"It's what you do next that counts"

GoHardOrGoHome

And two feet in the air for the photo?! Amazing!

MisterJinx

Great job and well done 💪

Kellygirl

Well done again! Delighted it went well for you.

Kellygirl

I meant to ask, did you do anything different fuelling wise prior to Valencia and did you use Creatine again?

Wottle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119972485#Comment_119972485

Hi Kellygirl

No I didn't use the creatine or beetroot juice.

Fueling strategy:

Saturday

Pizza at 1:30pm, jellies at 5pm, then nothing until I woke 4 hours before the start time and had 320 maurten drink.

Then 20 minutes before start, roughly 200ml of tailwind.

Maurten gels every 35 minutes, caffeine one was 4th in rotation.

Salt tab about mile 17

250ml tailwind for miles 24 & 25.

No cramping and never felt I was going to, but the fear psychologically was there.

I now think my cramping issues have simply been down to being too aggressive with pacing early on.

Kellygirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119973242#Comment_119973242

Jellies at 5pm 😂. It really did all come together well for you. I must trial the Maurten drinks next year.

AuldManKing

That's an amazing performance - very well done.

A Marathon PB, no real taper, feeling comfortable, no cramp and the audacity to try to make a call on the finishing straight - thats dreamland!

Some Questions:

How did you find the shoes?

Did you carbo load the same way for AMS/DUB/VAL?

To save me reading back - I'd be interested to see your split at 10k in each of the 3 marathons? My coach is forever advising the 'Tortise' approach to build into marathons - helps with fuel and cardiac drift.

Did you find the lack of a taper this time to be beneficial or a hindrance ?

How did you deal mentally with having 3 marathons so close - did it result in pressure being off at Valencia? or did you struggle for motivation in training in between the 3 (I'm considering a Dublin / Valencia double next year - Dublin at MP +20 sec)

Well done again on a terrific performance.

Wottle

Thanks very much, the call was actually motivating me and making me a little emotional when I would think of it. From the race report, it probably suggests I only thought of it in the last K, but that's not true, more like the halfway point. This also kept me accountable as I wanted the call to be a positive experience and not me falling apart, again.

My wife and three daughters are so supportive of me, my number 1 fans and I just wanted to share it with them, can't believe I clicked the wrong button, proper brain fart.

Here's the 10k splits, I think I had the right mindset for pacing Dublin, I just think the 2 week gap, starting with friends and humidity scuppered any chance. I downed tools at Orwell park when I fell just outside average PB Pace and ran the last 11/12k with a friend who was really struggling.

I'd listen to your coach, my eye's have been opened and like you I've struggled with cramp in every marathon. I'm now putting the cramping issue down to starting a little too quick, easing into the race and attempting negative splits is my goal from now on.

10k slits

Amsterdam 10k - 45'06 (3:19:21) (AHR 168)

Dublin 10k - 47'06

Valencia 10k - 47'21 (3:18:31) (AHR 162)

Did you find the lack of a taper this time to be beneficial or a hindrance ?

Neither really, I had 42 miles in the legs going into Sunday but all of those, apart fro 7 on Thursday, were very pedestrian. I have groups I run with for work and I'd taken enough days of previously with the other marathons, I didn't want to continue to take the plss. I did consider a leg loosener on the Saturday afternoon but thought it would more than likely have a negative effect and opted for legs up and a world cup match.

How did you find the shoes?

absolutely loved them, way more comfortable than the Vaporflies. I'd imagine I'll be sticking with them going forward with marathons.

Did you carbo load the same way for AMS/DUB/VAL?

I didn't really bother this time round. I don't like feeling bloated on the start line. Ate as normal on Thursday and Friday.

Saturday, my flight was early, only had a bulk flapjack at the expo at about noon. Then a decent sized pizza for lunch. Had a banana at some stage and then last thing I ate was a big bag of jellies.

Woke at 4am then to take a Maurten 320g. So I guess my Saturday intake and maurten 320 was very carb heavy but in the grand scheme of things, not excessive.

How did you deal mentally with having 3 marathons so close - did it result in pressure being off at Valencia? or did you struggle for motivation in training in between the 3 (I'm considering a Dublin / Valencia double next year - Dublin at MP +20 sec)

I felt the most pressure in Amsterdam, I felt I had to do my training justice and shorter distances suggested I was closer to 3:05 (bullshit in hindsight 😅

Didn't feel any pressure in Dublin and loved that my wife and daughters would be out cheering and I got to start it with two friends. If I delved any deeper, I probably knew I was kidding myself but all the same, I got a lot of confidence getting to Orwell Park on pace.

Valencia I had no pressure, besides boards, I actually didn't tell anyone I was going apart from a close friend. My mum actually rang me on Saturday looking for me, she had no idea.

I had the attitude of giving it a whirl and worse case scenario, I get to spend a couple of days in a beautiful city.

I wouldn't put you off doing Dublin at all, there's enough time and you're already used to longer runs in a block.

I've actually signed up for the Valencia Half on October 22nd, that'll be my build up race, any excuse to go back!

Wottle

Two other factors that I believe helped me in Valencia.

1. Running a number of sessions at 160 HR and working on parallel lines between heart rate and pace.

Previous Marathons I've averaged 168 beats with my early miles in the high 150s/early 160s.

Valencia was an average of 162, so did I actually coincidentally train at actual MP.

My theory at the time was just to get more efficient at early heart rate miles and delay the heart rate drift.

In Valencia it took till mile 14 before the HR had a drift away from 160/161.

In Dublin that jump happened in mile 3 and in Amsterdam mile 5 or 6.

2. I purchased a lactate meter and on the Thursday performed a treadmill step test with my HR chest strap and Stryd power pod on. Some estimate a marathon to be run between 2 & 2.5 mmol of blood lactate, so I tried to find this.

The test gave me back numbers of 294 to 300 watts and a HR guide of 157 to 160.

For the first half I ran an average of 301 watts and my HR read 157.

Having done the test I definitely had confidence in the numbers but still without any pressure or expectations.

Dubh Geannain

Congrats on the PB. You nailed that.

Wottle

Dec 5th to 11th

23 miles over 5 runs, all easy, quads very tender on the first few runs.

Picked up a cold towards the weekend, which has almost finally gone.

Murph_D

Just catching up with the Valencia report - really excellent. Completely agree with 'don't start too aggressively' strategy. An exemplary set of splits.

Definitely more to come considering the two shoelace stops and the phone episode!

Wottle

December 12th - 18th & 10 weeks to Seville Marathon

Mon - 4 miles on the treadmill, pretty forgettable.

Tue - Almost 6 miles on the treadmill with 7x3 mins at MP off 60 secs. I've a bit of a cold so didn't want to push the pace or reps.

Wed - A little over 7 miles easy with the group in Marlay, we found a 2k forest loop that was protected from the ice.

Thu - A little over 7 miles on the treadmill with 9x3 mins and 1x4 mins, all off 60 secs. Started at MP and worked down closer to half marathon pace.

Fri - 6 miles easy back on the Marlay safe loop.

Sat - flying visit to Portugal, 5 miles easy in the end. Had contemplated a time trial on the track but when I arrived there was about 40 to 50 athletes and coaches. Some of the athletes are Olympic standard, a lot of the guys going shirtless and showing their 6 packs. There was no way this little chubby lad was asking anyone for the use of lane 1.

It actually was a blessing as feeling a little tired and have I learned nothing from Dublin marathon, it's only been two weeks since Valencia.

Sun - 6 miles with 3 miles at 160 HR, enjoyed this run but still have the lingering head cold. Started 30 minutes before sunrise to the most wonderful pink sky. Paces were approximately 6'45 mile pace. Finished as sun was rising over the river Guadiana.

My plan is to grow these 160 heart rate sessions, and back to long runs from next week.

Wottle

Been fighting a cold, going on 3 or 4 weeks, elevated heart rate and can't believe how much mucus I've blown out of my nose.

I've done an ok job at ticking over, like I'm not sick sick if you know what I mean.

December 19th - 25th

Mon - 5 miles super easy with the group.

Tue - 6 miles proper easy keeping heart rate under 140 (8'47 mile pace).

Wed - session of 3x1k off approximately 80 secs, didn't have lap timer set up, so waited till HR returned to 125.

Splits were 3'41 - 3'42 - 3'45, tough but satisfying.

Thu - short 4k run with the group.

Fri - Rest

Sat - Met up with a friend who had the mountains on his mind, up Kilmashogue, towards Fairy Castle before returning via Tibradden. My HR was through the roof on every climb, I was probably a tad moany.

Sun - 4 mile run on my own before returning to collect my daughters for the goal mile at Tallaght track, lovely event put on by the club.

Wottle

December 26th - January 1st

Mon - Rest

Tue - 7 miles on the treadmill with 9x3 mins and 1x5 mins, all off 60 secs (little longer on last rep). Pace was roughly MP or slower as HR was a little high

Wed - Rest

Thu - 4 miles just to get out

Fri - Rest

Sat - Another rest day, just trying to shake this cold. Resting HR still higher than normal but coming down

Sun - Not sure I'm up to Tom Brennan 5k, maybe a parkrun.

Wottle

My Year in review

2,332 miles over 301 days of running.

18 Races - PBs in 5k, 5M, 10k, Half and full.

Some of the PBs were 13 to 14 years old.

Best race of the year was Marlay Parkrun and running 18'35, I got into a proper battle and the time was a bonus.

Highlight of the year was running my best Marathon ever, first time to negative split and knowing the areas I can improve for next year's Valencia Marathon.

Biggest disappointment of the year was not breaking 40 minutes for 10k.

Favourite shoe was the Adizero Adios pro2, just love it.

Most enjoyable route was Bohernabreena reservoir, ran up there with lots of friends over the year and it was spectacular every time

Happy New Year everyone and thanks for reading, roll on 2023

Wottle

Page two, bodes well for the forum.

Jan 2nd to 8th

55 miles for the week, not a single session, just lots of easy group running.

This weekend I have a 10k in Valencia, it'll be a nice weekend away from the kids with my wife.

When I signed up for it, I was in more of an optimistic humour than I am now and thought sub 40 would be a box ticking exercise. I'll be lucky to break 42 but I'm not too bothered for now.

I'll still try give a solid effort.

Wottle

Jan 9th to 15th

41 miles for the week, mostly all at a super easy pace.

Headed to Valencia for a 10k, between marathon recovery and sick over Christmas I had very little expectations.

I still intended to go out at 40 minute 10k pace and see how far I could hold it, the answer was less than 3k and it was here when I decided 5k would be enough.

20'30 for the 5k, never got going, couldn't get the heart rate up to race effort but still enjoyed it strangely enough. Valencia really is beautiful.

As a consequence, I've pulled the plug on Seville, no apetite to run a marathon for the sake of it.

My sight now solely aimed at 5ks and I'm excited for it.

First step, sub 20 in the next week or two.

Second step, back down to high 18 STH.

Final step, a PB and preferably under 18'30.

Wottle

Jan 16th to 22nd

51 miles for the week, all easy. Highlight of the week was acting as unofficial pacer for sub 25 at Marlay Parkrun.

Jan 23rd to 29th

Not a great week for mileage, just 32 but with ongoing sinus issues and a gastric bug thrown in for good measure, I thought less was best.

I did however still go for my sub 20 attempt.

Headed up to Marlay and felt up for it. Plan was no racing, just tick sub 20 box. And that I did 19'42, looking forward to building on it.

Wottle

Jan 30th to Feb 5th

58 miles for the week, which included a session on the Wednesday; 6x2 minutes at slightly quicker than 5k pace.

Did this in my Puma nitro elite, nice shoe but you really got to work to hit faster paces. Tough wind for every second rep. Paces came in between 5'55 & 6'15.

For my long run, I'm experimenting with a long warm up and cool down either side of Parkrun. Total 11 miles. This is to allow me to take Sunday as a full rest day.

So it was back up to Marlay Parkrun and swapped my Adizero pro 2 for the vaporfly 2, I think I prefer the former.

Felt in good form but actually found it hard to push the pace. Chipped a few seconds off last week's time with a 19'37.

Wont get another parkrun attempt till Feb 25th and that'll be over in Edgbaston Reservoir, so lots of time to get some sessions under the belt.

Wottle

Feb 6th to Feb 12th

Zero miles, no running at all for 9 days now.

Sunday night I had severe abdominal pains but thought they'd pass, it didn't.

Went to the doctor's and she sent me to A&E. Ended up getting a bed and thankfully some pain relief and antibiotics.

Diverticulitis was the diagnosis after the scan, thankfully no surgery and feeling much better. My lower back and legs have been a bit sore too.

Told not to run for two weeks but we negotiated it down to a week and then see. So hopefully try a short run on the Thursday or Friday.

In the meantime, I've signed up for the Terenure 5 miler, love this race.

Wottle

Back again and plan is to log for the rest of the year, having been unwell in February, my training really took a hit.

Feel I'm back on the right track, below is my 5k progression since been sick:

Feb 25th Edgbaston Parkrun - 21'17

March 18th Dodder Valley Parkrun - 20'43

March 25th Marlay Parkrun - 20'20

April 8th Marlay Parkrun - 19'58

April 22nd Dodder Valley Parkrun - 19'39

May 19th Le Chéile 5k - 19'00

In between the 5ks was the Berlin Half Marathon where I ran 1'33'25 for an 11 second PB. No real training for this, it was a total surprise, felt very strong throughout.

Terenure 5 miler May 14th 32'28, very happy with this run, consistent pacing and felt strong. Its also a course PB but more importantly another confidence booster that I'm on the right path.

Bit of context to the times above and how February's illness set me back, last year I ran 18'35 for 5k, 31'10 for 5 mile, 1'33'36 for the half and 3'18'31 in the Valencia Marathon.

Plan going forward is the Dunshaughlin 10k in 26 days time and a sub 40 attempt, I failed twice last year in the space of 6 days, running 40'30ish both times.

Ratoath Half marathon in 109 days.

Valencia Half Marathon in 152 days.

And the main goal Valencia Marathon in 194 days time when I'll be hoping to take a big chunk off that 3'18.

Next up though is a 5k in Bohermeen on June 2nd, hopefully get back under 19.

There'll be plenty of parkruns along the way as I hone in on a 100 (runs) & 25 (volunteering) milestones.

August I'll be away for 5 weeks and that's when I'll shift to base building and marathon focus.

Feel free to add input, always welcome, always learning.

Cheers

Wottle

May 22nd to May 28th

45 miles for the week (70k)

Monday - Very easy 50 minutes.

Tuesday - 70 minutes with a few marathon paced strides around the pond in Ranelagh gardens.

Wednesday - 60 minutes easy around Marlay park. Legs finally feeling back to normal after last Friday's race and Sunday's long run.

Thursday - 50 minutes easy by the Liffey at lunchtime, good to see Krusty along the route.

Evening time was a group session in Marlay and one of the big ones in preparation for Dunshaughlin 10k.

4x2k at 3'57 km pace. Although it was in the group I was pacing solo, a few had been racing Sunday, a few ran earlier and one was unwell.

Very happy with how it went, stayed positive throughout.

Friday - 30 minutes very easy in Marlay. I was hoping to give the parkrun a lash the next morning, so this was an attempt to ease the fatigue.

Saturday - previous evening's run didn't work and decided I'd just run the parkrun at marathon effort, 21'43 in the end.

Sunday - some lactate testing in a very warm shed, sweating buckets.

I actually did this test the week before Valencia Marathon, and the random figure for some, 2 mmol, seems to correlate really well for me with marathon pace.

Today's session showed a slight improvement and seems to agree with my coros watch's marathon prediction of 3'11.

Wottle

May 29th to June 4th

Mon - 40 minutes easy around Ringsend.

Tue - 90 minutes easy around some of the same route as previous day.

Wed - 80 minutes easy around Marlay with occasional strides at marathon pace.

Thu - Two runs, first at lunch time was 45 minutes easy around the Green and same again in the evening around Marlay.

Fri - Race day, I was feeling a bit more nervous than usual, it could have been the drive as well, wasn't looking forward to that.

I also had an upset tummy and headache. I considered giving the race a miss but then thought maybe I'm being mentally weak, so just sucked it up and headed to Bohermeen with my three daughters.

Took about 50 minutes to get there, parking was dead handy and very well organised at the community centre.

Tummy was still at me but warm up felt fine. The only mishap was losing my phone when I went toilet, I didn't realise for about 15 minutes that it was missing. Some good soul had handed it in and with 15 minutes to go we were reunited. My anxiety levels had been through the roof but now I was calm.

Headed to the start line with 10 minutes to go and it was already pretty packed, I stood no chance of getting into the right starting point for a sub 19 attempt.

1st KM - 3'41 - I passed the start line within 5 seconds but it took at least 800 meters to find my stride and some open road, lots of necessary dipping and diving.

2nd KM - 3'43 - Don't remember much only that I didn't feel as good as two weeks ago in Leixlip.

3rd KM - 3'49 - Got passed by a woman in a Clane AC singlet, I tried to stick with her and although my pace was fading slightly, she was motoring!

4th KM - 3'54 - Tried to hang on here but I really didn't feel like myself. The low hanging sun was a constant irritation to my eyes, regretted not wearing the shades.

5th KM - 3'51 - and I know the sub 19 is gone, 4th killed any chance. There's an acute angle turn with about 600m to go and this ruined any remaining momentum. Wasn't overly bothered with picking up the pace for a fast finish and just fizzled out.

So not a great race, my upset tummy was a thing and on the drive home I felt like puking dozens of times but didn't. I couldn't get my heart rate up to normal 5k levels and a poor starting position.

So given all that I'm actually chuffed to have run 19'08 and I'm taking it as a big win in preparation for Dunshaughlin 10k.

The event itself was top class, fair course, live music and a BBQ.

Sat - I woke feeling a million times better and headed to Dodder Valley for a group parkrun. One of my Thursday training partners was going to give sub 20 a lash and I stupidly told him I'd try help him out for the first few k, we got to two miles on pace and then I wished him good luck.

This is probably the stupidest thing I've done in some time, won't be repeated.

Sun - A glorious 85 minutes in the sun. Headed up to Bohernabreena on my own and loved every step.

This time last year I went through the 1000 mile mark, I'm currently 140 miles behind the target but feeling like momentum is with me.

Wottle

June 5th to 11th

Mon - 30 minutes easy with a group around Marlay.

Tue - A group I run with have a lot on at the moment, so found myself with a time slot all to myself, glorious day so headed to Bohernabreena reservoir again.

10 miles in total with 20 minutes of tempo.

Wed - Rest day, 17 or 18 days since the last one.

Thu - 40 minutes around Stephens Green with a few strides at lunch time.

Evening time was supposed to be 3x3k at 10k race pace in preparation for Dunshaughlin 10k. Wasn't feeling particularly confident about the session, body was tired and thoughts of overdoing it the last week were flooding my brain and worst of all Marlay concert field was all blocked off, so we headed to Loretto park beside Nutgrove shopping centre, I hate running in this park!

First 3k effort felt awful, started too quickly and couldn't find the sweet spot, averaged 3'55.

Decided to adjust pace on the next set to 4'05 - 4'08 but even that was tough going and stopped at 2k.

Threw in another 1k rep but that was more a case of waiting for others, came in at 3'55 but I was spent.

Really disappointed as this was the crescendo of the McMillan sessions and I never once thought I wouldn't complete it.

Fri - I need to freshen up before next week, so took another rest day.

Sat - Headed to Corkagh parkrun with my daughter and her friend, great fun and a nice fair course, will definitely be back to give it a crack.

Sun - Group long run, back up to Bohernabreena, about 10 of us, very enjoyable but the flies were a right pain in the arse.

A few days have passed since Thursday, totally over it, my confidence is still in decent shape and I'm definitely giving the sub 40 a crack.

Still need to freshen up and watch my diet over the next week

Wottle

June 12th to 18th

Mon - 30 minutes easy

Tue - 50 minute group run from town up to Palmerston park and back.

Wed - Starting to feel fresh, 4x400m off 60 seconds and 3x200m off a walk back recovery. A little too quick but enjoyable all the same.

Thu - 35 minutes easy with a friend.

Fri - 60 minutes super ez in the morning with a group.

Headed out to Irishtown in the afternoon to perform some lactate testing on a friend.

Sat - Dunshaughlin 10k, 8 weeks of specific training for this, very giddy all day, could not wait to get going.

However, I ran a stinker, downed tools at 3k and jogged 7k home. I knew it wasn't my day and I'm actually happy with my call.

I was extremely disappointed after, but my daughters told me I looked quite grey on the road trip home, so maybe STH up. I also had a nose bleed about 10 minutes before the start.

Comfort ate the whole weekend and took Sunday off.

By Monday morning I was finally over it and back at it.

Heading to Portugal for 4 days, plan is to run every day there and hopefully get on the track for a session.

Laineyfrecks

FWIW I think you made the right call too, sometimes you just know it's not going to happen so jogging the rest of it seems like the sensible decision to me. Was nice chatting to you before hand, always great to see a friendly face at the start line😊

Enjoy Portugal, not jealous at all!

Wottle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120742969#Comment_120742969

Likewise 🤗 I'll send lots of pics 😅

Wottle

I'm a couple of weeks out from starting my Valencia Marathon training, I've logged my last few training cycles here and felt it kept me on track.

In July I broke 20 minutes for a couple of 5ks, not really lighting the world on fire.

I've been in Portugal for the last 5 weeks and would class my training as average with only a 137 miles for the month. I'm not overly bothered as I've really enjoyed the downtime but way too much food.

I'm down for Ratoath half next week, it's really just to assess the fitness. I then have about six weeks before my next half marathon, I would love to break 90 minutes there but highly doubtful.

My only current concern is still my right heel which I'm just about able to manage. After the marathon in December, I'm going to try get to the bottom of it as it's going on 18 months plus.

As always input always welcome, cheers D

Wottle

Week 1/12

Monday - 8 miles ez

Tuesday - 8 miles ez

Wednesday - 7 miles with 5 of those at 160HR

Thursday - 5 miles ez

Friday - 6 miles Inc 5x1k @ 6'55 mile pace off 60 seconds standing recovery

Saturday - 15 miles, I have a target in my head that I'd like to run in Valencia, the run was broken down into 7.5 miles @ 85% of goal pace, 4.5 miles at 90% and 3 miles @ 95%.

Really enjoyed the run, heart rate was in a really good spot and well under marathon HR.

My new shoes, Mizuno rebellion pro are helping the heel a little, I feel I'm running with a slightly snappier stride, little more pressure on the quads though.

Couple of other things to note, I've started eating a lot more carbs, in particular extra bowls of cereals, my energy levels have really improved.

Finally, I ran a stinker in Ratoath last week. Even though I decided not to race it and go by HR, I still lost overall control of HR, slowed down a lot and ran 1'44.

I actually think I'm in much better shape than abover and looking forward to having a crack at a half on the way to the main event.

Thrilled with week 1!