"It's what you do next that counts"

Lazare

Great to see you too D, you ran a great race. Bang on what you predicted when we were chatting.

Wottle

Starting to have doubts over running Rotterdam marathon.

I feel I'm getting into good shape and am excited by a spring and summer of 5k to 10k racing.

After my recent long run, I pulled up quite lame, heel and back.

It got me thinking about how much time I'm sacrificing by doing Rotterdam. It took me six weeks after Valencia to finally feel like myself again.

If I run Rotterdam, I can see a slight PB but then again I have Valencia end of year which will be a full on assault.

I've also got the Berlin half the week before Rotterdam, going over with a group, so I could potentially give this a rattle if not doing Rotterdam.

Any thoughts welcome

py

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121916302#Comment_121916302

The long undulating run on Monday didn't make sense to me after you raced the 5Km on Sunday. An easy few Km or a rest day would have been more appropriate, or else skipping the 5Km.

We have both suffered with PF so I know the guessing game that you are going through right now. When I do a session or a long run, it is followed by a rest day or a very easy short run. If I race, it is followed by a rest day. The heel will have suffered with the back to back intensity of a race and then stress of a long run.

A few easy days of very easy running will get the heel back on track for Rotterdam but imo ye can't mess around with the recovery of intense/long runs when dealing with PF.

Wottle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121916685#Comment_121916685

Thanks PY for taking the time to reply. Yes you're a million percent correct on a few counts.

The 5k/ long run combo was not wise. I guess I've been telling myself I'm not marathon training and have been making it up to a degree.

The previous long run also didn't go well but there's excuses for that too, so maybe my view of Rotterdam is a little blurred.

The PF is certainly still a factor, I'm definitely managing it a hell of a lot better than previous years but the aftermath of Monday's long run had me dragging the foot along the floor, much better today after rest.

The good news going forward is that I'm leaving one of my gigs which frees up an extra two days for my own running, which will hopefully help with continuing management of PF.

How's yours going btw?

marathon2022

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121916302#Comment_121916302

If you are not injured do it, you never know what will happen between now and Valencia.

Wottle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121919243#Comment_121919243

Never thought of it from that perspective, definitely something to consider. Thanks for that.

Murph_D

Sorry to hear about the issues, but like py above I really can't believe you did a 20-mile LR (or any LR) the day after a 100% raced 5k. Just asking for trouble, and I'm sure it's something you would advise your athletes not to do.

But given your history, I'm 100% sure you will travel to Rotterdam and race it! 😀

Mind yourself in the meantime and best of luck either way.

py

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121916973#Comment_121916973

I think some reflection on why the previous long run was poor could be worthwhile. Understanding what aspects within your control had a positive/negative impact on why you felt it went poorly. Fuel, attire, fatigue, sleep, pace etc are all worthwhile reviewing. It needs to be an honest reflection without BSing yourself.

My own PF is very manageable these days. It was fine yesterday when in my original reply and then today its at me today after a late evening run around. It will settle throughout the day and over night provided I get good sleep. The plated shoes have helped a lot but I am slowly trying to wean myself off them for easy runs. I'll continue to use them for speed sessions or long runs. I have been holding back on my easy runs a little. The fitness is there for me to up the pace. There is minimal benefit to me in doing this so I have decided to keep them easy to very easy so that I can continue to get out running. It can be tough at times keeping the ego in check but it has allowed me to keep running regularly.

Wottle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121921285#Comment_121921285

Thanks Murph, had a good laugh out loud there, you certainly do know my history and my wife would agree.

I'm thinking I'll one more long run a go when feeling a little more fresh and then make a call.

Wottle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121921553#Comment_121921553

Good to hear you're managing it well.

The long run two weeks ago, I definitely have excuses, I was running a camp with 22 runners, covered a 100k which is my highest weekly mileage in some time. I also wore too many layers (tracksuit bottoms) as I didn't want anymore bites, plus it was warm.

The weekend gone was just a different kind of suffering. Maybe 5k race and long run is not the best move but I've actually done this plenty over last few years, including only a couple of weeks ago after the Amsterdam parkrun. It honestly never takes that much out of me, so I didn't think twice about doing it.

But I was sore/lame, confidence took a hit.

Just back from 8k and the body feels normal again (heel is doing its usual though). Maybe I was over reacting with initial post but I am going to stick to plan above, long run will be done Monday or Tuesday next week and fresh.

Wottle

March 18th to 24th

Monday - Last weeks 20 miler, already discussed.

Tuesday - Legs still tired so got on the bike for a spin to Jonny foxes and back by stepaside, about 75 minutes.

Wednesday - Rest day but busy with athletics in primary school.

Thursday - My last Thursday work run. Mixed emotions, a great group and I'll miss them but also looking forward to concentrating on my own running.

Friday - 5 miles easy in the Boston 12s, not sure about them.

Saturday - Marlay Parkrun 19'34, fun morning racing against a few from my training group. Legs still a bit heavy but didn't stop me leading for first 500m, I was wondering where the hell was everyone. Then about 6 runners went by me and I could relax a little more. It definitely wasn't a max effort like Tallaght 5k but not far off.

Sunday - 10 miles with company, upto Bohernabreena reservoir and back.

Almost certain I won't be doing Rotterdam marathon, I've actually put my number up for sale through their website.

I'll race Berlin half instead the week before and then focus fully on getting my 5k down.

Thanks for all the input on the matter.

And 100 days of sweets, chocolate, jellies, biscuits, crisps, fizzy drinks etc and 90 days of some form of S&C every day.

Wottle

March 25th to 31st

Monday - easy group 5k, followed by 4 miles easy an hour later. New shoes arrived and wanted to check them out. The zoom fly 5, like bricks, demoted immediately to walking shoes.

Tuesday - highlight of the week 8*1k at 4'12 Kilometer pace off 60 secs standing recovery. Felt like I could have done this all day long.

Wednesday - woke up with a scratchy throat. 7 miles easy with a few strides in the middle.

Thursday - Scratchy throat was now a head cold. Debated whether or not to do planned session. Decided to give it a go but was prepared to stop if needed. 3 sets of 3*400 at goal 5k pace. 30 secs standing recovery between efforts and 3 minute walk between sets. Loved this session, stolen from Steve Magness, although he has 4*400. Felt solid and all reps were 86 to 88 secs. Changed into my old spikes for 3*200m off 200 walk to finish, 41, 36, 35. I've ordered a pair of dragon flys, looking forward to more sessions on the track but not in Irishtown, the track is in awful condition and I thought it had been resurfaced?

Friday - Rest day, trying to shake this head cold.

Saturday - planned on parkrun but having walked the course beforehand, decided I'd be stupid to run.

Sunday - Wanted to do 5k at 4'15/6'50 pace and take a lactate reading, see if sub 90 in Berlin next week is a realistic target. Felt shlt on the warm up. Changed into alphaflys for Tempo effort and immediately felt better. Lots of distractions on the concert field, junior parkrun setup, other runners, and a bloody nose. Cleared my nose a little too aggressively and it wouldn't stop streaming. Averaged 4'08/6'39 and the lactate was 3.5 mmol, a little too high but given I was running faster than I should have, I think I'm a 7/2 shot for sub 90 but hopefully odds on for a PB 93'25.

Nothing too crazy planned for this week, just to shake the head cold and feel fresh.

marathon2022

Your in great shape, certainly short odds on a sub 90. Best of luck

Wottle

Berlin half 1:36:47 - not the race I was hoping for.