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Killer Robots

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  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Regional East Moderators, Regional Midlands Moderators, Regional Midwest Moderators, Regional Abroad Moderators, Regional North Mods, Regional West Moderators, Regional South East Moderators, Regional North East Moderators, Regional North West Moderators, Regional South Moderators Posts: 8,382 CMod ✭✭✭✭ Fathom


    Rubecula wrote: »
    I served in the military and I really would like us to step back a bit and rethink this scenario.
    You're qualified. I'm not. But I agree with you Rubecula.


  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 47,100 CMod ✭✭✭✭ Black Swan


    Rubecula wrote: »
    I served in the military and I really would like us to step back a bit and rethink this scenario.
    Indeed.


  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Regional East Moderators, Regional Midlands Moderators, Regional Midwest Moderators, Regional Abroad Moderators, Regional North Mods, Regional West Moderators, Regional South East Moderators, Regional North East Moderators, Regional North West Moderators, Regional South Moderators Posts: 8,382 CMod ✭✭✭✭ Fathom


    Air Force Capt. Michael Byrnes predicts that a single unmanned aerial vehicle with machine-controlled maneuvering and accuracy could, “with a few hundred rounds of ammunition and sufficient fuel reserves,” take out an entire fleet of aircraft.


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,551 ✭✭✭ Rubecula


    Fathom wrote: »
    Air Force Capt. Michael Byrnes predicts that a single unmanned aerial vehicle with machine-controlled maneuvering and accuracy could, “with a few hundred rounds of ammunition and sufficient fuel reserves,” take out an entire fleet of aircraft.


    couple of points on that one, ]

    a. what type of aircraft?
    b. how many in a fleet?
    c. will they fight back?
    d. will it attack as a surprise/ambush or will it be met head on?

    let us not forget the difficulties involved in aerial combat.


  • Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 84,892 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Capt'n Midnight


    Fathom wrote: »
    Air Force Capt. Michael Byrnes predicts that a single unmanned aerial vehicle with machine-controlled maneuvering and accuracy could, “with a few hundred rounds of ammunition and sufficient fuel reserves,” take out an entire fleet of aircraft.

    The prototype Firebee drone flew in 1951.

    In 1971 some second generation drones were used by pilots from Top Gun during MASTACS as target practice. Computers weren't so good then so the drones were remote controlled. They were smaller and could turn faster than the Phantoms. The hunters became the hunted.

    Manned fighters have been obsolete for almost half century.


    The weak spot of UAV's was interfering with the remote control link, but AI wouldn't need remote control


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  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Regional East Moderators, Regional Midlands Moderators, Regional Midwest Moderators, Regional Abroad Moderators, Regional North Mods, Regional West Moderators, Regional South East Moderators, Regional North East Moderators, Regional North West Moderators, Regional South Moderators Posts: 8,382 CMod ✭✭✭✭ Fathom



    Manned fighters have been obsolete for almost half century.

    The weak spot of UAV's was interfering with the remote control link, but AI wouldn't need remote control

    Cool info. Thanks Capt'n.


  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Regional East Moderators, Regional Midlands Moderators, Regional Midwest Moderators, Regional Abroad Moderators, Regional North Mods, Regional West Moderators, Regional South East Moderators, Regional North East Moderators, Regional North West Moderators, Regional South Moderators Posts: 8,382 CMod ✭✭✭✭ Fathom


    LAW are called lethal autonomous weapon systems (LAWS), lethal autonomous robots (LAR), robotic weapons, or killer robots. Sobering? Or the opposite?


  • Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 84,892 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Capt'n Midnight




  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 47,100 CMod ✭✭✭✭ Black Swan


    Indeed.


  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Regional East Moderators, Regional Midlands Moderators, Regional Midwest Moderators, Regional Abroad Moderators, Regional North Mods, Regional West Moderators, Regional South East Moderators, Regional North East Moderators, Regional North West Moderators, Regional South Moderators Posts: 8,382 CMod ✭✭✭✭ Fathom



    Robot peer influence.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,007 ✭✭✭ Eli Strong Crossbow


    Imagine a single intelligence with a network of cameras and other sensors, on drones and otherwise, directly controlling air strikes and artillery. I imagine integrated control like this would offer greater potential for conceiving and implementing strategies. The removal of the physical limits of human senses is a very interesting idea.

    I imagine infantry would be by far the most difficult to replace. Taking the man out of the machine would be easier than replacing the soldier.


  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Regional East Moderators, Regional Midlands Moderators, Regional Midwest Moderators, Regional Abroad Moderators, Regional North Mods, Regional West Moderators, Regional South East Moderators, Regional North East Moderators, Regional North West Moderators, Regional South Moderators Posts: 8,382 CMod ✭✭✭✭ Fathom


    Imagine a single intelligence with a network of cameras and other sensors, on drones and otherwise, directly controlling air strikes and artillery. I imagine integrated control like this would offer greater potential for conceiving and implementing strategies. The removal of the physical limits of human senses is a very interesting idea.
    "Interesting idea." Lots of controversy.


  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 47,100 CMod ✭✭✭✭ Black Swan


    Fathom wrote: »
    "Interesting idea." Lots of controversy.
    Assured to continue into the future.


  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Regional East Moderators, Regional Midlands Moderators, Regional Midwest Moderators, Regional Abroad Moderators, Regional North Mods, Regional West Moderators, Regional South East Moderators, Regional North East Moderators, Regional North West Moderators, Regional South Moderators Posts: 8,382 CMod ✭✭✭✭ Fathom



    I imagine infantry would be by far the most difficult to replace. Taking the man out of the machine would be easier than replacing the soldier.
    Does today's gaming and sci fi predict future?


  • Registered Users Posts: 8,551 ✭✭✭ Rubecula


    Fathom wrote: »
    Does today's gaming and sci fi predict future?

    good question, I would think it depends on which game you are referring to.

    Also, I would guess that certain things in games may foresee the future to some degree.


    Incidentally I do not like the word predict, it never works out, I have always preferred forecast as it tells you what is expected not what will happen.


  • Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 84,892 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Capt'n Midnight


    Fathom wrote: »
    Does today's gaming and sci fi predict future?

    Look at this prediction
    The Nokia Communicator came out three years earlier.
    Seiko had :confused:released a wristwatch TV in 1983.
    All the technology existed.

    5046_ad72_500.jpeg

    I'm more worried about the power short term Shareholders, Speculators and Asset Strippers have over our lives than Killer Robots.


    The killer robot problem would go away if those in control were made accountable.

    Corporate Social Responsibility enforced. Like a Minster of a Govt Dept (UK would be a better example) the buck should stop at the top. If a robot goes on a killing spree then the guys at the top need to explain why or face REAL consequences. And things like "there weren't enough controls/ resources" won't be an excuse. If it could have been prevented by best practice then a mandatory manslaughter charge should be brought.


  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Regional East Moderators, Regional Midlands Moderators, Regional Midwest Moderators, Regional Abroad Moderators, Regional North Mods, Regional West Moderators, Regional South East Moderators, Regional North East Moderators, Regional North West Moderators, Regional South Moderators Posts: 8,382 CMod ✭✭✭✭ Fathom


    Tech release must be timely (Example: Michelangelo inventions not timely). Are we ready for androids release? Killer androids?


  • Registered Users Posts: 408 ✭✭ AlphabetCards


    Imagine a single intelligence with a network of cameras and other sensors, on drones and otherwise, directly controlling air strikes and artillery. I imagine integrated control like this would offer greater potential for conceiving and implementing strategies. The removal of the physical limits of human senses is a very interesting idea.

    This is precisely where I feel AI is going to be implemented well. The very act of putting out a Fire Support Team to identify targets, call in Fires, adjust fall of shot (artillery, which is a hugely manpower intensive form of Fires) or deconflict airspace (JTAC) is all hugely manpower intensive. And for the modern army, aversion to casualties is a concern in the globally-connected world.


  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Regional East Moderators, Regional Midlands Moderators, Regional Midwest Moderators, Regional Abroad Moderators, Regional North Mods, Regional West Moderators, Regional South East Moderators, Regional North East Moderators, Regional North West Moderators, Regional South Moderators Posts: 8,382 CMod ✭✭✭✭ Fathom


    Vast US military monies. Military robot development should progress.


  • Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 84,892 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Capt'n Midnight


    Fathom wrote: »
    Vast US military monies. Military robot development should progress.
    You don't know how this works do you ?

    Military R&D is a bottomless pit.

    The F-35 project will cost a Trillion dollars and that's after all they've spento on the F-22.
    Do you what happens to the clock if you cross the international date ?
    Did you know that places like the Dead Sea are below sea level ?

    Congrats you are over qualified to work on a Trillion dollar project. :rolleyes:


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  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 47,100 CMod ✭✭✭✭ Black Swan



    Military R&D is a bottomless pit.

    Center for the Study of the Drone
    at Bard College:
    The U.S. military’s spending on drones is set to reach a five-year high. The Department of Defense Fiscal Year 2018 budget request contains $6.97 billion for drone-related procurement, research and development, and system-specific construction. The President’s Budget 2018 maintains funding for existing unmanned aircraft at roughly the same level as the previous year and increases funding for research and development. It lays the groundwork for programs that will develop new unmanned ground and maritime drones, as well as the next generation of unmanned aircraft.


  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Regional East Moderators, Regional Midlands Moderators, Regional Midwest Moderators, Regional Abroad Moderators, Regional North Mods, Regional West Moderators, Regional South East Moderators, Regional North East Moderators, Regional North West Moderators, Regional South Moderators Posts: 8,382 CMod ✭✭✭✭ Fathom


    ...increases funding for research and development. Universities & MIC.


  • Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 84,892 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Capt'n Midnight


    Fathom wrote: »
    ...increases funding for research and development. Universities & MIC.
    A lot of it is for re--inventing the wheel and siphoning off.

    The UK has just announced £92m to plan for a replacement GPS system./URL]
    A feasibility study to work out what a UK programme might look like would cost around £100m alone, according to the official.


  • Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 84,892 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Capt'n Midnight


    1535025762-20180823.png



    :(


  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 47,100 CMod ✭✭✭✭ Black Swan


    A lot of it is for re--inventing the wheel and siphoning off.
    The "Wheel" was invented in lab long, long before. Scale up from lab to manufacturing floor comes years later. Unless there is a major crisis (WW III), then they can launch liberty ships (aka mass produced killer robots) in days after inventories, staffing, training, and tooling. And robots building robots.


  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Regional East Moderators, Regional Midlands Moderators, Regional Midwest Moderators, Regional Abroad Moderators, Regional North Mods, Regional West Moderators, Regional South East Moderators, Regional North East Moderators, Regional North West Moderators, Regional South Moderators Posts: 8,382 CMod ✭✭✭✭ Fathom


    Behind times, becomes times.


  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 47,100 CMod ✭✭✭✭ Black Swan


    Methinks that there will be a great amount of time between new autonomous weapons systems design and development, and scale up to manufacturing floor, as well as distribution of new weapons systems due to the lag built into the Military Industrial Complex. MIC would have to retool for new systems, which costs, while profits can still be made with existing systems. Profits first, new systems second.


  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Regional East Moderators, Regional Midlands Moderators, Regional Midwest Moderators, Regional Abroad Moderators, Regional North Mods, Regional West Moderators, Regional South East Moderators, Regional North East Moderators, Regional North West Moderators, Regional South Moderators Posts: 8,382 CMod ✭✭✭✭ Fathom


    Monthly and annual results. Profits and bonuses. Beyond that...?


  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 47,100 CMod ✭✭✭✭ Black Swan


    Inside the United Nations’ effort to regulate autonomous killer robots.


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  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Regional East Moderators, Regional Midlands Moderators, Regional Midwest Moderators, Regional Abroad Moderators, Regional North Mods, Regional West Moderators, Regional South East Moderators, Regional North East Moderators, Regional North West Moderators, Regional South Moderators Posts: 8,382 CMod ✭✭✭✭ Fathom


    Elon Musk calls for ban on killer robots before ‘weapons of terror’ are unleashed.


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