Should Ireland have conscription?

AnGaelach

Just wondering what people think about it. Say spending a year in the military and then spending x number of days per year training.

Your vote won't be public.

Rory28

As someone past the the age of conscription so it wont affect me, I say yes.

Mr. Incognito

It shouldnt but the way the world is where the right is on the rise another war is inevitable and we as Europeans will be dragged into it unfortunately

Gatling

AnGaelach wrote: »

Just wondering what people think about it. Say spending a year in the military and then spending x number of days per year training.

That's not conscription ,

But we should have civilian emergency relief training

schizo1014

Imo I think the training would be invaluable to everyone and might be just what this generation of snowflakes need to harden the feck up!

frag420

AnGaelach wrote: »

Just wondering what people think about it. Say spending a year in the military and then spending x number of days per year training.

Your vote won't be public.

Doing what exactly? We would be better of spending the year learning to code or learning a new language like Mandarin than learning how to light a fire in a strong wind or making a shelter out of twigs and fresh air!

AnGaelach

OSI wrote: »

To what purpose?

To learn how to arrange their linen immaculately... What purpose does any country have conscription for? Finland, Austria and Sweden all use conscription as neutral countries.

Renegade Mechanic

As someone who would be laughed out of a conscription office, it would be hypocritical of me to say yes when the decision would not affect me.

pumpkin4life

I'm young enough to be conscripted.

The idea of some mandatory military service for men wouldn't be that bad an idea though. Something like the Swiss have. I know two lads involved in the Reserves; talking about the skills, confidence and discipline that they gain, all of that.

I'd love to blow up something big and expensive with a rocket launcher. That too.

Digital Solitude

AnGaelach wrote: »

To learn how to arrange their linen immaculately... What purpose does any country have conscription for? Finland, Austria and Sweden all use conscription as neutral countries.

I can make my bed just fine.

Why do you think we should or shouldn't have it?

I personally would deem it a silly idea, out current armed force is less than 10,000 strong and is doing pretty fine, up on 70,000 people sit the leaving every year, so we'd be putting that number close to 50-60,000. An increase in the reserves to help AGS would be no harm but conscription makes no sense IMO

endacl

No. stupid idea.

TheQuietFella

The Defences Forces top brass wouldn't want it but the answer is no!

Look at what conscription brought to U.S. and U.K forces!

Sonics2k

Not so much conscription, but I really believe young people should be encouraged to at least join the reserves.

I did two years in the reserves when I was young and it was absolutely fantastic, made a lot of great friends, learned some good skills and enjoyed it. Plus the pay was quite good at the time too.

AnGaelach

Digital Solitude wrote: »

Why do you think we should or shouldn't have it?

It brings people together since you've something more in common, it builds confidence and competence, and it's something productive.

selwyn froggitt

TheQuietFella wrote: »

Look at what conscription brought to U.S. and U.K forces!

"We the unwilling, led by the unqualified, to kill the unfortunate, die for the ungrateful'

TheQuietFella

Sonics2k wrote: »

Not so much conscription, but I really believe young people should be encouraged to at least join the reserves.

I did two years in the reserves when I was young and it was absolutely fantastic, made a lot of great friends, learned some good skills and enjoyed it. Plus the pay was quite good at the time too.

Spent quite a few there myself but I think times now are a little different?

I can't see the Government shelling out for new uniforms and all the logistics that come along with it!

AnGaelach

TheQuietFella wrote: »

The Defences Forces top brass wouldn't want it but the answer is no!

Look at what conscription brought to U.S. and U.K forces!

You can't really compare Ireland to the UK or US, our goals and aspirations are nothing alike, nor our resources or capacity. Compare Ireland to similar sized non-aligned/neutral countries instead.

Del2005

AnGaelach wrote: »

Just wondering what people think about it. Say spending a year in the military and then spending x number of days per year training.

Your vote won't be public.

We won't buy the equipment are currently tiny military needs, so adding thousands more personal would reduce the effectiveness of our armed forces instead of improving it. Then the fact that a large proportion of the people conscripted not wanting to be there could lead to a huge disciplinary issues.

TheQuietFella

AnGaelach wrote: »

You can't really compare Ireland to the UK or US, our goals and aspirations are nothing alike, nor our resources or capacity. Compare Ireland to similar sized non-aligned/neutral countries instead.

I wasn't comparing Ireland to the U.S. or the U.K. but making reference

to what represented both countries during times of war. I know that war brings

out the worst in everyone and who am I to damn the damned!

cajonlardo

People who really want to enlist cannot get in.

I was stuck in hospital for a while. A young lad I met there had applied 3 times and not got in.
I'm an ex army nco. Imo this lad would have made a good soldier. All I could think was how lucky I'd been - back when I enlisted they couldn't get enough people to join. I walked into a barrcks, enlisted and started training 2 days later.

On another point, professionals are unlikely to want to be next or near conscripts.
The chance of being forced to rely on someone who doesn't want to be there, is not cut out to be a soldier - that is an extra variable you just don't need.

So in short - it is a non question. There is no place in the pdf for conscripts.

topper75

selwyn froggitt wrote: »

"We the unwilling, led by the unqualified, to kill the unfortunate, die for the ungrateful'

Nobody is paying you to think soldier. I want those boots of yours like mirrors.

Commotion Ocean

Yes, but only if it applied to girls as well as boys ..... But the National Women's Council wouldn't like that ... That's too much equality for them.

osarusan

Only for people I don't like.

Yes, I would love to be conscripted into an army on behalf of some fat establishment parasite like John Redmond/John Bruton. Let these fúcks offer their own lives up first and come back to me then.

riffmongous

I know people who did it in Austria and said it was a complete waste of time, after the few weeks of basic training there is ****-all to do.. just sitting around playing cards or whatever.

I would support some sort of 6 month civil 'volunteering' though, at least people are contributing to society then

Chancer3001

We should have it to whip our teens into physical shape.

Daily exercise. High levels of fitness. Make us a healthier country eventually.

Make people older and wiser going to college and the same starting their working lives.

Cant think of many downsides

Widdershins

Conscription, civilian emergency relief training, or some other kind of service work would be a good thing for everyone (who's able) to do. Maybe a half a year working for elderly people or the community in some way.

Grayson

Compulsory service might not be a bad idea. Give people free college/education if they spend a year afterwards working for a charity, NGO or in government service in some manner. It's a handy way for them to get experience. I wouldn't make it compulsory military service. The military isn't for everyone and it's best to allow people to serve in a manner which benefits both them and the country.
It's a simple enough system but it would be a nightmare making sure it's not abused and that it's implemented without being too much of a bureaucratic nightmare for everyone involved.

Del2005

riffmongous wrote: »

I know people who did it in Austria and said it was a complete waste of time, after the few weeks of basic training there is ****-all to do.. just sitting around playing cards or whatever.

Isn't that what soldiering is. Days of complete boredom followed by minutes/hours of intense action/fear, then back to the boredom.

riffmongous

Del2005 wrote: »

Isn't that what soldiering is. Days of complete boredom followed by minutes/hours of intense action/fear, then back to the boredom.

Well what, a few weeks of action and then a year of boredom as conscripts don't usually get to do very much? Why should people be forced to do it, if you want to do it fair enough

Joshua J

Forcing people against their will to learn how to kill other people?. This is the best use of our time here on Earth?.

Chancer3001

Joshua J wrote: »

Forcing people against their will to learn how to kill other people?. This is the best use of our time here on Earth?.

Teach them respect discipline teamwork loyalty self sacrifice altruism humility and work ethic.

If shooting guns is part of that then so be it.

They dont have to sit around idle either.

Teach them skills and have them work in the country. Highway maintenance, even tidying problem areas, painting, supervising, exchange with ither conscrupted forces around the world to broaden the mind

Joshua J

Chancer3001 wrote: »

Teach them respect discipline teamwork loyalty self sacrifice altruism humility and work ethic.

If shooting guns is part of that then so be it.

They dont have to sit around idle either.

Teach them skills and have them work in the country. Highway maintenance, even tidying problem areas, painting, supervising, exchange with ither conscrupted forces around the world to broaden the mind

Against their will?.

El_Duderino 09

riffmongous wrote:

I know people who did it in Austria and said it was a complete waste of time, after the few weeks of basic training there is ****-all to do.. just sitting around playing cards or whatever.

My cousin said the same if his time in the Austrian army. He said his manager (whatever the military term was) knew who wanted to be there and who didn't.

He took the former on training and he came into the barracks every morning and asked the latter if they had work to do. If they said yes they would be left alone for the day, if they said no he would create a job like digging and filling a hole.

Widdershins

Joshua J wrote: »

Against their will?.

A bit like school.

Joshua J

Widdershins wrote: »

A bit like school.

Killing school?.

Sam Kade

Too many nancy boys around nowadays a few years in the army would sort them.

El_Duderino 09

Looking at history, the adventure of military must be interesting to some people. The less you have going on in your life the more appealing it must become. Some people just like the idea of war and military. I can't imagine conscription being good for the military.

If you think people need discipline, why the military? You need discipline in real life too. I think the Germans can do useful public service of some kind. I'd say the unions and workers would kick up a terrible fuss about young people coming in doing their job for cheap. That doesn't really apply to the Irish military because they do the important work with the professionals they have. The rest would just be busy work rather than anything useful

The One Doctor

If the government forced me to become a fighter pilot, I'd reluctantly accept.

Otherwise fuck that. No sane person should want to learn to kill people as a trade.

And yes, I'm aware of the hypocrisy.

Widdershins

Joshua J wrote: »

Killing school?.

changing the subject much. In terms of it being mandatory against their will.

Plenty of people learn skills or a trade in the army, they don't all go into combat.
A lot to be said for discipline and endurance etc.

Joshua J

Widdershins wrote: »

changing the subject much. In terms of it being mandatory against their will.

Plenty of people learn skills or a trade in the army, they don't all go into combat.
A lot to be said for discipline and endurance etc.

Maybe you need the discipline and endurance, if so, have at it. Leave it up to other people to decide for themselves.

Widdershins

Joshua J wrote: »

Maybe you need the discipline and endurance, if so, have at it. Leave it up to other people to decide for themselves.

I'm fine thanks. The general idea is that it would be compulsory so there'd be no deciding for yourself. Presumably for the common good. And it's nothing to do with me.

Joshua J

Widdershins wrote: »

I'm fine thanks. The general idea is that it would be compulsory so there'd be no deciding for yourself. Presumably for the common good. And it's nothing to do with me.

I'd be deciding for myself thanks all the same.

Grueller

Digital Solitude wrote: »

I can make my bed just fine.

Why do you think we should or shouldn't have it?

I personally would deem it a silly idea, out current armed force is less than 10,000 strong and is doing pretty fine, up on 70,000 people sit the leaving every year, so we'd be putting that number close to 50-60,000. An increase in the reserves to help AGS would be no harm but conscription makes no sense IMO

Why not just employ enough gardai to do the job properly?

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Conscrption - no. Not everyone is geared to be in the army (and the army, above all else, know this)

National service of some description, though - yes.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

AnGaelach wrote: »

To learn how to arrange their linen immaculately... What purpose does any country have conscription for? Finland, Austria and Sweden all use conscription as neutral countries.

Sweden doesn't have it any more, Finalnd and Austria have alternatives to military service.

I perform national service every year for about the first three months of the year.

Goya

Chancer3001 wrote: »

We should have it to whip our teens into physical shape.

Daily exercise. High levels of fitness. Make us a healthier country eventually.

Make people older and wiser going to college and the same starting their working lives.

Cant think of many downsides

Were you in the army?

Chancer3001

Flimpson wrote: »

Were you in the army?

No

fizzypish

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

Sweden doesn't have it any more, Finalnd and Austria have alternatives to military service.

Was talking to some Austrians recently. They were totally for their military service and proud to have done so. Personally I wouldn't have minded doing service. I don't think anybody should jump from secondary school into 3rd level education. Start working (or something) and take a year to grow a bit outside the nest. Of course having some alternative to military service would be a must. Some people wouldn't be cool with military service but defiantly some form of service. As much as we **** on this country, tis'nt a bad ould spot and I wouldn't mind giving back.

seamus

No. We would be pissing money away on military spending that we don't need.

There is absolutely zero evidence from any other country that mandatory military time results in less criminals or "hardens" people up. That's a romantic notion.

I would massively support a programme however where school leavers could get a college place and put it on hold for a year or two, to engage in some kind of training with specific groups - mountain rescue, civil defence, fire service, ambulance or military. Most of these groups are badly in need of support, and the more people who have done some work with them, the more likely they are to rejoin them after college, or otherwise support them at events or for funding, etc.

Throwing people into military service after school does nothing to help the country and the person's local community.