Anti-vaxxers

Jawgap

gar32 wrote: »

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/vaccines-and-autism-a-new-scientific-review/

And yet again vaccines possible link with autism. The vaccine manufacturers pay for 90% of the research and pay to discredit any study that links there products with the millions of damaged kids. Safer vaccines needed!!!

That's from 2011......here's a more recent publication.....

Vaccines are not associated with autism: An evidence-based meta-analysis of case-control and cohort studies

Btw, the paper on which that news report you linked is based concluded

Autism has been documented to be caused by genetic defects and/or inflammation of the brain. The inflammation could be caused by a wide variety of environmental toxicants, infections, and co-morbidities in individuals genetically prone to the developmental disorder.

......that's the totality of the conclusion.

It does indeed cite encephalopathy following vaccination as a possible cause of autism, but so too is ecencephalopathy caused by rubella.

Finally, her hypothesis.....

Integrating the data presented here, a hypothesis is that autism is the result of genetic defects, with the contributory effect of advancing age of the parents, and/or inflammation of the brain.

......is more an argument for having your kids while your younger rather than not getting them vaccinated.

Samaris

PopePalpatine wrote: »

What a charming woman.

Apparently the wedding ceremony is as good as vaccination against cervical cancer?

What an idiot of a woman.

Orion

gar32 wrote: »

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/vaccines-and-autism-a-new-scientific-review/

And yet again vaccines possible link with autism. The vaccine manufacturers pay for 90% of the research and pay to discredit any study that links there products with the millions of damaged kids. Safer vaccines needed!!!

No what we need is fewer anti-vax conspiracy theorists spreading lies that are causing people to die from preventable diseases.

Here's a suggestion gar - next time you post a 6 year old article how about you "do your research" before posting it here and let's see if it's been debunked already.

It would save me the very short amount of time it took to find this:
https://sciencebasedmedicine.org/anti-vaccine-propaganda-from-sharyl-attkisson-of-cbs-news-2/
http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2011/04/05/the-resident-anti-vaccine-reporter-at-cb/
http://sethmnookin.com/2011/03/31/more-embarrassing-anti-vaccine-reporting-from-cbs-newss-sharyl-attkisson/
http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2014/05/27/antivaccine-journalist-sharyl-attkisson-tries-once-again-to-convince-us-that-vaccines-cause-autism/

in other words Ratajczak's "study" is nonsense and Attkisson is a known antivaxxer who spins crap into news to satisfy her agenda.

Orion

Samaris wrote: »

Apparently the wedding ceremony is as good as vaccination against cervical cancer?

What an idiot of a woman.

To be honest I'm not surprised at Bennis at all considering her history of being against everything from divorce to sex. She even campaigned against the Children's Referendum.

She's an irrelevant relic from a foregone age.

Guy:Incognito

gar32 wrote: »

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/vaccines-and-autism-a-new-scientific-review/

And yet again vaccines possible link with autism. The vaccine manufacturers pay for 90% of the research and pay to discredit any study that links there products with the millions of damaged kids. Safer vaccines needed!!!

There's nothing stopping anyone funding a scientific study. Regret are free to fund one if they choose. They might not like the results mind........

Orion

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

There's nothing stopping anyone funding a scientific study. Regret are free to fund one if they choose. They might not like the results mind........

They'd call it trolling and try to dox the authors.

Lackey

Samaris wrote: »

Apparently the wedding ceremony is as good as vaccination against cervical cancer?

What an idiot of a woman.

I'm not saying I agree with the woman......BUT

THERE IS NO CERVICAL CANCER VACCINE!

The HPV vaccine is just that....a vaccine to prevent HPV
HPV is an STD which causes among other things cervical cancer.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_papillomavirus_infection

Just because you are vaccinated against HPV you still need to go for smear tests ....because The HPV vaccine is NOT A CERVICAL CANCER VACCINE IT IS A VACCIINE TO PREVENT HPV!!!!

jh79

Lackey wrote: »

I'm not saying I agree with the woman......BUT

THERE IS NO CERVICAL CANCER VACCINE!

The HPV vaccine is just that....a vaccine to prevent HPV
HPV is an STD which causes among other things cervical cancer.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_papillomavirus_infection

Just because you are vaccinated against HPV you still need to go for smear tests ....because The HPV vaccine is NOT A CERVICAL CANCER VACCINE IT IS A VACCIINE TO PREVENT HPV!!!!

Why is that of any significance? HPV causes cervical cancer.

Would you make such a distinction for a vaccine against HIV if someone called it a vaccine against AIDS?

whoopsadoodles

Lackey wrote: »

I'm not saying I agree with the woman......BUT

THERE IS NO CERVICAL CANCER VACCINE!

The HPV vaccine is just that....a vaccine to prevent HPV
HPV is an STD which causes among other things cervical cancer.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_papillomavirus_infection

Just because you are vaccinated against HPV you still need to go for smear tests ....because The HPV vaccine is NOT A CERVICAL CANCER VACCINE IT IS A VACCIINE TO PREVENT HPV!!!!

Which it states clearly in the information leaflet.

Page 7.

https://hse.ie/eng/health/Immunisation/pubinfo/schoolprog/HPV/hpv-vaccine-information-for-parents.pdf

knipex

gar32 wrote: »

There are 700 girls going to court also Japan and Korea have 1000's who's life have been ruined by hpv vaccine. How many people have to be damaged before people believe that this risk is real?

There is no evidence to support a link between the vaccine and the claimed damage to the women.

None (certainly not me) will claim that any medication is 100% safe. However vaccines in general are 99.99999% safe and the benefits of the vaccine far far far outweigh the risks..

gar32

That is the thing the reduction in sickness mostly from living cleaner healthy lives means the risk of the sickness has drop so much. (Maybe vaccines also helped.) The risk now from all the vaccines to getting closer to the risk of sickness.

HPV vaccine is a good example. 1% of women may get the cancer in the future but there could be say 0.2 % chance of vaccine reaction.

If 70% of cancer is spotted early with smear test and or cured that brings the risk down to near vaccine damage levels. If you add the risk of Tetanus, Flu and all the other vaccines people get these days vaccines are causing way more damage then is reported.

I have followed this subject 1st to try stop my wife from worrying about vaccines. Then I read more and more and more. There is no smoke without fire and the people, the corruption and the media hiding things like vaccine protest in Poland, Italy and France. I have come to understand there is much more to this vaccine thing the stopping sickness.

If you have young children or babies you should read up on all the info you can find not just the manufactures promotional studies.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cHWeJ0f_o3A

Watch this and say there is not some question in your head about how safe vaccines really are.

VinLieger

gar32 wrote: »

That is the thing the reduction in sickness mostly from living cleaner healthy lives means the risk of the sickness has drop so much. (Maybe vaccines also helped.) The risk now from all the vaccines to getting closer to the risk of sickness.

Yes and the reason we are living healthier lives is called herd immunity via vaccination

Lackey

jh79 wrote: »

Why is that of any significance? HPV causes cervical cancer.

Would you make such a distinction for a vaccine against HIV if someone called it a vaccine against AIDS?

Because the woman quoted above is being ridiculed for saying abstinence will also prevent HPV

how likely are teenagers to abstain from sexual activity?....Not Very .

edited to add exert from the information leaflet also stats abstinence will prevent HPV

Even after getting vaccinated, a person can still get other types of HPV and STIs. That’s why it’s important to:
Practice safe (or safer) sex. That means using condoms with all sexual partners. Condoms won’t offer complete protection, but they are the best option aside from not having sex at all (abstinence).
Don’t smoke. Smoking makes it harder for the body to fight viruses like HPV.
At age 21, women should also have their first Pap test. From age 21 through 29, women should have the test every three years. Women age 30 and older can have Pap and HPV tests every 5 years. Or, they can opt to have a Pap test alone every 3 years

so she is factually correct.

I see your correlation with HIV and AIDS

However.......

Clearance[edit]
Most HPV infections are cleared up by most people without medical action or consequences

Once you have HIV, you are infected for life and have the potential to infect others

There will be people who believe their daughters...or themselves are vaccinated against cancer when they are not.

Orion

gar32 wrote: »

That is the thing the reduction in sickness mostly from living cleaner healthy lives means the risk of the sickness has drop so much. (Maybe vaccines also helped.)

Maybe vaccines helped? :rolleyes:

Call me crazy but I'm not sure that good hygiene is any defence against polio, smallpox, measles, mumps, cervical cancer, pertussis or any other preventable diseases that vaccines protect us against and in some cases have eradicated.

But sure - make sure to wash your hands you're grand :rolleyes:

[edit]btw - youtube is not a scientific source.

whoopsadoodles

gar32 wrote: »

There is no smoke without fire

See once someone spurts something like that, you know immediately that their posts are riddled with ignorance.

knipex

gar32 wrote: »

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/vaccines-and-autism-a-new-scientific-review/

And yet again vaccines possible link with autism. The vaccine manufacturers pay for 90% of the research and pay to discredit any study that links there products with the millions of damaged kids. Safer vaccines needed!!!

Read the studies you link to.

They do not support your argument at all.

gar32

The MMR Vaccine’s Tragic History in Japan
The MMR vaccine was introduced in Japan in April 1989, and parents who refused the compulsory vaccine were fined. After three months of analysis, officials realized that one in 900 children developed adverse reactions to the vaccine, a rate that was 2,000 times higher than the expected rate.

Officials had hoped to resolve the problem by switching to another version of the vaccine, but the excessive amount of adverse reactions persisted, with one in 1,755 children affected. Testing of 125 children’s spinal fluid determined that the vaccines had entered one child’s nervous system, with two additional suspected cases.

Four years later, in 1993, the government removed the MMR mandate against measles and rubella. A doctor from Japan’s Ministry of Health and Welfare admitted that the separate, individual doses of measles and rubella cost twice as much to administer, and he defended the decision, stating, “but we believe it is worth it.” Furthermore, a member of the health ministry also stated that the ban has not caused an increase in deaths from measles.

gar32

The measles vaccine helps other vaccines could be removed without risk being more then the vaccines themselves

Orion

Gar - can you post any peer reviewed study or reputable news agency article to back up your last two posts? Or did you just pull it out of your arse?

knipex

gar32 wrote: »

That is the thing the reduction in sickness mostly from living cleaner healthy lives means the risk of the sickness has drop so much. (Maybe vaccines also helped.)

What ??? So polio,. smallpox, TB (until vaccinations stopped)

All these are the result of cleaner living with vaccines maybe helping ??

gar32 wrote: »

The risk now from all the vaccines to getting closer to the risk of sickness.

Any you have what to back this up ?? What data ? What information ??

Nothing !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

gar32 wrote: »

HPV vaccine is a good example. 1% of women may get the cancer in the future but there could be say 0.2 % chance of vaccine reaction.

And those numbers came from out of your ass ??? or have you a study, anything to support them ??

gar32 wrote: »

If 70% of cancer is spotted early with smear test and or cured that brings the risk down to near vaccine damage levels. If you add the risk of Tetanus, Flu and all the other vaccines people get these days vaccines are causing way more damage then is reported.

based on what ??? Its your opinion based on rubbish. misinformation and bull****..

Its not factual, its not informative, its regurgitated bull crap..

gar32 wrote: »

I have followed this subject 1st to try stop my wife from worrying about vaccines. Then I read more and more and more. There is no smoke without fire and the people, the corruption and the media hiding things like vaccine protest in Poland, Italy and France. I have come to understand there is much more to this vaccine thing the stopping sickness.

If you have young children or babies you should read up on all the info you can find not just the manufactures promotional studies.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cHWeJ0f_o3A

Watch this and say there is not some question in your head about how safe vaccines really are.

You dont have the expertise, knowledge or information to even begin to understand the studies and data. This has been proved by some of the links you posted. The dangerous part is you don't even realise how little you know.

You are a misinformed quack you thinks they know what they are talking about.

gar32

Gardasil Researcher Speaks Out
“Dr. Diane Harper says young girls and their parents should receive more complete warnings before receiving the vaccine to prevent cervical cancer. Dr. Harper helped design and carry out the Phase II and Phase III safety and effectiveness studies to get Gardasil approved, and authored many of the published, scholarly papers about it. She has been a paid speaker and consultant to Merck. It’s highly unusual for a researcher to publicly criticize a medicine or vaccine she helped get approved.”

gar32

Does the Doctor know about it ?LOL

Orion

gar32 wrote: »

The measles vaccine helps other vaccines could be removed without risk being more then the vaccines themselves

Really? Which ones exactly?
Mumps? 100% reduction in death rate.
Pertussis? 99.7% reduction in death rate.
Diptheria? 100% reduction in death rate.
Rubella? 100% reduction in death rate.

Source: https://ourworldindata.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/Vaccine_Reduction-of-Cases-and-Deaths.png

Orion

gar32 wrote: »

Gardasil Researcher Speaks Out
“Dr. Diane Harper says young girls and their parents should receive more complete warnings before receiving the vaccine to prevent cervical cancer. Dr. Harper helped design and carry out the Phase II and Phase III safety and effectiveness studies to get Gardasil approved, and authored many of the published, scholarly papers about it. She has been a paid speaker and consultant to Merck. It’s highly unusual for a researcher to publicly criticize a medicine or vaccine she helped get approved.”

Ah good old Diane Harper. Once again can you please post references because unsubstantiated quotes are not worth the paper they're printed on.

Anyhoo here's the actual facts about Miss Harper:
https://www.skepticalraptor.com/skepticalraptorblog.php/gardasil-researcher-against-vaccine-myth-debunked/

Next lie please?

Dohnjoe

gar32 wrote: »

Gardasil Researcher Speaks Out
“Dr. Diane Harper says young girls and their parents should receive more complete warnings before receiving the vaccine to prevent cervical cancer. Dr. Harper helped design and carry out the Phase II and Phase III safety and effectiveness studies to get Gardasil approved, and authored many of the published, scholarly papers about it. She has been a paid speaker and consultant to Merck. It’s highly unusual for a researcher to publicly criticize a medicine or vaccine she helped get approved.”

Please provide sources and context for your posts

Mr. CooL ICE

Mod:

gar32, please engage in actual debate. Quit the soapboxing

kylith

gar32 wrote: »

That is the thing the reduction in sickness mostly from living cleaner healthy lives means the risk of the sickness has drop so much. (Maybe vaccines also helped.) The risk now from all the vaccines to getting closer to the risk of sickness.

The reason why the risk of catching the disease is now closer to the risk of having a reaction to the vaccine is because vaccination has made these diseases rare. For example: smallpox was wiped out by vaccination. My chance of catching smallpox is zero. My chance of having a reaction to the smallpox vaccination (should I happen to be given it) is greater than zero. Therefore, the vaccine is more dangerous than the illness.

As the chances of contracting mumps, rubella, etc drops to zero (as it was doing before this anti-vax movement saw increasing numbers) the chance of reacting to the vaccine does appear to become greater.

Let me put it this way: back in the day you had, for the sake of argument, an 80% chance of your child getting measles and a 10% chance of them winding up blind from it - an 8% chance of blindness overall. How bad does a .2% chance of a reaction to the vaccine look in those circumstances?

Guy:Incognito

I'm going to guess that the lack of actual figures and breakdowas for reactions to vaccinations are not provided by the anti vaccine crowd are because it looks better for their cause to be able to say, for example, 0.5% have an adverse reaction and leave it at that, than to admit that a sizeable proportion of that could well be made up of a brief moment of dizziness or feeling unwell for a couple of minutes (ie, the reason they get you to stay there for a few min after getting a vaccine)

knipex

gar32 wrote: »

The MMR Vaccine’s Tragic History in Japan
The MMR vaccine was introduced in Japan in April 1989, and parents who refused the compulsory vaccine were fined. After three months of analysis, officials realized that one in 900 children developed adverse reactions to the vaccine, a rate that was 2,000 times higher than the expected rate.

Officials had hoped to resolve the problem by switching to another version of the vaccine, but the excessive amount of adverse reactions persisted, with one in 1,755 children affected. Testing of 125 children’s spinal fluid determined that the vaccines had entered one child’s nervous system, with two additional suspected cases.

Four years later, in 1993, the government removed the MMR mandate against measles and rubella. A doctor from Japan’s Ministry of Health and Welfare admitted that the separate, individual doses of measles and rubella cost twice as much to administer, and he defended the decision, stating, “but we believe it is worth it.” Furthermore, a member of the health ministry also stated that the ban has not caused an increase in deaths from measles.

Once again you have presented a half basked misinterpreted version of the facts

The issues in Japan were not due to a combined vaccine.

There is actually a paper on this

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8741307

Japan had a couple of issues,

1 there was an issue with a vaccine being used after its expiry date and
2 there were issues within manufacturing facilities of some manufactures.

Japan stopped administering the vaccine and since then it has become a "measles exporter" has the highest independence of measles outbreaks in the developed world (by a huge margin and despite "clean living").

However autism rates have continued to climb..

Japan also has one of the highest rated of vaccine preventable diseases in the world..

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4300546/

endacl

You're fond of research Gar. Have you ever come across the Dunning-Kruger Effect? Here's a little something you might enjoy.

https://www.avaresearch.com/files/UnskilledAndUnawareOfIt.pdf

Have a quick read and come back with any conclusions. You shouldn't really need to read it all. The first paragraph sums the concept up quite succinctly.