Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie
Is it time for mass protest at the housing crisis?
Options
Comments
-
-
Two reasons.
Many landlords bought when prices were high, and have large mortgages on the property, so even though rents are high, they barely cover the mortgage (before other costs such as wear and tear, idle periods, tenancy registration etc.) come into play.
Secondly, because we don't let landlords run a business. There is no incentive for a landlord to be a good landlord as they don't get tax deductions on all the money they put in, they can't claim all the interest as a business cost and all the laws are stacked against them if they get a bad tenant. If they are lucky, based on the value of the asset, they may make a 5-6% return on their investment. If a tenant overholds, if they damage the property, if interest rates rise, then the landlord will make a loss.
The only way to make money as a landlord is to be the absolute worst type of person imaginable, don't put any money into the property, give tenants the very minimum that is required, ignore the tenancy laws, as the fine is often cheaper than letting them stay in the property while the PRTB makes it's decision (that will often fly in the face of common sense anyway). I can see why people are selling up or treating their tenants like sh*t and getting as much rent as they can to avoid going under.
Not a landlord btw (and never intending to be one, in Ireland at least).
The problem is, like your post above illustrates is that amateur landlords expect renters to pay their mortgage for them and anything less than having the full mortgage covered by the rent is seen as a problem for them. It's not, and it's a distortion created by the pr machine of the landlords. A landlord should not expect to be able to put down a 20% deposit and walk away from a house that will in all probability have at least doubled in value by the end of the mortgage term and reap a 10x return on his initial investment.0 -
First off, there is no homeless crisis
I've said it before on this forum (Quoting myself from a different thread):I keep hearing about "The Homeless" problem
In my eyes the only people that can help the homeless are themselves.
There are 3 kinds of homeless people
1: Young women in their 20's with kids and the father "isn't around"
2: People with serious drink/drug problems
3: People who have genuinely lost everything through a series of bad events <= These are the vast minority
There is no helping 1 and 2, and they are the vast majority.
I saw on RTE news earlier in the week some woman living in a hotel for the last few years with 4 kids, the youngest of which was only a couple of months old, finally got a house off the council.
WTF was she doing having another kid when she already had 3 and was living in the hotel?
Her eldest child (7 or 8 years old maybe) had to be put up in a separate room because for insurance reasons the hotel can't have more than 4 people in a room.
No sign of the Dad (Dad's)
I know a Homeless guy in Raheny, He lives in St Annes park. His family don't want anything to do with him as he a terrible alcoholic.
He needs to sort himself out before anything can be done to sort him out with accommodation.
There is a reason as to why people are homeless, and generally the reason is because they have serious antisocial/substance abuse/addiction issues.
No amount of money will be able to help them.
There's no helping someone that won't help themselves.
I know the above is harsh, but it's very true.
In terms of Private housing, we're still reeling from the 2008 crash (YES, 10 years on!)
Couple of previous posters has said that everyone hates Developers and have no time for them.
This is very true, it should be noted that everyone also includes the Bank's.
You may have noticed in Dublin City there is a massive amount of building work going on at the moment
The Crane count is quite high, nearly boom time high.
But most of what's being built is commercial office blocks, and there is a reason for this, which I will get to.
The Banks are effectively state owned now or the state has a large amount of input into how they operate.
The last thing the state wants to have to do it to bail out the banks again. Yes there was a ruling that states that an EU Country is no longer obligated to bail out their banks if it ever came to that. But that doesn't mean they can't. If it came to it again, the Government would bail out the banks despite not being legally obligated to do so.
So how does this explain why all we are seeing is big office blocks being built?
Quite simple really, the Banks are being told to only lend to Developers that are guaranteed to be able to pay back the loans they are given.
Loaning to a Developer to build something huge like Capital Dock makes perfect sense.
1 Loan, 1 Developer, 1 Building, 1 Buyer for the Building.
There is low risk there despite the amount of money lent as the buyer would have already been lined up before hand.
We are also in the middle of Brexit, Good office space is hard to come by in Dublin.
Also if there was another crash, It'll be easy for a Bank to Evict the tennants and reclaim the property if they ever needed to.
It's low risk!
Now lets compare that to a Developer who wants to build a housing estate:
1 Loan, 1 Developer, 50 Buildings, No Buyers until the houses are completed (No one is going to fall for the deposit on a house not built yet scam during the boom again)
Time has finally thought the Banks that there is high risk involved with Houses.
They may lend for a higher interest rate but at that point the Developer is no longer making enough profit for it to be worth his/her while. (These guys don't get out of bed for anything less than a few million)
The Developers that want build houses are being told to go out to the market to secure funding for the Build. IE Offering "Investment Opportunities" to people like us.
But remember, everyone hates Developers and we don't trust them either. So very few people will invest in these "Opportunities".
If there was another crash, the bank is going to have a difficult time getting those houses back if there a people living in them or renting them.
It's high risk... Safe as houses term doesn't apply anymore
So ultimately the reason there is little of none housing development happening is because Developers are having a hard time securing funding to do these builds, due to the level of risk associated with them.
In terms of Social housing, we're still reeling from the 70's/80's Council Estate builds and the 10% rule in the Boom (If that makes sense)
Here's a great Idea:
Lets build a bunch awful looking houses, and pack as many of them into an area as we can.
Then we'll move in a bunch of low paid workers, people that don't work, people with addiction issues, single mothers with loads kids, people with all sorts of social problems into this area.
Then we'll provide f*ck all services to the place and perform no maintenance in the area.
And lets see what happens....
The result as we all know was the likes of places like:
Darndale
Kilbarrack
Whitechuch
Jobstown
etc
And parts of:
Finglas
Clondalkin
Ballymon
etc
The Irish council estate, a Pillar of poor social housing planning.
And I'm not being a snob, I grew up in Kilbarrack. The place was a Kip! and I mean a total DUMP!
So much to the extent that 2 Roddy Doyle Films were made there: The Snapper and the Van (of which I have a cameo role in!)
Anyone that thinks it's a good idea for councils to start building this type of estate again needs their f*cking head examined.
The councils realise this too, so that's why no more of them are being built.
In the 90's building boom, we then had flurry of single mothers looking for houses, for them and they 3 kids from 3 different Dads (It was no longer and Sin to have a child outside of Wedlock...).
The councils solution again was a poor one. Of all Private building developments 10% of the houses built would be for social housing units.
Que the building of places like Tyrells Town.
Developers knew they'd have no chance of selling a house if potential buyers knew there was going to be social housing mixed in with private houses.
I for one wouldn't buy a house if I knew Mary and her 5 kids from 5 different Dads was moving in FOR FREE next door.
Developers moved their "quota" of social housing units to the edge of their developments or into a Development all by itself and rented or sold to the council.
As far as I am aware this has since stopped, and rightly so.
The new Plan now since 2010 is for the council to just buy houses that are on the market and move people on the waiting list into them.
I know of people who have literally begged their neighbors not to sell to the council. No one wants to do in their neighbors or friends, so this process is slow.
The Market...... (I f*cking hate that term :mad: )
I looked on Myhome.ie in November, there were 4049 property's for sale in Dublin.
Break that down:
2887 Houses
952 Apartments
81 Sites
17 Investment property's
3 Agricultural property's
As far as I can see there is no real shortage of supply in terms of buying. (Otherwise those numbers would be far lower)
I would imagine a large number of these properties are places where some has died and the house is now permanently vacant.
Most houses I've looked at need a serious amount of modernisation.
It should be noted that there were only 447 property's to rent in Dublin at that time.
This is VERY low. There are a large number of hedge funds sitting a vast numbers of vacant properties waiting for their value to go up however.
The Rent prices are so high because of this (The HAP Scheme)
House prices are so high because of constant government interference in "The Market" :mad:, the most recent of which was the HTB schema which saw every house in the country increase by €20,000 overnight.
More interesting reading, according to property price register the following number of homes were sold in each year:
2010 - 6930 Properties sold
2011 - 5897 Properties sold
2012 - 8910 Properties sold
2013 - 10371 Properties sold
2014 - 14163 Properties sold
2015 - 15408 Properties sold
2016 - 15722 Properties sold
2017 - 13387 Properties sold (as of November)
So that's basically it.
This is why there is f*ck all houses to rent/buy and f*ck all social housing.
PS sorry for the long post0 -
The problem is, like your post above illustrates is that amateur landlords expect renters to pay their mortgage for them and anything less than having the full mortgage covered by the rent is seen as a problem for them. It's not, and it's a distortion created by the pr machine of the landlords. .
What determines an amateur landlord? You're probably describing any individual that bought a house. :rolleyes:
And how sure are you about this expectation of the mortgage definitely being paid by renters?
I charge 800 pm. My mortgage is 733.26pm, my life assurance is 23.12pm, and my mortgage cover is 66.52pm. So between my mortgage/insurance cost's I'm making a loss of 21.90 per month. That's not even taking into account the extra costs such as management fees, paying for repairs, moderate requests from the tenant for extra installations. etc.
Now I could increase the rent on my property to be more in line with others in Cork, and then, my tenant would seek somewhere cheaper to live and since she has a stable job with a family most other landlords will offer discounts to get her. So I charge more, lose out on a reliable tenant and get in single professionals instead who do far more in damages, who I have to chase for payments, etc.
Amateur landlord... Yup. I'm curious,Vronsky... Do you have a property and are you renting it out to anyone?A landlord should not expect to be able to put down a 20% deposit and walk away from a house that will in all probability have at least doubled in value by the end of the mortgage term and reap a 10x return on his initial investment
We no longer do. That dream scenario ended well over a decade ago for individual buyers. And doubling in value? lol. Now that's funny. It happened for my parents who bought in the 60s but for the rest of us buying within the last 10-20 years? Very few people would have been that lucky.
Quick edit: I'm sure there are individuals and companies making a killing out there on rents. I suspect it's happening in Dublin, and in very select areas of other cities... but I do get tired of this belief, that alll landlords are making decent money from renting. Many of us are scraping along hoping the market rises enough that we can sell and make a slight profit.0 -
Two reasons.
Many landlords bought when prices were high, and have large mortgages on the property, so even though rents are high, they barely cover the mortgage (before other costs such as wear and tear, idle periods, tenancy registration etc.) come into play.
Secondly, because we don't let landlords run a business. There is no incentive for a landlord to be a good landlord as they don't get tax deductions on all the money they put in, they can't claim all the interest as a business cost and all the laws are stacked against them if they get a bad tenant. If they are lucky, based on the value of the asset, they may make a 5-6% return on their investment. If a tenant overholds, if they damage the property, if interest rates rise, then the landlord will make a loss.
The only way to make money as a landlord is to be the absolute worst type of person imaginable, don't put any money into the property, give tenants the very minimum that is required, ignore the tenancy laws, as the fine is often cheaper than letting them stay in the property while the PRTB makes it's decision (that will often fly in the face of common sense anyway). I can see why people are selling up or treating their tenants like sh*t and getting as much rent as they can to avoid going under.
Not a landlord btw (and never intending to be one, in Ireland at least).
The problem is, like your post above illustrates is that amateur landlords expect renters to pay their mortgage for them and anything less than having the full mortgage covered by the rent is seen as a problem for them. It's not, and it's a distortion created by the pr machine of the landlords. A landlord should not expect to be able to put down a 20% deposit and walk away from a house that will in all probability have at least doubled in value by the end of the mortgage term and reap a 10x return on his initial investment.
Landlords , amateur or not, do it to make a profit .. Surely you comprehend this ??
The market sets house /rent prices not the landlord.
Oh by the way , many of those amateur landlords you speak of currently house RAS/HAP Tenants so less of your bull**** please0 -
Advertisement
-
It's ironic, when the recession hit and my house plummeted in value by around 50% the younger folks on boards were saying that we got what we deserved, paying far too much for houses that weren't worth the value, this was always going to happen...nobody put a gun to our heads to buy a house.
Then when the government said that 2nd time buyers needed to stump up 20% versus 10% for first time buyers we were told we created this mess, this was only fair and that nobody put a gun to our head to be in negative equity.
Those measure were completely unfair to a generation as the only ones truly affected would be those who bought in the couple of years prior to the recession and paid their mortgages despite their economic situations. Again, this argument was countered with nobody put a gun to your head to buy a house.
Now the tide has turned and we are expected to mass protest about it. I am expected to side up to the same people who sneered and said nobody put a gun to my head to buy a house, so they can buy a house.
Ironically, I would protest about it as I feel that people should be able to buy a house and perhaps the people who were happy to sneer and kick a person when they are down will now realise that they were being a$$holes.0 -
Another factor is the vulture funds/private landlord vehicles buying up blocks of apartments/phases of houses. They rent them out and charge high rents. These units were not available to your normal home purchaser, they’re snapped up by these companies with massive capital.
Developers love to sell to them, they sell in bulk, get cash up front and sales like these only push up the price of the additional units the developer builds.
These companies should be massively taxed for rental income, and there should be a limit to what they can purchase in new developments.0 -
Nah they would just have flogged the water system off to a private company and you'd be paying through the bollix so some vulture fund can make a massive profit. That's what's happened pretty much everywhere else.
I love how hysterical people have become about that dangerous and mysterious villain: "the vulture fund"
I heard a vulture fund went on a stabbing spree in Dundalk. And my neighbour is possitevely certain that a vulture fund drives a white van and was caught offering sweets to kids.0 -
It's ironic, when the recession hit and my house plummeted in value by around 50% the younger folks on boards were saying that we got what we deserved, paying far too much for houses that weren't worth the value, this was always going to happen...nobody put a gun to our heads to buy a house.
Then when the government said that 2nd time buyers needed to stump up 20% versus 10% for first time buyers we were told we created this mess, this was only fair and that nobody put a gun to our head to be in negative equity.
Those measure were completely unfair to a generation as the only ones truly affected would be those who bought in the couple of years prior to the recession and paid their mortgages despite their economic situations. Again, this argument was countered with nobody put a gun to your head to buy a house.
Now the tide has turned and we are expected to mass protest about it. I am expected to side up to the same people who sneered and said nobody put a gun to my head to buy a house, so they can buy a house.
Ironically, I would protest about it as I feel that people should be able to buy a house and perhaps the people who were happy to sneer and kick a person when they are down will now realise that they were being a$$holes.
That has little to do with the issue that a lot of young people can't afford to rent. While most jobs are in Dublin and therefore the workforce has to be close by young people struggle to even find a shabby room in a flat for inadequate money. These young people are not even thinking about buying.
They are expected to pay top prices for bog standard apartments and they get kicked from all sides if they don't leave their parents house and start being independent.
It is a sad state of things when people in their 30s have to move back home in order to save money for... maybe a house deposit.
And now that affordability has capped, it pushed the average buyer further out and only the wealthier ones will be able to afford living close to their work.
If you're born in a bad time, there's not much you can do. You still want to get on with your life and make the best out of it. My partner graduated in 2010 and everything that was waiting for him out there was the dole queue. He eventually managed to get a minimum wage job and he was incredibly happy about that. And from then until now the situation changed so fast, from no available credit to an incredibly tense market.0 -
They need to address why there's a housing crisis, why are people homeless? Building houses and firing people into them without addressing any issues that led them to that position would be foolish.0
-
Advertisement
-
Colonel Claptrap wrote: »I love how hysterical people have become about that dangerous and mysterious villain: "he vulture fund"
Someone very close to me was a resident of the Leeside apartment...cantdecide wrote: »That's not the world that hundreds of thousands of people find themselves in today.“I think that dishonour must surely go to Lugus Capital, the new owners of the Leeside Apartments in Cork city – this Christmas, this vulture fund is placing the threat of eviction over the heads of . . . households, many with young children, at these apartments.
This housing crisis is defined by a small minority of losers vs broader society. This minority is small in proportion but large in number. A stretched lower middle class too rich to enjoy the benefits of a welfare state and too poor to get on the property ladder with fewer opportunities than ever to get on in life, all scrambling to get gainful work and put a roof over their heads. Smart, hard working people struggling harder than their demographic ever had to historically with less than ever to look forward to. If you're on the other side of the fence, good for you.0 -
cantdecide wrote: »Your response to the explanation of the reasons why people are suffering economical harm because of past mistakes and mishandling at all levels is to jeer?
How is it even possible you took that post seriously?cantdecide wrote: »Please point to one post that calls for protests for free housing for all of us victims. Take your time and read slowly.
That's the kind of keyboard warrior attitude that causes dog-with-a-bone arguments.0 -
Aisha Zealous Telegraph wrote: »They need to address why there's a housing crisis, why are people homeless? Building houses and firing people into them without addressing any issues that led them to that position would be foolish.
Foolish but exactly what will ultimately happen.
Look we all know why there's a shortage. It's this focus on building houses and tiny apartment blocks. Dublin sprawls with it's insane focus on housing estates. Most cities around the world use tall apartment complexes to deal with their growing populations.0 -
That has little to do with the issue that a lot of young people can't afford to rent. While most jobs are in Dublin and therefore the workforce has to be close by young people struggle to even find a shabby room in a flat for inadequate money. These young people are not even thinking about buying.
They are expected to pay top prices for bog standard apartments and they get kicked from all sides if they don't leave their parents house and start being independent.
It is a sad state of things when people in their 30s have to move back home in order to save money for... maybe a house deposit.
And now that affordability has capped, it pushed the average buyer further out and only the wealthier ones will be able to afford living close to their work.
If you're born in a bad time, there's not much you can do. You still want to get on with your life and make the best out of it. My partner graduated in 2010 and everything that was waiting for him out there was the dole queue. He eventually managed to get a minimum wage job and he was incredibly happy about that. And from then until now the situation changed so fast, from no available credit to an incredibly tense market.
Hmmm not much different to 2005 so, I was paying €700p/m for a box room in a 2 bed flat in Rathmines. I had to move home in my late 20's to save up a deposit to buy a wreck of a house that left me with a one and a half hour commute to work. I got on with it.0 -
Hmmm not much different to 2005 so, I was paying €700p/m for a box room in a 2 bed flat in Rathmines. I had to move home in my late 20's to save up a deposit to buy a wreck of a house that left me with a one and a half hour commute to work. I got on with it.
Lots of people get on with it but it doesn't make the whole situation right.0 -
It's pretty clear that you have an us -v- them attitude in relation to wealth & property, which doesn't surprise me tbh going on your post history. You're way off the mark though in reality.
Not at all, the reality is that the world is rapidly becoming a more unequal place with fewer and fewer people owning more and more of the world's wealth in an era of rising employment instability and declining public services.Selling:
Developers can make a shedload more money using their land to cram in loads of houses and sell them, than just sitting on it and letting prices rise. In an increasing market, €1m of land turns into €10m of land way quicker if you build and sell rather than speculate. Land banks are an essential part of being a developer and I'm sure they love seeing prices go up for doing nothing. But they don't arrange secret meetings where they conspire to not build for another year and gain 10% on their value of their banks. Why would I do that when I can turn that into a 50% gain with some building?
Land is being hoarded on a huge scale, and it's something we see in the UK too on an even bigger scale. Likewise I think your assertion that developers don't cartelise and arrange a common consensus that suits their mutual long-term benefit is naïve at best to be honest. Land banking is an essential part of the flawed market-based housing system we have and it should be done away with.
Likewise we have a pathological aversion to state housing in Ireland which sees us relying on private companies to provide a social need, currently that's working out to be a bloody disaster and despite your assertions that we can sit back and things will get better - I have a hard time believing it. What is needed in both Ireland and the UK is a program of the state building modern high-rise social housing and renting that out to key workers and young workers.0 -
Lots of people get on with it but it doesn't make the whole situation right.
I'm not saying it does. I was pointing out that it's ironic when you get on with it and then things go tits up, people sneer at you and point the finger, only for a few years to pass and they arrive in the exact same situation and start complaining.0 -
Protest shoulder to shoulder with Coppinger?
Protest shoulder to shoulder with Erica Fleming and her draughty windows?
Protest shoulder to shoulder with hundreds of people who have already been offered a house but have continually turned it down cos it's not to their liking?
Ah, you can count me out.0 -
Likewise we have a pathological aversion to state housing in Ireland which sees us relying on private companies to provide a social need, currently that's working out to be a bloody disaster and despite your assertions that we can sit back and things will get better - I have a hard time believing it. What is needed in both Ireland and the UK is a program of the state building modern high-rise social housing and renting that out to key workers and young workers.
This, I can never get my head around. Decades ago you could rent social housing and then they offered a buy out clause if you desired it. I never understood why the stopped doing this.
Rather than buying housing stock, each county should have a building division. They buy development land or get land with a compulsory purchase order if someone is sitting on development land
They agree to build X amount of houses/ apartments each year and through scale of quantity they can reduce the costs on the builds which will allow them to charge a reasonable rent and still make a tidy profit to facilitate further housing. The houses can be purchased after a certain term with part of the rental payment being used as the initial deposit.0 -
Moderators, Category Moderators, Music Moderators, Politics Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 22,360 CMod ✭✭✭✭
Join Date:Posts: 22058
splinter65 wrote: »No. Because I want one. I see other people have houses and I want one.
I don’t want to hear about how they worked and saved for their house. I want one now so give it to me.
I work, but we are in vastly different times than 10/15/20... years ago.
34 years ago my parents got a mortgage through a scheme where the payments were 20% of the income of the highest salary. We'll never see anything like that again. it takes 2 people earning a high salary to get a mortgage now. I dare say they'll be a thing of the past in 34 years.cantdecide wrote: »Someone very close to me was a resident of the Leeside apartment...
This housing crisis is defined by a small minority of losers vs broader society. This minority is small in proportion but large in number. A stretched lower middle class too rich to enjoy the benefits of a welfare state and too poor to get on the property ladder with fewer opportunities than ever to get on in life, all scrambling to get gainful work and put a roof over their heads. Smart, hard working people struggling harder than their demographic ever had to historically with less than ever to look forward to. If you're on the other side of the fence, good for you.
It's not a ladder. They should stop selling it as one.0 -
Advertisement
-
Or councils coming in and outbidding working couples on houses they then rent out to spongers for 40 euro a week.
Its not fair and never will be.0 -
This, I can never get my head around. Decades ago you could rent social housing and then they offered a buy out clause if you desired it. I never understood why the stopped doing this.
They haven't stopped, I know of people that bought their house off the council last year having lived in it for 20 years.
These people live in a tiny social housing development (6 houses, built in an existing estate only 20 years ago).
The house is good quality, it's in a nice area, it made sense to buy it out.
They said themselves they wouldn't have done that had it been in some sh*thole areaRather than buying housing stock, each county should have a building division. They buy development land or get land with a compulsory purchase order if someone is sitting on development land
They agree to build X amount of houses/ apartments each year and through scale of quantity they can reduce the costs on the builds which will allow them to charge a reasonable rent and still make a tidy profit to facilitate further housing. The houses can be purchased after a certain term with part of the rental payment being used as the initial deposit.
To me, it sounds like you're talking about a council estate, it's a bad idea.
Perhaps I don't understand the full details of your idea.
Also to note:
As soon as builder/developer realises the government/council is paying for X,Y or Z; the price automatically doubles.
This is another reason why the councils are buying up existing stock that is for sale as opposed to building their own. It works out cheaper.
I read somewhere recently that some build on the edge of the city was costing the local council €350,000 a unit (I think, I could be wrong) I'll see if I can dig it out0 -
Idbatterim wrote: »Is it time for mass protest at the housing crisis? The only time the scum bags we elect to the dail are interested in us, is come election time. I have voted fg previously, I'm done with them. If they think a few euro a week decrease in USC is enough to keep people onside.
These same people who will be paying e700 plus for an average bedroom in an average house in an average part of Dublin IF they can even secure a viewing!
People protested about water, this scandal is off the wall in comparison. This situation is ruining lives and costing people a fortune, unlike water!
The only time they ever budge here, i.e. Politicians is when pressure is put on them and they collapse like a house of cards, as their populist nature compels them to.
Whatever ideological reason they have against solving the issues show a disgusting lack of empathy. I don't see what their issue is, their mates in the banks, the estate agents will be creaming it in with more building. More jobs, more lpt...
It's taken them 3 years minimum into the crisis to acknowledge the fact that apartment building is prohibitively expensive and wait more years for action. 3 years! 3 years of misery for tens of thousand of people of not more. What's the problem? They are overpaid, do nothing but talk it seems to me.
So there you go coppinger etc. Someone ill probably never agree with on economic policy etc, but organise a protest for this issue and I'll stand shoulder to shoulder with you!
After the previous water crisis and protest and where that lead to. The government will do a pretty quick about turn this time! Particularly as an election could be held any time!
Isn’t there a day of action planned for April? And a minister has promised a General Election if serious efforts are not made this year.0 -
Not at all, the reality is that the world is rapidly becoming a more unequal place with fewer and fewer people owning more and more of the world's wealth in an era of rising employment instability and declining public services.
The reality is that value and wealth have changed but peoples' perception of it hasn't changed.
Buying and renting a property for the individual made sense 20 years ago. You could buy a place at relatively low purchase prices, renovate it and sell it easily for 30k-40k profit. (Which I did to gain the money for my deposit on my current property) Nowadays, it's extremely difficult (although not impossible) to do the same. And then there's the rental aspect, where rental incomes could be managed quite easily to maintain a reasonable profit over the standard expenses of the mortgage/insurance and extras like maintenance, but the margins have thinned dramatically over the last decade. Even with the rises in rent averages, there are still the compromises with costs versus reliability of tenants.
I'd agree with you that fewer people owning more and more of the world's wealth, but owning a property in Ireland doesn't automatically translate into wealth creation. Yes, I have a property. When I bought it, the property was actually worth 175k, but even though the market has risen, I'm not going to get near to that now. Nor am I going to make up that difference in rental income, considering the costs over time of renting out the property.0 -
This post had been deleted.
thanks permabear! As you highlight, this impossible situation is entirely of the governments making. I assume many on this forum who arent criticizing the situation, arent in Dublin or have inherited or got the house from the state for nothing or can buy / have bought in another county for a pittance!
I will say this again, I know load of people on 50-60k that are totally stuck! If you arent in Dublin or havent tried to rent here in the past few years, most people dont have a bloody clue! Nobody is looking for anything for free! I want reasonably affordable accommodation for workers in particualr, if people are on very low incomes or state support, let them pay a reasonable amount, which would certainly be more than the 15% of the income that they currently pay , I am not sure if that figure is correct, but its one I see thrown about a lot!
How can you ask one person to pay 15%, but people on the private market might pay 50% of wages if they want to live on their own?!0 -
Idbatterim wrote: »thanks permabear! As you highlight, this impossible situation is entirely of the governments making. I assume many on this forum who arent criticizing the situation, arent in Dublin or have inherited or got the house from the state for nothing or can buy / have bought in another county for a pittance!
I will say this again, I know load of people on 50-60k that are totally stuck! If you arent in Dublin or havent tried to rent here in the past few years, most people dont have a bloody clue! Nobody is looking for anything for free! I want reasonably affordable accommodation for workers in particualr, if people are on very low incomes or state support, let them pay a reasonable amount, which would certainly be more than the 15% of the income that they currently pay , I am not sure if that figure is correct, but its one I see thrown about a lot!
How can you ask one person to pay 15%, but people on the private market might pay 50% of wages if they want to live on their own?!
In my case, I neither inherited nor bought my home for a pittance. What I did, however, was buy what I could afford. It’s not in my ideal area. It never occurred to me that I could go on a list and wait for a house to be given to me. What galls me about the current situation is the number of CEOs on big money keeping the “crisis “ in the public domain, aided by self interested politicians. Add in the Erica factor and you get an idea of why so many of us are turning our backs.0 -
Wheeliebin30 wrote: »Or councils coming in and outbidding working couples on houses they then rent out to spongers for 40 euro a week.
Its not fair and never will be.
Of course, if you were selling your house, youd sell to a private buyer for 25% less than the market value purely on ideological grounds?0 -
Deleted User wrote: »In my case, I neither inherited nor bought my home for a pittance. What I did, however, was buy what I could afford. It’s not in my ideal area. It never occurred to me that I could go on a list and wait for a house to be given to me. What galls me about the current situation is the number of CEOs on big money keeping the “crisis “ in the public domain, aided by self interested politicians. Add in the Erica factor and you get an idea of why so many of us are turning our backs.
Apathy because scroungers?
There are no cases where genuine hard working people can't do what you did?
There are hoards and hoards of happy homeowners in Ireland. If you're one, good for you. That doesn't mean that someone trying to navigate the economic reality of post boom/ recession Ireland will face what you've faced. You also haven't faced what others have faced.0 -
cantdecide wrote: »Apathy because scroungers?
There are no cases where genuine hard working people can't do what you did?
There are hoards and hoards of happy homeowners in Ireland. If you're one, good for you. That doesn't mean that someone trying to navigate the economic reality of post boom/ recession Ireland will face what you've faced. You also haven't faced what others have faced.
Having set up homes in both the 70s and 80s, I beg to differ.0 -
Advertisement
-
Deleted User wrote: »Having set up homes in both the 70s and 80s, I beg to differ.
You're not really saying anything now (as you hadn't in your previous post really). If you're saying that people are facing the same economical reality in 2018 that they did in the '70s and '80s then you're just showing how out of touch with reality you are.
My parents bought their house (a detached 4 bed bungalow) on the back of my dad's carpenter's wages (my mother was a stay at home mum of three kids) in the early 80s.
Could they do that today? The answer is absolutely not.0
![[Deleted User]](/applications/dashboard/design/images/defaulticon.png)
Advertisement