General gaming discussion

SomeSayKos

I replayed all of the uncharted games on the Nathan Drake collection during the weekend and I gotta say those games haven't held up well. The shooting sections are a real drag which is a shame because the game is 85% shooting. I really liked these games when they came out but they feel outdated now (which is probably a good thing as it means the medium is progressing).

Anyone have a similar experience?

gimli2112

I'm playing the first one and loving it. It really doesn't feel that dated to me but it was a huge leap forward at the time. I thought RE4 was desperate when I went back to it last year in terms of the control of the character.

one armed dwarf

Tbh I always found them to be a bit dull. They looked and animated great but it's just a very linear style of action with no real choices to be made.

On the other hand even if it controls bad I still think RE4 is a much better paced game and doesn't feel as limiting as the hiding behind walls gameplay of Uncharted.

gimli2112

I thought the second one was a huge improvement tbh but I always liked the first one.

GhostofKNugget

Something I saw a little while ago but never seen discussed on here. The PS4 has now outsold the original Playstation and the Wii - which I found surprising - and became the fastest home console to sell 100 million units. Not a chance of it passing out the PS2's 155 million, especially with the PS5 debuting at the end of the year but it's still pretty impressive.

https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2019-10-30-ps4-overtakes-wii-and-ps1-to-become-second-best-selling-home-console-of-all-time

quokula

GhostofKNugget wrote: »

Something I saw a little while ago but never seen discussed on here. The PS4 has now outsold the original Playstation and the Wii - which I found surprising - and became the fastest home console to sell 100 million units. Not a chance of it passing out the PS2's 155 million, especially with the PS5 debuting at the end of the year but it's still pretty impressive.

https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2019-10-30-ps4-overtakes-wii-and-ps1-to-become-second-best-selling-home-console-of-all-time

Could PS4 overtake PS2? In short, no. The arrival of PS5 next year (not to mention PlayStations 6 through 10 in the years to come) means PS4 sales will slow as players make room (and save money for) the next generation of consoles.

That's a pretty odd conclusion for Eurogamer to come to, considering the PS2 took slightly longer to hit 100 million, and the PS3 launch followed that just as closely as the PS5 launch is following this milestone.

With that said, I wonder if this double counts people who bought a PS4 then a Pro (I know there were slim PS2s but there was no reason to upgrade) as they surely aren't doing better on market share considering how well the Switch is doing compared to the Gamecube, or how Microsoft were only just breaking into the market with the original Xbox.

I guess there's also the possibility of the entire market getting bigger, higher populations, growing markets in developing countries in Asia etc.

Retr0gamer

quokula wrote: »

That's a pretty odd conclusion for Eurogamer to come to, considering the PS2 took slightly longer to hit 100 million, and the PS3 launch followed that just as closely as the PS5 launch is following this milestone.

With that said, I wonder if this double counts people who bought a PS4 then a Pro (I know there were slim PS2s but there was no reason to upgrade) as they surely aren't doing better on market share considering how well the Switch is doing compared to the Gamecube, or how Microsoft were only just breaking into the market with the original Xbox.

I guess there's also the possibility of the entire market getting bigger, higher populations, growing markets in developing countries in Asia etc.

Well the PS2 had that as well as lots of people had to buy multiple consoles because of how badly made it was.

Id be more upset that such a poor console like the ps4 would beat the PS2 and DS as they have infinitely better libraries and exclusives.

Ninja edit to save my embarrassment.

GhostofKNugget

Retr0gamer wrote: »

Well the PS2 had that as well as lots of people had to buy multiple consoles because of how badly made it was.

Id be more upset that such a poor console like the ps5 would beat the PS2 and DS as they have infinitely better libraries and exclusives.

You could wait for the PS5 to be released before telling us how poor it is...

Varik

quokula wrote: »

That's a pretty odd conclusion for Eurogamer to come to, considering the PS2 took slightly longer to hit 100 million, and the PS3 launch followed that just as closely as the PS5 launch is following this milestone.

With that said, I wonder if this double counts people who bought a PS4 then a Pro (I know there were slim PS2s but there was no reason to upgrade) as they surely aren't doing better on market share considering how well the Switch is doing compared to the Gamecube, or how Microsoft were only just breaking into the market with the original Xbox.

I guess there's also the possibility of the entire market getting bigger, higher populations, growing markets in developing countries in Asia etc.

For most of those who upgraded to a Pro, I'd say a lot traded them in so that another user getting it there. Attach rate is pretty high, so i'd say most PS4 aren't sitting idle.

SomeSayKos

Retr0gamer wrote: »

Well the PS2 had that as well as lots of people had to buy multiple consoles because of how badly made it was.

Yup! I've personally gone through 3 Playstation 2's and the last one I got lasted as far as 2012.

Mark Hamill

gimli2112 wrote: »

I'm playing the first one and loving it. It really doesn't feel that dated to me but it was a huge leap forward at the time. I thought RE4 was desperate when I went back to it last year in terms of the control of the character.

There is a way to make Leon rotate with the mouse, which improves the controls a bit.

gimli2112

As a console player I don't have the manual dexterity or intelligence to operate a mouse

Penn

SomeSayKos wrote: »

Yup! I've personally gone through 3 Playstation 2's and the last one I got lasted as far as 2012.

I think the same could be said for most consoles though. I went through 2 PS1s, 2 Xbox360s, 2 PS3s (though that was by choice for the bigger hard drive, not failure, my OG one is still working, my nephew has it) and 2 PS4s (again, by choice for upgrading to the PS4 Pro).

Plus imagine how many DSs sold were replacements for broken ones.

My PS2 lasted me it's whole life (though was definitely on shaky ground by the end).

quokula

I lost count of the 360s I went through, I think it was 5. Though they were all replaced under warranty rather than new sales.

My PS2 did stop working at one point but I was able to get it repaired rather than replaced. PS1 never needed repair but it did need to be turned upside down to continue working.

Every other console I've owned (and I've owned pretty much all of them from launch in the last 20 years or so) has been totally reliable. PS4 is the only one I've bought twice, thanks to the Pro upgrade. The other PS4 got relegated to the bedroom to be a video streaming box rather than selling it on.

Retr0gamer

Mark Hamill wrote: »

There is a way to make Leon rotate with the mouse, which improves the controls a bit.

It's really not that hard to pick up. Play through the first episode of quake with it was how I introduced friends. Takes about 3 hours. Then you'll never go back to a noobpad.

Mal-Adjusted

SomeSayKos wrote: »

I replayed all of the uncharted games on the Nathan Drake collection during the weekend and I gotta say those games haven't held up well. The shooting sections are a real drag which is a shame because the game is 85% shooting. I really liked these games when they came out but they feel outdated now (which is probably a good thing as it means the medium is progressing).

Anyone have a similar experience?

I found the gunplay in the first game terrible but everything else great (and the combat improved leaps and bounds in the second one anyway)

Retr0gamer

Retr0gamer wrote: »

And sounds like a dub playing mgs3 speed run.

Wexford, but close!

Retr0gamer

Deleted User wrote: »

Wexford, but close!

I'm guessing that was you! Fair play to you for taking part. Your run was a highlight for me and very entertaining. Hope you'll be back again.

I read some of the threads on specific game here and I see an awful lot of people playing and re-playing games until they can get all the trophies, or specific trophies at least.

Personally I couldn't give a fiddlers about trophies, I play through the story and hopefully enjoy it along the way. There are games where I will want to play all the side quests, eg God of War, and others that I would feel bothered with, eg Outer Worlds.

I don't feel that I'm missing out by not playing for trophies as my time is limited, is this common?

I have a feeling it's mostly young fellas collecting trophies as they squeeze every bit of value out of the game, as I would have at that age :-)

gimli2112

Some people just like it. I know one guy that has hundreds of platinums. I think it might be 150 but probably more. He enjoys it. There is a sense of achievement. I don't do it myself but I'm always glad to platinum a game.
I'm unreasonably proud of my Bloodborne and BF4 platinums neither of which were that difficult although both rage inducing in their own special way. There was a Bf4 one where you had to get a bomber kill on a particular map. I did it one weekend solo battling a squad for control of the bomber controls, it was epic.

pixelburp

Given how precision engineered games are these days to prey upon basic psychological impulses, I just see the urge to get trophies as part of those impulses; that they trigger some form of addictive or compulsive personality in the gamers who doggedly pursue every last trophy. Maybe for even younger gamers there's a social element, where the trophies operate as badges of prowess to throw in the faces of your peers (no more than sticker collecting or whatnot from my own day).

I may be staring down the barrel of 40 this year but there's no way in hell you could persuade me to be a teenager again; I grew up just on the cusp of the internet, social media, and the heavy psychological tooling of video games. Avoided all of that and thus the new, slightly sh*tty looking environment teens now live in.

Penn

Deleted User wrote: »

I read some of the threads on specific game here and I see an awful lot of people playing and re-playing games until they can get all the trophies, or specific trophies at least.

Personally I couldn't give a fiddlers about trophies, I play through the story and hopefully enjoy it along the way. There are games where I will want to play all the side quests, eg God of War, and others that I would feel bothered with, eg Outer Worlds.

I don't feel that I'm missing out by not playing for trophies as my time is limited, is this common?

I have a feeling it's mostly young fellas collecting trophies as they squeeze every bit of value out of the game, as I would have at that age :-)

For me it always comes down to if I'm enjoying playing a game but have finished the main story and whatever other bits and bobs, but I still want to keep playing the game, I'll check to see what trophies I'm missing and use going for those as my reason to keep playing. It gives a purpose and some direction, a set of goals to be achieved. Goals that keep me playing the game.

That said, if there's a bunch of multiplayer or just ridiculously difficult ones, I'll not bother. I remember being one trophy off the platinum for Assassin's Creed Brotherhood because there was one multiplayer trophy that pretty much the only realistic way of getting it was in a private game and players boosting each other, taking turns to get it. You were completely at the mercy of other players trying to get it legitimately, so I just didn't bother.

Borderlands 2 is one of my favourite games of all time, I think I only got maybe 60% trophy completion. Borderlands 3 was enjoyable but not as good as BL2, but I got 100% in it because the trophies were more achievable, didn't require multiple playthroughs to level up each character and because a lot of the content/farming wasn't as good, going for the trophies gave me something to do.

I also normally don't bother with going for trophies that require multiple playthroughs of a game on various difficulty levels, but then with Resident Evil 2 because you can burst through the scenarios so quickly, I did go for it because I was enjoying playing the game so much and getting used to trying to speedrun through them.

If anything I think part of it is because my time with games can be quite limited these days, so I tend to belt through the main game too quickly. Then when I get more free time to play, I still want to play the game. The trophies can give me something to do.

johnny_ultimate

Each to their own and all, and achievements can in the best case add a fun little sparkle to the game (some of the little pop-ups in Disco Elysium are very funny)...

That said, I do think the way many achievements are designed sort of sucks the joy out of the games in question. The ones that force players to play on irritating difficulty settings, or that require them to commit time to the most tedious aspect of a game (collectibles etc). Red Dead Redemption 2 was tough enough to see over the finish line - another 20-30 hours on all manner of obnoxious busywork would be torturous. Sure, in worst case scenarios (your World of Warcrafts etc) they can be an insidious part of the Skinner box design - for the most part though, in your standard single player game, a lot of achievements are just boring and tedious as **** to actually complete.

If the achievements are fun and respectful of your time, then I can see the appeal for some, even with their general pointlessness - there’s been a few short games where I’ve enjoyed poking around for the last few bits. At their very best (and this is rare) they can encourage experimentation with mechanics or meaningful exploration of the game world. But yeah when it’s just a matter of sucking every last second of play out of a game, regardless of the quality of said play, or some sort of compulsive urge for 100% completion... then I really struggle to see the appeal.

one armed dwarf

I like weird achievements, like dragging the gnome around in HL2 Episode 2 and blasting it off into space.

There's so much though that can barely be called an 'achievement', like collecting a bunch of ****e. It's not a measure of skill or cleverness, just commitment to doing something dull.

GhostofKNugget

What really annoys me is the likes of Arkham Knight that had the 'true' ending attached to the collection of all 243 Riddler trophies. Fúck that shíte...

gimli2112

I do remember Far Cry 3 had collectibles and I spent an hour wondering how I was going to get into a particular cave. That was a lot of unfun.

Jordan 199

gimli2112 wrote: »

I do remember Far Cry 3 had collectibles and I spent an hour wondering how I was going to get into a particular cave. That was a lot of unfun.

I feel your pain.

Penn

one armed dwarf wrote: »

I like weird achievements, like dragging the gnome around in HL2 Episode 2 and blasting it off into space.

There's so much though that can barely be called an 'achievement', like collecting a bunch of ****e. It's not a measure of skill or cleverness, just commitment to doing something dull.

Yeah I loved Assassin's Creed 2 and got the platinum, but the trophy for collecting 100 feathers (over multiple different maps and only having the general location and needing to climb all over the building to find and get to most of them)... yeah, that one f*cked me off by the end. Had a lot more free time back then though and less of a backlog of games.

Exclamation Marc

Penn wrote: »

Yeah I loved Assassin's Creed 2 and got the platinum, but the trophy for collecting 100 feathers (over multiple different maps and only having the general location and needing to climb all over the building to find and get to most of them)... yeah, that one f*cked me off by the end. Had a lot more free time back then though and less of a backlog of games.

Haha that was my first one too. And in the age of not as many game guides it was tough. But it was achievable as it was only a small addition to get the platinum.

My general rule of thumb is that any platinum requiring online challenges is a near immediate no. I did it for Far Cry 4 which required one co-op trophy (I think it was clearing out a camp with a buddy) which was a pain to find anyone who'd do it with me. And given the busyness of life, it was hard to arrange a boosting session with randomers for one trophy.

I like platinum trophies where its not massively challenging or painful though a la AC2. Recently got the Jedi Fallen Order one as it only needed two or three hours extra.

I do remember that cave in Far Cry 3

Penn

Exclamation Marc wrote: »

My general rule of thumb is that any platinum requiring online challenges is a near immediate no. I did it for Far Cry 4 which required one co-op trophy (I think it was clearing out a camp with a buddy) which was a pain to find anyone who'd do it with me. And given the busyness of life, it was hard to arrange a boosting session with randomers for one trophy.

I mostly don't bother with ones that have multiplayer trophies, but I actually did get the platinums for Tekken 7 and Mortal Kombat 11 because the online trophies weren't that bad to get, and I actually did pretty well playing online. Much better than previous fighting games like SF4 and Injustice where I tried online and just got crushed in every match, so went back to playing offline.

My nephew pointed out last week that I'm only one trophy off the platinum for Rocket League, which is just to play one match online with a friend. He got the game for Xmas so if I see him online I'll probably have a game with him and get the platinum, but not fussed about it either.