven you have no idea what you’re talking about.

Now I’m done with you, End Off😂

sparky42

Why are people still feeding a low level troll?

Sgt. Bilko 09

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119406421#Comment_119406421

I think the Turks are really pushing the German/French on the project as they have a nato alley that is progressing there project in quick time on the TF-X. Both projects were established at the same time.

ah! that shows my knowledge of maritime (lack off) craft to a tee, I though safehaven did a full suite of vessels.

sparky42

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119407619#Comment_119407619

It’s not really the Turks, their project is more to put pressure on getting back into the F35 program, the main competitor for the French/German/Spanish project is the U.K. led Tempest program which has got backing from the Swedes and Japanese from memory.

As for Safehaven, there’s also the fact that their order books are pretty much full, apart from price I think that went against them for the Reserve order.

Sgt. Bilko 09

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119407635#Comment_119407635

I actually never looked at it that way to be honest I forgot turkey was booted from the project. Just realising now, the TF-X is a mirror image for the South Korean KF-21. I would agree with your opinion on it.

Hopefully that tempest programme is sped up -as it looks like a remarkable aircraft from the design

TheTruth89

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119407410#Comment_119407410

Oh yeah that's an "Increase" alright 🤣 I won't even go into explaining that , yer laughin lads get yer jets and cyber divisions so out of that 🤣🤣 or maybe they might pay the soldiers a living wage so they can actually retain experienced soldiers...

No of course not it LL def be spent on military hardware we don't need 🤣🤣

The only thing you ve proven is you have no ability to think for yourself and what you consider knowledge is news articles you can regurgitate 🤣

MAULBROOK

Dose this bloke have a off switch. On and on and on,

TheTruth89

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119409308#Comment_119409308

Alright sensitive Sally, with all the military talk in here I thought ye d be tough out never heard so much whinging In my life.

It's not my fault the DF aren't worth funding properly it's just that they aren't really needed to be a full fledged military force. The RAF do the job for us so we don't need jets. It's called R-E-A-L-I-T-Y.

End of thread.

I'll leave ye get back to taking about special projects certain nations are doing like ye are in the know... And being armchair generals and toy soldiers.

Gobshites 🤣🤣🤣

MAULBROOK

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119409882#Comment_119409882

I don't mind input but mother of Jesus you don't half go on. And no need for the insults.