Would you be ok with white Irish becoming a minority?

AnGaelach

BoatMad wrote: »

Indeed. for example the recent census showed that non national births increased by 17 K from the previous year ( 2015 -2016) while irish native births increased by 22K

even the previous year, 2014 2015 , Irish native births increased by 17K while non nationals increased by 15K

while the birth rate from the non national community is clearly much/somewhat higher then the native community , the greater numbers of irish natives and their brith rate ensure that no dominance of non nationals is remotely likely in Ireland, it would require an enormous increase in non natives and 50-60 years of hyper birth rates to even come close

I don't think you understand the scale of immigration. Islam/Hindu grew by 30% within the last 5 years, and I somehow doubt that's down to each Muslim or Hindu woman giving birth to ten times as many kids as natives.

BoatMad wrote: »

Ireland has approx 500,000 non nationals , including 100K UK, 150-200K EU and 180-200K non EU , with irish emigration failing , the underlying native birthrate is now being seen, so at a 8 times domination of population and a birthrate of nearly 80% of non nationals, we arnt going non irish any day soon now , if ever !!!!

Are you using figures from 2006 or something?

Not including Black Irish/African (57,850 - since we don't know what proportion have Irish citizenship and which do not), there's 746,858 non-nationals.

So that means there's between 746,858 and 804,708 not nationals (depending upon how many Black African have Irish citizenship and how many do not).

That means you are understating the figure by between 33% and 38%

http://www.cso.ie/en/media/csoie/releasespublications/documents/population/2017/Chapter_6_Ethnicity_and_irish_travellers.pdf

BoatMad wrote: »

ah - facts , dont you just love em

To classify them as facts, they actually have to be factual.

dav3

Ah yes we forgot that if you're not white Irish, you're not Irish. Unless you can trace your ancestry back to the days of them sucking on the high king's nipple every day, you're a dirty immigrant. A non-white Irish dirty immigrant. It's quite sad to see the desperation by some people who count those born outside the state and those that are not white as non-Irish.

Meanwhile, back on planet earth. Using the latest census figures 2016 and a clear definition of what an Irish person is according to the constitution and law of the land…

http://www.cso.ie/en/media/csoie/releasespublications/documents/population/2017/Chapter_5_Diversity.pdf

4,082,513 people identified as Irish
535,475 identified as non-Irish
71,933 ticked the box 'no nationality' including those that didn’t bother answering.

Between 2011 and 2016 the number of non-Irish nationals fell for the first time since the question was introduced on the census in 2002 and stood at 535,475 down from 544,357 five years earlier.

The proportion of the population who were non-Irish nationals has also fallen from 12.2 per cent in 2011 to 11.6 per cent in 2016.

Now, using the flawed, back of a beermat logic of the far-right, racists and xenophobes in Ireland and elsewhere.

The Non-Irish population decreased 0.6% in 5 years. Therefore the Non-Irish population will decrease by 0.12% per year.
Non-Irish nationals make up 11.6% of the population.
Dividing 11.6% by 0.12%/per year gives us 96.67 years

Using the idiotic logic of the xenophobes and ethno-nationalists in this thread. I therefore predict that Ireland will be 100% Irish in less than a century. You heard it here first!

No need to worry about jobs for the Irish, or houses for the Irish, we'll be 100% Irish, every job and house will go to an Irish person. All we have to worry about are those dark skinned Irish polluting our pure white Irish race, oops I mean culture. I bet they don't even like coddle.

Junkyard Tom

Oh noes! It's startin lads... RUN! No wait, drive!

Under 20's Irish sprinter Gina-Apke Moses wins gold!



irishtimes.com

BoatMad

AnGaelach wrote: »

I don't think you understand the scale of immigration. Islam/Hindu grew by 30% within the last 5 years, and I somehow doubt that's down to each Muslim or Hindu woman giving birth to ten times as many kids as natives.



Are you using figures from 2006 or something?

Not including Black Irish/African (57,850 - since we don't know what proportion have Irish citizenship and which do not), there's 746,858 non-nationals.

So that means there's between 746,858 and 804,708 not nationals (depending upon how many Black African have Irish citizenship and how many do not).

That means you are understating the figure by between 33% and 38%

http://www.cso.ie/en/media/csoie/releasespublications/documents/population/2017/Chapter_6_Ethnicity_and_irish_travellers.pdf




To classify them as facts, they actually have to be factual.

This is the table I used

as you can see the rough breakdown is 100K Uk , 200K EU and 200K non EU ( give or take ) ,The " irish" category will of course contain naturalised citizens etc
the main reason for the fall in native irish was the emigration in the recession, that has largely ended and as a result the resurgence of the native population in the figures is seen clearly



source: http://pdf.cso.ie/www/pdf/20160905091115_Population_and_Migration_Estimates_April_2016_full.pdf

BoatMad

Are you using figures from 2006 or something?

Not including Black Irish/African (57,850 - since we don't know what proportion have Irish citizenship and which do not), there's 746,858 non-nationals.

So that means there's between 746,858 and 804,708 not nationals (depending upon how many Black African have Irish citizenship and how many do not).

That means you are understating the figure by between 33% and 38%

http://www.cso.ie/en/media/csoie/rel...travellers.pdf

why you link to a page about Irish traveller population is a mystery

The 2016 census figures state what they state ( see above )

BoatMad

Junkyard Tom wrote: »

Oh noes! It's startin lads... RUN! No wait, drive!

Under 20's Irish sprinter Gina-Apke Moses wins gold!



irishtimes.com

brill, our little nation just gets better and better

The_Kew_Tour

Fantastic Achievement and well done to her. Especially with lack of facilities here some going.

Ulysses Gaze

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

Fantastic Achievement and well done to her. Especially with lack of facilities here some going.

That makes it an even better achievement.

Will I Am Not

Don't forget the Balbriggan u19 basketball team :pac:

The_Kew_Tour

Ulysses Gaze wrote: »

That makes it an even better achievement.

Without question. Hopefully it's the start of many Golds for her.

AnGaelach

BoatMad wrote: »

why you link to a page about Irish traveller population is a mystery

I'd recommend you actually go where it has the populations broken down by population change.

BoatMad

AnGaelach wrote: »

I'd recommend you actually go where it has the populations broken down by population change.

yes and heres the commentary from that page

"Between 2011 and 2016 the number of non-Irish nationals fell for the rst time since the question was introduced on the census in 2002 and stood at 535,475 down from 544,357 ve years earlier.
The proportion of the population who were non-Irish nationals has also fallen from 12.2 per cent in 2011 to 11.6 per cent in 2016."


we have as i said around 500,000 people non irish residents, not including dual or naturalised citizens, with 4 million or so iirsh citizens with a birthrate that is not far below the non irish residents , now that irish emigration has fallen,

we have no fear that we will be in any minority in any of our lifetimes, if ever

personally I welcome the energy and diversity they bring and I look forward to such 2nd generation kids as irish men and women contributing to this great little nation

SEPT 23 1989

The census ffs

Raycyst

The Fake Sheikh wrote: »

Don't forget the Balbriggan u19 basketball team :pac:

This type of thing isn't diversity, it's the destruction of diversity and it's making all places the same, with each place having no distinctiveness.


In the 1980s the Olympic teams from each country were more or less ethnically pure, and the diversity was clear to see. Of course there were exceptions but what I'm saying is generally true.

Now, the teams are not ethnically pure and the diversity is gone.


Globalisation destroys diversity by making everywhere the same. Irishness will be destroyed too, or diluted until it is a shadow of its former self.

RayM

Raycyst wrote: »

Irishness will be destroyed too, or diluted until it is a shadow of its former self.

The concept of 'Irishness' will evolve, just like it has always done. As long as people like you remain in a minority, we'll be just fine.

Grayson

Raycyst wrote: »

This type of thing isn't diversity, it's the destruction of diversity and it's making all places the same, with each place having no distinctiveness.


In the 1980s the Olympic teams from each country were more or less ethnically pure, and the diversity was clear to see. Of course there were exceptions but what I'm saying is generally true.

Now, the teams are not ethnically pure and the diversity is gone.


Globalisation destroys diversity by making everywhere the same. Irishness will be destroyed too, or diluted until it is a shadow of its former self.

What are you smoking? Are you seriously saying that diversity is actually racial/ethnicity purity?

I would suggest that you purchase a dictionary.

Raycyst

I'm smoking home grown weed, thank you for taking an interest.


Yes, I am saying that diversity requires diversity. It seems obvious to me. Tautalogical almost

What I mean is, if everywhere becomes the same, where will the diversity be?

Diversity currently exists because different countries exist, and each country contains its own type. Japan and Russia will definitely retain their national character whereas it's less clear that Sweden will.
Diversity is more or less the same thing as having different races each of which is ethnically pure.


I'll try an analogy. Individual notes on a piano are nice. If we play them all at the same time we have an unpleasant cacophony of sound.

A better analogy is lovely pots of paint of different colours, like yellow and purple. If we mix them all we have a single shade of brown, and lots of it. We'd have destroyed the diversity by mixing everything together.

Autochange

24 % dont mind becomming a minority in their own country. Wow.
Turkeys voting for christmas

finooola

Jurgen Klopp wrote: »

if say somewhere like China started allowing in so many people that the Chinese became a minority in their own homeland it would seem fcukin nuts

There are something like 30 different ethnicities native to China. Use a better example for whatever point you're trying to make

Omackeral

Raycyst wrote: »

In the 1980s the Olympic teams from each country were more or less ethnically pure.

Guten tag, mein Fuhrer!

finooola

Just thinking more about this poll overnight. Who cares what any of you (or I) think? Humans are going to mix and migrate more and more into the future. This will happen more quickly in richer countries such as Ireland, but it will happen everywhere. Doesn't matter what any of us think.

The_Kew_Tour

Its a "Great Little Country" if you are "rich"

511

finooola wrote: »

Just thinking more about this poll overnight. Who cares what any of you (or I) think? Humans are going to mix and migrate more and more into the future. This will happen more quickly in richer countries such as Ireland, but it will happen everywhere.

If immigration happens at a large rate (which it is) and the immigrants are poorly educated/unskilled, were going to end up with ghettos and racial tension like in America and the rest of Europe.

The reason why Europe is home to some of the highest avergae IQs and most innovative countries is because of thousands of years of evolution in temperate climes where agriculture thrives. Farming, as opposed to a hunter-gather lifestyle, is more intellectually stimulating and it also developed our work ethic.

We can't be letting in low-IQ and lazy 3rd immigrants like we've done for the past 20 years or so because we'll just drag ourselves down to the Middle-East's Africa's level.

Doesn't matter what any of us think.

Yes, it does. We should be building a better Ireland for future generations, not one filled with racial tension because Europeans are too cowardly and afraid of being called racist to stand up to politicians, businessmen and landlords who want to flood Western countries with immigrants because it makes them richer.

finooola

511 wrote: »

If immigration happens at a large rate (which it is) and the immigrants are poorly educated/unskilled, were going to end up with ghettos and racial tension like in America and the rest of Europe.

The reason why Europe is home to some of the highest avergae IQs and most innovative countries is because of thousands of years of evolution in temperate climes where agriculture thrives. Farming, as opposed to a hunter-gather lifestyle, is more intellectually stimulating and it also developed our work ethic.

We can't be letting in low-IQ and lazy 3rd immigrants like we've done for the past 20 years or so because we'll just drag ourselves down to the Middle-East's Africa's level.



Yes, it does. We should be building a better Ireland for future generations, not one filled with racial tension because Europeans are too cowardly and afraid of being called racist to stand up to politicians, businessmen and landlords who want to flood Western countries with immigrants because it makes them richer.

To the first part, that is bull****, and any serious anthropologist will tell you so. To the second part, that is not the reason why capitalism demands a certain amount of free movement of labour.

sondagefaux

Raycyst wrote: »

This type of thing isn't diversity, it's the destruction of diversity and it's making all places the same, with each place having no distinctiveness.

I think you need to travel a bit more if you think that different parts of the world haven't retained their distinctiveness.

Raycyst wrote: »

In the 1980s the Olympic teams from each country were more or less ethnically pure

Define 'ethnically pure'. Are you suggesting that either part of Germany, for example, was an 'ethnically pure' state in the 1980s?

1980s Olympic teams were also pumped full of steroids and other performance enhancing drugs...

Raycyst wrote: »

Globalisation destroys diversity by making everywhere the same. Irishness will be destroyed too, or diluted until it is a shadow of its former self.

A. Define Irishness

B. Is Irishness a static state?

C. If it isn't a static state (e.g. if Irishness in 890 was different from Irishness in 1890 and again from Irishness in 1990), what precisely are you claiming will be destroyed or diluted?

rgossip30

We wanted workers but got a lot of others . This is what happens in all countries in Europe. The EU workers come and work in low paid jobs then realise they are better off on welfare .
Asylum Seekers make claims for refugee status 90% + are bogus they get leave to remain after judicial reviews . Deportations are low but rising something positive .
Governments accept this for the advancement of globalisation despite the objections. The solution we must integrate them but is it working .
Terrorists never attack politicians, governments or the Rich, because they work FOR them.

Raycyst

finooola wrote: »

Just thinking more about this poll overnight. Who cares what any of you (or I) think? Humans are going to mix and migrate more and more into the future. This will happen more quickly in richer countries such as Ireland, but it will happen everywhere. Doesn't matter what any of us think.

but it will happen everywhere?
That's not true. Japan will remain Japanese and Russia will remain Russian. Hungary and Poland have respect for themselves and will remain true to themselves.
In fact, it's easier to name countries in suicide mode, examples being Sweden, France, Germany, the UK, but also Ireland unfortunately.
No-one voted that Ireland should destroy itself like Sweden.


Doesn't matter what any of us think.
So have no control over our own governments now?
What about voting?
Can we not vote against this?

It seems we may not be able to vote against multiculturalism and immigration if all politicans collude to refuse to represent the wishes and the interests of their electorates.
In other words, the public doesn't want multiculturalism or immigration but it is being forced upon us by out of touch elites who hate their own country and history.

They are treasonous traitors to Ireland and to themselves. Politicans colluding with one another represents a crime. Of course the Gardai will do nothing. Only ordinary people can save the country now.

This society is being destroyed by idealogues who hate themselves and who stand for nothing.


Globalisation is a scam and it destroys societies. It is criminal to support it.

Will I Am Not

Come and stay the weekend in our lovely seaside town.

Mr. CooL ICE

511 wrote: »

The reason why Europe is home to some of the highest avergae IQs and most innovative countries is because of thousands of years of evolution in temperate climes where agriculture thrives. Farming, as opposed to a hunter-gather lifestyle, is more intellectually stimulating and it also developed our work ethic.

We can't be letting in low-IQ and lazy 3rd immigrants like we've done for the past 20 years or so because we'll just drag ourselves down to the Middle-East's Africa's level.

You have a source for this?

Comte de Mirabeau

I'm a white Irish heterosexual Catholic male , who's neither left or right wing and takes each policy and point of view on it's own merits. . .Apparently someone like me is one of the most repulsive, threatening and dangerous combinations you can be according to the western media. What a bizarre narrative and agenda were all supposed to believe and run with. . . . and yet so many do.